Spider mite eggs wiped out with safer insecticidal soap

[jonnynobody]

I had to quarantine 3 plants due to a mite infestation. I figured I'd go all out war with 'em to see if I could save them. If I can't eliminate the problem the plants get trashed. Yesterday I applied Safer brand insecticide soap (potassium salts of fatty acids) @ 50% strength using 9ml/quart. I rubbed each and every leaf like I was washing a dinner plate with my fingers. I rubbed the stalk and heavily sprayed the medium, the pot, and everything around it. Today I checked 'em out and I saw nothing but clean leaves for the most part. I did observe 1 or 2 eggs, but that's one hell of an improvement in 1 application. It seems to me like manually scrubbing leaves with a good old fashioned soap solution is the best way to eliminate eggs and disrupt the larval cycle. Adults are kinda easy to kill, but the eggs are the real root of the infestation. I did notice some chlorosis and some unhappy leaves. I also dunked them in tetrasan which is an ovicide. I think the tetrasan is what caused the damage. To verify I'll transfer a single plant from nursery B into isolation nursery A. I'll apply the Safer soap again @9ml/qt. and rub the leaves the same way I did yesterday. Once it dries I'll spray the leaves to eliminate any residual soap that might interfere with the leaves ability to breathe. If no damage is present tomorrow I do believe I found my nuclear mite egg killer. Of course this is something that is most practical in the vegetative stage when the plants are small and more manageable. Once they're big and in a flower room this method obviously would not work.

I've tried just about everything and all these fuckers do is wink at me, smile, and keep on bug fucking the shit outta my leaves. I'll report back tomorrow if the soap damaged the test plant or not. If no damage is present then I'm gonna lay into these vegging plants hard with leaf scrubs using the soap to wipe these bastards out. I'll also be able to confirm the tetrasan is a bad choice to use due to the damage it causes. So far the Safer soap has been the best product I've used so far.

I'm also going to try a dilute solution of dr bronner's pepperminte castile soap and do the same leaf scrub in a few days to see if it produces the same effect.

Anyone else have experience using soap solutions for leaf scrubs? I'll take any tips or tricks I can get my hands on!

 

[myke]

I use the safers at 50ml/litre.Why you only doing 9?

 

[jonnynobody]

I use the safers at 50ml/litre.Why you only doing 9?

Wow that is a lot of soap. I burned the plants at the Safer brand recommendation of 18.5ml/quart. However, I didn't rinse the leaves after the soap dried. I think it clogged the pores and suffocated the leaves.

This is a brand new product for me and I have no experience with it other than the 2 applications I've done so far. Is it normal practice to rinse the soap residue off after it dries? I keep hearing everywhere how innocuous this stuff is, but with 18.5ml/quart the plants burned pretty good. The larger ones took it better with less damage, but it was clear the soap harmed the plants. I'm leaning on failure to rinse as the culprit. I remember hearing about mighty wash doing the same thing which is why they sell mighty rinse. The MW leaves a nasty residue on the leaves that was damaging grower's plants. Good old fashioned suffocation kills everything. Thanks for taking the time to help me out here brother.

 

[myke]

Well theirs a few kinds,right now Im using the yellow smells like lemons.Directions say 50ml/L.Now could be because im in Canada they've diluted it?.Ive never rinsed after?Maybe I should start lol.

 

[myke]

Ok I also have the white bottle it says 20ml/l,50.5% potassium salts,

 

[myke]

Ok so yellow is called End All. 50ml/l now I know why the white stuff is more money.

 

[jonnynobody]

Ok I also have the white bottle it says 20ml/l,50.5% potassium salts,

Mine is almost the same. I think it was 45% potassium salts of fatty acids. This is unexpected and interesting. I gotta figure this out. What size plants are you applying it on? Mine are fairly small:



Are yours much bigger than this? The big plants took it much better than the small ones. They were almost completely unharmed, but I did notice a little twist in some new growth. Within a 2 days no damage was visible so the big'uns bounced back quickly. The small ones had lots of twisting and new growth came out chlorotic. Within 4 or 5 days new growth was coming out properly and the plants were on the mend.

