Silky T
Well-Known Member
I don't use any foliar sprays at all. I tried it on one plant and it reacted and scared me. So I stopped.
Why are my leaves doing this. Overwatering?
- Thread starter Maineconnect
- Start date
Maineconnect
Active Member
Plants are still only drinking 1 time daily. New growth slow and stunted. Does anyone think I’m Overfeeding?
Last cycle I was watering twice a day at this point.
something is drastically different.
Last cycle I was watering twice a day at this point.
something is drastically different.
Flowki
Well-Known Member
All I can see is signs of wind stress and what appears to be over watering. However they are in coco, the pots appear to be an ok size but the middle pots do look potentially small for the width of your stem, how long did you veg?.
I might have a theory but laugh it off if it's bat shit crazy.
It looks like over watering but reading what you've said it isn't obvious why. I am thinking that this might have something to do with heat and humidity fluctuation. Perhaps your current swings are putting the plant in on/off mode for taking up water from the roots due to rise and fall of humidity.
Your canopy humidity and heat may be more stable but your lower canopy/root zone conditions might not be. Essentially your plants might be getting mixed signals, upper canopy wanting to turn respiration on, lower canopy wanting to turn it off.
I would say to try using air pots, they allow more water evaporation at the edge of the pots and oxygen flow to the outer roots. I would also sugest using a 6 inch stand alone ''outlet'' fan with the ducting running under your canopy, split the ducking 3 way for more even under canopy stale air removal. Have that fan pointing in the direction of your dehumidifier or at-least canopy fans. This should even out your over all humidity and be far more accurate. It would also reduce the the situation where the upper canpopy is being wind stressed with low humidity air/heat while the lower canopy has plenty of humidity.
Again it's just a thought that could be completely unralated to your issues (although the above is a good thing to do anyway). You have insect problems so it could be as simple as that. Or, as you have slightly messed with heat settings from the last run you could have put the plants into a confused state of uptake, did you account for the RH increase when you increased temp?. If temp went high and RH didn't follow they would take more water, if temp drops and RH stays in similar range this could be the issue alone, if it happened frequently. What your temp/himidity read out's say from one single point of your grow is in no way a good reflection of your total space temp/humidity. You can add wind to the canopy but this doenst mean the under canopy/ edges of canopy etc are happy and in line with read outs.
I might have a theory but laugh it off if it's bat shit crazy.
It looks like over watering but reading what you've said it isn't obvious why. I am thinking that this might have something to do with heat and humidity fluctuation. Perhaps your current swings are putting the plant in on/off mode for taking up water from the roots due to rise and fall of humidity.
Your canopy humidity and heat may be more stable but your lower canopy/root zone conditions might not be. Essentially your plants might be getting mixed signals, upper canopy wanting to turn respiration on, lower canopy wanting to turn it off.
I would say to try using air pots, they allow more water evaporation at the edge of the pots and oxygen flow to the outer roots. I would also sugest using a 6 inch stand alone ''outlet'' fan with the ducting running under your canopy, split the ducking 3 way for more even under canopy stale air removal. Have that fan pointing in the direction of your dehumidifier or at-least canopy fans. This should even out your over all humidity and be far more accurate. It would also reduce the the situation where the upper canpopy is being wind stressed with low humidity air/heat while the lower canopy has plenty of humidity.
Again it's just a thought that could be completely unralated to your issues (although the above is a good thing to do anyway). You have insect problems so it could be as simple as that. Or, as you have slightly messed with heat settings from the last run you could have put the plants into a confused state of uptake, did you account for the RH increase when you increased temp?. If temp went high and RH didn't follow they would take more water, if temp drops and RH stays in similar range this could be the issue alone, if it happened frequently. What your temp/himidity read out's say from one single point of your grow is in no way a good reflection of your total space temp/humidity. You can add wind to the canopy but this doenst mean the under canopy/ edges of canopy etc are happy and in line with read outs.
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Maineconnect
Active Member
Your fucken spot on with everything your saying.
I tried to re invent the wheel this round with my temps.
also I do have broads.
I do not have adequate airflow below my canopy and I will try and do something about that tonight.
when I raised my temps I did raise my humidity.
the broads are fuckin shit up but my transpiration is off I believe I mentioned that with a question mark in an earlier post.
this is my last run in this house and my only meds for winter.
rough being a farmer.
Maineconnect
Active Member
I dropped my
Temps a few days ago sprayed and my temps are now 76-77 and 50-55 I’m going to add more airflow below canopy
And do a good strip.....
This is fucked any further insight would be appreciated but I’ve been in this game long enough to know that this rooms going downhill quick.
Flowki
Well-Known Member
I really don't want to say anything too specific as I am no expert and have no idea on your full situation.
