Biden's Infrastructure Week

[PizzaMan5000]

As somebody who lived in poverty while working and attending school full time, I want a check for all the loans that I took out and paid off.
A down payment on a house would be nice.....

I ate ramen or bologna with no cheese, and was sober to pay for school and housing. My loans never went over $3,000. I paid my shit off, working overtime and going to school.

If I knew that people wouldn't be expected to pay for debt, I would have skipped the job, and lived in a dorm... I would have been smoking and eating well....

 

[hanimmal]

if they don't fix why college is so overpriced vs when I was in school we have failed. 1st fix the stupid cost of college. Who is making all the doe....

Universities and colleges are re-investing a lot of that money on improving their campuses is what I would look at.

Like it or not if they don't have all the super expensive luxurious like pools, gym equipment/workout rooms, eatery options, study areas, etc all cost a ton of money. And if they don't have them they lose those kids that can afford to go to a 'better' school that does.

I took several loans to help pay my way through college. Then over the next 11 years, I paid all of the principle and interest back!

That was the agreement that I signed, so that's what I did. Why would anyone think they should get out of that loan agreement?

You took the money, and used it for whatever you wanted, so pay it back!

The first time I went to school I left after 2 years and had to pay back my loan with nothing gained. So I can see the issue that people who come from nothing and are not ready for college or are playing sports and are not able to take their classes seriously getting tens of thousands of dollars in debt and nothing to help them pay it off when they bill starts up when they are out of school for 6 months.

I was lucky and got a good job and was able to pay it off pretty quick, but things are not the same as they were in the 90's.

As somebody who lived in poverty while working and attending school full time, I want a check for all the loans that I took out and paid off.
A down payment on a house would be nice.....

I ate ramen or bologna with no cheese, and was sober to pay for school and housing. My loans never went over $3,000. I paid my shit off, working overtime and going to school.

If I knew that people wouldn't be expected to pay for debt, I would have skipped the job, and lived in a dorm... I would have been smoking and eating well....

If you could have went to a community college for free would you have done that instead?

Also not sure what you have heard but Biden said something along the lines of forgiving people who are in that couple years but no degree borrowing range and not just everything people have taken out.

And as for living on campus, a lot of kids don't have a choice and it is just setting them up to fail for them to try to maintain a job while taking on a full load of course work.

 

[PizzaMan5000]

Universities and colleges are re-investing a lot of that money on improving their campuses is what I would look at.

Like it or not if they don't have all the super expensive luxurious like pools, gym equipment/workout rooms, eatery options, study areas, etc all cost a ton of money. And if they don't have them they lose those kids that can afford to go to a 'better' school that does.




The first time I went to school I left after 2 years and had to pay back my loan with nothing gained. So I can see the issue that people who come from nothing and are not ready for college or are playing sports and are not able to take their classes seriously getting tens of thousands of dollars in debt and nothing to help them pay it off when they bill starts up when they are out of school for 6 months.

I was lucky and got a good job and was able to pay it off pretty quick, but things are not the same as they were in the 90's.



If you could have went to a community college for free would you have done that instead?

Also not sure what you have heard but Biden said something along the lines of forgiving people who are in that couple years but no degree borrowing range and not just everything people have taken out.

And as for living on campus, a lot of kids don't have a choice and it is just setting them up to fail for them to try to maintain a job while taking on a full load of course work.

It was community college, it still costs thousands per semester.

My point is I worked and struggled to pay for my own debt. We all face the same choices, pay now or pay later. I paid as soon as possible. I also didn't use loans for LIVING EXPENSES.
just because it's "for self improvement" doesn't mean that we aren't aware of the costs going into it.... A lot of student loan debt is for housing, I'm not getting a check for the apartment and bills from when I was a student.
^I went in with the intention to pay my own way, and now all the irresponsible and unrealistic people are getting a bailout..... Fucking bullshit!

I get frustrated when people complain about debt they signed up for.

 

[hanimmal]

It was community college, it still costs thousands per semester.

