Possibility of WW3?

[scumrot derelict]

The only way I can see that happening is if we just close our borders completely. Then we fight it out with ourselves. Only once we can achieve peace and learn not to screw with each other like in the novel "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress," by Robert Heinlen, should we have the right to mingle with the rest of the world. The US is still an infant, who cries, and isn't ready to move out. But I worry by the time we do become adults, the world will have passed us by. Or maybe the rest of the world will become a utopia, and it won't matter how backward we are. Sort of like that one Star Trek TNG episode where this rich guy froze himself, and was surprised the concept of stocks didn't exist anymore.

Some stuff to address in there, but I want to hear from @New Age United first.

I feel like if he can agree with that post, then he has something else to add.

 

[New Age United]

Elaborate. Why? And how would you enforce a new set of rules to keep this from ever happening again? What would you do to prevent it?

Because the super wealthy have been using the masses like pawns for thousands of years, it was all business as usual to these people. I honestly don't know if we can do anything about it, they have us so divided and feuding amongst ourselves that we will never be able to come together and reform.

As far as UN resolutions and treaties I think they can crumble very easily when real world conflicts escalate into all out war so I don't think we should feel secure that WW3 is not a real possibility.

But honestly I'm not well educated in the politics of Iran or Syria or any other country besides Canada and the US for that matter, that's why I came here to try to gain some insight into what is actually happening and what this last week's events in Iraq mean for the future of relations and peace.

 

[scumrot derelict]

Because the super wealthy have been using the masses like pawns for thousands of years, it was all business as usual to these people. I honestly don't know if we can do anything about it, they have us so divided and feuding amongst ourselves that we will never be able to come together and reform.

As far as UN resolutions and treaties I think they can crumble very easily when real world conflicts escalate into all out war so I don't think we should feel secure that WW3 is not a real possibility.

But honestly I'm not well educated in the politics of Iran or Syria or any other country besides Canada and the US for that matter, that's why I came here to try to gain some insight into what is actually happening and what this last week's events in Iraq mean for the future of relations and peace.

That's fair. Entirely fair, in fact. I wish I had something to give you back, but, I'm in the same caliber. I've never been a foreign policy expert, or someone who's been involved with Syrian and Iranian politics for any amount of time. All I can remember from my scatterbrained-and-fucktarded point of view is that when we bomb, they are DEFINITELY not afraid to retaliate, and that what little we have seen in escalation these past few days are just the first taste.

 

[scumrot derelict]

it shakes me to the core.

if you talked to the 20 year old me, i would have laughed in your face and either tried to borrow beer money from you, or just changed the subject to something about music, or maybe the shitty art i enjoy. but, now that I have a kid and a family, it's almost instinctual to have these scared and negative feelings.

dont even know what to do with them. it's terrifying to me that someone like this is leading the charge in a situation that can affect so many innocent and honest lives.

it's getting really hard to separate the bullshit anymore.

 

[Communist Dreamer]

Some stuff to address in there, but I want to hear from @New Age United first.

I feel like if he can agree with that post, then he has something else to add.

I feel like this is such a complicated issue. Because it deals with immigration and emigration.

The road to get there could first cause immigration problems:
If we close the border, how do we know who they are? To stop criminals and prevent those with disease who need treatment. Making them illegal doesn't fix that. So do we let them in like we did with Ellis Island, but move it to the Mexico border?

Do we fortify our border with real border patrol? Then how easily do our own citizens leave and come back, or do we let them back? Cause the whole wall thing is stupid AF.

Then there's economics issues. Both Mexico and Canada don't easily let foreigners become permanent residents unless they invest a huge amount of money, or have some talent that makes them useful. We're pretty much the only country who has such a lenient immigration policy. It only seems barbaric since you're dealing with so many more immigrants than any other country in the world does.

I wish we could just move to a system where everyone does what they're good at, and they're compensated fairly. Unlike the capitalist system where the worker is a slave and the capitalist owner dictates the rules.

What I also hate is how people says "hey, if you don't like how your job treats you, get a new one!" I don't think those people have any concept of reality. You lose seniority, the benefits already gained, and they have these secret lists the capitalists can look up online to know all about you. Since whatever problem was that made you quit, they don't want the drama.

