which bulb

[68grasshopper]

hi, regardless of wattage ,which is best for flowering ??? a hps dual spectrum bulb or a hps red spectrum bulb (super hps) ? presumably it would be the red spec super hps ?
thanks

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

I have been testing different bulbs this year including Phillips 315 3100k cmh, Hortilux Blue MH 400 and 600 watt and Hortilux Super HPS 600 watt and diffeeent combinations of each.

For a single bulb I pick the Hortilux Super Hps for best yield and quality.

The metal halides grew too leafy buds but nice short compact flowering plants. They had less yield and looser buds.

The cmh is pretty awesome but not enough watts to cover a 3.5x3.5’ area and gave 30% less yield. So much for forum hype.

I think a mix is best for hid. I will next time I build set up 2 super hps 600’s with a 315 cmh 3100k in the middle over a 4x8 area.

The full spectrum bulbs with some added blue help with plant leaf health and they stay green easier. Shorter too. And they help bring out natural colors like purple without cold temps.

But hps with its strong red spike and higher intensity per watt is the clear winner of used alone in my garden.

Gave best yield, structure, density and potency. Just not color for bag appeal if purple is desired.

My findings match the university of Michigan indoor grow light testing. I read a lot.

Hope this helps.

 

[thenotsoesoteric]

Honestly the standard hps bulb does a good enough job that I honestly can barely tell a difference between it or the super red, hortalux, or the bluer bulbs. And like MichiganMed said the bluer bulbs are too leafy imo.

For me, I just go standard. For the extra $60+ I just don't see a big difference.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

Honestly the standard hps bulb does a good enough job that I honestly can barely tell a difference between it or the super red, hortalux, or the bluer bulbs. And like MichiganMed said the bluer bulbs are too leafy imo.

For me, I just go standard. For the extra $60+ I just don't see a big difference.

I only pay $65 delivered for Hortilux 600’s. They last longer and I have never had a failure or bad bulb.

And they consistently beat all other single ended bulbs in tests for highest par. Up to 20 % higher than competitors. Good test at Growers House.

They are supposed to have 25% more blue spectrum than a standard hps. That actually makes a perfect flowering spectrum.

Other bulbs have a special added blue spectrum as well. Like the Phillips green power. Which usually costs more.

So they are more expensive but really not much more than any branded horticulture bulb. And cheap Chinese 600’s are still $25-40 anyway.

Mine last for 10 months before showing any real losses on my cheap light meter. I’m sure the spectrum is worse by then. Hortilux suggests replacement by then anyway for best growth.

And I want the best results I can get even if the difference is minor.

 

[68grasshopper]

I have been testing different bulbs this year including Phillips 315 3100k cmh, Hortilux Blue MH 400 and 600 watt and Hortilux Super HPS 600 watt and diffeeent combinations of each.

For a single bulb I pick the Hortilux Super Hps for best yield and quality.

The metal halides grew too leafy buds but nice short compact flowering plants. They had less yield and looser buds.

The cmh is pretty awesome but not enough watts to cover a 3.5x3.5’ area and gave 30% less yield. So much for forum hype.

I think a mix is best for hid. I will next time I build set up 2 super hps 600’s with a 315 cmh 3100k in the middle over a 4x8 area.

The full spectrum bulbs with some added blue help with plant leaf health and they stay green easier. Shorter too. And they help bring out natural colors like purple without cold temps.

But hps with its strong red spike and higher intensity per watt is the clear winner of used alone in my garden.

Gave best yield, structure, density and potency. Just not color for bag appeal if purple is desired.

My findings match the university of Michigan indoor grow light testing. I read a lot.

Hope this helps.

thanks , last grow i used 2 x 315w cmh and my yield was down 8-10 compared to using 2 x 400w hps, def alot of hype and horse shit surrounding these bulbs,mine produced nice solid buds with plenty of thc but very small buds. aleady sold my cmh bulbs, going straight back to hps. thanks for detailed answer.

 

[68grasshopper]

Honestly the standard hps bulb does a good enough job that I honestly can barely tell a difference between it or the super red, hortalux, or the bluer bulbs. And like MichiganMed said the bluer bulbs are too leafy imo.