Personally what I would do, above aside is properly identifying the insect problem and see what range of effects that type can have. Trees can excrete a water based defence mechanism to deal with insect attack (I watch a lot of random shit). It's a long shot but perhaps this could be of some explanation.
The only other things I could suggest is to make sure you are doing the basics, good run off when feeding to stop any build ups at the roots, replenish oxygen levels etc.
I would think that if the problem simply is over watering for some reason, keeping canopy temps at 80F (led?) and on the low end of RH would encourage the leaves to transpire and hopefully get out of the rut they are in. But again this entirely depends on what the problem actually is so it could do more harm than good.
Am I right in thinking you are running co2 sealed?. I would imagine that high RH could lead to water logged root zone, on top of sealed co2 use with improper venting, it could create an oxygen deficient root zone even in coco. But how that would continue to look like over watering I have 0 clue. You should ask other long term sealed growers if this is a possible issue.
Maineconnect
Active Member
So maybe co2 is my enemy right now.
I am running 1000 ppm co2 I exchange the room 1 or 2 times a day with core exhaust.
should I have moreair exchange throughout the day?
may night my exhaust runs.
yahigh vpd may get me out of hot water.
I’ve dropped temps and humidity for a couple days.
I I’m confused with yiur statement about water drops on leaves? The eggs I think I’m scoping may be water droplets? Am I understanding that right
I am running 1000 ppm co2 I exchange the room 1 or 2 times a day with core exhaust.
should I have moreair exchange throughout the day?
may night my exhaust runs.
yahigh vpd may get me out of hot water.
I’ve dropped temps and humidity for a couple days.
I I’m confused with yiur statement about water drops on leaves? The eggs I think I’m scoping may be water droplets? Am I understanding that right
Flowki
Well-Known Member
Again I don't know much about sealed co2 rooms and the effects of lack of venting. You need to talk to somebody who does as it might play into your issues.
What I meant with the insect thing is find out exactly what they are for sure (another poster thought they were something else) and if in some way they can fuck with the plant and force it to take up more water as some kind of defensive measure. That was a long shot idea, I don't know much about the various MJ pests and physical effects either, but it's what I would personally look into just to cover all bases.
Maineconnect
Active Member
In other words keep scoping.
I have seen no crawlers just translucent eggs and plenty.
I am taking action and spraying.
I am putting more airflow below my canopy towards my dehu.
& I’m looking for someone who knows a thing or to about co2.
thanks for the help man.
Your insight is very helpful.
I looked at my last cycle in this rooms chart and was only feeding at 1.2 ec at this point. Same size plants same size containers.
now I seem to be leveling out at around1.6-1.8.
only real difference co2.
maybe I’m over feeding.
if so it doesn’t reflect on my tables averages and I did go back to my old wand that gives the coco more of a flood.
I willkeep the post updated on how it progresses if you know anyone familiar with co2 please let me know.
( I have a 10k window unit ac running constantly so that is a source of fresh air all day.)
Pray for me I need this crop so bad.
Maineconnect
Active Member
I wonder if I should run the house and garden samples I have fulvic humics plus there enzyme product. I’m going to drop my feed down to 1.5 is and reduce CaMg and run a major flush on this room.
I’m also going to try and correct my stupid fucken low ph run off despite what people have been telling me
I’m also going to try and correct my stupid fucken low ph run off despite what people have been telling me
Flowki
Well-Known Member
I'd say be careful not to change too much too fast. If any new issues come up you have multiplied the possible sources. You've already lowered temps and changed humidity on top of some extra air circulation adjustment.
I don't think run off ph or even ec is suppose to come out the same as it went in since you are clearing excess nutrients. I also recall reading that flushing coco will mess with it's cec? exchange, mess up the balance basically. Watering to 20% run off with 3/4 strength for a few days would be about as close as I'd personally get to a ''flush''. But I say this with no experience of running co2 and what the ideal e.c is at your co2/temp/rh/par level. You should try to find this out before you do any drastic changes. They don't look over fed to me but who knows.
Put up a thread specifically asking for a sealed growers help, surely some are around. At-least if you provide them with the relative details you will be able to eliminate the co2 sealed side of things as an issue. If this is the first time you have ran co2 and this is the first time you've had such an issue then I'd say it's a high suspect.
Sorry I've read back a bit. 80f for leds should be completely fine normally, in sealed rooms up to 85f is suppose to be the whole point isn't it?, to allow the co2 use. It does seem strange you'd end up with over watering in this situation although if you were watering daily on top of high RH I guess it would make sense.
How do they look now?, I get the feeling slightly lowering humidity alone might have been a good first response.
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Rooster91762
Well-Known Member
I'm more of a visualist, I help teach people by making them see things from a different perspective, and although it has already been pointed out I would like to ad these analogies: Did you see the movie 'Jaws'? Remember the famous scene when Richard Dreyfus told the Capt. "You need a bigger boat?"... have you ever seen 50 pounds of potatoes packed into a 10 pound bag? In other words your ladies need way more room to dance in. That and over watering. Get those 2 things fixed and you will be off to the races bruh
twentyeight.threefive
Well-Known Member
He is in coco. And has pests. I'm not sure why this conversation is still going on.