But none of us want to talk about the real issues, and instead use hyperboles and the equivalent of memes that get us nowhere and just fight.

 

[New Age United]

That's fair. Entirely fair, in fact. I wish I had something to give you back, but, I'm in the same caliber. I've never been a foreign policy expert, or someone who's been involved with Syrian and Iranian politics for any amount of time. All I can remember from my scatterbrained-and-fucktarded point of view is that when we bomb, they are DEFINITELY not afraid to retaliate, and that what little we have seen in escalation these past few days are just the first taste.

I don't doubt that Iran or any of these rogue militias in the middle East are afraid of war, I don't think they will coward and disband at the last moment like the Iraqis did, but I guess what I'm really wondering about is the involvement of higher powers like Russia, China and NATO forces. Is there any likelyhood at all that things could escalate into a massive war.

Like I said I have no faith in UN resolutions just like the league of nations collapsed before WW2 so too could the UN, I'm not one for indulging in conspiracy theories but I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to find out that events like WW2 and 9/11 were orchestrated by the world superpowers which of course are governed by the ultra wealthy. I forget who said it but someone once said if you're looking for the culprit look for the ones who have the most to gain. In WW2 it was to end the great depression, in 9/11 it was for oil, I'm not sure what any side has to gain now I thought most of the industrial world was starting to boom, you would think that war on any scale would be counter-productive at this stage but I think the people pulling the strings have expert opinions on psychology and human nature and somehow they know just what they are doing to benefit themselves the most.

 

[scumrot derelict]

I feel like this is such a complicated issue. Because it deals with immigration and emigration.

The road to get there could first cause immigration problems:
If we close the border, how do we know who they are? To stop criminals and prevent those with disease who need treatment. Making them illegal doesn't fix that. So do we let them in like we did with Ellis Island, but move it to the Mexico border?

Do we fortify our border with real border patrol? Then how easily do our own citizens leave and come back, or do we let them back? Cause the whole wall thing is stupid AF.

Then there's economics issues. Both Mexico and Canada don't easily let foreigners become permanent residents unless they invest a huge amount of money, or have some talent that makes them useful. We're pretty much the only country who has such a lenient immigration policy. It only seems barbaric since you're dealing with so many more immigrants than any other country in the world does.

I wish we could just move to a system where everyone does what they're good at, and they're compensated fairly. Unlike the capitalist system where the worker is a slave and the capitalist owner dictates the rules.

What I also hate is how people says "hey, if you don't like how your job treats you, get a new one!" I don't think those people have any concept of reality. You lose seniority, the benefits already gained, and they have these secret lists the capitalists can look up online to know all about you. Since whatever problem was that made you quit, they don't want the drama.

But none of us want to talk about the real issues, and instead use hyperboles and the equivalent of memes that get us nowhere and just fight.

You realize I am drunk as shit and trying to enjoy my first night out in almost a month right? Goddamnit,

>_< wall of text.

I'll just say this: I'm sure we agree on the fundamentals: https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/pages/attachments/2016/03/03/fundamentals_of_immigration_law_-_feb_2016.pdf

Stipulate that the interpretation above is factual and then we can do the immigration talk, because I am way too fucking exhausted to explain how all the "fake news" and "yer a marxist fascist globalist communist socialist leftist" defenses that get thrown around on the boards are just so fucking tired and boring to respond to.

 

[Communist Dreamer]

You realize I am drunk as shit and trying to enjoy my first night out in almost a month right? Goddamnit,

>_< wall of text.

I'll just say this: I'm sure we agree on the fundamentals: https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/pages/attachments/2016/03/03/fundamentals_of_immigration_law_-_feb_2016.pdf

Stipulate that the interpretation above is factual and then we can do the immigration talk, because I am way too fucking exhausted to explain how all the "fake news" and "yer a marxist fascist globalist communist socialist leftist" defenses that get thrown around on the boards are just so fucking tired and boring to respond to.

