PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure how your 58% plus 5% equals 85%, but it's true I should have clarified that 80% of adults in Israel have been vaxxed. If you think my conclusions are dumb af, then show me where I'm wrong.
Pandemic 2020
- Thread starter Jimdamick
- Start date
- Status
hanimmal
Well-Known Member
From your last couple posts you are saying that the title means that they died from covid/Vaccines, but that is a false reading.
Note that it says that 'this table contains data on the number of initial hospitalization and coronary deaths that occurred after the first or second dose of the vaccines'. That is not saying that they were there because of the virus or vaccine. And using the below information to try to paint it as such is disingenuous as fuck.
As for your 'Your dumb' trolling of me. Im fine with being dumb as long as I know how to read a graph title and don't get sucked into a digital death cult.
PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
They all died from covid. Some were fully vaccinated, some had only one dose, some were unvaxxed. That's what he data is comparing: how many people died of covid who were vaxxed or not. It's basic, simple and straightforward. I'm sorry that you can't understand such things, and are unwilling to dig into the data yourself. I have posted the database links numerous times, and if you disagree you can look foryourself, and then debate me with knowledge, instead of spending time looking for silly gifs and memes to post as your snarky retort.
hanimmal
Well-Known Member
People who have died and recording their corona virus status and if they have had the vaccine or not.
Is it really that hard to understand how that is different?
Your death cult trolling is boring, at least having to look for a meme takes some thought.
PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
Google translations can be weird from hebrew, hence the "coronary" thing. Today the same link is being translated as "Corona Mortality and Hospitalizations.." which seems pretty clear what the cause is. Again, here s the link to the database which is straightforward, and as part of the Ministry of Health's "covid-19 reservoir" I can assure you that it doesn't include any silly things like car accidents. Again here is the link:
hanimmal
Well-Known Member
Last edited:
potroastV2
Well-Known Member
If you think that he's "dumb," just try to imagine what everyone else here thinks about YOU.*
Thanks, I'm gonna be laughing about this all day!
* only a pea-brained idiot would be proud of taking 2 covid tests every week!
doublejj
Well-Known Member
After son dies of COVID, mother holds vaccine drive at his funeral
www.cbsnews.com
After son dies of COVID, mother holds vaccine drive at his funeral
Betty Antoine's 46-year-old son Brandon died of COVID after refusing to get vaccinated.
www.cbsnews.com
printer
Well-Known Member
Flawed Paper on COVID-19 Vaccines, Deaths Spreads Widely Before Retraction
The COVID-19 vaccines have been shown in trials and real-world application to be safe and effective. But a paper shared widely online claimed that vaccines cause two deaths for every three lives saved. Experts say the analysis misinterpreted data and was flawed — and it has now been retracted by the journal that published it.
www.factcheck.org
A “peer reviewed, scientific study showed that the COVID-19 vaccine causes two deaths for every three lives it saves.”
The study, "The Safety of COVID-19 Vaccinations — We Should Rethink the Policy," was done by three European researchers, led by Harald Walach, professor at Poznan University of Medical Sciences in Poland.
The researchers said that they calculated from a large Israeli field study the number of people who needed to be vaccinated to prevent one death; and that they used the Adverse Drug Reactions database of the European Medicines Agency and of the Dutch National Register to get the number of vaccination cases "reporting severe side effects and the number of cases with fatal side effects."
The researchers concluded: "For three deaths prevented by vaccination we have to accept two inflicted by vaccination."
The European Medicines Agency, however, warns that its data on adverse reactions can’t be used on its own to conclude whether a vaccine caused death:
"The information on this website relates to suspected side effects, i.e. medical events that have been observed following the administration of the COVID-19 vaccines, but which are not necessarily related to or caused by the vaccine. These events may have been caused by another illness or be associated with another medicine taken by the patient at the same time."
The study was published in the journal Vaccines on June 24. Four days later, the journal appended a note to the study, expressing concerns about the study and calling its main conclusion incorrect. The note said:
"The journal is issuing this expression of concern to alert readers to significant concerns regarding the paper cited above. Serious concerns have been raised about misinterpretation of the data and the conclusions.
