First Grow - 3000w - Ebb & Gro - H&G - Sealed

KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

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Hello. This is my first grow. I don't have a digital camera but will be buying one soon so pics will follow. I am planning to veg for 4 weeks and flower for 8 weeks with 24 to 30 plants. I am still in the process of getting everything setup but this is the plan so far:


I built a 9'x5'x9' room in the garage for vegging which will house clones and Mothers. I insulated the walls and ceiling and drywalled both sides to try control temps and hopefully will not have to buy another AC for that room but we'll see. It is an ebb and flow system.

2- 4' 4 bulb 260w T5 fixtures
3x3 tray
100 gal res
Water Pump
Air pump with 2 outlets and airstones
6" Vortex for exhaust

I will be using a sealed 9'x9'x8' room (not including the doorway and closet) for flowering. I've already covered the one existing window and installed panda film on 3 of the 4 four walls. The 4th wall is where the door and closet is. I've taken off the closet doors and removed the carpet and drilled two 6" holes in the floor for ventilation. I have also drilled a 5" hole for the AC exhaust. I am housing the AC unit, dehumidier, and ballasts in the closet (the doors will remain off.) I have also drilled two 6" holes in the ceiling for venting to the attic.

Lighting:
4- 600w GE Lucalox bulbs
4- 600w Sun System Harvest Pro Elite ballasts
4- 6" Suntubes
4- Adjust-A-Wing reflectors (medium)
4- Super Spreaders
2- Dayton 463 CFM blowers
50'- 6" Thermaflo ducting

I have already purchased two of each (and 1 dayton) for testing.

I have removed the Suntube reflector and modified the AAW reflector to fit onto the Suntube. I ran venting to the two lights that I have in series. The venting blows in cool air from underneath the house and vents to the attic. I tested the temps of the lights after being on for 4 hours and the Dayton cools them both to allow holding your hand on the glass indefinitely. I like the superspreader. The temp below the super spreader is significantly less than the temp on the sides or above the bulb.

Watering:
Ebb & Gro system with 24 - 30 buckets. I heard some complaints about the fill and drain time for the Ebb & Gro system so I am changing the lines from 1/2" to 3/4". That being the case instead of purchasing the lower buckets I bought 2 gal paint buckets ($2/each) and will be drilling 3/4" holes for the larger lines. I will also NOT be purchasing their $120 55 gal res (a sturdy 45 gal plastic trash can for $30 should do just fine.)

Media:
Rockwool cubes and Hydroton pellets

Environmental Control (Sealed Room):

Sentinel CHHC-1 Environmental Controller
Sentinel CO2 regulator
20 lb CO2 tank
DeLonghi 12,000 BTU AC
Supentown 65 pint Dehumidifier
CAN 75
8" Vortex fan (for scrubbing)
Panda film

I purchased the single hose AC before I realized I was going to do a sealed room with CO2 and will soon be returning and purchasing a dual hose AC Unit. I'm thinking of getting the Soleus LX-120 but will have to see if anyone carries it local so I can test if it returns to same mode when powered off and back on (anyone have experience with this particular vendor?)

The Supentown dehumidifier doesn't return to the same mode when the power is cut so I wouldn't recommend it for use with the CHHC-1.


I'm planning on trying to maintain 80 - 85 for temps, 50 - 60 for humidity, and 1500 PPM for CO2.

Nutrients:

H&G Aqua Flakes
H&G Root Excelerator
H&G Algen Extract
H&G Multi Zyme
H&G Bud XL
H&G Top Booster

I will be using strictly House & Garden products for both Veg and flower. The local hydro shop recommended and I'm a newbie so feedback is welcome. I will probably follow the H&G instructions but would like to keep my nutes low without starving the plants. I like Al. B. Fucts recommendation of 1400 PPM from go to whoa.

Strains:

20- Sour Diesel (I/S)
6- Grapefruit Diesel (I/S)
3- OG K(r)ush (I/S)
3- Flo (by DJ Krush) (I/S)

I wanted to start with sort of a mix and figure out which one I liked the best and which one grew the best in my setup. I'm kinda of hating it right now because they are growing at different rates and making timing and canopy management a real pain in the ass. All the strains are from clones. The OG K(r)ush, Flo, and Grapefruit are about 2 weeks old, the Sour Diesel is about 3 days old.

Equipment:
Bluelabs Combo Meter (pH/PPM)
Digital Therm/Hygro

I would like to thank Al. B Fuct (https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/6592-get-harvest-every-2-weeks.html ) for all his helpful knowledge and for getting me hooked on RIU.

I would also like to thank SOG (https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journal-discussion/170770-sog-grow-room-discussion.html ) for all his efforts and his pioneering spirit (i was thinking of the AAW/Suntube combo and his post convinced me.)

