Watch me kill plants in Organic Soil ‍

[deimos phobos]

This is part of a new series, featuring me killing plants in organic soil. Have not been able to solve the problem

Background: Symptoms always the same: leaves often start yellowing almost right away after seedling stage even though they are in brand new, nutrient rich Destiny Organics supersoil ( https://www.destinyorganics.ca/ )

Medium: Destiny Organics
Light: HLG 550 local knockoff, LM301B chips
Temps/Humidity: Controlled. I work within my natural basement temps and just follow VPD of 1.3 veg 1.5 flower. Lows of 68F lights out, highs of 79F lights on.
Water: RO, 7 pH, ~20ppm
CaMg added? Yes
pH adjusted? No, the system boasts all over that pH and PPM testing is not required, but I did test the water to find out.
Feeding: just watering with Fish Hydrosylate once so far. And kelp foliars. This is their included feeding schedule: https://destinygrowkits.com/feed-schedule/Destiny-Feeding-Schedule.pdf

Whoever fixes my problem for good gets a big juicy smackeroo right on the lips, from yours truly

 

[Kassiopeija]

Hello, is there a special reason why you feed a supersoil? Even in coarse peatmoss such little young plants wouldn't require any feedings... and in a supersoil its twice not required. However, I cant open the link to your supersoil recepe, so I don't know.

But I would just start with RO/rainwater and then feed only reactively. If anything, start by adding CalMag very mildly.

Your plant displays signs of interveinal chlorosis (this can have many reasons) and also potassium excess (burned tips). Potentially a lockout/pH problem. Check your soils pH and also EC to know whats up.

Also, bottom leaves can become yellow if the light isn't strong enough down there, or if the lockout did cause a mobile nude def.

Hope this helps

 

[deimos phobos]

Hello, is there a special reason why you feed a supersoil? Even in coarse peatmoss such little young plants wouldn't require any feedings... and in a supersoil its twice not required. However, I cant open the link to your supersoil recepe, so I don't know.

But I would just start with RO/rainwater and then feed only reactively. If anything, start by adding CalMag very mildly.

Your plant displays signs of interveinal chlorosis (this can have many reasons) and also potassium excess (burned tips). Potentially a lockout/pH problem. Check your soils pH and also EC to know whats up.

Also, bottom leaves can become yellow if the light isn't strong enough down there, or if the lockout did cause a mobile nude def.

Hope this helps

Thanks so much for getting back to me.

I fixed the link in the original post to the soil, not sure why that wasn’t working. The system calls for just kelp foliars and a slight bit of fish hydrosylate during veg, but honestly, those seem to have nothing to do with the problem as it was well underway before either of those were ever applied

This problem affects all my plants in all stages eventually. It always turns pale and yellow

 

[Sfrigon 1]

Looks pretty good to me

 

[Kassiopeija]

This problem affects all my plants in all stages eventually. It always turns pale and yellow

That sounds like a N def to me. Is it always the bottom leaves that start first to yellow? Do you have additional pictures where the problem is shown in an aggravated state?
If it is, then the chlorosis could also be explained by this by a decreased uptake of Mg because N & Mg synergize with each while excess Potassium actually locks both out.

So if this is true, you could try to apply a foliar feed (mineralic or otherwise) because both N & Mg are known to be taken up good by leaves. You could test this on one plant safely without getting anything into the substrate and then, after a day or two, see if this was helpful. Do you have access to Epsom Salt and Carbamid-N (or Nettle-South if you prefer to stay strictly organically.)

 

[deimos phobos]

That sounds like a N def to me. Is it always the bottom leaves that start first to yellow? Do you have additional pictures where the problem is shown in an aggravated state?

It is always the bottom leaves that seem to yellow first, but it makes it’s way up the plant afterwards yep. I don’t have further pics on hand but I’ll snap more and keep posting them on here as it progresses for sure

If it is, then the chlorosis could also be explained by this by a decreased uptake of Mg because N & Mg synergize with each while excess Potassium actually locks both out.

So if this is true, you could try to apply a foliar feed (mineralic or otherwise) because both N & Mg are known to be taken up good by leaves. You could test this on one plant safely without getting anything into the substrate and then, after a day or two, see if this was helpful. Do you have access to Epsom Salt and Carbamid-N (or Nettle-South if you prefer to stay strictly organically.)

Thanks again for this info.. Epsom salts , assuming it’s the same thing you soak yourself in a bathtub with, should be available at every store indeed. I have never heard of this second item, but let me search for it. It’s probably around even if it means I gotta drive into Toronto for it !

