When's the Right Time to Top-Dress?

[GiovanniJones]

A confusing thing about organic growing for me is the delayed response of top dressing. With bottled nutes, it seems possible that deficiencies can quickly be corrected as soon as they're observed. However, in organic grows, I've read that it takes about a month or so for organic amendments to turn into nutrition that the plants can use. Hypothetically, if I see, for example, a nitrogen deficiency and I top-dress with something like blood meal or feather meal, it's going to take a month for it to help the plant while it's further starved of nitrogen.

On the other hand, if hypothetically my plants need more food, woule it be better to top-dress with composted soil or earthworm castings because the little microbes have already been working the soil for a while and the nutrients are more readily available?

Am I thinking right here? To summarize, if I use amendments, I'd have to anticipate nutrient needs a month early. If I use composted amendments, the nutrients would help my plants much sooner. Is this correct? If that's the case, I should always have some hot, fresh living soil on hand for top-dressing.

Thanks again.

 

[PadawanWarrior]

Different amendments become available at different rates. Some are quickly available and some could take years.

A lot of times anymore I'll mix up the amendments with EWC and some pumice and keep it moist a few days before I top dress with it. It seems to work a little faster. I should make a big batch and keep some ready. A longer cook time would just make it more quickly available.

 

[Richard Drysift]

It’s like you gotta put it in there way before they actually need it. I think it’s a lot better to amend spent soil heavily after a harvest and just give water for most of the grow as opposed to trying to fix deficiencies mid-grow.
Chicken manure is a pretty fast form of N. I throw a handful or two into each container. Also spikes work great. You can diy a spike out of the soil amendments you have or just buy them. Jobes AP spikes are made of feather and bone meal along with mycorrhizae. Btw if myco is not something you use regularly get some in granular form and sprinkle in the hole at each transplant. Plan to transplant to fresh mix at least 3 times during the entire grow; it’s not easy to keep soil in a container highly active longer than 60 days.

 

[MICHI-CAN]

In ground soil I amend with hardwood mulch. Preferably high bark content. Provides natural biologics continuously. And I dry fert at planting. Again at 45 days from planting. Container soil I add to my new mix every year and season as normal.

 

[PadawanWarrior]

It’s like you gotta put it in there way before they actually need it. I think it’s a lot better to amend spent soil heavily after a harvest and just give water for most of the grow as opposed to trying to fix deficiencies mid-grow.
Chicken manure is a pretty fast form of N. I throw a handful or two into each container. Also spikes work great. You can diy a spike out of the soil amendments you have or just buy them. Jobes AP spikes are made of feather and bone meal along with mycorrhizae. Btw if myco is not something you use regularly get some in granular form and sprinkle in the hole at each transplant. Plan to transplant to fresh mix at least 3 times during the entire grow; it’s not easy to keep soil in a container highly active longer than 60 days.

I don't skimp on the Mykos. I coat my roots and newly prepared hole anytime I transplant.

 

[JoeBlow5823]

A confusing thing about organic growing for me is the delayed response of top dressing. With bottled nutes, it seems possible that deficiencies can quickly be corrected as soon as they're observed. However, in organic grows, I've read that it takes about a month or so for organic amendments to turn into nutrition that the plants can use. Hypothetically, if I see, for example, a nitrogen deficiency and I top-dress with something like blood meal or feather meal, it's going to take a month for it to help the plant while it's further starved of nitrogen.

On the other hand, if hypothetically my plants need more food, woule it be better to top-dress with composted soil or earthworm castings because the little microbes have already been working the soil for a while and the nutrients are more readily available?

Am I thinking right here? To summarize, if I use amendments, I'd have to anticipate nutrient needs a month early. If I use composted amendments, the nutrients would help my plants much sooner. Is this correct? If that's the case, I should always have some hot, fresh living soil on hand for top-dressing.

Thanks again.

If your growing in a good organic blend, you really shouldnt ever see major nutrient issues rapidly develop. Top dress should still get inside the plant before there is any major issues. But yes, part of it is putting the nutrients there in advance. I grow in good organic soil that has plenty of nutrients to get me to flower. I add this at the start and middle of flower. It easily carries the plants through to the end.

