Anyone growing in perlite? Results?

Porky101

Porky101

Well-Known Member
Im going to keep feeding them more and monitor the results. I am looking for BURN. So far I am getting deficiencies. This could either be lockout or too little food. I know 2.2EC sounds high, But I am not getting burn on the tips like I would expect, so my logic tells me I can push them more (Definitly could be lockout though, I am more confident they need more food than lockout).


They are lacking MG and are abundant in N. So perhaps N is locking out the MG. But I have now added an additional 0.2EC of epson salts raising the MG and S. So this should counteract the N lockout?
 
Porky101

Porky101

Well-Known Member
cobshopgrow said:
true, hydrobuddy itself should show some lower ec too, or?.
thats may a 1.2 or such.
could be part of the problem.
Click to expand...
Hydrobuddy shows my EC @ 1.3 .....But I am feeding them at around 1.5-2.6EC Depending if they in veg flower and what week they in.


I think maybe my problem here is these are all different strains. Some strains maybe dont like the feed? Others do seem to be doing better. Ill post photos of the healthier plants.


This is my verdict :

Lockout of MG from too much N.
Solution : Lower N, increase mg.

How?
Just add 0.2EC Epson salts to the water.


This is the part where it gets tricky....How to lower N and keep my CA levels. I have noticed my plants always have CA deficiencies, feeding high EC seems to reduce this a lot.


What is the best way to lower N and keep my CA levels in check?
 
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cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
so you use the ratios showen but feed higher ppms and are sure you really give the ppm you have claculated?
just, if there is a big unknowen portion of the ec i would recheck what i have mixed there.

dunno about the extra epsom.
think you could try as there are fertilizers using even higher levels then you do.
Total Nitrogen (N)123.78607.80
Nitrate Nitrogen (NO3-)119.5540
Ammonical Nitrogen (NH4+)4.2320
Phosphorous (P)67.76819.53
Potassium (K)252.544619.07
Magnesium (Mg)73.14484.61
Calcium (Ca)80.40805.07
Sulfur (S)96.59546.09
Iron (Fe)3.49140.22
Zinc (Zn)1.21040.07
Boron (B)0.45390.03
Manganese (Mn)0.75650.05
Copper (Cu)0.45390.03
Molybdenum (Mo)0.15130.01
Silicon (Si)1.74570.11
tried to copy your formula with the megacrop 2 part, roughly.
 
Porky101

Porky101

Well-Known Member
cobshopgrow said:
so you use the ratios showen but feed higher ppms and are sure you really give the ppm you have claculated?
just, if there is a big unknowen portion of the ec i would recheck what i have mixed there.

dunno about the extra epsom.
think you could try as there are fertilizers using even higher levels then you do.
Total Nitrogen (N)123.78607.80
Nitrate Nitrogen (NO3-)119.5540
Ammonical Nitrogen (NH4+)4.2320
Phosphorous (P)67.76819.53
Potassium (K)252.544619.07
Magnesium (Mg)73.14484.61
Calcium (Ca)80.40805.07
Sulfur (S)96.59546.09
Iron (Fe)3.49140.22
Zinc (Zn)1.21040.07
Boron (B)0.45390.03
Manganese (Mn)0.75650.05
Copper (Cu)0.45390.03
Molybdenum (Mo)0.15130.01
Silicon (Si)1.74570.11
tried to copy your formula with the megacrop 2 part, roughly.
Click to expand...
seems very high in K?

I see what you are saying, that I need to stick to hydrobuddy exactly and not simply feed a higher EC. You have a point there. However im sure you can simply double the quantity and get the same result. Its the same thing as multiple feedings and watering which you do. So even if you double up on the feed the ratio's will remain constant.
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
yep, its high in K.
not experineced enough to say if its really needed but normally nutirent charts show a high K uptake end of flower.

as long the ratios are the same it should be fine, say, if you doubble all salts and get your higher EC therefore youre ok.
if you give what hydrobuddy calced you and get a dramatic higher ec , i would qeustion what i do, should be ec +-0.2.
 
Porky101

Porky101

Well-Known Member
cobshopgrow said:
yep, its high in K.
not experineced enough to say if its really needed but normally nutirent charts show a high K uptake end of flower.

as long the ratios are the same it should be fine, say, if you doubble all salts and get your higher EC therefore youre ok.
if you give what hydrobuddy calced you and get a dramatic higher ec , i would qeustion what i do, should be ec +-0.2.
Click to expand...

