Rurumo's Mars Hydro FC3000 3x3 OG S1 adventures

[Rurumo]

Hello everyone! I've decided to start a new grow journal using a Mars Hydro FC3000 in a Mars Hydro tent. This tent is actually set up at my friend's house since I overestimated the amount of space at my place-bottom line, not enough space. He is really excited about it since he's been wanting to learn to grow for a long time and has had his medical license since last year, though our state is now recreational legal. So, I'm teaching him how to do it step by step, and am providing all the equipment and seedlings. I will be growing out some OG S1s from Cannaventure this time, 2 each of Irene and Louis XIII, two favorites of mine that can be hard to find sometimes as smoke.

I'll be growing them out in coco in 2 gal air pots and plan on mainlining them to 8 tops. Nutrients will be Jack's a/b. I'm using spirulina as a biostimulant from day 1 and am adding Grow Genius silicic acid once per week, just to finally try out silicic acid to see if there is anything to it. Here are the seedlings I've prepared:



I used Canna coco this time instead of my usual favorite Grow!t coco from Hydrofarm. My initial impression this time (I used to use canna a long time ago) is that the Canna coco is finer than I like, it's more of a fine grind compared to the medium grind of the Hydrofarm, and you can really tell the difference when watering seedlings in solo cups. I feel like it will be really easy to overwater seedlings in this media. EC .8 of equal parts Jack's A/B and .5 g epsom/gal. One Irene was a failure to germinate, hence the smaller seedling.



The Mars Hydro tent is really nice! I like it more than any of the other less pricey tent options, it just doesn't have the same issue with pinholes or light through zippers/seams. The material is more like a Gorilla lite tent-it will obviously last. Easy setup/sturdy poles. Also, the zipper is very strong and seems like it will last for years. The FC3000 is a beauty, straight out of the box. I like how it comes with the driver disconnected, so you have the option of mounting it outside of the tent during the summer to reduce heat-which I chose to do. When winter rolls around, it mounts very easily with 4 little knobs that are included. At 50% and 28 inches away from the top of these pots, it produced about 15k lux:



I added a 6" AC Infinity fan-these things mount super fast and easy with zip ties!



I will be transferring the seedlings over shortly! I plan on updating this journal regularly and will give plenty of details for people new to growing in Coco with mineral salts but also with some added organic supplements, mycorrhizae, trichoderma, and plant growth promoting rhizobacteria. I will treat the seedlings again with Dynomico mycorrhizae at transplant and weekly with a sample bottle of King Crab bacterial inoculant, which is very economical, so a single sample bottle will last an entire grow! Coco is an incredible media for beneficial fungal/bacterial growth even with the use of mineral salts, especially when you stick to low EC multifeeds and give them a little something to snack on.

As a huge fan of OGs, I'm pretty stoked to see what these S1s yield! I'm hoping for a keeper female to breed with later this year. And also just a nice variety of some tasty OG nugs. Thanks for stopping by!

 

[Rurumo]

My concerns about the canna coco were right on. I hate it. I can't believe I wasted money on two bags of it. I realize, back when I used to use it, I still mixed in 30% perlite. It's just way too fine and doesn't drain well. Later today, I'm going to take pics of samples of canna, hydrofarm, and botanicare to compare them and show you what I mean about fiber length. I just checked my seedlings and some are showing obvious signs of overwatering-the roots are obviously unhappy. So I just squeezed the cups and was able to squeeze out tons of water-24 hours after feeding-this never happens with longer fiber coco coir.


The two unhappy seedlings are both LouisXIII. Now, OG's are sensitive lassies, so I would expect them to be unhappy first. You really have to put in the effort to make an OG happy, they are very high maintenance girls. Only one of them is really as happy as she should be.
Here is another of the LouisXIII:



I'm posting these for new coco growers, and new growers in general. When your first true leaves curl down like this it means their roots are being smothered by excess water. With long fiber brands of coco, you can feed to runoff almost from day one and not see this (depending on how sensitive the strain is.) I like to feed every other day once the first true leaves come in, but these plants have been getting fed every three days and it's still to much for them. Once I squeezed the water out of these cups, which also helped aerate the media, they've perked up a lot.

