John Dingell has a few ideas about how to fix American politics

[ttystikk]

I reject your hopeless cynicism.

Things are better today than they were 40 years ago. In some ways, not all.

There is bad:
I don't deny that the economic condition of the 90% stagnated while the 10% have accumulated all the economic gains. Also economic conditions of the lower 30% have gotten awful.

On the plus side, we have made social progress. The ADA, progress towards increased diversity in the workforce, education methods and attitudes have improved. We no longer accept the "my country right or wrong" belief. The implementation of the Affordable Care Act was a leap forward towards universal access to healthcare. It's not a big deal to have black and women political leaders. These are important changes that set the stage for a more progressive society. It can't happen the other way -- economic improvements without social improvements mean large groups of our society get left behind.

If you want to disregard social progress because we've lost ground economically, I counter that with the idea that the 10% has used racism and misogyny to take over our government. Social progress is economic progress. We are making progress in an important area and everybody will benefit over the next 10-20 years.

But not next year.

So, I reject your hopeless cynicism.

You mislabel me.

Politically, things are definitely worse. I can't wait for your argument to the contrary lol

Socially, things are definitely not better; ask Jewish people, LGBT people or people of color instead of white washing so much.

Economically, things are more polarized than ever.

But golly, isn't your new smartphone sexy?

If there was no hope, I wouldn't bother discussing things.

I'm not optimistic, that's true. Having paid attention in history class, I'm well aware of how much worse things will likely have to get before they change.

 

[Unclebaldrick]

That you say this is fun for you speaks volumes about the bankruptcy of your character.

Blah blah blah, have you met fake buddhaboy?

 

[Jenns36]

so i'm filling in the blanks with the tty/sky story and am intrigued:

he flew her to CO for presumed "relations", she stayed for a bit, sent him on an errand or 2 and then "borrowed" a bunch of his weed to fly back to FL with.

that close?

And then he brought her back again! And I dont think she borrowed or stole it I think he gave it to her but classic lie from a narcissist to blame it on her and say she took it

 

[londonfog]

And then he brought her back again! And I dont think she borrowed or stole it I think he gave it to her but classic lie from a narcissist to blame it on her and say she took it

how you know she didn't take it when she sent him on a "honey do " mission. What women seeds a man off for make up. I have been married for over 20 years and have NEVER bought my wife makeup. Do you steal his weed also ?

 

[Jenns36]

how you know she didn't take it when she sent him on a "honey do " mission. What women seeds a man off for make up. I have been married for over 20 years and have NEVER bought my wife makeup. Do you steal his weed also ?

Why would you bring the person back if they stole from you? She came back so I guarantee she didn't. And no I am not a thief

 

[schuylaar]

I read the article. It wasn't from one of the many odious propaganda sites that tty posts from and thought the ideas were OK.

Two questions that came to me when reading the article:

Is the problem of division and stalemate in government really due to the constitution due to the people of this country?
Isn't it better if people fund campaigns through small donations rather than the government itself?

Regarding the outsized voice given to states with small populations in the Senate, it that such a bad thing? 32% of the population of the US reside in four states: California, Texas, Florida and New York. If we fix our "problem" by removing the Senate, wouldn't those four states ensure continuance of their place in the balance of power by channeling most resources and attention to themselves?

I also think that the article ignores the demographic shift going on today that is the source of so much anxiety and polarization in the current white majority. This gets back to my questioning if the real problem isn't the Senate but the people who vote for extreme nut jobs like Trump and radical right wing Republicans.

if you get rid of donor class and EC, everything else will fall into place..it's that simple.

 

[Fogdog]

You mislabel me.

Politically, things are definitely worse. I can't wait for your argument to the contrary lol

Socially, things are definitely not better; ask Jewish people, LGBT people or people of color instead of white washing so much.

Economically, things are more polarized than ever.

But golly, isn't your new smartphone sexy?

If there was no hope, I wouldn't bother discussing things.

I'm not optimistic, that's true. Having paid attention in history class, I'm well aware of how much worse things will likely have to get before they change.

40 years ago

The Kavanaugh hearings? Wouldn't have happened.
The "me too" movement? Wouldn't have happened
Black, latino, women practically nonexistent in political leadership positions, much less in business.

Today, white blue collar workers are despondent and have the highest suicide rates while minority blue collar workers more often see a brighter future for themselves and their kids.

Compared to white people, minorities are more optimistic than white people and more optimistic than they were 40 years ago

I understand that your cynical viewpoint demand we agree with your view that things are worse than 40 years ago but really, it's white men like you who think so.

Source: https://www.brookings.edu/articles/why-are-black-poor-americans-more-optimistic-than-white-ones/

Why are black poor Americans more optimistic than white ones?

The explanations for these trends are complex, but economics and ambition play a part. For many years, blue-collar white people had some advantages over minorities, but they are now among the most disaffected parts of society and the most vulnerable to deaths of despair. Crucially, they are much more likely to report that their lives are worse than those of their parents and, in terms of stable employment and status, that is often the case.

In contrast, black and Hispanic people are more likely to report that their lives are better than their parents’ lives. While disadvantage and discrimination still exist, minorities have been making gradual progress in narrowing gaps with white people in terms of their education, wages, and life expectancy. Some of this is because of concrete gains made by those communities. But much of the improvement is due to the relative decline in the incomes and status of poor white people—a trend associated with the hollowing-out of blue-collar jobs, which are decreasing in both number and stability at the same time as the market for high-skilled labor continues to prosper and grow.

