Will You Take The Vaccine?

Are you going to take the corona virus vaccine?

  • No.

  • Yes.


Results are only viewable after voting.

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Since people who are fully vaccinated can still catch covid, and can still infect others who are fully vaccinated with covid, the main advantage of the shot seems to be preventing you getting a severe chest infection and needing medical care/clogging the ICU.

While COVID-19 vaccines are highly effective at preventing severe disease, hospitalization, and death from COVID-19 and also reduce the likelihood of mild or asymptomatic infection, a small share of fully vaccinated individuals do become infected, and some become hospitalized or have died. These rare occurrences are known as “breakthrough cases” which are to be expected, and historically known to occur with other vaccines as none is 100% effective.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) currently monitors hospitalizations and deaths, from any cause, among fully vaccinated individuals with COVID-19, but not breakthrough infections, which it stopped monitoring as of May 1. CDC presents this data in aggregate at the national level but not by state, and there is no single, public repository for data by state or data on breakthrough infections, since the CDC stopped monitoring them.

We therefore reviewed the websites and other official state sources for all 50 states and D.C. to see which are providing data on COVID-19 breakthrough cases, hospitalizations and deaths, how regularly, and what those data may tell us. We only used data from official state sources (we did not include data available only in news media reports, for example). Where a state did not provide comparable data on overall COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations, or deaths reported over the period in which it captured breakthrough events, we obtained data on cases and deaths from the Johns Hopkins University COVID-19 Dashboard and on hospitalizations from the U.S. Department of Health & Human Services for the appropriate period (see methods for more detail).

Importantly, not all hospitalizations and deaths of those fully vaccinated and diagnosed with COVID-19 are due to COVID-19 or have a known cause at the time of reporting. The CDC reports that as of July 19, of 5,601 hospitalized breakthrough cases, 27% were asymptomatic or not related to COVID-19 and of 1,141 fatal cases, 26% were asymptomatic or not related to COVID-19. States differ in whether they provide this detail. DC, for example, reports that as of July 11, 50% of hospitalized breakthrough cases were due to COVID-19, 19% were not, and 31% were of unknown reason. However, few states made these distinctions. Where they did, we only included breakthrough hospitalizations and deaths due to COVID-19. In other cases, some of these breakthrough events may be due to causes other than COVID-19.
Overall, we find that:
  • Half of states (25) report some data on COVID-19 breakthrough events (see Table 1). Twenty-four provide data on breakthrough cases, 19 on hospitalizations and on deaths.
  • Fifteen of these states regularly update these data, often on a weekly basis. The rest use a different frequency, have one-time reports, have stopped updating, or have an unclear reporting frequency.
  • The data reported from these states indicate that breakthrough cases, hospitalizations, and deaths are extremely rare events among those who are fully vaccinated against COVID-19 (see Figure 1). The rate of breakthrough cases reported among those fully vaccinated is below 1% in all reporting states, ranging from 0.01% in Connecticut to 0.54% in Arkansas.
    • The hospitalization rate among fully vaccinated people with COVID-19 ranged from effectively zero (0.00%) in California, Delaware, D.C., Indiana, New Jersey, New Mexico, Vermont, and Virginia to 0.06% in Arkansas. (Note: Hospitalization may or may not have been due to COVID-19.)

    • The rates of death among fully vaccinated people with COVID-19 were even lower, effectively zero (0.00%) in all but two reporting states, Arkansas and Michigan where they were 0.01%. (Note: Deaths may or may not have been due to COVID-19.)
more...
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
Since people who are fully vaccinated can still catch covid, and can still infect others who are fully vaccinated with covid, the main advantage of the shot seems to be preventing you getting a severe chest infection and needing medical care/clogging the ICU.
Also about 2700% less likely to catch the virus in the first place when fully vaccinated.
 

Montague

Member
CDC Director said today August 6th that “what they (Coronavirus vaccines) can׳t do anymore is prevent transmission.”


"We don’t have anything that will stop transmission [of Delta]..."
AstraZeneca lead scientist says Delta makes mass testing pointless in UK
London: The Delta variant of COVID-19 has wrecked any chance of herd immunity, according to the Oxford scientist who led the AstraZeneca vaccine team, as he called for an end to mass testing so Britain could start to live with the virus.
Scientists who addressed Britain’s all-party parliamentary group on coronavirus said it was time to accept that there is no way of stopping the virus spreading through the entire population
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
CDC Director said today August 6th that “what they (Coronavirus vaccines) can׳t do anymore is prevent transmission.”