Here is the happiest of the seedlings at 10 days old, this is how they all should look:



I have perlite, so I will either have to use it when I transplant, or buy some better coco. Bottom line, I no longer recommend Canna coco. It's a good quality product, but it lacks the excellent drainage and aeration properties that makes coco coir my favorite media. I dislike perlite-it's a common source of heavy metal contamination in grows, and it's simply unnecessary if your coco has the proper fiber length.

 

[Rurumo]

Canna coco is screened to a very fine grain with quite a bit of tiny particles . This is fine if additional perlite is added, as I used to do, but it doesn't drain well by itself:

Compare it to Botanicare, which includes small, medium, and long fibers:



This mix of grain sizes results in excellent standalone drainage. I did not have any Hydrofarm Grow!t coco left, but it would be in between Botanicare and Canna in grain size, BUT it is screened better to remove the very small grain size as well as dust that hampers drainage. I've already ordered another bag of it to transplant these seedlings into when it's time-With otherwise identical care, my seedlings grow twice as fast in Hydrofarm or Botanicare coco than in Canna. From now on, I'll take into account the brand of coco someone is using when answering beginner coco questions, it makes a huge difference!

 

[Dr.Amber Trichome]

Canna coco is screened to a very fine grain with quite a bit of tiny particles . This is fine if additional perlite is added, as I used to do, but it doesn't drain well by itself:View attachment 5099773

Compare it to Botanicare, which includes small, medium, and long fibers:

View attachment 5099774

This mix of grain sizes results in excellent standalone drainage. I did not have any Hydrofarm Grow!t coco left, but it would be in between Botanicare and Canna in grain size, BUT it is screened better to remove the very small grain size as well as dust that hampers drainage. I've already ordered another bag of it to transplant these seedlings into when it's time-With otherwise identical care, my seedlings grow twice as fast in Hydrofarm or Botanicare coco than in Canna. From now on, I'll take into account the brand of coco someone is using when answering beginner coco questions, it makes a huge difference!

That’s interesting. I am getting back into coco myself . I ordered a bag of cyco.
Good luck with this grow and it’s very nice of you to teach us . Your very nice to take time and teach your friend as well. Thank you for all your kindness.

 

[Rurumo]

I've been reading up on coco particle size and how it affects air/water relationships in the media and found a really interesting old study. https://journals.ashs.org/hortsci/view/journals/hortsci/40/7/article-p2138.xml
Not all coir is created equally-one line that sums it up is "Both easily available and total water holding capacity declined proportionally with increasing coarseness index, while air content was positively correlated." Blends with a higher proportion of small particles resemble peat in terms of water holding capacity and air content-I'm pretty sure that this is the goal with a lot of brands, like Canna, which isn't a bad thing, just a marketing target to aim for (sustainable direct replacement for peat.) Sri Lanka has the best developed coir industry with the highest standards for screening, so you'll find that a lot of the top brands source their coco from there. The interesting thing is what they do with the coco coir once they get their hands on it. I was surprised by the fineness of the bagged canna coco this time, but then I realized, I only started using bagged coco last year. Prior to that I bought bricks. Bricks are cheaper because they are processed on site, in Sri Lanka, while loose bagged coco undergoes an additional screening/processing/bagging process, so I'm not surprised it's different. My favorite bagged brand of coir is Hydrofarm, and it's very similar to Canna except it has a higher % of long fibers left in.


Another reason to look for Sri Lankan coir is that the heavy metal content tends to be lower. A lot of the cadmium found in coirs is actually added during processing by the equipment used. But, if you buy premixed coir/perlite, then the perlite is another potential source of heavy metal contamination that should be checked. Recently, a large amount of mixed coco/perlite bags were responsible for a big cannabis grow op failing heavy metal testing.

