Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
Try growing a willow or somthing that has apical problems, might get better results
Clone topped itself. Awesome!
- Thread starter Delta-9Pyromaniac
- Start date
Delta-9Pyromaniac
Well-Known Member
We'll know soon enough. She's getting really bushy. Tops sprouting out of every node almost. Although I'm not to impressed with the roots, She seems happy. And yes...., that is a sandwich bag she's in. I've found it easier for transplant to just tare the bag open and, the added benefit of being able to track the roots.
Attachments
Delta-9Pyromaniac
Well-Known Member
Before anybody says lights are bad for the roots, I do keep the bag wrapped in another thick black plastic bag or panda
Last edited:
Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
Light is fine for roots, the trichoderma that forms in the soil with the aid of light not so great, monitor for any green growth as a sign of too damp and too light.
Other than that its fine, i root into clear plastic bottles sometimes with zero root problem, good way to see the root health too.
Delta-9Pyromaniac
Well-Known Member
Good to know. Thanks
SensiBlaze
Member
In my limited experience with clones, I have had at least one self top every single run.. I dunno if that's super rare but I've heard clones are much more likely to do this than seedlings. I've never noticed any abnormal or negative outcomes from it either.. They actually seem to take the fuck off once they get well established root systems
Does anyone have info on why it's a bad thing if the plant loses its apical dominance? Isn't that exactly what topping/fimming/lst does to the plant anyway?
Does anyone have info on why it's a bad thing if the plant loses its apical dominance? Isn't that exactly what topping/fimming/lst does to the plant anyway?
Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
The plant dosent loose its apical dominance through topping and the fim technique, it merely redistributes it to the next highest or biggest part that is naturally the next in line to be the top apical dominant point.In my limited experience with clones, I have had at least one self top every single run.. I dunno if that's super rare but I've heard clones are much more likely to do this than seedlings. I've never noticed any abnormal or negative outcomes from it either.. They actually seem to take the fuck off once they get well established root systems
Does anyone have info on why it's a bad thing if the plant loses its apical dominance? Isn't that exactly what topping/fimming/lst does to the plant anyway?
A willow has slightly less apical dominance and is not a bad thing but when a plant that relies on apical dominance looses it, well i'm not sure thats natural for it's species and thus forth we can assume this is through some negative abiotic stressor.
I'm on a limb with most of this stuff, just gathered through reading, other knowledgeable members from threads and days now past plus plenty of personal hands on experience in my earlier growing days, which is where the thread and pictures i posted come from.
One interesting point to note is that quite often the plant returns back to its normal growth and all is well again.
One might ask if more nodes, leaves and branches equals more bud when considering this biological phenomenon, i'd have to say no, the subsequent growth is smaller and of no greater wet weight to a normal plant, quite the opposite and the buds are far too leafy and underdeveloped calyx wise. At no point does it exceed its biological maximum potential for growth - which any healthy plant with all supplied is already at, laws of thermo dynamics etc etc.....
A subject of interest to me for a few years now, many have differing ideas but this seems corelates better with most supporting evidence.
I'm sure if you force a plant to grow into a hot grow light when it dosent want to it might loose its apical dominance in favour of its sideways growth or downwards growth idk, play around with different things and im sure youll find the plant tries to adapt in a whole manner of ways.
Do not confuse this with triploids or ploidy, the Wikipedia reference is not this whatsoever, apical dominance problems are another thing and ploidy is rare even almost impossible. I reference abiotic stress to minor mutations in dna possibly caused by hormones or some signalling pathway. This negates it as a breedable mutation and trait, some have tried, all but a few have failed, those that managed it attested to using stress to cause the trait to show through subsequent generations.
I think thats all i know, mucho written on other threads about this over the years
SensiBlaze
Member
Nice, thanks for the input!
I have two Yumberry clones, rooted one week apart, and the 2nd one ended up topping itself. I'm going to watch these two very closely to see if there's any noticeable difference in the finished product between the sister clone and the mother as well.
Speaking of polyploids.. My 2nd grow I was lucky enough to have a plant do this! I had NO idea what the hell it was when I was growing it so I didn't think to take pics of the cured bud
I did find this from a few weeks before harvest though and you can see if you look close (bottom left nug)
The stem it grew from popped out of the cotyledon node after I mainlined her, which is something I see almost every time I mainline. But as soon as it started growing I noticed leaves were growing out of every inch of that stem.. Not 2 nodes, not 3 nodes.. Literally random leaves EVERYWHERE on the stem.. It was a total trip!
But as excited as I was to smoke such a dense and crazy looking bud... It was straight up nasty! I was so disappointed lol. There was way more sugar leaf than there was bud.. Shoulda just used it for budder haha.. Or framed it maybe?
I have two Yumberry clones, rooted one week apart, and the 2nd one ended up topping itself. I'm going to watch these two very closely to see if there's any noticeable difference in the finished product between the sister clone and the mother as well.
Speaking of polyploids.. My 2nd grow I was lucky enough to have a plant do this! I had NO idea what the hell it was when I was growing it so I didn't think to take pics of the cured bud
I did find this from a few weeks before harvest though and you can see if you look close (bottom left nug) The stem it grew from popped out of the cotyledon node after I mainlined her, which is something I see almost every time I mainline. But as soon as it started growing I noticed leaves were growing out of every inch of that stem.. Not 2 nodes, not 3 nodes.. Literally random leaves EVERYWHERE on the stem.. It was a total trip!