"The major concern is the misrepresentation of the COVID-19 vaccination efforts and misrepresentation of the data, e.g., Abstract: ‘For three deaths prevented by vaccination we have to accept two inflicted by vaccination.’
"Stating that these deaths linked to vaccination efforts is incorrect and distorted."
A board member of the journal, University of Oxford immunologist Katie Ewer, tweeted that she resigned the board post because of the publication. She said the study "is grossly negligent and I can't believe it passed peer-review. I hope it will be retracted."
The journal’s associate editor, Florian Krammer, a professor of vaccinology at the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai in New York City, also tweeted that he resigned because of the study.
Walach, an author of the study, told Retraction Watch, a website that reported on the aftermath of the study, that he does not agree with the expression of concern, saying "we have used and analyzed the data correctly, and not incorrectly. But that the data are less than optimal is clear to everyone and we said so in our paper. The purpose is to generate enough momentum for governments and researchers to finally create the good data that are long overdue."
www.politifact.com
COVID deaths reported in Israel for first time in over 2 weeks
Unvaccinated 48-year-old man and vaccinated man in his 80s succumb as daily cases keep rising; news outlets say Health Ministry inflating number of serious cases
The ministry said that nearly 5.7 million people out of Israel’s population of roughly 9.3 million have received at least one vaccine shot, of whom close to 5.2 million have been fully vaccinated.
The deaths came as Israel has been experiencing a resurgence in infections due to the ultra-infectious Delta variant, though there have been few deaths and serious cases have risen slowly following the country’s mass vaccination campaign.
www.timesofisrael.com
The COVID-19 vaccines have been shown in trials and real-world application to be safe and effective. But a paper shared widely online claimed that vaccines cause two deaths for every three lives saved. Experts say the analysis misinterpreted data and was flawed — and it has now been retracted by the journal that published it.
Flawed Paper on COVID-19 Vaccines, Deaths Spreads Widely Before Retraction - FactCheck.org
The COVID-19 vaccines have been shown in trials and real-world application to be safe and effective. But a paper shared widely online claimed that vaccines cause two deaths for every three lives saved. Experts say the analysis misinterpreted data and was flawed -- and it has now been retracted...
www.factcheck.org
A “peer reviewed, scientific study showed that the COVID-19 vaccine causes two deaths for every three lives it saves.”
The study, "The Safety of COVID-19 Vaccinations — We Should Rethink the Policy," was done by three European researchers, led by Harald Walach, professor at Poznan University of Medical Sciences in Poland.
The researchers said that they calculated from a large Israeli field study the number of people who needed to be vaccinated to prevent one death; and that they used the Adverse Drug Reactions database of the European Medicines Agency and of the Dutch National Register to get the number of vaccination cases "reporting severe side effects and the number of cases with fatal side effects."
The researchers concluded: "For three deaths prevented by vaccination we have to accept two inflicted by vaccination."
The European Medicines Agency, however, warns that its data on adverse reactions can’t be used on its own to conclude whether a vaccine caused death:
"The information on this website relates to suspected side effects, i.e. medical events that have been observed following the administration of the COVID-19 vaccines, but which are not necessarily related to or caused by the vaccine. These events may have been caused by another illness or be associated with another medicine taken by the patient at the same time."
The study was published in the journal Vaccines on June 24. Four days later, the journal appended a note to the study, expressing concerns about the study and calling its main conclusion incorrect. The note said:
"The journal is issuing this expression of concern to alert readers to significant concerns regarding the paper cited above. Serious concerns have been raised about misinterpretation of the data and the conclusions.
"The major concern is the misrepresentation of the COVID-19 vaccination efforts and misrepresentation of the data, e.g., Abstract: ‘For three deaths prevented by vaccination we have to accept two inflicted by vaccination.’
"Stating that these deaths linked to vaccination efforts is incorrect and distorted."
A board member of the journal, University of Oxford immunologist Katie Ewer, tweeted that she resigned the board post because of the publication. She said the study "is grossly negligent and I can't believe it passed peer-review. I hope it will be retracted."
The journal’s associate editor, Florian Krammer, a professor of vaccinology at the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai in New York City, also tweeted that he resigned because of the study.