It's worth considering the coarseness index of the particular coir you use because it may determine weather or not you want/need to add perlite, how often to water during the seedling stage, and most importantly, how many fertigations are optimal (if using high frequency fertigation) during flower. Smaller particle size also increases the CEC of the coir, making a "finer" blend of coir (like canna) a good choice for people who like using larger pots of coir and feeding less frequently (like promix.)

 

[Rurumo]

Here are the seedlings making a comeback from the low temps I kept my house at while I dried my last crop. I love this pic, shows how the OG S1s are slow growers compared to the polyhybrid crosses. I wish I could have grown out the entire packs of Irene and Louis XIII S1s, but it's still interesting how consistent the pairs are (the tiny irene is a week or so behind). Once I transplant, I'll start updating both my journals regularly again.

 

[HydoDan]

I don't grow in coco, but I may someday. Never thought about particle size but it makes sense.
Thanks for the info.

 

[HydoDan]

Here are the seedlings making a comeback from the low temps I kept my house at while I dried my last crop. I love this pic, shows how the OG S1s are slow growers compared to the polyhybrid crosses. I wish I could have grown out the entire packs of Irene and Louis XIII S1s, but it's still interesting how consistent the pairs are (the tiny irene is a week or so behind). Once I transplant, I'll start updating both my journals regularly again.
View attachment 5106062

More happy plants! Luv it!

 

[Rurumo]

That’s interesting. I am getting back into coco myself . I ordered a bag of cyco.
Good luck with this grow and it’s very nice of you to teach us . Your very nice to take time and teach your friend as well. Thank you for all your kindness.

Thank you Amber! The Cyco should be good stuff, I recall they have high standards for heavy metals in their nutrients and I believe their coco is also of Sri Lankan origin, so it should be nice and consistent.

 

[Rurumo]

More happy plants! Luv it!

Thanks Dan!

 

[Rurumo]

I was planning on topping these and growing all of my primary bud sites from 4 branches instead of two like a regular mainline since OG's don't respond well to aggressive topping in my past experience, but my buddy wanted to learn how to mainline so we went with 2 plants with 4 branches and 2 with 2. I feel like a complete idiot though, I should have done one with each of the Irenes and LouisXIIIs for a nice little side by side, but I wasn't thinking and mainlined the louis and left the Irenes with 4 branches. You can already see the difference in growth when you leave 4 branches instead of two. Mainlining is fun, but leaving those two extra branches will probably save two weeks of veg time. I got a little N curl on a few leaves too, but that's not uncommon with sensitive plants like these, especially right after you chop them in half. Fingers crossed on a keeper from one of these girls!
LouisXIIIs in front, Irenes in the back


LouisXIII


Irene-the Irenes have decent vigor for an OG!


I'm loving the new Mars Hydro FC-3000. The Lux readings are super even throughout the tent, I feel like this is a perfect light for a 3x3 so far, but we'll see the proof during flower.

 

[higher self]

Plants looking good!!

 

[Rurumo]

Plants looking good!!

Thanks bud! I'm excited for an all OG crop, going to be fun sampling the terps.

 

[higher self]

Thanks bud! I'm excited for an all OG crop, going to be fun sampling the terps.

Yes I feel that you will have a hard time not keeping all four of those plants & only choosing one or two lol. My Louis stretches a lot so I pretty much cut it back before flower & it grows quickly during stretch. The Irene has vigor like you have seen but not too bad of a stretch more bushed out then vertical growth.

 

[Rurumo]

Yes I feel that you will have a hard time not keeping all four of those plants & only choosing one or two lol. My Louis stretches a lot so I pretty much cut it back before flower & it grows quickly during stretch. The Irene has vigor like you have seen but not too bad of a stretch more bushed out then vertical growth.