I know how everyone loves pics and i should could use the advice and feedback so the digital camera is on the high priority list.

Here's a link to the discussion:

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journal-discussion/232929-first-grow-3000w-ebb-gro.html#post2972105

Good luck to all and thanks in advance for helpful advice.
 
KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

Active Member
The 6" Suntube and medium Adjust-A-Wing combo with SuperSpreader. There were two bolts on the top of the Suntube already (bronze screw nut) so I just drilled two holes through the AAW. I cut about an inch of the reflector on one side for the cord from the suntube. As you can see the venting for the lights is in series coming up from the subfloor and venting out into the attic.
 

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KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

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As I noted earlier the $120 55 gallon reservoir seemed like a rip off to me so I went to the local salvage yard and guess what? 55 gallon plastic drum that was used for shipping rockstar ingredients for $18. It's 1/4" thick and it's already been proven to hold 55 gallons of liquid so I think it will work just fine. I cut a hole in the top for access and cleaned it out with bleach. I'll have to make a cover but I think i can handle that for $100.

I was concerned about having 30 - 2 gallon buckets with only a 55 gal res but neglected to take into account the Hydroton will be in there too so 55 should be plenty. (Don't try to do mathematical calculations at 3 am.)

$120 my ass.
 

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KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

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Here's some pics of the ladies. The taller ones are the OG K(r)ush and Flo. They are 2 1/2 weeks old. The medium sized ones are the Grapefruit Diesel. They are 2 weeks old. The smallest ones are the Sour Diesel. They are only a week old. All of them are from clones.

I'm fairly certain that the Grapefruit have light leaves cuz idiot, lazy, cheap-o boy (me) didn't change the res until 3 weeks had passed. It's most likely a Zinc deficiency. I did find it interesting that all of them were getting the same nutes but only the Grapefruit showed the deficiency. I guess they are more sensitive to Zinc than the others. Different strains are more different that i thought. Lesson learned. I have changed the nutes and hopefully they will darken up again in a few days.
 

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KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

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So I setup the controller, drilled 7/8" holes in the $2 2 gallon paint buckets, put in 3/4" grommets, and cut some 3/4" tubing and tested the system out. I see why others have complained about the 1/2" lines. As the system fills the 3/4" allows the buckets to fill at almost the same rate as the controller so that by the time the controller is full the buckets are pretty much full as well. The system levels out and the controller tops the buckets off but if the lines were 1/2" it would be a lot slower and would have to level out numerous times before finishing the cycle.

If you are going to go with 3/4" lines only buy the inner buckets. It's a lot easier to drill new holes rather than make existing holes larger. The paint buckets are also $2 cheaper and are exactly the same size. I could only find white ones but the inner buckets are black so there shouldn't be much light penetration. I though about painting them black but that lasted about 2 seconds and the laziness factor kicked in.

Overall I feel the construction and materials of the controller are not very good quality. Very thin bucket, cheap pumps, and a digital timer would be SOOOO much better. The fill and drain times are set at 15 min intervals so when you fill the roots sit in nutes for 15 mins without any air. Not that that is horrible but more finite control over the timing would be ideal. The controller comes with 2 pumps and enough 1/2" fittings for the just the controller (no tubing.)

The instructions say to warm a 1/2" hose in water to fit it over the pump outlet. That shit doesn't work. I heated the tubing over a flame, slipped it on the outlet and immediately cooled it in cold running water and now it's virgin tight. A barbed outlet would have been a lot easier. C'mon Ebb & Gro. I also found that for trying to squeeze tubing onto fittings heating the end with a lighter made it a lot easier.

The tubing cutter made cutting the 3/4" tubing a lot easier. I highly recommend one.

I used a 7/8" bit for drilling holes. After drilling the first hole be sure to insert the grommet and fitting and check for leaks. 7/8" worked for me but your grommets may be different.
 

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KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

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I have read (minus the soil chapters) the following books:

Marijuana Horticulture The indoor/outdoor medical grower's Bible by Jorge Cervantes.

The Cannabis grow bible by Greg Green

Grow Great Marijuana by Logan Edwards

Gardening indoors with Soil & Hydroponics by George F. Van Patten

If you don't have the Bible go get it now! It has the most information and is very helpful. I refer to it a lot since I'm still designing the setup and learning the ropes.

Gardening indoors has a lot of good general info about Hydroponic and Soil gardening and it was a great intro to hydroponics. I found it very useful.

The other too were very basic and I tend to question their credibility when they differ form the Bible or the Gardening indoors.
 

