Nitrogen toxicity - lockout

[shiva71]

Hiya
I have a girl who is not doing terribly well. 2 things are apparent, there is some clawing at the end of the fan leaves, which suggests N toxicity. Also there is some yellowing between the veins which suggests a Mg deficiency. I just wondered are the 2 things connected, like if you have an excess of N does that cause lockout of other nutrients?
Cheers!

 

[J2M3S]

Pics would be beneficial.

 

[Jjgrow420]

Check Mulder's chart. It shows what nutes are antagonists for others.

^^ wrong guy

 

[Herb & Suds]

Over feeding can do that and it sounds like you know you may have

 

[Nutty sKunK]

Hiya
I have a girl who is not doing terribly well. 2 things are apparent, there is some clawing at the end of the fan leaves, which suggests N toxicity. Also there is some yellowing between the veins which suggests a Mg deficiency. I just wondered are the 2 things connected, like if you have an excess of N does that cause lockout of other nutrients?
Cheers!

Excess N requires more Mag as Jjgrow said. This chart is very good to know if problems arise.

 

[hotrodharley]

This one is a little easier to understand. You can see nitrogen doesn’t block magnesium.

 

[rkymtnman]

I have a girl who is not doing terribly well

are you still over-feeding? sounds like it.

 

[Onextremebuzz]

If you really wanna be brave and it's in veg and it's big enough take it out of the pot shake all the dirt off the roots it's ok to damage the root ball even quite a bit in the process as long as your some what gentle and repot it in new dirt , hard to know but a feeding history and watering history can help. That measure is aggressive but it will have the fastest results especially if you don't really water it in the new pot just a tad so it's barely moist and it will kick roots into overdrive and they will repair quick

 

[Onextremebuzz]

Also I want to throw in that if your on here asking that question I'm leaning towards an over watering and over feeding issue. If your feeding every watering and not allowing time for the pot to dry out between waterings the ph is going to be likely low and your trying to correct a problem caused by over feeding by feeding more nutes. If you are over watering you will see a very weak root ball and the pot will always feel bottom heavy and that's were all the salts will go to hang out. If that's the case then a rough medium change like I suggested is probably your best bet.

 

[Nutty sKunK]

View attachment 5271419
This one is a little easier to understand. You can see nitrogen doesn’t block magnesium.

But it requires more magnesium when more nitrogen is present through synergy. So u can get a Mag def with high N

 

[curious2garden]

Over feeding can do that and it sounds like you know you may have

He's been hitting her with bloom boosters and has a Ca def

 

[shiva71]

Appreciate the replies doods.
Ok here she is:

This is what looks like N toxicity, but tbh its only here and there, its not allover the plant...

And heres what i think is Mg deficiency:

If you really wanna be brave and it's in veg and it's big enough take it out of the pot shake all the dirt off the roots it's ok to damage the root ball even quite a bit in the process as long as your some what gentle and repot it in new dirt , hard to know but a feeding history and watering history can help. That measure is aggressive but it will have the fastest results especially if you don't really water it in the new pot just a tad so it's barely moist and it will kick roots into overdrive and they will repair quick

Haha sorry dude shouldve said im in DWC, but thanks anyway!

Over feeding can do that and it sounds like you know you may have

are you still over-feeding? sounds like it.

If i look at my notes, im basically lettign the ppm drop 100 then raising it by 50 or so. So some of the feeding numbers - it was 730, dropped to 580; raised it to 775, dropped to 630, raised it to 800, it dropped to 700, raised it to 830. So you see im increasing the ppm very slowly, from 730 to 775 to 800 to 830, its not like im throwing +200ppm at her.
Thanks for the charts, not 100% sure how to interpret them but will look into it.
The guy in the grow shop said back off on the base nutes (Canna, very high in N) and use more calmag which is what ive done and she does seem slightly happier.
Thanks again for the replies

 

[shiva71]

He's been hitting her with bloom boosters and has a Ca def

Actually bro that was my other plant, i discovered my air stone was totally blocked so she was basically drowning which might explain why she was such a mess. Thats been fixed and she seems a bit happier with some proper bubbles in the bucket.