For me, I just go standard. For the extra $60+ I just don't see a big difference.

cheers buddy ,exactly what im gonna do is go back to hps, got sucked in and believed the hype about cmh and got burnt. atb

 

[68grasshopper]

I only pay $65 delivered for Hortilux 600’s. They last longer and I have never had a failure or bad bulb.

And they consistently beat all other single ended bulbs in tests for highest par. Up to 20 % higher than competitors. Good test at Growers House.

They are supposed to have 25% more blue spectrum than a standard hps. That actually makes a perfect flowering spectrum.

Other bulbs have a special added blue spectrum as well. Like the Phillips green power. Which usually costs more.

So they are more expensive but really not much more than any branded horticulture bulb. And cheap Chinese 600’s are still $25-40 anyway.

Mine last for 10 months before showing any real losses on my cheap light meter. I’m sure the spectrum is worse by then. Hortilux suggests replacement by then anyway for best growth.

And I want the best results I can get even if the difference is minor.

i`ve just had a quick look for hortilux and it seems there not available in the uk so will go back to phillips hps.i`ll def have a look to see i can get them delivered from the us but i think the customs charge will be a killer.
merry xmas.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

i`ve just had a quick look for hortilux and it seems there not available in the uk so will go back to phillips hps.i`ll def have a look to see i can get them delivered from the us but i think the customs charge will be a killer.
merry xmas.

You can get the Phillips hps over there more reasonable I bet.

 

[thenotsoesoteric]

I only pay $65 delivered for Hortilux 600’s. They last longer and I have never had a failure or bad bulb.

And they consistently beat all other single ended bulbs in tests for highest par. Up to 20 % higher than competitors. Good test at Growers House.

They are supposed to have 25% more blue spectrum than a standard hps. That actually makes a perfect flowering spectrum.

Other bulbs have a special added blue spectrum as well. Like the Phillips green power. Which usually costs more.

So they are more expensive but really not much more than any branded horticulture bulb. And cheap Chinese 600’s are still $25-40 anyway.

Mine last for 10 months before showing any real losses on my cheap light meter. I’m sure the spectrum is worse by then. Hortilux suggests replacement by then anyway for best growth.

And I want the best results I can get even if the difference is minor.

I seen my best product with hortilux and a ushio bulb vs standard bulbs but I mean to me it was so minor of a increase over a standard hps bulb that it would be hard to pick out the dry bud grown under each lamps. That's why I tell people if you don't have the extra money for an upgraded bulb then don't worry, you will still have superb buds if you make sure all other areas of your grow are on point.

 

[68grasshopper]

You can get the Phillips hps over there more reasonable I bet.

yeah the 600w phillips greenpower dual spec hps works out about 30 pounds /41 dollar, the 400w greenpower is 20 pounds, so thats what i`ll get .cheers

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

I seen my best product with hortilux and a ushio bulb vs standard bulbs but I mean to me it was so minor of a increase over a standard hps bulb that it would be hard to pick out the dry bud grown under each lamps. That's why I tell people if you don't have the extra money for an upgraded bulb then don't worry, you will still have superb buds if you make sure all other areas of your grow are on point.

Can’t argue with that. I totally agree.

 

[OldMedUser]

I seen my best product with hortilux and a ushio bulb vs standard bulbs but I mean to me it was so minor of a increase over a standard hps bulb that it would be hard to pick out the dry bud grown under each lamps. That's why I tell people if you don't have the extra money for an upgraded bulb then don't worry, you will still have superb buds if you make sure all other areas of your grow are on point.

I recently picked up a used 1000W MH/HPS magnetic ballast for $70Can and at another store was going to get another Hortilux HPS for it and wanted a spare as well but $110 each. The owner showed me these knock-offs made by Light EnerG for $50 each. Said the local commercial growers were grabbing them up and saying they worked as well as the Horts. Almost zero failures reported after 2 years of sales and they work with mags or digi ballasts. The pic of the spectral output on the box was near a twin of the Hort but with slightly higher blue values. WTF I took two and he ended up giving them to me for $40 each as I dropped a grand in the store. Knocked another 10% off my whole order too. Wish he wasn't a 18 hour drive away.