Sorry dude. Enjoy yourself. I sometimes just throw things out. It wasn't my intention to do the WOT. These are complicated issues. Each topic I introduced could be a book in and of it self and is hard to do in a Tweet like fashion everyone wants these days. Twitter has ruined our lives!

 

[scumrot derelict]

Sorry dude. Enjoy yourself. I sometimes just throw things out. It wasn't my intention to do the WOT. These are complicated issues. Each topic I introduced could be a book in and of it self and is hard to do in a Tweet like fashion everyone wants these days. Twitter has ruined our lives!

needed that today!

 

[New Age United]

I feel like this is such a complicated issue. Because it deals with immigration and emigration.

The road to get there could first cause immigration problems:
If we close the border, how do we know who they are? To stop criminals and prevent those with disease who need treatment. Making them illegal doesn't fix that. So do we let them in like we did with Ellis Island, but move it to the Mexico border?

Do we fortify our border with real border patrol? Then how easily do our own citizens leave and come back, or do we let them back? Cause the whole wall thing is stupid AF.

Then there's economics issues. Both Mexico and Canada don't easily let foreigners become permanent residents unless they invest a huge amount of money, or have some talent that makes them useful. We're pretty much the only country who has such a lenient immigration policy. It only seems barbaric since you're dealing with so many more immigrants than any other country in the world does.

I wish we could just move to a system where everyone does what they're good at, and they're compensated fairly. Unlike the capitalist system where the worker is a slave and the capitalist owner dictates the rules.

What I also hate is how people says "hey, if you don't like how your job treats you, get a new one!" I don't think those people have any concept of reality. You lose seniority, the benefits already gained, and they have these secret lists the capitalists can look up online to know all about you. Since whatever problem was that made you quit, they don't want the drama.

But none of us want to talk about the real issues, and instead use hyperboles and the equivalent of memes that get us nowhere and just fight.

I'm not a fan of capitalism either I'm a socialist, but the name intrigues me to ask if you are communist or Marxist or do you just have ideals of such and don't actually identify as either???

 

[Communist Dreamer]

I'm not a fan of capitalism either I'm a socialist, but the name intrigues me to ask if you are communist or Marxist or do you just have ideals of such and don't actually identify as either???

The first step is eliminating the owner and slave relationship, so the worker owns their work, and just isn't paid in money what the owner thinks is fair. There's a lot of things I don't agree with on Marx. Such as we need the socialist stage. Especially if said socialism only changes Microsoft to "US Department of Operating Systems," but still keeps Bill Gates as the perpetual sole committee member. Since there'd be no difference as what is going on right now, except it's much harder to impossible to sue the government.

Through technology I think we could run simulations on how to get to the communist stage where everyone is give the exact amount of resources they need, not which resources are easiest to acquire with capital, that results in inefficient waste. But hey, we saved a buck!

 

[New Age United]

The first step is eliminating the owner and slave relationship, so the worker owns their work, and just isn't paid in money what the owner thinks is fair. There's a lot of things I don't agree with on Marx. Such as we need the socialist stage. Especially if said socialism only changes Microsoft to "US Department of Operating Systems," but still keeps Bill Gates as the perpetual sole committee member. Since there'd be no difference as what is going on right now, except it's much harder to impossible to sue the government.

Through technology I think we could run simulations on how to get to the communist stage where everyone is give the exact amount of resources they need, not which resources are easiest to acquire with capital, that results in inefficient waste. But hey, we saved a buck!

See I'm more socialist I would prefer a system where different trades have different salaries but the employees own the capital and run the company, and government would have a plethora of necessary social programs ensuring that the basic needs for life are met for every every citizen. The money that would have gone to and been hoarded by the ultra wealthy can now go to higher taxes, much higher maybe even 50%, which would be a flat rate for everyone of every income, and can now be funneled into these social programs.

History has shown us that you cannot reform without a shift in consciousness, if the collective consensus is not in accordance with the new ideals than it will fail, and as we've seen in the past this division can cause much conflict and war. I believe that the majority of people need to attain Enlightenment in order for something like communism to come into full effect perhaps in a few hundred years of conscious evolution we will be there but I absolutely do believe that socialism is the next step and is attainable in our lifetime.