"We don’t have anything that will stop transmission [of Delta]..."
AstraZeneca lead scientist says Delta makes mass testing pointless in UK
London: The Delta variant of COVID-19 has wrecked any chance of herd immunity, according to the Oxford scientist who led the AstraZeneca vaccine team, as he called for an end to mass testing so Britain could start to live with the virus.
Scientists who addressed Britain’s all-party parliamentary group on coronavirus said it was time to accept that there is no way of stopping the virus spreading through the entire population
Cant prevent the transmission is not the same as not being able to slow the transmission.

Not overwhelming the hospitals with masses of sick folks should be the goal.

Im curious are you anti vaccination/anti science?

Is this true for Delta?
That it slows or are you asking for the subset of the delta virus cases with fully vaccinated people? I don't have the raw data or anything, just going off the CDC website that I linked a few times, I think it was for July or August that they said it was 27x less likely to wind up in the hospital taking a bed from people who need it for any other reason other than they are radicalized into not believing science and the people who dedicated their lives to keeping us as healthy as possible by not getting the highly effective and very safe vaccine.
 

CatHedral

Well-Known Member
Cant prevent the transmission is not the same as not being able to slow the transmission.

Not overwhelming the hospitals with masses of sick folks should be the goal.

Im curious are you anti vaccination/anti science?


That it slows or are you asking for the subset of the delta virus cases with fully vaccinated people? I don't have the raw data or anything, just going off the CDC website that I linked a few times, I think it was for July or August that they said it was 27x less likely to wind up in the hospital taking a bed from people who need it for any other reason other than they are radicalized into not believing science and the people who dedicated their lives to keeping us as healthy as possible by not getting the highly effective and very safe vaccine.
The reason I ask is because I read that Delta is marginally less transmissible to and from the fully vaccinated vs. the unvaxed.
So while I do agree that symptomatic or serious breakthroughs of Covid among the vaxed are the exception and much reduced, I count silent infection as “catching it”. I have both Pfizer, but with delta I am still masking up. I would hate to infect someone. Most people in my region don’t mask.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
The reason I ask is because I read that Delta is marginally less transmissible to and from the fully vaccinated vs. the unvaxed.
So while I do agree that symptomatic or serious breakthroughs of Covid among the vaxed are the exception and much reduced, I count silent infection as “catching it”. I have both Pfizer, but with delta I am still masking up. I would hate to infect someone. Most people in my region don’t mask.
No question I would stay masked up still when around people/inside with others who you don't live with.

As for catching the virus, 'marginally' means a whole lot of things (flip side of 'exponential'), so while it is a easily correct statement, it is pretty meaningless. Marginally better being vaccinated is still better. How much better is just noise IMO for people who are doing 'research'.

And with how safe and effective that the vaccine is, it is a no-brainer, unfortunately people who have been brainwashed into anti-science sheep and cling to things like your saying and misconstrue it as a reason to not bother getting vaccinated.
 

CatHedral

Well-Known Member
No question I would stay masked up still when around people/inside with others who you don't live with.

As for catching the virus, 'marginally' means a whole lot of things (flip side of 'exponential'), so while it is a easily correct statement, it is pretty meaningless. Marginally better being vaccinated is still better. How much better is just noise IMO for people who are doing 'research'.

And with how safe and effective that the vaccine is, it is a no-brainer, unfortunately people who have been brainwashed into anti-science sheep and cling to things like your saying and misconstrue it as a reason to not bother getting vaccinated.
We will not know the full history of the pandemic until years later.

I don’t see how anyone can draw the highlighted portion as a conclusion from my post. The fact that all three vaccines are doing an excellent job blocking morbidity is the take-home.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
We will not know the full history of the pandemic until years later.

I don’t see how anyone can draw the highlighted portion as a conclusion from my post. The fact that all three vaccines are doing an excellent job blocking morbidity is the take-home.
It was more of a statement of fact for the reason I even bothered to point out the marginal thing more than anything.
 

Montague

Member
Malaysia will start treating Covid as ‘endemic’ around end-October, trade minister says

https://www.cnbc.com%2F2021%2F09%2F07%2Fmalaysia-to-treat-covid-as-endemic-starting-end-october-trade-minister.html
Malaysia is declaring the end of the pandemic
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
Malaysia will start treating Covid as ‘endemic’ around end-October, trade minister says

https://www.cnbc.com%2F2021%2F09%2F07%2Fmalaysia-to-treat-covid-as-endemic-starting-end-october-trade-minister.html
Malaysia is declaring the end of the pandemic
Nice to meet you new person who posts a couple posts and immediately comes here to post stuff about the pandemic.