 

[GiovanniJones]

Thanks for all the info everyone, it's really helpful to me. Cheers.

 

[youraveragehorticulturist]

The right time to top dress is a week or two before you need it!

My soil is pretty much Coot's Mix + some fish bone meal. I was consistently getting yellowing starting in the fourth week of flowering. Now I top dress with an All In One Bloom mix (like Joe Blow) during the 2nd week of flower so it's already there when the plants are hungry for it.

I was inspired by Richard Drysift talking about being proactive with his spikes, just sticking a few in early flower.

 

[JoeBlow5823]

The right time to top dress is a week or two before you need it!

My soil is pretty much Coot's Mix + some fish bone meal. I was consistently getting yellowing starting in the fourth week of flowering. Now I top dress with an All In One Bloom mix (like Joe Blow) during the 2nd week of flower so it's already there when the plants are hungry for it.

I was inspired by Richard Drysift talking about being proactive with his spikes, just sticking a few in early flower.

Yeah it only makes sense to have the fertilizer available for them when they need it. Can take a grow or two before you really understand how they grow and about when they will want it.

 

[The3rdMan]

A confusing thing about organic growing for me is the delayed response of top dressing. With bottled nutes, it seems possible that deficiencies can quickly be corrected as soon as they're observed. However, in organic grows, I've read that it takes about a month or so for organic amendments to turn into nutrition that the plants can use. Hypothetically, if I see, for example, a nitrogen deficiency and I top-dress with something like blood meal or feather meal, it's going to take a month for it to help the plant while it's further starved of nitrogen.

On the other hand, if hypothetically my plants need more food, woule it be better to top-dress with composted soil or earthworm castings because the little microbes have already been working the soil for a while and the nutrients are more readily available?

Am I thinking right here? To summarize, if I use amendments, I'd have to anticipate nutrient needs a month early. If I use composted amendments, the nutrients would help my plants much sooner. Is this correct? If that's the case, I should always have some hot, fresh living soil on hand for top-dressing.

Thanks again.

Have you considered combining your top dress amendments with soil and baking the mix for 30 days? Then, you don't have to anticipate a month in advance. The nutrients in the "cooked" dressing should be readily available when you use them.

 

[bum]

It’s like you gotta put it in there way before they actually need it. I think it’s a lot better to amend spent soil heavily after a harvest and just give water for most of the grow as opposed to trying to fix deficiencies mid-grow.
Chicken manure is a pretty fast form of N. I throw a handful or two into each container. Also spikes work great. You can diy a spike out of the soil amendments you have or just buy them. Jobes AP spikes are made of feather and bone meal along with mycorrhizae. Btw if myco is not something you use regularly get some in granular form and sprinkle in the hole at each transplant. Plan to transplant to fresh mix at least 3 times during the entire grow; it’s not easy to keep soil in a container highly active longer than 60 days.

I would not use Jobe's products for cannabis. ESPECIALLY SPIKES. In my research I have found them to be high in heavy metals. Fertilizers are one of the preferred methods of 'hazardous waste recycling' (look it up) and a number of Jobe's retail products have tested into the thousands of ppm for lead, cadmium, and others. Spikes are a convenient way of inconspicuously packing hazardous waste into a retail products, which is totally legal in the glorious USA. This is why all your fertilizer bags container a disclaimer about metals.

If you think OMRI is paying attention, they aren't.

 

[bum]

I would not use Jobe's products for cannabis. ESPECIALLY SPIKES. In my research I have found them to be high in heavy metals. Fertilizers are one of the preferred methods of 'hazardous waste recycling' (look it up) and a number of Jobe's retail products have tested into the thousands of ppm for lead, cadmium, and others. Spikes are a convenient way of inconspicuously packing hazardous waste into a retail products, which is totally legal in the glorious USA. This is why all your fertilizer bags container a disclaimer about metals.

If you think OMRI is paying attention, they aren't.

Seems I can no longer edit but I'd like to correct myself: It's not that OMRI is knowingly certifying materials made with hazardous waste ingredients, it's that it's possible for 'recycling' bound hazardous waste to never be designated as such- meaning it's not registered and tracked (as is required of treatment/disposal bound waste). The waste becomes a ghost ingredient and OMRI doesn't do much (any?) analysis of final products, they are focused on inputs.