 

[scumrot derelict]

See I'm more socialist I would prefer a system where different trades have different salaries but the employees own the capital and run the company, and government would have a plethora of necessary social programs ensuring that the basic needs for life are met for every every citizen. The money that would have gone to and been hoarded by the ultra wealthy can now go to higher taxes, much higher maybe even 50%, which would be a flat rate for everyone of every income, and can now be funneled into these social programs.

History has shown us that you cannot reform without a shift in consciousness, if the collective consensus is not in accordance with the new ideals than it will fail, and as we've seen in the past this division can cause much conflict and war. I believe that the majority of people need to attain Enlightenment in order for something like communism to come into full effect perhaps in a few hundred years of conscious evolution we will be there but I absolutely do believe that socialism is the next step and is attainable in our lifetime.

Out of pure curiosity, can I ask where you are posting from? I don't want to be nosy or anything. Stop me if I am.

 

[New Age United]

Out of pure curiosity, can I ask where you are posting from? I don't want to be nosy or anything. Stop me if I am.

Saint John New Brunswick Canada right on the ocean on the East coast bout an hr from the border with Maine, I was born in Maine and am a dual citizen.

 

[djav59]

The 1st migrants ever brought to this area were by tobacco farmers there weren't many of them but it was the beginning next tobacco switched to Christmas trees then they came in large numbers this was all sponsored by wealthy republican tree growers who claimed they couldn't find workers fact is no one was willing to do this type work for $5 per hr. Now they are the ones complaining
Then they brought illegal immigrants they still do, and they are given every benefit you can imagine the employer usually supplies housing and they get food stamps,and free medical while if I apply I get zero the very 1st thing that happens is the women get pregnant boom another citizen they form their own communities within the community .
Imagine the impact on a small mountain town where jobs have always been scarce or nonexistent.
Now this area is a free for all mix of people here for some unknown reason most just nuts hiding from where they were from originally , or immigrants ,or retirees the rest tourists but it makes a right mess in this small place.
Disparity of wealth is root cause of ruination of a once beautiful mountian county I can tell you that.

 

[djav59]

How does this relate to WW3 well the whole planet is overcrowded but nobody mentions population or birth control.
If I see this little neck of the woods packed w people what is the rest of the world like?
We all know folks can all get along right ?
Now imagine resources being depleted almost overnight.
Things are already failing and some just dont care or cant see meawhile the warmarchine and the greed that drives it keeps turning and we are the fodder .

The tree of democracy's roots are watered by the blood of patriots .
Thomas Jefferson
Have you watered the tree lately?

 

[hanimmal]

How does this relate to WW3 well the whole planet is overcrowded but nobody mentions population or birth control.
If I see this little neck of the woods packed w people what is the rest of the world like?
We all know folks can all get along right ?
Now imagine resources being depleted almost overnight.
Things are already failing and some just dont care or cant see meawhile the warmarchine and the greed that drives it keeps turning and we are the fodder .

The tree of democracy's roots are watered by the blood of patriots .
Thomas Jefferson
Have you watered the tree lately?

Imagine a zombie outbreak, or whatever batshit thing people want to be worried about.

Population is not the problem, it is the burning down and ripping apart everything in nature to build the suburbs that was brought about by white flight since the 50's. We need to be smarter in how we develop now that we understand the consequences. But the Republicans just troll and ride the wave of people who welcome the end of the world so they get to live on a cloud with their god.

 

[captainmorgan]

The dear leader says climate change is a hoax and the USA has never been this great, all thanks to him. The environment and food chains are collapsing and people are worried if they posted a good selfie on facebook. It will be medieval when shit hits the fan.

 

[Rob Roy]

History has shown us that you cannot reform without a shift in consciousness,

There are two ways to create human interactions.

The first way is where people interact on a voluntary basis. The second is where human interactions occur on an involuntary basis.

In your ideal "reform" which method will you use ?

 

[New Age United]

There are two ways to create human interactions.

The first way is where people interact on a voluntary basis. The second is where human interactions occur on an involuntary basis.

In your ideal "reform" which method will you use ?

Absolutely voluntary if the people do not begin to "actually" agree on these ideals than theres no point in even having the conversation.