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stankdank1

stankdank1

Active Member
You went big, looks and sounds cool. I just started with a super closet and realized how ripped of I got. I didn't know what I was doing and needed something for the bedroom that won't piss the wife off. It works well, but I could have built something for allooooooooot less. Sucks to be a noob!! I think it will still pay for its self after a year of harvests. Man I wish I had more room to grow. Im jealous in a good way. best of luck.
 
G

greenpassion

Member
Hey looks good , Thought i would share i have a CAP ebb & grow 48 bucket system in the flower room and i am just final flushing the first crop and learning that make sure you flush about every two weeks or the end flush will take like 3 res changes and in other words lots of BS they hold lots of nutes in the bottom of the buckets so i had to flush 3 times to drop the ppm low enough to harvest. besides that though they grow some fat plants make sure you veg the main stalk thick cause the plants get top heavy and tall in this system and the 2 gallon buckets are not to sturdy.. good luck
 
KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

Active Member
greenpassion said:
Hey looks good , Thought i would share i have a CAP ebb & grow 48 bucket system in the flower room and i am just final flushing the first crop and learning that make sure you flush about every two weeks or the end flush will take like 3 res changes and in other words lots of BS they hold lots of nutes in the bottom of the buckets so i had to flush 3 times to drop the ppm low enough to harvest. besides that though they grow some fat plants make sure you veg the main stalk thick cause the plants get top heavy and tall in this system and the 2 gallon buckets are not to sturdy.. good luck
Click to expand...
Thanks a million greenpassion. That's exactly the kind of feedback I'm looking for. I will definitely be following your advice. Good luck on your current grow!
 
KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

Active Member
stankdank1 said:
You went big, looks and sounds cool. I just started with a super closet and realized how ripped of I got. I didn't know what I was doing and needed something for the bedroom that won't piss the wife off. It works well, but I could have built something for allooooooooot less. Sucks to be a noob!! I think it will still pay for its self after a year of harvests. Man I wish I had more room to grow. Im jealous in a good way. best of luck.
Click to expand...
Thx stankdank. I saw a friends setup and pretty much decided to copy it. Seeing what he yielded made it easier to spend the money on the setup. I've already hit some speed bumps but, hey there's always a learning curve. I hear on the sucks to be a noob. There's a lot of good info on this site and making friends with your local hydro shop is a great idea!
 
KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

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So the new Dual hose AC unit arrived and has been installed. it's a Soleus PH4-12R-01 Portable Air Conditioner Heater Dehumidifier with Heat Pump Technology (LX-150). So far it works great. It even came with two insulation sleeves for the intake and exhaust hoses which i thought was kinda cool. I have noticed that the CO2 level does seem to drop when the AC is on (from like 800 ppm to 600 ppm). I'm thinking maybe even though there is an intake hose perhaps some air is being exhausted out? Or perhaps being "filtered" out? Any else with CO2 and dual hose noticed this?
 

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rbahadosingh

rbahadosingh

Well-Known Member
I think you should think about getting a co2 generator and not the tank. That tank will probably be empty in a week in that size space....
 
KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

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rbahadosingh said:
I think you should think about getting a co2 generator and not the tank. That tank will probably be empty in a week in that size space....
Click to expand...
Thx for the suggestion. I've had the tank about 8 days averaging 900 ppm and it's still going strong. The pressure gauge has moved very little. My friends setup that i copied was the same size as mine and after flowering 24 plants to 5' tall he said on average he had to replace his tank every 3 weeks. We'll see how it goes.
 
KnowledgeSeeker

KnowledgeSeeker

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So I've decided to not do a sealed room. After doing more research and talking to more people who have been growing for a while it just doesn't make sense to me personally to do a sealed room.

Reason #1: Electricity. 2400w of lights is going to generate considerable heat. Even with only 2 600w lights running my AC runs for about 1/2 hour to bring the room temp down from 82 to 74. It then takes about 1/2 hour for the temp to get back up to 82. So if it's sealed my AC would be on for at least 6 hours a day. If I bring in free cold air from outside and exhaust hot air from the room at the same time as the AC is running it will not take nearly as long to bring the room temp down and it will be a lot cheaper.

Reason #2: the CHHC-1. The CHHC-1 will turn of the CO2 when the cooling period begins and will bring it back on when the cooling period ends so the CO2 is not trying to fill the room as it is exhausted. The other nice thing about the CHHC-1 is that it allows me to set my regulator to the highest setting because the on/off is controlled by the CHHC-1. So when the cooling period ends the CHHC-1 floods the room with a long blast to get CO2 levels back to where they should be very quickly.

The bottom line: CO2 is a lot cheaper than electricity. With a good controller you can make sure that the majority of the time your plants have as much CO2 as they can use.

Unfortunately I can't change the title of the thread but it is what it is....
 
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