The standard HPS lights like farmers use to light up their yards are nothing compared to something like a good Super HPS. Very much lacking in par in the red and blue areas.

The Philips retro-white bulb for my 400W magnetic HPS ballasts aren't made any more but check out the spectrum from those compared to a cheap HPS.



The 1000W Hortilux Super HPS

 

[full of purple]

I recently picked up a used 1000W MH/HPS magnetic ballast for $70Can and at another store was going to get another Hortilux HPS for it and wanted a spare as well but $110 each. The owner showed me these knock-offs made by Light EnerG for $50 each. Said the local commercial growers were grabbing them up and saying they worked as well as the Horts. Almost zero failures reported after 2 years of sales and they work with mags or digi ballasts. The pic of the spectral output on the box was near a twin of the Hort but with slightly higher blue values. WTF I took two and he ended up giving them to me for $40 each as I dropped a grand in the store. Knocked another 10% off my whole order too. Wish he wasn't a 18 hour drive away.

The standard HPS lights like farmers use to light up their yards are nothing compared to something like a good Super HPS. Very much lacking in par in the red and blue areas.

The Philips retro-white bulb for my 400W magnetic HPS ballasts aren't made any more but check out the spectrum from those compared to a cheap HPS.

View attachment 4059563

The 1000W Hortilux Super HPS

View attachment 4059723

I have a few extra magnetic ballast and a shit load of 1000w Hortilux bulbs only used 1 run
If your close you can have

 

[OldMedUser]

I have a few extra magnetic ballast and a shit load of 1000w Hortilux bulbs only used 1 run
If your close you can have

I doubt I'm close and would likely cost more for shipping, for the ballasts at least, than it would cost to buy used ones like the one I got for $70. Way up in northern Alberta.

That's the hard part. Probably lots of guys nearby that have used gear they would like to sell cheap but no one wants to publicly advertise it for sale for fear of the cops or even worse, rippers.

Very kind offer and I hope you meet a local grower in need that could benefit from your generosity. I actually have more lights than I can use now for my current and planned growing needs. Free shit is always nice tho.

A very Merry Xmas to you and yours!

 

[thenotsoesoteric]

I recently picked up a used 1000W MH/HPS magnetic ballast for $70Can and at another store was going to get another Hortilux HPS for it and wanted a spare as well but $110 each. The owner showed me these knock-offs made by Light EnerG for $50 each. Said the local commercial growers were grabbing them up and saying they worked as well as the Horts. Almost zero failures reported after 2 years of sales and they work with mags or digi ballasts. The pic of the spectral output on the box was near a twin of the Hort but with slightly higher blue values. WTF I took two and he ended up giving them to me for $40 each as I dropped a grand in the store. Knocked another 10% off my whole order too. Wish he wasn't a 18 hour drive away.

The standard HPS lights like farmers use to light up their yards are nothing compared to something like a good Super HPS. Very much lacking in par in the red and blue areas.

The Philips retro-white bulb for my 400W magnetic HPS ballasts aren't made any more but check out the spectrum from those compared to a cheap HPS.

View attachment 4059563

The 1000W Hortilux Super HPS

View attachment 4059723

Killer deal man, and I'm aware of the differences on paper but again if I had a bud grown under a standard hps lamp, the kind I used to buy from a local hardware store, and a bud grown under a horticultural style lamp the average person would not be able to tell a difference and I pretty sure many people who assume they'd be able to tell a difference would fail as well.

While I've personally seen differences in different lamps I never seen such a huge difference that I was like "Bam that's the one." It's always roughly the same final weight, relatively the same smell and resin content. The only big difference I've seen was between MH and HPS lamps. MH a little more resin and terp profiles a little sharper but less weight and a lot more leafy matter, hps denser buds, still great resin and terps profile a little less defined but minimal. That being said, I do prefer the hortilux when I run a 1000w and I prefer the ushio super red for 600w. Currently I'm running a solis tek bulb for my 400w and it's average at best and shitty at worst because quality issues. I've only had the solis tek ballast for 1 year and only have used it 6-8 months and it's already burnt out 2 bulbs, the first happened after only 3-4 weeks of operation.

