Does Veg Time make a difference? Your Opinion..

Richard Drysift

Well-Known Member
This is true but also depends on strain wouldn’t u think??? Also 8 plants is a lot more work IMO and more soil Nutrients and so on, Me personally I would rather train 2 or 3 plants and creat a manifold than to have 8 3 gal pots IMO....
Of course strain has some sway over yields but for the most part weed is weed. I sorted out the keepers long ago. More work? YES but not that much more. More nutrients? No about the same maybe slightly less because smaller plants but in organic soil i just water them anyway. It is all a matter of preference really.
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
The sad fact is that because enough are very limited in plant count they advertise scrogs and low number grows as being a lot more efficient than they really are.

The led scroggers are the worst, on one thread they are raving about the efficiency of their Qb's and cobs but then they kill all that ppfd in a five month scrog, face palm....!
 

ColoradoHighGrower

Well-Known Member
This is very interesting discussion - all other factors aside (like COB vs hydro vs SCROG vs SOG), my guess is that there is a sweet spot for yield gain due to veg time, and beyond that, there are rapidly diminishing rates of return. It is likely a left-skewed distribution like the graph on the bottom (sweet-spot at/near the mode line, with time on horizontal axis, and grams/watt on the vertical axis):

firstgraph.jpg
 

Tx-Peanutt

Well-Known Member
The sad fact is that because enough are very limited in plant count they advertise scrogs and low number grows as being a lot more efficient than they really are.

The led scroggers are the worst, on one thread they are raving about the efficiency of their Qb's and cobs but then they kill all that ppfd in a five month scrog, face palm....!
Wry true I guess if I was growing in a room 16 x 16 with 8ft of height I would probably drow 20 plants in 3 gal pots with no topping just flip to flower as quick as possible but I’m in a tent so I make as many colas as I can to get the best bang for my space
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
Wry true I guess if I was growing in a room 16 x 16 with 8ft of height I would probably drow 20 plants in 3 gal pots with no topping just flip to flower as quick as possible but I’m in a tent so I make as many colas as I can to get the best bang for my space
Your trying to give premise to scrogs being more efficient in one way or the other when simply it has always been known that sog trumps scrog.

You may prefer to do big plants in a 16x16x8 room but others have filled same size rooms with hydro gullies channels or tubes and sog'ed every inch bar a central channel to gain access and grown more. Sog lends itself well to vertical styles over scrogs or bigger plants.

I didnt make this conclusion, was already a fact when i got here. Lots of plants are easy to manage in automated hydro.
 

Flowki

Well-Known Member
This is true but also depends on strain wouldn’t u think??? Also 8 plants is a lot more work IMO and more soil Nutrients and so on, Me personally I would rather train 2 or 3 plants and creat a manifold than to have 8 3 gal pots IMO....
Manifolding 3 plants is just as much work as potting up 8 plants topped twice. You'll need a lot more veg time with manifold and will yield less (besides initial footprint/intensity waste). A 4x4 canopy is a 4x4 canopy, it will require similar base water volume to sustain it no matter the pot count, assuming correct pot sizes. You will yield less or have to veg longer doing manifold as it's not a good way to fill out the width and upper canopy to collect the best light. That in turn will mean they don't drink quite as much water due to less intensity (best case). Running the 8 topped properly will fill the area quicker, have more leaf area at top and will drink more water as a result. In essence yield% will increase with water%.

Sog is essentially the top of the pyramid in growing. During the first week or two of veg, far more of the foot print is being used by the increased initial root mass>canopy size, it's far more efficient use of light and will multiply speed and efficiency with each veg light. If the setup or desire for full sog is not there then you take the next step down the pyramid. Run as many plants as you can in the given time frame and applicable topping to control height and width. Stepping down and down the pyramid with the likes of single plant scrog, you lose more and more efficiency>yield.

I'm not trying to tell you what to do but pointing out that manifold is low down the pyramid. You will be putting in X amount of base work to grow and maintain a healthy 4x4 or 8x8 canopy regardless of style but it isn't rewarded equally across styles in end annual yield. Yield is a subjective goal but many share it.
 