Since the 9ml/quart did eliminate the mite eggs I'm going to stick with that just to be on the safe side. I'm also going to rinse after the soap dries this time to keep the plant leaves from suffocating. I'll report back with pictures tomorrow. Hopefully all is right with the world

 

[jonnynobody]

Ok so yellow is called End All. 50ml/l now I know why the white stuff is more money.

Man I was gonna say that's a viscous amount of soap per liter. 20ml sounds better

This stuff is really impressive. I'm planning to mix up a little dr bronner's castile soap at 10ml/quart and test that on a single plant too. Rinse after drying and see how it goes. It appears chemical pesticides have been the most ineffective against mite eggs and the most effective pesticide has been good old fashioned soap. Sometimes the hippies really know what they're talking about when it comes to plant care

 

[myke]

Yeah I spray clones and big plants with the same mix. I literally soak them their dripping after. Good to know that half strength works. Will save me some money.
I haven’t noticed any damage after spraying even when I cut clones. I flip them and spray then in rooting powder and stab.

 

[jonnynobody]

Yeah I spray clones and big plants with the same mix. I literally soak them their dripping after. Good to know that half strength works. Will save me some money.
I haven’t noticed any damage after spraying even when I cut clones. I flip them and spray then in rooting powder and stab.

Do you reduce the power on your light output after application? Mine were at full power. I'm wondering if that's the culprit.

 

[myke]

Do you reduce the power on your light output after application? Mine were at full power. I'm wondering if that's the culprit.

I try to spray just before lights out.

 

[jonnynobody]

I try to spray just before lights out.

I think that was my fatal error. I sprayed in full blast light at the beginning of lights on. It looked exactly like phytotoxicity. I just sprayed a test plant with 9ml/quart of safer soap and finger scrubbed all the leaves. I'm waiting for it to dry then I'll spray er down with some h20. After it dries I'll toss er back in under the light. If all is right with the world tomorrow I'll know I've got this bull by the horns. Thanks for helping me figure this out.

 

[OldMedUser]

Ok so yellow is called End All. 50ml/l now I know why the white stuff is more money.

I use the End All concentrate for mites and thrips but add 10ml/L canola or neem oil to it to make it even more effective. It does not kill the eggs so I use 4 applications 4 days apart to wipe them out for good. Like you I never rinse it off and doesn't seem to hurt the plants at all.

So many people claim that you need to use nastier stuff and switch between 3 products or the get used to it and that's bro-science at it's finest. Safers kills by drying out the adults/young and the added oil suffocates them so there's nothing for the bugs to become acclimated to like they can over many generations with chemical products. It takes years for bugs to adapt to any product that kills chemically.

Canadian here too and I haven't noticed the white stuff but then I'm not looking for it either.

 

[OldMedUser]

I think that was my fatal error. I sprayed in full blast light at the beginning of lights on. It looked exactly like phytotoxicity. I just sprayed a test plant with 9ml/quart of safer soap and finger scrubbed all the leaves. I'm waiting for it to dry then I'll spray er down with some h20. After it dries I'll toss er back in under the light. If all is right with the world tomorrow I'll know I've got this bull by the horns. Thanks for helping me figure this out.

Rookie mistake my friend. No liquids with the lights on tho I move my plants away from the lights, turn the fan off and spray when needed or set my timer so the lights go off when it's convenient for me to spray.

It doesn't kill the eggs tho your plant massage therapy would do that. Spraying multiple times a few days apart is the way to wipe them out. 1st spray kills all the adults but there are lots of eggs hatching the day after so you need to spray again before they become mature enough to lay more eggs. then a couple more times to get any you missed. I like to do at least 4 sprays but will do 5 just to make sure especially if it's close to flowering time. Do not spray buds unless you like the taste of soap in your smoke.

