Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
Right back to the Buck Fallacy we go, eh?
Anything to get out of that corner you were just walked into
I'm sure nobody else saw it though..
The DNC Reports Lowest Fundraising Since 2003
- Thread starter Padawanbater2
- Start date
Anything to get out of that corner you were just walked into
I'm sure nobody else saw it though..
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
Why do you think more is expected of you just because you're a white guy?
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
You have been crushed. I didn't think you had it in you to continue.Right back to the Buck Fallacy we go, eh?
Anything to get out of that corner you were just walked into
I'm sure nobody else saw it though..
OK then. You made a blanket statement where you claim the Senate is against the repeal of Citizen's United. This in spite of facts regarding the Congressional record's showing every Senator supporting Bernie's bill for an amendment to repeal the CU ruling. Also in spite of facts regarding position statements made by the DNC and sitting Congressmen. Where do you find justification for your statement? Is it a belief or a fact? If it's a fact, then show them to me.
Regarding a claim that (I paraphrase) Clinton outspent Trump yet still lost proves liberal candidates can spend fraction of what usually accounts for a Senate or HR campaign by accepting only individual small donations and consistently win against well funded campaigns that also accept corporate and other large donations. By "liberal", I'll take the platform listed by Justice Democrats as an example but you can change it however you like here.
https://justicedemocrats.com/platform
Did I correctly state your position or do you want to clarify?
My assertion is you are wrong on multiple accounts. I'll hold my explanation until you can respond. I'm not posting a straw man argument, I'm willing to wait until you restate your position in this regard if necessary.
If you don't reply you forfeit (snicker)
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
I am still waiting for an answer here. There is no reason you can't answer this question and still "walk me into a corner" you masterdebater, you
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
LOL
Dankest of memes
Pad's been around but he's shirked this corner of the forum. Any further obfuscation will be seen as forfeit. LOL.
Below is pad's vision of himself relative to the established parties in terms of the left-right political spectrum. Wwaaaay to the right is GOP and then Dem. Regardless of whether or not this is a continuous scale and how anybody else would place them, only three tick marks separate the two existing parties. All differences in fiscal and social policies are contained in three tick marks. Three tick marks represent the difference between public funding for schools, secular education, a woman's right to choose, the existence of Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, suppression of minority votes, punitive immigration policies, the wall. Three tick marks between Democrats and Republicans.
Pad puts himself, what? Maybe a ninety marks to the left of them?
His major complaint is that he's not doing well enough financially. Men's rights, a living minimum wage, perhaps a minimum personal income. This doesn't sound to me like a political view that is thirty-times the difference between no Medicaid and Medicaid in terms of public policies. You? what do you think about his ability to understand what "far left" even means.
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Ever heard of the Overton Window? Look it up, it explains a lot about his political position.LOL
Dankest of memes
Pad's been around but he's shirked this corner of the forum. Any further obfuscation will be seen as forfeit. LOL.
Below is pad's vision of himself relative to the established parties in terms of the left-right political spectrum. Wwaaaay to the right is GOP and then Dem. Regardless of whether or not this is a continuous scale and how anybody else would place them, only three tick marks separate the two existing parties. All differences in fiscal and social policies are contained in three tick marks. Three tick marks represent the difference between public funding for schools, secular education, a woman's right to choose, the existence of Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, suppression of minority votes, punitive immigration policies, the wall. Three tick marks between Democrats and Republicans.
Pad puts himself, what? Maybe a ninety marks to the left of them?
His major complaint is that he's not doing well enough financially. Men's rights, a living minimum wage, perhaps a minimum personal income. This doesn't sound to me like a political view that is thirty-times the difference between no Medicaid and Medicaid in terms of public policies. You? what do you think about his ability to understand what "far left" even means.
Notice where he put the center mark.
You seem strangely intolerant of differing views of late. It's disappointing.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
It's pad's view of himself that I found revealing. The issues he raises and the answers he proposed for the most part aren't 30 times greater than the differences between no social security, medicare, medicaid and having them. But the scale is subjective, so my 30x estimate doesn't necessarily apply.
Regarding the center, this is revealing. Doesn't matter where the larger hash mark is placed. The center is in the middle.. Otherwise, it can't be called a center. That you and pad think the center point along a line is subjective I find really funny. A center is not the same as a zero. In a continuous scale, the zero point can be offset however the author wishes. But a middle is always the mid-way point along a line. We've talked about these types of errors that you make when graphing ranked order subjective criteria. I already know you don't get it. Pad doesn't too, apparently.
As I said, it's a view into how pad thinks of himself. Unlike pad, I'm not claiming to know what another is thinking. This provides an insight into what he thinks of himself. Also insight into his understanding of what "hard left" means. It means, single payer -- so a government pays for delivery of medical services, it means limited campaign donations also, living minimum wage or minimum personal income, men's rights, stuff like that.
Those solutions don't sound to me like something that is 30 times the difference between having no social security and having it. And so, I asked AC (and not you) what he thought.
You've been incredibly intolerant of differing views for a long time and I overlooked your histrionic outbursts in the mistaken impression you were rational. I've come to find I'm wrong. I'd have no problem with the views you express when they are based on facts. Same with pad. Now that I understand, I'm glad to take the opposite side when the facts take me there.