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
the style you should adopt depends on your available room, and how deep your light can penetrate. there's no point in vegging for 6 months and growing trees if your light only penetrates 18 inches. or 24, or w/e. if you don't see good bright spots of light penetrating all the way down to the bottom of your canopy, then your canopy is too deep.
 

Tx-Peanutt

Well-Known Member
Your trying to give premise to scrogs being more efficient in one way or the other when simply it has always been known that sog trumps scrog.

You may prefer to do big plants in a 16x16x8 room but others have filled same size rooms with hydro gullies channels or tubes and sog'ed every inch bar a central channel to gain access and grown more. Sog lends itself well to vertical styles over scrogs or bigger plants.

I didnt make this conclusion, was already a fact when i got here. Lots of plants are easy to manage in automated hydro.
I was under the impression that a s.o.g is no topping just veg for a few weeks and switch to flower with a bunch of plants in your space ???? I am not saying that anything is better just giving my opinion I never once said that anything was better not even once did I say that.... So if your growing in a 3x3 grow tent in soil u will yield more using a s.o.g than a scrog??? I can’t see how that would be possible without knowing how a strain grows out ... So depending on your style of growing and method of growing like soil or hydro has a lot to do with your final yield.. Some strains might do better than others in a sog but some might not .. I have grown 2 GG and just with a simple LST it performed way better than a single cola GG did I yielded more with LSTing it with out even topping it. for my space topping and LST just gives me a better yield IMO.Dude u are either half ass reading my post and just trying to argue like a dumbass cuz I never once said I was growing in a 16x16x8 room, all I said was if I was growing in a room that Big ... What a schmuck
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
I was under the impression that a s.o.g is no topping just veg for a few weeks and switch to flower with a bunch of plants in your space ???? I am not saying that anything is better just giving my opinion I never once said that anything was better not even oncee did I say that.... So if your growing in a 3x3 grow tent in soil u will yield more using a s.o.g than a scrog??? I can’t see how that would be possible without knowing how a strain grows out ... So depending on your style of growing and method of growing like soil or hydro has a lot to do with your final yield.. Some strains might do better than others in a sog but some might not .. I have grown 2 GG and just with a simple LST it performed way better than a single cola GG did I yielded more with LSTing it with out even topping it. for my space topping and LST just gives me a better yield IMO.Dude u are either half ass reading my post and just trying to argue like a dumbass cuz I never once said I was growing in a 16x16x8 room, all I said was if I was growing in a room that Big ... What a schmuck
And your a Dweeb but childish name calling aside sog trumps your methods as i and others have said. It dosent matter soil hydro or strain someones already done it all and proved the point.
 

Cannabis.Queen

Well-Known Member
Sog will pretty much always win. Bit I'll say it again... we don't all have unlimited plant counts.
This is the main factor.

I train for months and make them strong. Usually I would grow them a few months (like I'm doing now with my outdoor) then place them out. And I am, but I also have plants ive been growing since I got ripped last year of half my grow. So now I have huge plants indoors flowering now and I'll have 10 plants outdoors this year plus maybe a few autos.

I don't have to worry about plant count and I try not to worry about yield much either since it's all personal. But I do know I get a better yield in quality of bud and bud density. I believe this works the same way as a sog. The plant senses that it can support more and heavier bud and conforms to that. When left without a strong support system like a net it strong branches holding up the goodies; the goodies fall a bit short an light in my opinion :)
 

gwheels

Well-Known Member
This is the main factor.

I train for months and make them strong. Usually I would grow them a few months (like I'm doing now with my outdoor) then place them out. And I am, but I also have plants ive been growing since I got ripped last year of half my grow. So now I have huge plants indoors flowering now and I'll have 10 plants outdoors this year plus maybe a few autos.

I don't have to worry about plant count and I try not to worry about yield much either since it's all personal. But I do know I get a better yield in quality of bud and bud density. I believe this works the same way as a sog. The plant senses that it can support more and heavier bud and conforms to that. When left without a strong support system like a net it strong branches holding up the goodies; the goodies fall a bit short an light in my opinion :)
I agree completely. Our new rules will be 4 plants per household max so sog is ok if you want to pull 4 oz every 12 weeks but I would rather pull 8 to 16 oz every 16 weeks. If plant count was 8 i would run an 8 pot system and flip it sooner.

