US Paid $1B to Green Climate Fund, Top Polluters Paid $0

[twostrokenut]

Perhaps you've been influenced.

With members of Congress paying special attention to Big Oil, the policy that elected representatives have developed does not reflect the interest of the public, which wants "affordable, reliable, clean sources of energy," Slocum says. A 2006 survey by the Pew Research Center found a majority of Americans across the political spectrum want an energy policy that emphasizes renewable and alternative sources of energy.

Over 10 years now, I sure would like to know how much this $500 billion Oil deal with Russia is gonna cost the "American" public in further hampering of clean energy technology.

ya I would like to see these....



start popping up soon too.

 

[Justin-case]

Beyond? Solar and wind is the goal...

I'm not real into advandced science, but I remember hearing about this over the years. It may be what he is talking about.


Achieving First Plasma. After being turned on for the first time, the UK's newest fusionreactor has achieved first plasma. ... Called the ST40, the reactor was constructed by Tokamak Energy, one of the leading private fusion energy companies in the world.May 1, 2017
A "World First" Fusion Reactor Just Created Its First Plasma - Futurism
Futurism › a-world-first-fusion-reactor-ju...

Feedback

 

[ttystikk]

I'm not real into advandced science, but I remember hearing about over this years. It may be what he is talking about.


Achieving First Plasma. After being turned on for the first time, the UK's newest fusionreactor has achieved first plasma. ... Called the ST40, the reactor was constructed by Tokamak Energy, one of the leading private fusion energy companies in the world.May 1, 2017
A "World First" Fusion Reactor Just Created Its First Plasma - Futurism
Futurism › a-world-first-fusion-reactor-ju...

Feedback

They keep saying they're right on the cusp of controlled fusion.

They said they were 20 years away... 40 years ago.

It's still a 'future tech'.

Solar panels and wind turbines both have free fuel and lower installed cost than fossil fuel generation.

Why wait for someday when there's a better, cheaper and scalable solution available now?

 

[Justin-case]

We need to rebuild our energy infrastructure to take advantage of sources of energy that don't cost money.

Once the panel is in place, the sun is free.
Once the wind turbine is installed, the wind is free.

There's no way fossil fuels can compete with that.

Real Jobz!

It's a win, win.The sooner we invest the better,

They keep saying they're right on the cusp of controlled fusion.

They said they were 20 years away... 40 years ago.

It's still a 'future tech'.

Solar panels and wind turbines both have free fuel and lower installed cost than fossil fuel generation.

Why wait for someday when there's a better, cheaper and scalable solution available now?

We're are getting there, solar has really taken off around here. Higher utility rates and tax credits have been major factors for the increased demand.

 

[twostrokenut]

We need to rebuild our energy infrastructure to take advantage of sources of energy that don't cost money.

Once the panel is in place, the sun is free.
Once the wind turbine is installed, the wind is free.

There's no way fossil fuels can compete with that.

compete? here is the latest subsidy per megawatt hour I can find from 2010....

For solar power, they were $775.64 per megawatt hour, for wind $56.29, for nuclear $3.14, for hydroelectric power $0.82, for coal $0.64 and for natural gas and petroleum liquids $0.64.

so lance armstrong, helluva competitor amirite?

 

[UncleBuck]

compete? here is the latest subsidy per megawatt hour I can find from 2010....

For solar power, they were $775.64 per megawatt hour, for wind $56.29, for nuclear $3.14, for hydroelectric power $0.82, for coal $0.64 and for natural gas and petroleum liquids $0.64.

so lance armstrong, helluva competitor amirite?

i'm sure your completely uncited, unattributed numbers reflect current reality and take into account subsidization.

or maybe you just made them up. you are known as an inveterate liar.

 

[ANC]

1 billion dollars is nothing. considering how many high consumption citizens you have in the States, it is like $3 a head. That is all your clean air and water is worth to the government.

 

[PetFlora]

i must be thinking of some other conspiracy theory retard.

are you the retard who thinks bin laden died in 2004 and george w bush just forgot to take credit for it?

the truth is out there- just not on MSM.

Are you the libtard who believes Mandela's official date of death was Dec 6, 2013?