 

[Herb & Suds]

Appreciate the replies doods.
Ok here she is:
View attachment 5271781
This is what looks like N toxicity, but tbh its only here and there, its not allover the plant...
View attachment 5271782
And heres what i think is Mg deficiency:
View attachment 5271783

Haha sorry dude shouldve said im in DWC, but thanks anyway!


If i look at my notes, im basically lettign the ppm drop 100 then raising it by 50 or so. So some of the feeding numbers - it was 730, dropped to 580; raised it to 775, dropped to 630, raised it to 800, it dropped to 700, raised it to 830. So you see im increasing the ppm very slowly, from 730 to 775 to 800 to 830, its not like im throwing +200ppm at her.
Thanks for the charts, not 100% sure how to interpret them but will look into it.
The guy in the grow shop said back off on the base nutes (Canna, very high in N) and use more calmag which is what ive done and she does seem slightly happier.
Thanks again for the replies

Calmag unless you are using the flowering one has nitrogen in it

 

[Nutty sKunK]

I’d personally add 0.5g of Epsom salts per L to offer more magnesium. Calmag is ok but if you are deficient in magnesium it’ll be best to just add that until levels are good in the soil. Then use calmag from then on.

This is an interesting article. It’s for basil plants but MJ requires roughly the same levels of magnesium as basil. 60ppm is the target

https://e-gro.org/pdf/E303.pdf

 

[calvin.m16]

I'd check your rootzone pH and EC/PPM before adding or removing anything. Find out where you stand before you start jumping around in the minefield of potential solutions.

 

[curious2garden]

Appreciate the replies doods.
Ok here she is:
View attachment 5271781
This is what looks like N toxicity, but tbh its only here and there, its not allover the plant...
View attachment 5271782
And heres what i think is Mg deficiency:
View attachment 5271783

Haha sorry dude shouldve said im in DWC, but thanks anyway!


If i look at my notes, im basically lettign the ppm drop 100 then raising it by 50 or so. So some of the feeding numbers - it was 730, dropped to 580; raised it to 775, dropped to 630, raised it to 800, it dropped to 700, raised it to 830. So you see im increasing the ppm very slowly, from 730 to 775 to 800 to 830, its not like im throwing +200ppm at her.
Thanks for the charts, not 100% sure how to interpret them but will look into it.
The guy in the grow shop said back off on the base nutes (Canna, very high in N) and use more calmag which is what ive done and she does seem slightly happier.
Thanks again for the replies

Nitrogen is a mobile nutrient and you don't show even N toxicity over the plant so is that Mg def or moving N to where it's needed clearing some of the toxicity. You could hit her with a dose of foliar epsom salts and see. I'd just watch her for a bit since she looks too well fed. But that's me and I'm pretty lazy.

 

[rkymtnman]

If i look at my notes, im basically lettign the ppm drop 100 then raising it by 50 or so. So some of the feeding numbers - it was 730, dropped to 580; raised it to 775, dropped to 630, raised it to 800, it dropped to 700, raised it to 830. So you see im increasing the ppm very slowly, from 730 to 775 to 800 to 830, its not like im throwing +200ppm at her.

at some point along the way is too much. that latest pic has tip burn on just about every leaf especially the new growth.

it's a combination of raising ppms AND keeping an eye out for burn for when to hit the brake pedal.

 

[curious2garden]

at some point along the way is too much. that latest pic has tip burn on just about every leaf especially the new growth.

it's a combination of raising ppms AND keeping an eye out for burn for when to hit the brake pedal.

Exactly and sometimes they want the PPM/EC but want a lower N feed. They are finicky eaters. I have a real prima donna Wedding Cake that reacts strongly to N levels everyone else finds barely adequate. Oh well I guess we must suffer for our art

 

[Onextremebuzz]

Hmm now that you have mentioned you are on DWC, do you have a water cooler? If you have an old chest freezer and a inkbird you can maybe do some stoner science. But I didn't catch a reference to the water temp or ph. Did you know that ph and water temp are two peas and a pod if your having nutrient swings I'd look there first.