My point is I worked and struggled to pay for my own debt. We all face the same choices, pay now or pay later. I paid as soon as possible. I also didn't use loans for LIVING EXPENSES.
just because it's "for self improvement" doesn't mean that we aren't aware of the costs going into it.... A lot of student loan debt is for housing, I'm not getting a check for the apartment and bills from when I was a student.
^I went in with the intention to pay my own way, and now all the irresponsible and unrealistic people are getting a bailout..... Fucking bullshit!

I get frustrated when people complain about debt they signed up for.

Housing and food, rec, health, studying areas is where a lot of it is from.

I know what your saying on your personal struggle. It is a great argument for people who have already gotten through their education to complain about someone else.

I was talking about something different, but I would say that maybe we should do better and not think that it is correct for people to have to 'struggle' while gaining an education with anything other than the course load.

Also for anyone not understanding how this impacts kids who don't come from a family that can support them in their first crucial years and no understanding of what the workload in school is like, it is easy to end up with $20k+ bill to pay and no degree inside of 2 years. This is crippling to a 19 year old kid.

Your acting like people are being unresponsible because they have student debt is what I think is bullshit and makes me wonder why you would pick this issue to be so concerned over?

 

[PizzaMan5000]

Your acting like people are being unresponsible because they have student debt is what I think is bullshit and makes me wonder why you would pick this issue to be so concerned over?

Are you serious?

Yes... I believe people should pay their own debt.
That is my entire point.

Delayed gratification is the entire point of higher education. People want the reward without the effort nowadays.

 

[hanimmal]

Are you serious?

Yes... I believe people should pay their own debt.
That is my entire point.

Yes I am serious. People should not have to struggle just because other people did.

It is stupid and inefficient.

Delayed gratification is the entire point of higher education. People want the reward without the effort nowadays.

I disagree, the hard work put in to learn math and STEM subjects anyways, from my experience, is all about learning the actual material well enough that you are able to contribute in your field when you graduate when you have to really learn about what it is that you need to do.

Your troll about effort is wrong, because the effort should go into learning as much as you can and using your time earning your education building up as much experience as possible.

I would much rather have a kid intern for relevant job experience than having them go work in a restaurant or something and stress about bills.

 

[Dr.Amber Trichome]

Are you serious?

Yes... I believe people should pay their own debt.
That is my entire point.

Delayed gratification is the entire point of higher education. People want the reward without the effort nowadays.

People have always wanted reward without effort . This has been going on since the beginning of time.

 

[PizzaMan5000]

Yes I am serious. People should not have to struggle just because other people did.

It is stupid and inefficient.



I disagree, the hard work put in to learn math and STEM subjects anyways, from my experience, is all about learning the actual material well enough that you are able to contribute in your field when you graduate when you have to really learn about what it is that you need to do.

Your troll about effort is wrong, because the effort should go into learning as much as you can and using your time earning your education building up as much experience as possible.

I would much rather have a kid intern for relevant job experience than having them go work in a restaurant or something and stress about bills.

Yeah, but nobody wants to hire people who feel entitled to "everything free and without sacrifice".

Poverty as a young adult made me into a cook, mechanic, and a grower.

I'm not whining about how hard it was, I'm whining that people think they are entitled to something free, after agreeing to pay for it.... Like hiding a car when they are behind on payments.

 

[hanimmal]

Yeah, but nobody wants to hire people who feel entitled to "everything free and without sacrifice".

You are just trolling huh?

Poverty as a young adult made me into a cook, mechanic, and a grower.

Poverty for me got me into waiting tables, sales, management, during which I put my old lady through school for the better part of a decade, and then when she was done the Republicans triggered the Great Recession with their shit policies and I was lucky to be in a position to get my education.

I'm not whining about how hard it was, I'm whining that people think they are entitled to something free, after agreeing to pay for it.... Like hiding a car when they are behind on payments.

No, what you are whining about is you thinking that is what they are wanting and it is blinding you to understanding it is like someone that buys a car so they can get to work and earn a better living than the jobs they can get to on foot, and as soon as they get off the lot it takes a shit on them and the loan is still going to have to get paid. It is not helping them with a job and draining all their money.