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/president-obama-poses-selfie-nelson-mandelas-memorial-service/story?id=21162957

http://canadafreepress.com/article/did-obama-know-date-of-mandelas-death-was-june-26-2013

On June 26, 2013, the Guardian Express printed stories relating the death of Nelson Mandela, after learning that the Pretoria hospital where he was being treated turned off his life support system and allowed the great leader to pass on in dignity.

Nelson Mandela Dead; Family Colluding with President Zuma ...
guardianlv.com/2013/07/nelson-mandela-dead-family-colluding-with-president-zuma-to-keep-him-alive/

Perhaps they somehow missed such an important event http://www.onthisday.com/date/2013/december/6

The real agenda for them meeting is so far over your head and would change your incessant need for mind control political 'news' behavior that it would shake you to your core

Again, the truth is out there, but you're no Mulder

 

[twostrokenut]

i'm sure your completely uncited, unattributed numbers reflect current reality and take into account subsidization.

or maybe you just made them up. you are known as an inveterate liar.

Those were subsidy per energy unit numbers dollar/megawatt hour. Which energy sources would survive without subsidies at all is the interesting question.

 

[TacoMac]

He was just early; solar panels means electricity is free, once you have the panel.

That's not entirely accurate at this point. Solar doesn't last very long and requires nearly constant upgrades to keep running efficiently.

The big problem with solar is two fold:

1. It's not very efficient at all.
2. The panels have a very short effective life span.

At this point, the typical solar panel has about a 20 year life span. But what they don't really tell you is that their efficiency drops by between 1 and 2% per year (and that's on a very good panel). So in just 10 years time, you're going to lose somewhere between 10% and 20% of the panels effective power and up to 30% in some cases.

When you start with idea that it takes about 45,000 dollars to outfit the typical house with enough panels to run it, that's a TON of money. Over 20 years, that amounts to $187.50 per month if you're paying cash no interest to pay for the panels.

Now, when you start factoring in the power loss over time, you need to either start replacing panels or adding panels to maintain the same energy levels. That jacks the price up to around $220.00 per month.

Then, right about the time you pay off the panels 20 years later, they're pretty much garbage so you have to trash them and start all over again.

This is, of course, before you even start talking about the batteries, backup systems and things of that nature.

For now, solar is, at best, a band-aid for our energy problems. Nuclear and Wind are going to lead the way for the foreseeable future.

I give it about another 100 years before advances in Solar become so powerful and so cheap that they will pretty much completely take over for day to day power needs.

 

[Justin-case]

Those were subsidy per energy unit numbers dollar/megawatt hour. Which energy sources would survive without subsidies at all is the interesting question.

so if we cut subsidies to coal, oil, and gas it will offset renewables, got it. I don't think a price tag is going to be a factor in clean energy. My generation is ready to pay for your's mistakes. We just wish you wouldn't fight us tooth and nail the entire time, skid mark.

 

[PetFlora]

They keep saying they're right on the cusp of controlled fusion.

They said they were 20 years away... 40 years ago.

It's still a 'future tech'.

Solar panels and wind turbines both have free fuel and lower installed cost than fossil fuel generation.

Why wait for someday when there's a better, cheaper and scalable solution available now?

The oil cartels will kick the can down the rod as long as they can. Many thousands of 'free' energy devices have been taken away by the NSA, citing national security

 

[twostrokenut]

so if we cut subsidies to coal, oil, and gas it will offset renewables, got it. I don't think a price tag is going to be a factor in clean energy. My generation is ready to pay for your's mistakes. We just wish you wouldn't fight us tooth and nail the entire time, skid mark.

The price tag is THE factor. I'm afraid you just don't grasp the scale of the numbers.

If all energy were suddenly not subsidized tomorrow, which ones would survive the market? Solar would be the first to go. Your generation doesn't even know what a bubble is or why the dollar is one.

 

[Justin-case]

The price tag is THE factor. I'm afraid you just don't grasp the scale of the numbers.

If all energy were suddenly not subsidized tomorrow, which ones would survive the market? Solar would be the first to go. Your generation doesn't even know what a bubble is or why the dollar is one.

This isn't theory, most of Europe is way ahead of us already. What's the cost of a polluted environment?

 

[ttystikk]

The oil cartels will kick the can down the rod as long as they can. Many thousands of 'free' energy devices have been taken away by the NSA, citing national security

There's no point in discussing anything with a conspiracy theorist.