 

[hillbill]

I grow lots of small plants in 5 qts of mix, top dress once at 4 weeks, usually P Bat Guano, Oak Ash, EWC.

 

[IIReignManII]

So far I've been doing one topdress at week one of flower...malted barley topdress every 3 weeks or so and a mung bean SST every 2 to 3 weeks

 

[Tlarss]

I top dress kelp meal fish bone meal and compost/ earthworm castings a few days before I flip...and then I do it again sometimes with general purpose dry Amendment (bio-live) at week 3 depending on how the plant is looking.

 

[rkmcdon]

I up pot from 1 to 10 gallon pots the day i flip to flower and then top dress ewc's, kelp, biolive, guano, neem and MBP (with pumice, rice hull and biochar mixed in for aeration) around day 28-30

 

[The3rdMan]

I up pot from 1 to 10 gallon pots the day i flip to flower and then top dress ewc's, kelp, biolive, guano, neem and MBP (with pumice, rice hull and biochar mixed in for aeration) around day 28-30

What quantity of EWC, kelp, etc. do you top dress with and how often during the flower phase?

 

[rkmcdon]

I do a single top dress at the beginning of the 5th week and i top dress with 2 cups of this mix per 10 gallon pot:
4 gallons ewc
1 gallon pumice
8 cups rice hulls
8 cups biochar
1 cup biolive
1 cup neem
1 cup kelp
1 cup bat guano
2 cups ground up malted barley (2 row from the local brew store)

 

[Joeybliss]

A confusing thing about organic growing for me is the delayed response of top dressing. With bottled nutes, it seems possible that deficiencies can quickly be corrected as soon as they're observed. However, in organic grows, I've read that it takes about a month or so for organic amendments to turn into nutrition that the plants can use. Hypothetically, if I see, for example, a nitrogen deficiency and I top-dress with something like blood meal or feather meal, it's going to take a month for it to help the plant while it's further starved of nitrogen.

On the other hand, if hypothetically my plants need more food, woule it be better to top-dress with composted soil or earthworm castings because the little microbes have already been working the soil for a while and the nutrients are more readily available?

Am I thinking right here? To summarize, if I use amendments, I'd have to anticipate nutrient needs a month early. If I use composted amendments, the nutrients would help my plants much sooner. Is this correct? If that's the case, I should always have some hot, fresh living soil on hand for top-dressing.

Thanks again.

No not a month. If u have a healthy soil microbes you will see improvements in as fast as 2-3 days cause they break down and exude sugars that are plant available

 

[Joeybliss]

It’s like you gotta put it in there way before they actually need it. I think it’s a lot better to amend spent soil heavily after a harvest and just give water for most of the grow as opposed to trying to fix deficiencies mid-grow.
Chicken manure is a pretty fast form of N. I throw a handful or two into each container. Also spikes work great. You can diy a spike out of the soil amendments you have or just buy them. Jobes AP spikes are made of feather and bone meal along with mycorrhizae. Btw if myco is not something you use regularly get some in granular form and sprinkle in the hole at each transplant. Plan to transplant to fresh mix at least 3 times during the entire grow; it’s not easy to keep soil in a container highly active longer than 60 days.

Make fermented plant extract from seeds and nettle mugwort anything that grows on your property that’s not poisonous and add brown sugar and water along with some LAB and let it ferment for 2-3 weeks I use this throughout the whole grow and stop in mid flower and as the plants flip I add more bananas and avocados to the fermented swamp water I use it at 32 oz to 5 gallons water. I’ll feed 1x week and they never want for nothing. Some epsom salt watering and a few watering with a recharge like product they should never be lacking. Some varietals are heavy feeder wher others are not like I’m growing GG4 x gmo next to SFV kush and the kush plant is always dry and thirsty and the GG4 is not and always has moist soil both I. Fabric pots. I just cut off all nutes at week 4 of flower and just water with molasses 1x week to feed microbes and get that nice fade and not have a green harvest that taste like shit. Cut off N at like week 3 flower