 

[topcat]

Hmm. I went to Community College in the early 70s and it was free, besides books, labs. All UC transferable courses. Those were the days. No, no they weren't.

 

[hanimmal]

Hmm. I went to Community College in the early 70s and it was free, besides books, labs. All UC transferable courses. Those were the days. No, no they weren't.

Im really impressed with how well community colleges are working with high schools now too. Kids who are really on the ball and firing on all cylinders can graduate high school with (at least according to some people I met in school that did this) enough college credits for a undergraduate degree.
https://www.michigan.gov/documents/mde/Earning_College_Credit_in_HS_-_Synopsis_of_Opp_-_ADA_576819_7.pdf

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

Richest Hide Away Their Money: How to Stop It, Oscar Mayer Heir Says (businessinsider.com)

The Oscar Mayer heir who gave away his fortune reveals how the rich hide their wealth — and how to stop them

• New research indicates that the wealthiest Americans hide their money from tax collectors.
• Chuck Collins has written a whole book on how the wealthy hide their fortunes.
• He told Insider that it's a fixable problem but that it would require closing loopholes.

Chuck Collins knows how rich people hide their money.

Collins was an heir to the Oscar Mayer wiener fortune, an inheritance he gave away. That meant he learned firsthand how the wealthy, even the very charitable, hold on to their fortunes. It's one thing to give up your income, he learned, and another to compromise the principal — and deprive future generations of accrued wealth.

He opted to give it all away. Today, he's the director of the Program on Inequality and the Common Good at the Institute for Policy Studies, where he delves deep into billionaire gains, income inequality, and how the ultrawealthy dodge taxes in America.

The situation is likely worse than many people think. Recent research found that America's highest earners might have been hiding billions from the IRS, far more than assumed. The report, from the IRS and academic economists, found that the top 1% of Americans didn't report 21% of their income and that the figure might be twice as high for the top 0.1%.

Sen. Bernie Sanders has introduced legislation that would increase taxes and cut loopholes, and The Wall Street Journal recently reported that President Joe Biden was looking into beefing up the IRS.

In his upcoming book, "The Wealth Hoarders," Collins dives into what he calls the "wealth defense industry," the army of tax attorneys, family offices, accountants, and more who are devoted to protecting clients' wealth — and circumventing taxes. His thesis implies that this industry is an inevitable outgrowth of financialization, in which the financial sector grows out of proportion to the rest of the economy. But he argues it's not too late to reverse it.

Ahead of the book's publication, Insider spoke with Collins about his history, the book, and what needs to come next.

The state of the 'wealth defense industry'
Collins writes that the wealth defense industry has "mushroomed" since his introduction to it in 1983. For instance, there are now over 10,000 family offices worldwide, he writes.
more...

 

[Dr.Amber Trichome]

Richest Hide Away Their Money: How to Stop It, Oscar Mayer Heir Says (businessinsider.com)

The Oscar Mayer heir who gave away his fortune reveals how the rich hide their wealth — and how to stop them

• New research indicates that the wealthiest Americans hide their money from tax collectors.
• Chuck Collins has written a whole book on how the wealthy hide their fortunes.
• He told Insider that it's a fixable problem but that it would require closing loopholes.

Chuck Collins knows how rich people hide their money.

Collins was an heir to the Oscar Mayer wiener fortune, an inheritance he gave away. That meant he learned firsthand how the wealthy, even the very charitable, hold on to their fortunes. It's one thing to give up your income, he learned, and another to compromise the principal — and deprive future generations of accrued wealth.

He opted to give it all away. Today, he's the director of the Program on Inequality and the Common Good at the Institute for Policy Studies, where he delves deep into billionaire gains, income inequality, and how the ultrawealthy dodge taxes in America.

The situation is likely worse than many people think. Recent research found that America's highest earners might have been hiding billions from the IRS, far more than assumed. The report, from the IRS and academic economists, found that the top 1% of Americans didn't report 21% of their income and that the figure might be twice as high for the top 0.1%.