Be consistent in your spraying schedule or your war with mites could go on for ages like it was with me. 2 years of half-assing it then finally stuck to the program and haven't seen a mite for 2 years now tho seem to always have a few thrips running around but they don't seem to hurt much unless they have a population explosion.

Get some cheap canola oil and add 10ml/L/qt to your mix. Shake gently all the time you are spraying to mix it in well or it floats on top in your sprayer and doesn't get on the bugs. A lot of the bug sprays have it listed as an ingredient because it works well.

There is no need to rub the leaves and that's probably contributing to the damage. Just make sure you spray every little bit especially underneath as that's where a lot like to hide and lay their eggs. I use a strong light behind me shining over my shoulder to see dry spots better so I don't miss any spots. Non toxic to humans so use my left hand to run up the branches while spraying and even lay the plants sideways on a plastic sheet to more easily get under the leaves. Then stand them up and soak the tops.

Good luck!

 

[jonnynobody]

I use the End All concentrate for mites and thrips but add 10ml/L canola or neem oil to it to make it even more effective. It does not kill the eggs so I use 4 applications 4 days apart to wipe them out for good. Like you I never rinse it off and doesn't seem to hurt the plants at all.

So many people claim that you need to use nastier stuff and switch between 3 products or the get used to it and that's bro-science at it's finest. Safers kills by drying out the adults/young and the added oil suffocates them so there's nothing for the bugs to become acclimated to like they can over many generations with chemical products. It takes years for bugs to adapt to any product that kills chemically.

Canadian here too and I haven't noticed the white stuff but then I'm not looking for it either. View attachment 4980266

Do you use the recommended rate on the bottle or do you recommend reducing the ratio a bit? I'm thinking about grabbing a bottle of the End All concentrate. I see it has pyrethrins in it which is great. That stuff is supposed to be great at knocking down spider mites. I'm really hoping I can knock this population out. Just as an insurance policy I started a couple trays of seedlings in case I lose the war here. I'm about 90% sure I can get this under control, but backup plans are better to have and not need than need and not have Thank you for the recommendation on the End All. I'll give it a shot and add the neem at the rate you recommended. Gotta whip these little leaf vampires back to hell where they belong.

I'll apply the safer soap just before lights off with no rinse to see if that yields better results. If all goes well I'll again try the recommended rate of 18.75ml/quart until the End All arrives. Then I'll follow your IPM recommendation every 4 days until they're gone. Your help is much appreciated.

 

[OldMedUser]

Do you use the recommended rate on the bottle or do you recommend reducing the ratio a bit? I'm thinking about grabbing a bottle of the End All concentrate. I see it has pyrethrins in it which is great. That stuff is supposed to be great at knocking down spider mites. I'm really hoping I can knock this population out. Just as an insurance policy I started a couple trays of seedlings in case I lose the war here. I'm about 90% sure I can get this under control, but backup plans are better to have and not need than need and not have Thank you for the recommendation on the End All. I'll give it a shot and add the neem at the rate you recommended. Gotta whip these little leaf vampires back to hell where they belong.

I'll apply the safer soap just before lights off with no rinse to see if that yields better results. If all goes well I'll again try the recommended rate of 18.75ml/quart until the End All arrives. Then I'll follow your IPM recommendation every 4 days until they're gone. Your help is much appreciated.

I'm using the End All concentrate with the 10ml/L canola oil added mixed as directed with 50ml/L and it worked great with mites once I was consistent with my spray schedule as mentioned above.

I'm pretty sure it was the light that caused your issues and not the spray itself. Even water under the lights will cause brown spots. I don't rinse partly/mostly because I'm a bit lazy and it won't hurt but I'd wait until you have finished the 4 sprays then rinse just the once. In humid grows all that spraying could lead to powdery mildew or other fungal problems. Really dry here most of the year but I never spray anything unless it's to fight bugs or apply a needed nutrient for a quick fix.

Religious folks call their god the great designer but man it made a lot of design errors in all sorts of it's creations and what was it thinking when it made mites!