Walach, an author of the study, told Retraction Watch, a website that reported on the aftermath of the study, that he does not agree with the expression of concern, saying "we have used and analyzed the data correctly, and not incorrectly. But that the data are less than optimal is clear to everyone and we said so in our paper. The purpose is to generate enough momentum for governments and researchers to finally create the good data that are long overdue."
Journal discredited study about COVID vaccine deaths
Conservative commentator Liz Wheeler, who has 1.4 million Facebook followers, was eager to get to the first segment on h
COVID deaths reported in Israel for first time in over 2 weeks
Unvaccinated 48-year-old man and vaccinated man in his 80s succumb as daily cases keep rising; news outlets say Health Ministry inflating number of serious cases
The ministry said that nearly 5.7 million people out of Israel’s population of roughly 9.3 million have received at least one vaccine shot, of whom close to 5.2 million have been fully vaccinated.
The deaths came as Israel has been experiencing a resurgence in infections due to the ultra-infectious Delta variant, though there have been few deaths and serious cases have risen slowly following the country’s mass vaccination campaign.
COVID deaths reported in Israel for first time in over 2 weeks
Unvaccinated 48-year-old man and vaccinated man in his 80s succumb as daily cases keep rising; news outlets say Health Ministry inflating number of serious cases
www.timesofisrael.com
Sativied
Well-Known Member
Roughly 58% of the total population is fully vaxxed. An additional 5% of the total population had 1 shot. That 63% of the total population who had 1 or 2 shot equals roughly 85% of the adult population. Which does not mean, like you claimed, that 80% is vaccinated. Only 58% is fully vaccinated.... and effectively even less cause it takes a week or two after the 2nd shot to build up immunity. In addition to the incorrect vax rates as a base for the rest of your post, you can’t determine efficacy by looking at a random small period/pool and compare it to the base vax rate of the entire population even if it was 80-20. That’s not how that works. Nor by comparing essentially fully or partly vaccinated older people with unvaccinated younger people.
The group that is most likely to need hospitalization or even die is currently almost entirely overlapping the fully vaccinated group. In fact last week only 1 fully vaccinated yet infected under 60 was seriously ill, none under 50, opposed to 14 unvaccinated under 50.
Read the article I posted, it’s a rare occassion a link to a news article fits so well.
PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
If you're talking about the translation and the term coronary, as I mentioned Google translate isn't perfect. Here is a different translation:
So I was off by a few % because I was giving averages? OK, but what's your point really? The ratios of death and hospitalization still stand, and honestly based on your reasoning it even reinforces my math (since I included the largely unvaccinated under 20 population in my data pull), if you care to crunch the numbers.
hanimmal
Well-Known Member
My point is that what you are showing as 'evidence' is evolving to fit the story you are trying like hell to sell here, which is very sketchy.
I would still trust the doctors here in America that are telling us in real time that almost all of the people in the hospital for the virus are unvaccinated people.
Sativied
Well-Known Member
I expected a reply that would make me doubt whether you are trolling or just dumb. Leaning heavily to the latter. But then, can you be this dumb yet able to write complete sentences. You’re effectively off by almost 30% by the way, but as I explained even if you had used the correct percentages your ratios wouldn’t represent anything meaningful a selfrespecting vax-sceptic could sensibly use. to imply whatever point it is you think you have.
PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
That might have been true back in April, but not currently.
Coronavirus (COVID-19) Overview
COVID-19 is a new type of coronavirus that causes mild to severe cases. Here’s a quick guide on how to spot symptoms, risk factors, prevent spread of the disease, and find out what to do if you think you have it.
www.webmd.com
As I already mentioned, I should have said adults vaxxed, as I didn't include kids in that number. With that I'd be maybe 5% off. We can do the same debate with kids included in the numbers if you like, but it won't help your cause, which you would see for yourself if your were to actually look at the data instead of engaging in a hollow debate.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
remember when you cried when i said it was good to kill nazis and then a few weeks later you claimed you were a secret nazi killer who almost killed a nazi once?That might have been true back in April, but not currently.
Coronavirus (COVID-19) Overview
COVID-19 is a new type of coronavirus that causes mild to severe cases. Here’s a quick guide on how to spot symptoms, risk factors, prevent spread of the disease, and find out what to do if you think you have it.