Sen. Bernie Sanders has introduced legislation that would increase taxes and cut loopholes, and The Wall Street Journal recently reported that President Joe Biden was looking into beefing up the IRS.

In his upcoming book, "The Wealth Hoarders," Collins dives into what he calls the "wealth defense industry," the army of tax attorneys, family offices, accountants, and more who are devoted to protecting clients' wealth — and circumventing taxes. His thesis implies that this industry is an inevitable outgrowth of financialization, in which the financial sector grows out of proportion to the rest of the economy. But he argues it's not too late to reverse it.

Ahead of the book's publication, Insider spoke with Collins about his history, the book, and what needs to come next.

The state of the 'wealth defense industry'
Collins writes that the wealth defense industry has "mushroomed" since his introduction to it in 1983. For instance, there are now over 10,000 family offices worldwide, he writes.
more...

Sickening.

 

[PizzaMan5000]

No, what you are whining about is you thinking that is what they are wanting and it is blinding you to understanding it is like someone that buys a car so they can get to work and earn a better living than the jobs they can get to on foot, and as soon as they get off the lot it takes a shit on them and the loan is still going to have to get paid. It is not helping them with a job and draining all their money.

That's just a fact of life. No car= walk.

I delivered pizza for years... Maintaining my car, insurance, and registration was everything. Any bad choices, and I'm unemployed.
But it's better to make $20+ per hour because I was skilled and responsible enough to always have a car. Cooks make $9/hr, but don't need a car.
Lots of cooks tried to "step up" to delivering, but were no-shows when their car broke.
^
Don't bite off more than you can chew.

I just don't believe in rewarding bad decision making.

 

[mooray]

It's always been tough finding that line of how far we want to let people fall, or punish them, when they make a mistake.

To parallel a story of why I think some folks are unhappy with the results of their education and the expense, I did some technical work for a guy that was a pure salesman and he sold a customer a piece of equipment with promises of prosperity, which of course did not materialize. In the end, the fellow bought something that was useless to him and all he had to show for it was debt.

I feel like we're talking out of both sides of our mouth when we complain about the death of the American dream, and also expect people to honor their debt, like one party must hold up their end of the deal, but the other does not.

 

[hanimmal]

That's just a fact of life. No car= walk.

I delivered pizza for years... Maintaining my car, insurance, and registration was everything. Any bad choices, and I'm unemployed.
But it's better to make $20+ per hour because I was skilled and responsible enough to always have a car. Cooks make $9/hr, but don't need a car.
Lots of cooks tried to "step up" to delivering, but were no-shows when their car broke.
^
Don't bite off more than you can chew.

I just don't believe in rewarding bad decision making.

Ok?

That really doesn't have anything to do with education loans hammering a portion of our economy.

It's always been tough finding that line of how far we want to let people fall, or punish them, when they make a mistake.

To parallel a story of why I think some folks are unhappy with the results of their education and the expense, I did some technical work for a guy that was a pure salesman and he sold a customer a piece of equipment with promises of prosperity, which of course did not materialize. In the end, the fellow bought something that was useless to him and all he had to show for it was debt.

I feel like we're talking out of both sides of our mouth when we complain about the death of the American dream, and also expect people to honor their debt, like one party must hold up their end of the deal, but the other does not.

Also the 'making a mistake' may just have been a function of where they were at the time. There are a million reasons for kids to not be able to complete their college education that it shouldn't be assumed that even the majority of the people with crippling college debt are there because of a mistake. And may a few months/years later may end up in a different position in life where they can succeed where they couldn't (for whatever reason) before.

It is in the differentiating the people who people get mad about using the common goods from the rest that ends up bottle necking success. And this is the problem with the current Republican obstruction of any program not directly benefitting their demographic.

 

[mooray]

That's a good point. "Making a mistake" wasn't the right language.

 

[hanimmal]

 

[hanimmal]

It is so nice having non gas lighting competent press briefings.

 

[Rob Roy]

if they don't fix why college is so overpriced vs when I was in school we have failed. 1st fix the stupid cost of college. Who is making all the doe....

Perhaps, one day this will make sense to you.