If you have no limit fill it up flip in 2 weeks and every 12 to 14 weeks you harvest

Here if i sogged 4 plants I would have about 4 harvests a year and get 4 to 6 oz mean average 5 aprox total = 5 oz or 20 per year

With 4 plants and a 4 week veg it is 14 to 16 weeks would be 3.5 harvests per year at 8 to 12 oz mean average 10.
aprox total = 10 x 3.5 = 35 oz per year

With 4 plants and a 6 week veg it is 16 to 18 weeks would be 3 harvests with a 12 to 16 oz mean average 14 oz
aprox total = 14 X 3 = 42 oz

So it is really about what you have the ability to grow. If you can grow 16 in a 4 x 4 and flip in a short time you will get 14 to 16 oz but we can't do that so a longer veg works better.

:)

Just my 5 cents. We pitched the penny years ago so 2 cents makes no sense :D
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
I agree completely. Our new rules will be 4 plants per household max so sog is ok if you want to pull 4 oz every 12 weeks but I would rather pull 8 to 16 oz every 16 weeks. If plant count was 8 i would run an 8 pot system and flip it sooner.

If you have no limit fill it up flip in 2 weeks and every 12 to 14 weeks you harvest

Here if i sogged 4 plants I would have about 4 harvests a year and get 4 to 6 oz mean average 5 aprox total = 5 oz or 20 per year

With 4 plants and a 4 week veg it is 14 to 16 weeks would be 3.5 harvests per year at 8 to 12 oz mean average 10.
aprox total = 10 x 3.5 = 35 oz per year

With 4 plants and a 6 week veg it is 16 to 18 weeks would be 3 harvests with a 12 to 16 oz mean average 14 oz
aprox total = 14 X 3 = 42 oz

So it is really about what you have the ability to grow. If you can grow 16 in a 4 x 4 and flip in a short time you will get 14 to 16 oz but we can't do that so a longer veg works better.

:)

Just my 5 cents. We pitched the penny years ago so 2 cents makes no sense :D
No one cares what the answer is in legal states, your not the only growers here, stop trying to take over the site because you can only grow four measley plants, four plants wtf, your barely a grower at four plants ffs....!
 

NanoGadget

Well-Known Member
No one cares what the answer is in legal states, your not the only growers here, stop trying to take over the site because you can only grow four measley plants, four plants wtf, your barely a grower at four plants ffs....!
What a silly, elitist thing to say. So only commercial growers are real growers? There are hell of a lot more personal/hobbyist growers in the world than there are large scale commercial ops. If you think that way why don't you and all the other weed tycoons go start a private club where you can stroke each other's egos and look down on the peasants without having to smell them.
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
What a silly, elitist thing to say. So only commercial growers are real growers? There are hell of a lot more personal/hobbyist growers in the world than there are large scale commercial ops. If you think that way why don't you and all the other weed tycoons go start a private club where you can stroke each other's egos and look down on the peasants without having to smell them.
We did, its called Rollitup, im telling you four plants is a sucky amount to be limited to right now on it.
 

gwheels

Well-Known Member
We did, its called Rollitup, im telling you four plants is a sucky amount to be limited to right now on it.
For personal use 4 plants is plenty. Or 6 in a few states ? If everyone grew 4 plants the commercial guys would be out of business.

1 pound off of 4 is not impossible and it is faster off of 6. 3 x 3 or 4 x 4 tent is all you need.

It was asking for an opinion. I gave mine. It would help steer people with a limited plant number. If it is not limited SOG is the quickest way to gain weight.

You dont have to be an asshole about it but maybe you can't help yourself.

Maybe have a bong rip or something.
 

Lucky Luke

Well-Known Member
SOG will always pull more over a year, followed by scrog. I think we all know this.

I don't do SOG as that puts me into a trafficable quantity (20 plants is bad where I am and I'm in a non legal country and I'm to old and pretty to go to gaol.) So I have run scrogs and just trained plants.
Its all about a full canopy no matter how you grow.

My thoughts are if a more mature plant has a better quality flower or not. I'm thinking it may do.
 
Top