Do you think that Malaysia declaring the end of the pandemic means they actually think it is safe to be unvaccinated or not wearing a mask when in public confined spaces?
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Malaysia will start treating Covid as ‘endemic’ around end-October, trade minister says

https://www.cnbc.com%2F2021%2F09%2F07%2Fmalaysia-to-treat-covid-as-endemic-starting-end-october-trade-minister.html
Malaysia is declaring the end of the pandemic
So did Trump as I recall, it was all suppose to be gone like "magic" over a year ago.

Denying reality does not help in this situation, it only makes it worse, this is a pandemic, not politics, too bad most morons don't know the difference. At this point the only ones they are killing with bullshit are those who already agree with them, the smart folks have been vaxxed. Half of republicans are not vaxxed and are gonna be delta covid road kill by spring. The republican leadership is concerned, as it could affect the outcome of the election and they can only cheat and steal so much. It's a bad idea that's circling the drain of history, when they start killing their own kind ya know yer dealing with losers.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
The reason I ask is because I read that Delta is marginally less transmissible to and from the fully vaccinated vs. the unvaxed.
So while I do agree that symptomatic or serious breakthroughs of Covid among the vaxed are the exception and much reduced, I count silent infection as “catching it”. I have both Pfizer, but with delta I am still masking up. I would hate to infect someone. Most people in my region don’t mask.
Every immune response is a response to infection. What you call "silent infection" is how a vaccine works.



“The fact that asymptomatic people spread the virus is not new information. We have known that people are contagious before they are symptomatic for over a year,” said Dr. Jason Gallagher, an infectious disease expert and clinical pharmacy specialist in infectious diseases at Temple University Hospital in Philadelphia.

“However, we are learning more about this finding very quickly. Two studies now show that the viral RNA declines more quickly in vaccinated people than unvaccinated people, suggesting that they are less likely to transmit virus to others,” he said.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
What was true a month ago is still true. Imagine that.

  • Covid-19 vaccines are still “stunningly effective” despite fears that immunity may dwindle over time, experts have said.
  • There have been some concerns about the efficacy of Covid-19 vaccines after a number of recent studies indicated a growing number of “breakthrough” Covid cases among the fully vaccinated.
  • Studies have shown that the fully vaccinated are still highly protected against severe infection, hospitalization and death caused by the virus.
 

CatHedral

Well-Known Member
Every immune response is a response to infection. What you call "silent infection" is how a vaccine works.



“The fact that asymptomatic people spread the virus is not new information. We have known that people are contagious before they are symptomatic for over a year,” said Dr. Jason Gallagher, an infectious disease expert and clinical pharmacy specialist in infectious diseases at Temple University Hospital in Philadelphia.

“However, we are learning more about this finding very quickly. Two studies now show that the viral RNA declines more quickly in vaccinated people than unvaccinated people, suggesting that they are less likely to transmit virus to others,” he said.
The action of a non-attenuated vaccine, of which mRNA vaccines are a class, is not by infection. mRNA vaccines cannot be classed as pathogens. They elicit immune response without pathogenesis or infection.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
The action of a non-attenuated vaccine, of which mRNA vaccines are a class, is not by infection. mRNA vaccines cannot be classed as pathogens. They elicit immune response without pathogenesis or infection.
Yes, mRNA is a component of the virus and not the whole virus, inactivate or otherwise. Coronavirus mRNA elicits an immune response and the immune system makes antibodies.

The antibodies are deployed when a new infection is detected. When a person's immune system is able to contain the infection it is called contained. Hence your "silent infection". When a person's immune system is not able to contain the infection, it is called break-through infection.

 

CatHedral

Well-Known Member
Yes, mRNA is a component of the virus and not the whole virus, inactivate or otherwise. Coronavirus mRNA elicits an immune response and the immune system makes antibodies.

The antibodies are deployed when a new infection is detected. When a person's immune system is able to contain the infection it is called contained. Hence your "silent infection". When a person's immune system is not able to contain the infection, it is called break-through infection.

My read of the terminology is that what an mRNA virus does is not infection, silent or otherwise. It is the simulation of an infection.
I consider the distinction useful.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
My read of the terminology is that what an mRNA virus does is not infection, silent or otherwise. It is the simulation of an infection.
I consider the distinction useful.
Yes, I think it is an amazing technology. Very interested in seeing where they go with this in the future.

 
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