View attachment 4951810
As I already mentioned, I should have said adults vaxxed, as I didn't include kids in that number. With that I'd be maybe 5% off. We can do the same debate with kids included in the numbers if you like, but it won't help your cause, which you would see for yourself if your were to actually look at the data instead of engaging in a hollow debate.
anyhoo the only people dying in significant numbers from covid anymore are the unvaccinated and also your vagina smells bad
hanimmal
Well-Known Member
https://www.rollitup.org/t/pandemic-2020.1008556/post-16445659That might have been true back in April, but not currently.
Coronavirus (COVID-19) Overview
COVID-19 is a new type of coronavirus that causes mild to severe cases. Here’s a quick guide on how to spot symptoms, risk factors, prevent spread of the disease, and find out what to do if you think you have it.
View attachment 4951810
As I already mentioned, I should have said adults vaxxed, as I didn't include kids in that number. With that I'd be maybe 5% off. We can do the same debate with kids included in the numbers if you like, but it won't help your cause, which you would see for yourself if your were to actually look at the data instead of engaging in a hollow debate.
Once again you are pretending like incident of a person having this virus while in the hospital is relevant (or more likely just a distraction to confuse people who don't understand the death cult trolling) to the vast majority of people who are sick with the virus being the reason they are in the hospital.
The thing you are cherry picking around is that those people that are vaccinated are not the ones getting seriously ill and taking up a shit load of resources to treat in the hospital and putting vulnerable people at higher risk.
https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-health-941fcf43d9731c76c16e7354f5d5e187
Jimdamick
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the info @PJ Diaz, I didn't know that.You probably want to opt for real N95's, and avoid the KN95 masks. They aren't NIOSH approved (as they don't meet the NIOSH standards for use in healthcare settings), and the CDC just pulled the EUA on them at the end of June:
Update: FDA No Longer Authorizes Non-NIOSH or Decontaminated FFRs
The FDA revoked the emergency use authorizations for non-NIOSH-approved disposable respirators and the EUAs for decontamination and bioburden reduction systems.www.fda.gov
It turns out that silk masks are pretty effective, more so than cotton:
Best silk face masks on the market
Studies find that silk face masks effectively help repel aerosol droplets, like those that carry Covid-19www.nbcnews.com
I researched and read that the only difference between the two maskes was that the KN95 were manufactured off shore in China.
The Best FDA-Approved KN95 Face Masks on Amazon | PEOPLE.com
I never saw/heard about the new rules issued by the CDC.
Revoked EUAs for Non-NIOSH-Approved Disposable Filtering Facepiece Respirators | FDA
Oh well, I guess I'll have to eat the ones that I bought for $25 on Amazon & get these, at least for my wife who is a teacher.
NIOSH Approved N95 Mask Particulate Respirator - Pack of 20 Face Masks - Universal Fit
Visit the Maxboost Store
4.7 out of 5 stars 365 ratings
| Price: | $46.95 ($2.35 / Count) Prime FREE Delivery & FREE Returns |
https://www.amazon.com/gp/cobrandcard/redirect.html?imp=9bb669b2-07e1-4899-87e9-beaf0a10c9b1&location=%2Fl%2F14611608011&token=527C1472A7099EBA29617456C39FC691CDDD13EC
| Size | Pack of 20 |
| Style | Pack of 20 |
| Brand | Maxboost |
| Material | Nonwoven Fabric, Melt-blown nonwoven fabric |
| Item Weight | 1 Ounces |
- Nonwoven Fabric, Melt-blown nonwoven fabric
- Imported
- NIOSH Approved N95 certified for at least 95 percent filtration efficiency against certain non-oil based particles.
- Adjustable nose clip helps in obtaining a secure seal.
- Durable latex-free material to ensure your wearing comfort.
- Compatible with a variety of protective eyewear and hearing protection.
- Advanced electrostatic media is designed for ease of breathing, and produced by a credible manufacturer (Suzhou Fangtian Industries Co., Ltd.), Model: FT-N040.
I don't really go out much, just to the grocery store where I can maintain social distancing pretty much, so I'll use the KN95's & get N95's for my wife.
The K95's seem to be adequate for me, plus I hate the double bands on the N95 (They mess up my hair
)Thanks again
- Status