I have a feeling, I'll see the same traits that you have, these plants have very similar growth traits so far. I've kept cuts of each and I think you're right, I bet I will have a hard time picking one to keep. My last experience with OG S1s went the same way, they were all beautiful plants. I see a lot of keepers coming out of CSI's TK S1s too.

 

[Rurumo]

The two Irene's that I left 4 branches on when I topped are doing wonderful, but the LouisXIII's I mainlined are just finally resuming normal growth after being stunted, but they'll be fine for pheno hunting purposes. I didn't want to confuse my buddy or make more work for him, so I had him continue feeding them all the same EC solution, which is a bit too high for the stunted plants, so the smallest one has some visible N tox, but I think it will just grow out of it-the new growth already looks better. I'll pot all of them up in the next few days just to keep things simple, and will probably flip in two weeks. They are getting .9 EC of Jack's 321 right now, RH 55%, room temp 80 deg, 1 gal air pots fed once per day (potting up to 2 gal soon). I usually start feeding twice per day at 12/12 flip.


Thanks again @MarsHydrofactory for the excellent FC-3000, I love this light in a 3x3, very even canopy coverage. I'm thinking of trying out a single 2 ft agromax bulb in the center space during flower at 4 15 min intervals, the space seems perfect for that.


2 Irene S1s in the back, 2 LouisXIII's in front, very excited to try the smoke from these girls!


Irene #1


Irene #2-both have very similar growth patterns.


LouisXIII #1-this plant has really started growing well the past few days, I think she'll catch up nicely.


LouisXIII #2, my poor little runt-100% my fault, not the plant

Thanks for checking in everyone! I love to grow S1s of classic cuts, they really give you a taste of the possible gene pool dwelling within your favorite cuts, with some amazing results and some terrible. Next time will be Northern Lights #5 S1 and Chem 91 S1 from CSI, saving cuts from all of these plants for future breeding fun.

 

[Rurumo]

This group of OGs has been a real challenge to clone-they take so long to form roots that the cuttings end up looking really shabby, especially the Louis. I wanted to wait to put them into 12/12 until I for sure, for sure, had a clone of each, but right now I just have one Irene clone that looks good-and three others with roots but look terrible. I've potted these up to 2 gal pots and will flip them over the next few days. The LouisXIIIs still look N toxxed, but their new leaves look good and I think they'll grow out of it during stretch. I didn't want to burden my friend who is feeding these with two different nutrient concentrations, so they all are getting fed .9 EC right now. I fed them their 2nd dose of aspirin yesterday and will just give that one more time in two weeks-so 3 doses total this time.




Irene #1-the Irene's are very similar in appearance-I would love for one of these to end up a keeper but I usually end up finding one really nice keeper out of every 12-16 plants, so once every year and a half or so for me. Going to take some time to rebuild a quality harem!


Irene #2


LouisXIII #1-my bets are on this Louis since it handled my one/two punch of butchery and overfeeding like a champ! FYI, both of these LouisXIII's have the most incredible stem rub smell-very light/sour/limey.


LouisXIII #2-Making a passable comeback....

Thanks for stopping by everyone! I know the veg part of these diaries aren't the most interesting, but I do find the differences in these plants to be fascinating at every stage of development. Now I need to go mail in two more payments for new seeds that I DO NOT NEED....grrrr

Also, I'd love to see more OG S1s from Cannaventure and CSI, they are some of my favorite plants to hunt through!

 

[Rurumo]

These girls are really taking off since I flipped to 12/12. I'm doing very little defoliation on them, they are just too sensitive and I suspect it would do more harm than good after stunting the LouisXIIIs with mainlining. The Louis are doing much better now and are growing out of the N toxicity, even the runt will turn into a decent plant i think. They are getting .8 EC twice daily. I just hope my current round of clones take-these OG S1s have been some of the hardest plants to clone for me. The new FC3000 is a great light for a 3x3, I'm very impressed with the power and spread over the canopy-I've increased to 75% at just over 2 ft distance and will keep it at 80% through flower and just adjust distance if I want to push more light.