Ok I will do a test on my ferts.
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
my realworld readings are a little higher to what hydrobuddy say, but i guess thats ok.
read somewhere hydrobuddy istn precise there, or the meters arent, different salts conduct different, the meters dont know this.
but it should be about that, in my case plus 0.2
 
Porky101

Porky101

Well-Known Member
cobshopgrow said:
so you use the ratios showen but feed higher ppms and are sure you really give the ppm you have claculated?
just, if there is a big unknowen portion of the ec i would recheck what i have mixed there.

dunno about the extra epsom.
think you could try as there are fertilizers using even higher levels then you do.
Total Nitrogen (N)123.78607.80
Nitrate Nitrogen (NO3-)119.5540
Ammonical Nitrogen (NH4+)4.2320
Phosphorous (P)67.76819.53
Potassium (K)252.544619.07
Magnesium (Mg)73.14484.61
Calcium (Ca)80.40805.07
Sulfur (S)96.59546.09
Iron (Fe)3.49140.22
Zinc (Zn)1.21040.07
Boron (B)0.45390.03
Manganese (Mn)0.75650.05
Copper (Cu)0.45390.03
Molybdenum (Mo)0.15130.01
Silicon (Si)1.74570.11
tried to copy your formula with the megacrop 2 part, roughly.
Click to expand...
Way more MG than mine though, I only have 50mg. Maybe thats the problem...
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
let me know if it is, think the high Mg is ment for cocos ? (the fert is ment for all media, but the high mg aim may for coco maybe), cant tell you if you need that much in perlite.
normally they should need less mg then p.
its really high, especially in relation to Ca.
the values are taken from the online calculator from greenleaf, you can check yourself and play around.
i always hesitate a bit to go that high with mg, especially in non cocos.
 
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Porky101

Porky101

Well-Known Member
cobshopgrow said:
let me know if it is, think the high Mg is ment for cocos ? (the fert is ment for all media, but the high mg aim may for coco maybe), cant tell you if you need that much in perlite.
normally they should need less mg then p.
its really high, especially in relation to Ca.
the values are taken from the online calculator from greenleaf, you can check yourself and play around.
i always hesitate a bit to go that high with mg, especially in non cocos.
Click to expand...
My mg is 50. Surely i can raise that a bit to 70?
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
not a 100% sure if its good, idk, never went higher then 60 myself.
@TintEastwood , do you have a idea? i saw you giving quite high mg ppm.


just think the ratios given by the megacrop 2 part should somehow work, or something one can take as a base.
 
TintEastwood

TintEastwood

Well-Known Member
Never grown in perlite, only coco. Sorry if I missed it. How often are you feeding and at what ph?

Check these ratios...
tox-lockout.jpg

Rough guidelines...

Ca should be 1/2 to 2/3rds of K ppms

Mg should be 1/2 of Ca ppms

P should be 1/2 or less of Ca ppms

VEG:
Up to equal ppms N and K

FLOWER:
N can be as low as 1/2 K ppms

If it were coco.....I would be feeding up to 6 times a day @ 6.0ph, 1.6ec/800ppm.

I suspect you have been feeding too high EC and not often enough.

potassium-excess-in-a-cannabis-plant-e1568202330791.jpg
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
really huge ones, crazy.
i see why you water 6 times a day lol.

and thanks for the ratios, didnt knew youre in cocos "only".
this 4:2:1 K,Ca,Mg i read often and use myself as good i can.
Your P to Ca ratio is maybe hard to reach when using high P fertilizers and or a lot MKP.
Taking Maxibloom as example, P is similar ratio to Ca, think even higher.
Just scratching my head there.
 
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TintEastwood

TintEastwood

Well-Known Member
cobshopgrow said:
really huge ones, crazy.
i see why you water 6 times a day lol.

and thanks for the ratios, didnt knew youre in cocos "only".
this 4:2:1 K,Ca,Mg i read often and use myself as good i can.
Your P to Ca ratio is maybe hard to reach when using high P fertilizers and or a lot MKP.
Taking Maxibloom as example, P is similar ratio to Ca, think even higher.
Just scratching my head there.
Click to expand...
It was too crazy. I was a noob. My indoor get it up to 6x a day also.
Those are just general guidelines, not hard numbers.
lol Still confused at times. I need more experience, more runs!

Perlite may not have the coco specific issues with Ca and K.???
Coco can absorb Ca from the nute solution, and can release K. (varies depending on coco, buffering, etc)

PH can be the killer - wrong PH = Lockout of element(s)
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
perlite have almost no CEC, should be more like DWC.
shouldnt be able to bind Ca and Mg like coco do.

Not like coco sucking your ca and mg with their doubble charges, beeing prefered by the coco, the coco release K, Nacl or whatever is in it with and got just a single charge in exchange.
But Perlite have hardly any CEC, what goes in is there, whats not, is not.

see page 9, nice list for the PH and CEC of medias.
 
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