So to me, I would always tell someone on a budget to worry less about getting an expensive bulb and more about getting environment in check i.e. ph, ventilation and nutrient levels. If they can find a deal like you did then grab it but I'd worry first about getting familiar with growing first. A person will still harvest great bud with standard hps bulb.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

Killer deal man, and I'm aware of the differences on paper but again if I had a bud grown under a standard hps lamp, the kind I used to buy from a local hardware store, and a bud grown under a horticultural style lamp the average person would not be able to tell a difference and I pretty sure many people who assume they'd be able to tell a difference would fail as well.

While I've personally seen differences in different lamps I never seen such a huge difference that I was like "Bam that's the one." It's always roughly the same final weight, relatively the same smell and resin content. The only big difference I've seen was between MH and HPS lamps. MH a little more resin and terp profiles a little sharper but less weight and a lot more leafy matter, hps denser buds, still great resin and terps profile a little less defined but minimal. That being said, I do prefer the hortilux when I run a 1000w and I prefer the ushio super red for 600w. Currently I'm running a solis tek bulb for my 400w and it's average at best and shitty at worst because quality issues. I've only had the solis tek ballast for 1 year and only have used it 6-8 months and it's already burnt out 2 bulbs, the first happened after only 3-4 weeks of operation.

So to me, I would always tell someone on a budget to worry less about getting an expensive bulb and more about getting environment in check i.e. ph, ventilation and nutrient levels. If they can find a deal like you did then grab it but I'd worry first about getting familiar with growing first. A person will still harvest great bud with standard hps bulb.

What do you like better about the Ushio 600 over the Hortilux? I have not tried it.

 

[thenotsoesoteric]

What do you like better about the Ushio 600 over the Hortilux? I have not tried it.

I haven't actually tried the hortilux 600, so I couldn't compare it to that but out of the 3 or 4 other bulbs I tried for my 600w I preferred that one. I've tried several 1000w bulbs and brands and even the hps dual MH bulbs but the hortilux was my go to for the 1000w.

 

[Lucky Luke]

Interesting thread.
I just use the cheap bulbs and from what's been stated so far ill continue to do so.

 

[OldMedUser]

So to me, I would always tell someone on a budget to worry less about getting an expensive bulb and more about getting environment in check i.e. ph, ventilation and nutrient levels. If they can find a deal like you did then grab it but I'd worry first about getting familiar with growing first. A person will still harvest great bud with standard hps bulb.

I pretty much agree but have had to run out and buy a hardware store hps when my 1000W SunMaster Warm White conversion bulb blew at the start of my 4th flowering stage with it. Cost me about $150 back in 2002. Was my 4th run of the same Kali Mist clones from the same mom grown the same way in DWC with the same jugs of AN nutes and the results were the worst ever. Light, airy buds and barely over half the yield at around 60%. A friend quit growing and sold me two 400W magnetic HPS ballasts and one 400MH with all Hortilux bulbs and the 2 400s gave me even better yields than the Sunmaster did and way better than the standard HPS bulb.

There's just not enough PAR watts in those bulbs for optimal growth but almost any HPS bulb made for plants will give much better results and many can be bought for 10-$20 more than those old style ones. Still better than nothing tho.

Nowadays, new growers can go online and pick up a complete grow setup with tent, carbon filter, ballast with both MH and HPS bulbs and all the bits and pieces to just add plants and grow for a few hundred dollars. None of it is top grade but enough to get a few grows under their belts. With the money they save not having to buy pot they can upgrade as they go along and their skills have improved enough to get the most out of better gear.

With any new hobby one should start with adequate gear that's not too costly and if your interest grows then so should your investment so you can get the most enjoyment and best results out of it. If you find that it doesn't float your boat and you abandon it then you're not out a huge amount.