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abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
The blue and red dots should be at least 20 ticks wide each and with some overlap. The entire spectrum should be narrower.LOL
Dankest of memes
Pad's been around but he's shirked this corner of the forum. Any further obfuscation will be seen as forfeit. LOL.
Below is pad's vision of himself relative to the established parties in terms of the left-right political spectrum. Wwaaaay to the right is GOP and then Dem. Regardless of whether or not this is a continuous scale and how anybody else would place them, only three tick marks separate the two existing parties. All differences in fiscal and social policies are contained in three tick marks. Three tick marks represent the difference between public funding for schools, secular education, a woman's right to choose, the existence of Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, suppression of minority votes, punitive immigration policies, the wall. Three tick marks between Democrats and Republicans.
Pad puts himself, what? Maybe a ninety marks to the left of them?
His major complaint is that he's not doing well enough financially. Men's rights, a living minimum wage, perhaps a minimum personal income. This doesn't sound to me like a political view that is thirty-times the difference between no Medicaid and Medicaid in terms of public policies. You? what do you think about his ability to understand what "far left" even means.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
I'd agree with that. It's pads view of himself and it's no surprise he sees it differently.
What about his placement at nearly the farthest end of the left side. His solutions are single payer healthcare, limited campaign donations also, living minimum wage or minimum personal income, men's rights. Hard left?
Of course I'm stirring the pot. No need to reply if you don't want to go there.
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
He's still a liberal, all of his policies are capitalist. Even with single payer, hospitals are privately owned, the insurance companies, though policies are paid by gov't are privately owned. Drug companies privately owned. It's just a cunt hair left of center.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
https://www.quora.com/Whats-the-difference-between-the-left-and-liberal
One rough guide in American usage is that liberals are in some sense heirs of the New Deal and the Great Society who want to take some of the sharp edges off capitalism by providing or raising a social welfare net, though not nearly to the extent it is provided or raised in social democratic Europe, without in either case (liberalism or social democracy) disturbing the essential social relations of capital, where the capitalists own the means of production and the workers own only their ability to work and must work for the capitalists to live.
Leftists are people who want to erase those relations by abolishing private ownership of means of productions and wage labor, having productive assets socially owned, economic activity run as a cooperative venture by workers without capitalists, and some think, abolishing markets in most or all areas, having economic decisions about production, investment, and distruibution made according to a democratically decided on plan.
One rough guide in American usage is that liberals are in some sense heirs of the New Deal and the Great Society who want to take some of the sharp edges off capitalism by providing or raising a social welfare net, though not nearly to the extent it is provided or raised in social democratic Europe, without in either case (liberalism or social democracy) disturbing the essential social relations of capital, where the capitalists own the means of production and the workers own only their ability to work and must work for the capitalists to live.
Leftists are people who want to erase those relations by abolishing private ownership of means of productions and wage labor, having productive assets socially owned, economic activity run as a cooperative venture by workers without capitalists, and some think, abolishing markets in most or all areas, having economic decisions about production, investment, and distruibution made according to a democratically decided on plan.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Wherever you want it to be. That's what pad did.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
"Months of post-election malaise hamstrung the Democratic National Committee’s (DNC) fundraising over the first six months of 2017, creating a serious money gap with Republicans and raising questions about Democrats’ ability to take advantage of opportunities in the 2018 midterm elections.
The DNC raised $38.2 million in the first half of the year, compared with the Republican National Committee's (RNC) $75.4 million haul during that period — a $37.2 million difference. As of June 30, the RNC has almost $45 million in the bank, while the DNC has just under $7.5 million, along with $3 million in debt."
Full Article
The DNC raised $38.2 million in the first half of the year, compared with the Republican National Committee's (RNC) $75.4 million haul during that period — a $37.2 million difference. As of June 30, the RNC has almost $45 million in the bank, while the DNC has just under $7.5 million, along with $3 million in debt."
Full Article
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
Couldn't have anything to do with the DNCs conduct during the 2016 primary, though.. That's just.. crazy...
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
It's funny you guys say the DNC didn't do anything wrong, and they had no role in the outcome of the 2016 primary when stuff like this surfaces. This lends credibility to the idea that big donors have lost confidence in the Democratic establishment. Your saving grace was accepting corporate bribes from the big donor class. And now they've abandoned you because you can't even win an election against the most disliked and untrusted Republican candidate in decades. Donors are fleeing in droves... The country is on fire and people see the supposed 'opposition party' as the corporatist shills they are; that's why nobody is donating to them. Not big donors nor small donors alike. Definitely not small donors. Progressives aren't interested in donating to an organization that doesn't represent their interests. Now big donors aren't either.
Uh oh!
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
DONOR CLASS WAAAAHHHHHHHH
ESTABLISHMENT WWWAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH
NEO-LIBERALISM WWWAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
I want to hear more about how Progressives are uniting to build a political coalition.
I think that's the political movement of the future, because the Republicans are morally and ethically bankrupt and the Democrats seem bent on following their example.