Maineconnect
Active Member
its day 12 flower and plants look great.! Little stretch but I deffinately worked my way out of this jam so far.
what I did.
more airflow underneath canopy somewhat directed towards dehu.
sorayed conserve —-> Sulfur——>conserve ——> Cali clean three days apart——-> 50 k predator mites and I think I’m going to make it to the finish.
I also heard my CaMg strong st 5 ml / gal through transition & did give a bit of H & G humic @ enzymes seemed to help.
all
And all
Plants look well and there run off and stretch ( although not that excited about stretch and
maybe you can give me pointers on light distance$
)
I changed back to my original wand that delivers moreflow rate and flushed entire room at 1.2 ec with a slightly raised ph to try and correct my low run off ph. This is succession with the drop in food I believe only helped me.
my temps remain 79-82 at canopy 1200 ppm co2 and closely
Pay attention to my vpd.
mill post photos when I start to stack!
so far I’vekept it simple but really want to run a pk booster this round? Suggestions?
blessings
Thanks for insight and hlessinfs
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Flowki
Well-Known Member
The outdoor pic looks really nice, the indoor hard to tell with the hps but the canopy is damn near perfectly flat, do you run a hedge trimmer over those? ;p. I mean that as a compliment.
If the plants are very happy they will naturally grow a shit ton. That pre flower growth only becomes a bad thing if you don't have the space for them to naturally fill out their full potential, it's grower error basically, including over filling horizontal net pre flower. People bundle this healthy pre flower growth with the ''stretch'' that you get if lights are way too far away. The other main factor for that bad stretch (some speculation on my part) is that plants crammed together will A; have no other physical way to grow but up and B; try to out-compete competition by growing up.
I've seen lots of things to indiscriminantly reduce pre flower growth and stretch, like using heavy blue, dropping lights closer to shock stunt them, feeding less N, lowering temps, crush bending stems etc. They are all band aid solutions or out right bad for the plants. Gently tucking with a net while the stems are still nice and veg soft (upto 3 weeks after flip) is in my book the only thing that should be done. Mostly because it's manditory in order to get the most out of our lighting layouts.. but it also created the least amount of stress. I wouldn't even do that if I didn't have to, lets put it like that.
Fixing stretch or ''too big'' is done way back in veg, trying to fix it during pre flower is weeks+ too late. This is a far more difficult prediction process if you run diff strains a lot, as they ofc have differing natural sizes. When you also add something new to the mix that has a positive effect, the extra growth becomes a problem too, for predicting the final sizes, shit happens. But the key point is to understand that happy pre flower growth should be massively encouraged, especially in allowing horizontal/vertical space for them to grow into. It takes prediction and experience with the individual set-up/strain, very few short cuts unfortunately.
For that reason I always hold off from giving specific advice on certain things, like light heights. I don't know your set-up and intensity, if you move the lights to close on my account and they end up sucking up more nutes and going toxic/heat stressed.. not very good advice ;p. You can try THIS as to get a much better ball park figure for your specific setup. I don't know how accurate it truly is (although I'm using it myself) but at-least you can use it as a more accurate self tuned bench mark to make your own readings from your own setup. It's far better than going off ''well roughly 18 inches''.
I also can't comment at all on using pk boost. You use ec for a start, I use elemental ppm, so we are speaking two different languages essentially. I do recommend you try to get a handle on elemental ppm at some point, especially if you are venturing down the road of pk. Getting the amount of that stuff wrong is one of the few easy mistakes that can completely fuck up a grow in 1 day. Although not so easy if it's the liquid version but still, it's bad stuff in the wrong hands.. and something to be very careful using even in the right hands.
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Maineconnect
Active Member
wow a lot of really great information there and thank you for the canopy compliment.
I’m raising my lights up this morning in preparation ( maybe one more 12/12 cycle where they are)
seeing slight tip burn on new growth so I’m flushing w/ 1/3 strength nutes & rechargethis next watering.
It is a lot plants in a small space. My only hope is to get in there and do a really good leaf and bend whatever can be bent that’s pliable.
I would like to understandhow to feed on an elemental basis. Sounds like some somewhat involved chemistry and math.
I actually 8-12 weeks out on a very large rec grow.
Flowki
Well-Known Member
I've ran out of things to watch on netflix so riu posts have been getting longer ;p.
The elemental ppm pluss going onto dry salt nutrients was a very steep learning curve for me personally. I didn't enjoy it much at all but it was definitely worth the mind fuck, I'd do it again. Although tbh it was that bad I have mentally blocked the whole process,