 

[ttystikk]

That's not entirely accurate at this point. Solar doesn't last very long and requires nearly constant upgrades to keep running efficiently.

The big problem with solar is two fold:

1. It's not very efficient at all.
2. The panels have a very short effective life span.

At this point, the typical solar panel has about a 20 year life span. But what they don't really tell you is that their efficiency drops by between 1 and 2% per year (and that's on a very good panel). So in just 10 years time, you're going to lose somewhere between 10% and 20% of the panels effective power and up to 30% in some cases.

When you start with idea that it takes about 45,000 dollars to outfit the typical house with enough panels to run it, that's a TON of money. Over 20 years, that amounts to $187.50 per month if you're paying cash no interest to pay for the panels.

Now, when you start factoring in the power loss over time, you need to either start replacing panels or adding panels to maintain the same energy levels. That jacks the price up to around $220.00 per month.

Then, right about the time you pay off the panels 20 years later, they're pretty much garbage so you have to trash them and start all over again.

This is, of course, before you even start talking about the batteries, backup systems and things of that nature.

For now, solar is, at best, a band-aid for our energy problems. Nuclear and Wind are going to lead the way for the foreseeable future.

I give it about another 100 years before advances in Solar become so powerful and so cheap that they will pretty much completely take over for day to day power needs.

Your cost numbers are outdated; solar is less now.

Yes, panels degrade over time, but they're still making power in 20 years- 70-80% of new, and they're paid for.

You've totally forgotten about utility price increases over time.

Yes, solar will keep getting better. It's good enough right now. The largest solar installers in America are now utilities. If it didn't make financial sense, why would they be doing it?

 

[srh88]

Your cost numbers are outdated; solar is less now.

Yes, panels degrade over time, but they're still making power in 20 years- 70-80% of new, and they're paid for.

You've totally forgotten about utility price increases over time.

Yes, solar will keep getting better. It's good enough right now. The largest solar installers in America are now utilities. If it didn't make financial sense, why would they be doing it?

I agree with tacomac but not the 100 years. They are improving fast now. I'd like to have them on my house but you can't bank your power here.. it's bullshit. It all goes to a cut on your electric bill

 

[SneekyNinja]

That's not entirely accurate at this point. Solar doesn't last very long and requires nearly constant upgrades to keep running efficiently.

The big problem with solar is two fold:

1. It's not very efficient at all.
2. The panels have a very short effective life span.

At this point, the typical solar panel has about a 20 year life span. But what they don't really tell you is that their efficiency drops by between 1 and 2% per year (and that's on a very good panel). So in just 10 years time, you're going to lose somewhere between 10% and 20% of the panels effective power and up to 30% in some cases.

When you start with idea that it takes about 45,000 dollars to outfit the typical house with enough panels to run it, that's a TON of money. Over 20 years, that amounts to $187.50 per month if you're paying cash no interest to pay for the panels.

Now, when you start factoring in the power loss over time, you need to either start replacing panels or adding panels to maintain the same energy levels. That jacks the price up to around $220.00 per month.

Then, right about the time you pay off the panels 20 years later, they're pretty much garbage so you have to trash them and start all over again.

This is, of course, before you even start talking about the batteries, backup systems and things of that nature.

For now, solar is, at best, a band-aid for our energy problems. Nuclear and Wind are going to lead the way for the foreseeable future.

I give it about another 100 years before advances in Solar become so powerful and so cheap that they will pretty much completely take over for day to day power needs.

You're at least 10 years out of date with those statements.

Average ROI is 5 - 7 years and in most places the panels are guaranteed for 25.

Check your local suppliers if you don't believe me.

 

[Justin-case]

I agree with tacomac but not the 100 years. They are improving fast now. I'd like to have them on my house but you can't bank your power here.. it's bullshit. It all goes to a cut on your electric bill

Yep, as far as I know no utility will buy your power, only credit you. Not bad if you have a few accounts and go all electric.

 

[ttystikk]

I agree with tacomac but not the 100 years. They are improving fast now. I'd like to have them on my house but you can't bank your power here.. it's bullshit. It all goes to a cut on your electric bill

That's the utility trying to get one over in you. Call your representatives.

Grid tied and banking your excess energy with the utility is much better than batteries, because batteries aren't 100% efficient- and because the utility can use that extra power during the day to run the AC in someone else's house!