LouisXIIIs in front, Irene's in back


LouisXIII #1-doing great


LouisXIII#2-growing fast daily now


Irene #1-These Irene S1s are good, easy plants


Irene #2-I'm going to have to thin out the bud sites on these a little. If you do too much on an OG it will kill your yields.

Just a quick update. Hopefully next time they will be flowering- thanks for stopping by!

 

[Rurumo]

Just a quick update-2 weeks since flip, no signs of intersex traits, hopefully I'll have some flowers developing for my next update. Plants have really taken off since last week, Irene #2 is a beast and I've been supercropping like crazy to keep her inline. I'm pleased with the way the plants have filled out this canopy since last week. .9 EC is keeping them satisfied, though the Irenes could take more, but the LouisXIIIs are awfully N sensitive so I'll keep feeding at this rate as long as the leaves all look healthy-trying to stick with mixing just one batch of nutes for this group. The FC3000 is performing well, looking forward to seeing some tasty OG buds under it!


They are a nice group of plants-


LouisXIII #1


LouisXIII #2-she'd like to be fed a bit less actually, but oh well-I was finally able to clone both LouisXIIIs-hardest plants for me to root cuttings from in years.


Irene #1-getting a bit squished by her sis


Irene#2-I hope her buds are epic because she has some nice qualities in veg. The Irene S1s are the least demanding OGs I've ever grown, really nice plants so far.

Thanks for stopping by!!

 

[Mr.Head]

My concerns about the canna coco were right on. I hate it. I can't believe I wasted money on two bags of it. I realize, back when I used to use it, I still mixed in 30% perlite. It's just way too fine and doesn't drain well. Later today, I'm going to take pics of samples of canna, hydrofarm, and botanicare to compare them and show you what I mean about fiber length. I just checked my seedlings and some are showing obvious signs of overwatering-the roots are obviously unhappy. So I just squeezed the cups and was able to squeeze out tons of water-24 hours after feeding-this never happens with longer fiber coco coir.
View attachment 5099123

The two unhappy seedlings are both LouisXIII. Now, OG's are sensitive lassies, so I would expect them to be unhappy first. You really have to put in the effort to make an OG happy, they are very high maintenance girls. Only one of them is really as happy as she should be.
Here is another of the LouisXIII:

View attachment 5099124

I'm posting these for new coco growers, and new growers in general. When your first true leaves curl down like this it means their roots are being smothered by excess water. With long fiber brands of coco, you can feed to runoff almost from day one and not see this (depending on how sensitive the strain is.) I like to feed every other day once the first true leaves come in, but these plants have been getting fed every three days and it's still to much for them. Once I squeezed the water out of these cups, which also helped aerate the media, they've perked up a lot.

Here is the happiest of the seedlings at 10 days old, this is how they all should look:

View attachment 5099126

I have perlite, so I will either have to use it when I transplant, or buy some better coco. Bottom line, I no longer recommend Canna coco. It's a good quality product, but it lacks the excellent drainage and aeration properties that makes coco coir my favorite media. I dislike perlite-it's a common source of heavy metal contamination in grows, and it's simply unnecessary if your coco has the proper fiber length.

I feel like this is an extreme reaction to some seedling leaf droop for a couple days. In my experience Canna's been the best coco product I've used.

I have also never noticed any difference between the bag and the brick after rehydration and breaking it up properly. I just recently started buying bags as I was tired of rehydrating it. I had a bucket full of brick coco and a fresh bag, I never noticed any difference.

You also state your temps were low. Not trying to start no-ish but that could be the cause of the leaf droop on the couple seedlings. My experiences have just been different is all. Very consistent with excellent drainage.

Very nice happy plants. Keep killin it!