But as excited as I was to smoke such a dense and crazy looking bud... It was straight up nasty! I was so disappointed lol. There was way more sugar leaf than there was bud.. Shoulda just used it for budder haha.. Or framed it maybe?
Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
I looked at your picture and plant, i think this closely resembles the problem with the bud -Nice, thanks for the input!
I have two Yumberry clones, rooted one week apart, and the 2nd one ended up topping itself. I'm going to watch these two very closely to see if there's any noticeable difference in the finished product between the sister clone and the mother as well.
Speaking of polyploids.. My 2nd grow I was lucky enough to have a plant do this! I had NO idea what the hell it was when I was growing it so I didn't think to take pics of the cured bud
View attachment 4017374
The stem it grew from popped out of the cotyledon node after I mainlined her, which is something I see almost every time I mainline. But as soon as it started growing I noticed leaves were growing out of every inch of that stem.. Not 2 nodes, not 3 nodes.. Literally random leaves EVERYWHERE on the stem.. It was a total trip!
But as excited as I was to smoke such a dense and crazy looking bud... It was straight up nasty! I was so disappointed lol. There was way more sugar leaf than there was bud.. Shoulda just used it for budder haha.. Or framed it maybe?
I believe it is the apical dominance problem again and know for sure it is not polyploidy.
The bud spreads out and looses any upwards growth. Of course nodes start appearing from the sides of the stems like crazy, literally hundreds of them little mofos (and each with their extra leaf), its apical dominance has gone, there is no hormone telling it where to grow from, no structure or order.
Grow it does but never bigger than an ordinary bud and look at all that leaf, not a pleasant smoke.
For some reason these types of buds do not mature that well or swell up much per say.
Its not unfair to say that newer growers can experience this more.
Again i'm going to go as far as to say it is impossible to get a polyploid plant and even if you did you wouldn't necessarily notice. Forget ploidy of any type, it is not within our realms so we cannot apply its principle to our growing. Other plant species, plenty of science and ploidy going on.
SensiBlaze
Member
Ah I see! So I was mistaken lol. Thank you for clearing that up
That does make sense though.. Do you think because I mainlined the plant very early on (it was my first crack at it) that could have caused the apical issue?
Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
Fuck dude, i can but scratch the surface of what seems some straight up technical biological hard mother nature probably going to need a lab and a greenhouse full of test plants to even understand whatever the hell is going on.Ah I see! So I was mistaken lol. Thank you for clearing that up
All i can say is that some kind of stress is triggering some hormonal/mutation problem and that it will go away when that changes, i know not what or why past the little i have gleaned on the subject. Some plants naturally do this but marijuana is not one, for her to is very strange and indicative of stress.
Ive witnessed many try to breed it and go on about genetics and mutations and try to disprove this information but as yet no one has (in many years) except one member and at length we seemed to agree that this was more as a response to stress not genetics.
A lot of this was passed onto me by old wise members, damn they knew a lot of things about marijuana, now days it seems a lot more convoluted.
Good luck and i hope this is of some intrest
SensiBlaze
Member
You definitely shed some light on the situation I most definitely appreciate that! As a fairly new grower I am still learning patience is a key aspect of keeping my girls happy! Seems to me that's the hardest thing to learn when it comes to growing.. Just let her grow and give her what she wants 
Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PolyploidAh I see! So I was mistaken lol. Thank you for clearing that up
Polyploidy is to do with some doubling of chromosomes and other genetic stuff, it dosent factor into apical dominance and whorled phllotaxy.
You will see three leaved seedlings and mistakenly hear people call them triploids, its real term is a trifoliate, again nothing to do with ploidy of any kind.
One could speculate that ploidy might cause such mutations but the chances are so very rare and the frequency that this suff occurs even within this site is far too vast to ever account for ploidy.
As much as i know
Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
Getting a good environment is the hard bit with a lot of plant problems in a good soil, just keep growing plants and eventually they will get bigger and better.You definitely shed some light on the situation I most definitely appreciate that! As a fairly new grower I am still learning patience is a key aspect of keeping my girls happy! Seems to me that's the hardest thing to learn when it comes to growing.. Just let her grow and give her what she wants
SensiBlaze
Member
Yeah, I mean as rare as everyone makes ploidy seem, there's no way I just happened to stumble across a miracle of nature my 2nd run haha.. I'm over here thinking I'm special when I really just stressed her outhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyploid
Polyploidy is to do with some doubling of chromosomes and other genetic stuff, it dosent factor into apical dominance and whorled phllotaxy.
You will see three leaved seedlings and mistakenly hear people call them triploids, its real term is a trifoliate, again nothing to do with ploidy of any kind.
One could speculate that ploidy might cause such mutations but the chances are so very rare and the frequency that this suff occurs even within this site is far too vast to ever account for ploidy.
As much as i know
Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
Theres quite a lot of the alternate belief on the internet that it is ploidy and so forth but every now and again you find a thread that will repeat what ive said. Its not too hard to believe when you consider she turns purple in the cold and hermies a lot.Yeah, I mean as rare as everyone makes ploidy seem, there's no way I just happened to stumble across a miracle of nature my 2nd run haha.. I'm over here thinking I'm special when I really just stressed her out
A lot of these traits are hard wired from the eons she spent fighting the harsh conditions in the wild and trying to achieve basic male/female populations etc etc.
Chip Green
Well-Known Member
I have really enjoyed reading what has been discussed here.
Delta-9Pyromaniac
Well-Known Member
Quick pic update.
Attachments
Kingrow1
Well-Known Member
Much better