 

[deimos phobos]

I can’t find any information on “carbamid n” nor “nettle-south”

 

[Kassiopeija]

It's another word for Urea

 

[deimos phobos]

Ah. Well still no results other than scientific papers. I don’t see any product availability, just academic info.

Must need a different search term

 

[Kassiopeija]

It's a source for Nitrogen.

BTW if you do foliar feeding you'll have to buy yourself also a substance which will reduce the *surface tension* of water. Liquid soap would do that but a professional product is better

 

[deimos phobos]

I have Silica which I used to emulsify karanja oil before. Not sure if this works. But I don’t see myself being able to foliar with anything as those terms do not yield any results

 

[Kassiopeija]

If you can, collect some a few handful of Nettles (or other green plant material, Cannabis leaves work well, too!), make them small, fill up a bucket of pure water, let it sit for 2 weeeks, stir every day a bit. After this, you can feed your plant with it, it's then a good (and strong) source of Nitrogen (and also Silica-acid if you pick up the right plants...)

 

[Kassiopeija]

You can also take your own urin and dilute with water 1:10

 

[Nizza]

they only look like they could use a transplant to me. I would never use piss on my plants even if it works.

I read into what they use in that soil. They use powdered oyster shell. It could be that you are watering too much to waste and leeching out the oyster shell and the pH is going out of wack. Before transplanting into new soil I would maybe add some more oyster shell or even dolomite lime, and try not to water more than 10-20% runoff.

Perhaps the soil it too dry and the water is running straight through. If you think your peat has over dried, try a drop of ivory dish soap or a surfacant/wetting agent like silica on a few waterings to help the peat gain its moisture retention back.

Also, with LEDS you should be adding a bit more cal-mag than normal. I think oyster shell has some but you want to look into this a bit more. Be careful how close you put the LEDS too, a LUX meter can help

 

[deimos phobos]

they only look like they could use a transplant to me. I would never use piss on my plants even if it works.

I read into what they use in that soil. They use powdered oyster shell. It could be that you are watering too much to waste and leeching out the oyster shell and the pH is going out of wack. Before transplanting into new soil I would maybe add some more oyster shell or even dolomite lime, and try not to water more than 10-20% runoff.

Perhaps the soil it too dry and the water is running straight through. If you think your peat has over dried, try a drop of ivory dish soap or a surfacant/wetting agent like silica on a few waterings to help the peat gain its moisture retention back.

Also, with LEDS you should be adding a bit more cal-mag than normal. I think oyster shell has some but you want to look into this a bit more. Be careful how close you put the LEDS too, a LUX meter can help

Hey man, really appreciate the reply!

I laughed out loud at the piss comment too!

RE needing transplant - they are just about at that stage but in this case I do not my believe my problems come from this, as I sometimes get yellowing as early as the second or third sets of true leaves

I also am always SUPER cautious of stopping watering as soon as any water runs out, I definitely try to aim for like 2% runoff vs. 10%

The CalMag thing? Super super possible as I never bought my first bottle of CalMag until this week!

Any chance you can give me some input on pHing with living soil? Should I, or shouldn't I? The RO water is confirmed, tested, yesterday at 6.9-7 pH and a TDS ~20ppm

I keep hearing lockouts coming up as a possibility but the whole point of Destiny's system and their massive selling point in big bold letters on every display case, is that you do not pH the water

I like the adding silica for watering and can definitely try that

 

[whitebb2727]

Water them. Quit feeding.

 

[kingromano]

tired plants
lights possibly too close
put lights farther and watch em get better

 

[Nizza]

Well if the pH is good I'd say yes the light can be causing issues. Cal-mag can help but that should be in there. It could also be that the soil is too hot for the babies.

 

[JohnDee]

Whoever fixes my problem for good gets a big juicy smackeroo right on the lips, from yours truly

not interested...too much makeup

Your plant displays signs of interveinal chlorosis (this can have many reasons) and also potassium excess (burned tips). Potentially a lockout/pH problem. Check your soils pH and also EC to know whats up.

^^^ When I see clear cut interveinal chlorosis like that...with no necrosis...that's my tipoff that it's more likely a K+ lockout rather then a Mg issue...extra Mg may make it worse...
JD

 

[Kassiopeija]

^^^ When I see clear cut interveinal chlorosis like that...with no necrosis...that's my tipoff that it's more likely a K+ lockout rather then a Mg issue...extra Mg may make it worse...
JD

sure, but he's growing in SS and there's no way of getting that excess K outta the earth.... Except for using different soil or stretching that soil. Besides, he's feeding RO water in an organic grow, which are actually know to be able to take high amounts of CalMag (if the soillife is healthy.)