We are finally approaching a condition where we are truly "all in this together". 40 years ago, assholes like Ronald Reagan or 20 years ago, assholes like Newt and even today, assholes like Trump could play off whites, who still are the voting majority, against minority people. But no more. The blue wave of the most previous election shows how progressive-minded people can vote together to make the changes that are necessary to bring this society back into balance. I get it, you think everything is fixed and Democrats are no better than Republicans. If you looked at the facts, you'd know you were wrong but cynics only see the dark side of things.

 

[schuylaar]

But the elephant in the room is that 33% of the electorate are as dumb as a fucking rock.

And that 40%-50% of the potential electorate choose not to be involved.

And there's that damn 1st ammendment that promotes fake news to the 33% that are dumb as a rock.

When you have ideas on how to enlighten the masses, let me know.

Maybe a children's news program to explain civics, history and political science and 4 week election cycles.

you can't change the 33%; we must wait for them to die..expanding the electorate through GOP'ers turned indies, millennials, gen z, felon voters and pending redistricting is how it will change.

 

[Jenns36]

you can't change the 33%; we must wait for them to die..expanding the electorate through GOP'ers turned indies, millennials, gen z, felon voters and pending redistricting is how it will change.

Who taught you all this information let me guess the man who buys you cosmetics? You're pathetic too

 

[Rob Roy]

This is absolutely true. Witness convicts risking their lives fighting fires in California- for a dollar an hour.

There is nothing in any way acceptable about that compensation policy.

It would be ironic if any of the fire fighting convicts were incarcerated because they were arsonists.

 

[Fogdog]

Who taught you all this information let me guess the man who buys you cosmetics? You're pathetic too

Actually, in this case, probably the only case ever, I think sky is right. The 33% is an aging and shrinking demographic of white racist-leaning voters who are probably never going to change or vote for progressive policies. Fortunately, they are already a minority and we just have to hedge them in and wait until the Trump voter to dies off while we bring in other voting groups that have been shut out or discouraged from voting to ensure the progressive trends in the US continue.

 

[Fogdog]

if you get rid of donor class and EC, everything else will fall into place..it's that simple.

I agree. Except it won't be simple and the backlash might be violent. The backlash in France, for example, shows that forward thinking leaders can't get too far ahead of the crowd and can't ignore the foot-dragging conservative right.

 

[Jenns36]

Actually, in this case, probably the only case ever, I think sky is right. The 33% is an aging and shrinking demographic of white racist-leaning voters who are probably never going to change or vote for progressive policies. Fortunately, they are already a minority and we just have to hedge them in and wait until the Trump voter to dies off while we bring in other voting groups that have been shut out or discouraged from voting to ensure the progressive trends in the US continue.

If she is right it was only by mere luck.

 

[Fogdog]

If she is right it was only by mere luck.

How did you come up with that belief?

 

[rkymtnman]

Do you steal his weed also ?

i've seen pics of it. i'd have given it back to be honest. lol

 

[Jenns36]

i've seen pics of it. i'd have given it back to be honest. lol

It is shit weed and doesn't even get you high

 

[ttystikk]

40 years ago

The Kavanaugh hearings? Wouldn't have happened.
The "me too" movement? Wouldn't have happened
Black, latino, women practically nonexistent in political leadership positions, much less in business.

Today, white blue collar workers are despondent and have the highest suicide rates while minority blue collar workers more often see a brighter future for themselves and their kids.

Compared to white people, minorities are more optimistic than white people and more optimistic than they were 40 years ago

I understand that your cynical viewpoint demand we agree with your view that things are worse than 40 years ago but really, it's white men like you who think so.

Source: https://www.brookings.edu/articles/why-are-black-poor-americans-more-optimistic-than-white-ones/

Why are black poor Americans more optimistic than white ones?

The explanations for these trends are complex, but economics and ambition play a part. For many years, blue-collar white people had some advantages over minorities, but they are now among the most disaffected parts of society and the most vulnerable to deaths of despair. Crucially, they are much more likely to report that their lives are worse than those of their parents and, in terms of stable employment and status, that is often the case.

In contrast, black and Hispanic people are more likely to report that their lives are better than their parents’ lives. While disadvantage and discrimination still exist, minorities have been making gradual progress in narrowing gaps with white people in terms of their education, wages, and life expectancy. Some of this is because of concrete gains made by those communities. But much of the improvement is due to the relative decline in the incomes and status of poor white people—a trend associated with the hollowing-out of blue-collar jobs, which are decreasing in both number and stability at the same time as the market for high-skilled labor continues to prosper and grow.

We are finally approaching a condition where we are truly "all in this together". 40 years ago, assholes like Ronald Reagan or 20 years ago, assholes like Newt and even today, assholes like Trump could play off whites, who still are the voting majority, against minority people. But no more. The blue wave of the most previous election shows how progressive-minded people can vote together to make the changes that are necessary to bring this society back into balance. I get it, you think everything is fixed and Democrats are no better than Republicans. If you looked at the facts, you'd know you were wrong but cynics only see the dark side of things.

If this is your defense of 'things are better now than they were 40 years ago' you've failed completely.

Typical.

 

[Jenns36]

If this is your defense of 'things are better now than they were 40 years ago' you've failed completely.

Typical.

Where's your defense that it isn't Tty

 

[rkymtnman]

It is shit weed and doesn't even get you high

i gave tty the benefit of the doubt. sometimes looks can be deceiving. plus i'm not driving that far up to Fo Co for herb.

 

[Unclebaldrick]

i gave tty the benefit of the doubt. sometimes looks can be deceiving. plus i'm not driving that far up to Fo Co for herb.

I'm done with him. Being an attack dog is not usually something I take to with alacrity, but his politics have gone to shit and his attitude of attacking anybody that does not agree has become beyond tedious. I won't try to chase him off but I will continue to savage his bullshit consparcon theories and expose his hypocritical nonsense.