Liberal Media - Fort Hood Spin

[PadawanBater]

Only a true ignoramus would compare far right Christians to radical Muslims. While it is true that some Christians have done horrible things in the name of religion, Christians do these things contrary to their religious teachings and not in keeping with them as do Muslims. Plus, examples of Christians committing atrocities are few and far between - one needs to go back to the crusades for examples. And by the way, Christianity was only wrongly used to promote slavery - it was in fact properly and heavily used to bring about the abolition of slavery (yes, Christianity ended slavery which is still practiced in the Muslim world). By and large, some Christians can be annoying, but there is certainly no parallel to the concept of "dar al Islam" in Christianity. Dar al Islam is a Muslim concept in which peace is obtained through global domination and forced conversion to Islam.

Anyway, here is an interesting video. The woman is Wafa Sultan, a psychiatrist and ex-Muslim. This appeared on an Arab TV network. Enjoy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciOGS6r97oE

Here is one of many found on MEMRITV.org. It is an interview with a 10 year old girl married against her will. Absolutely disgusting.

http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/2107.htm

I've never defended Islam, and never will. It's undoubtably the single most dangerous religion on the planet today.

I was using Christianity in my comparison with Islam. This thread is about a Muslim who committed an act of terrorism with a little influence from his religion. In my opinion it was a good comparison, because Jeff and HMTH were claiming that Christianity is completley innocent and nothing like this ever happens under Christian influence. I listed 4 different instances where Christian extremism led to terrorism. They then claimed based on this information -- that Islam is dangerous, which I agree with -- that fact alone justifies segrageting Muslim Americans (American soldiers no less). That's wrong, just as it would be wrong to do that with Christians. If you accept it's wrong for Christians, but not for Muslims, you're holding a hypocritical position. Fine if you hold that position, just admit that you're a hypocrite.

Also, it doesn't really matter, to me anyway, what the Bible is "wrongly" used for. Wrong is wrong and it doesn't matter how you got there. Now, since we know wrong can most definitely come from the Bible, as many different people can interpret it many different ways*, it should be completely discarded or at the very least revised. But that's impossible because all of it is "devine", so nothing can be changed without millions, possibly billions of people bitching about it.

Don't you think Hitler believed he was doing good? Should we not consider his acts inhumane based on the consequences that proceeded them, why should his intentions come into play at all when considering whether the act is good or bad? It's meaningless.

*funny bit of information I've come to notice... every single believer I come across has his own interpretation of Heaven, Hell, the soul, etc...

 

[Illegal Smile]

Little influence from his religion? This nutjob was all about his religion. He is a hardcore jihadist. Anyone who says otherwise is part of the problem.

 

[Haul me to Heaven]

Christianity does not teach/preach that we should kill our enemies. And to shift the conversation to the Christians is a subtle way of justifing the conduct of muslims. Catholisium was once very hostile toward those thet did not believe the way they do and Christians have been blamed for thier conduct as well.

And, as with people of any faith, there are some that just don't get it. religion should be about helping people understand that God loves them and, by his example, we should love others.

But- this is a hostile world and we, therefore, must always protect the lives of the innocent from the those who seek to harm their lives and hearts.

Is our own country under attack? I think we are. Our Constitution must be killed before the NWO can be fully installed here in the 'homeland'. So too our currency must be destroyed so that a new cashless currency can be implemented. Nothing like being a citizen one day only to have your 'chip' shut off for not bowing down to this new 'government'.

It's all comes down to th right to life and the pursuit of happiness.

Those rights are often removed in war.

But- today: is Freedom being replaced by slavery?

Who/what is really behind the modern wars?

 

[RickWhite]

I've never defended Islam, and never will. It's undoubtably the single most dangerous religion on the planet today.

I was using Christianity in my comparison with Islam. This thread is about a Muslim who committed an act of terrorism with a little influence from his religion. In my opinion it was a good comparison, because Jeff and HMTH were claiming that Christianity is completley innocent and nothing like this ever happens under Christian influence. I listed 4 different instances where Christian extremism led to terrorism. They then claimed based on this information -- that Islam is dangerous, which I agree with -- that fact alone justifies segrageting Muslim Americans (American soldiers no less). That's wrong, just as it would be wrong to do that with Christians. If you accept it's wrong for Christians, but not for Muslims, you're holding a hypocritical position. Fine if you hold that position, just admit that you're a hypocrite.

Also, it doesn't really matter, to me anyway, what the Bible is "wrongly" used for. Wrong is wrong and it doesn't matter how you got there. Now, since we know wrong can most definitely come from the Bible, as many different people can interpret it many different ways*, it should be completely discarded or at the very least revised. But that's impossible because all of it is "devine", so nothing can be changed without millions, possibly billions of people bitching about it.

Don't you think Hitler believed he was doing good? Should we not consider his acts inhumane based on the consequences that proceeded them, why should his intentions come into play at all when considering whether the act is good or bad? It's meaningless.

*funny bit of information I've come to notice... every single believer I come across has his own interpretation of Heaven, Hell, the soul, etc...

Wow, your thinking is like a tangled extension cord. Let me see if I can untangle it.

First, there is nothing in Christianity, Judaism, Catholicism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Taoism, Confucism, Shintoism or any other faith other than Islam that serves as a declaration of war against people of other faiths.

Terrorists are defined as people who use terror as a way to achieve a given political goal. Nut jobs that murder abortion doctors are not really terrorists per se because there is no concerted effort to bring change through terror. That is what separates a lone nut job from a terrorist.

Even if we assume there is an element of terror, examples of this type of thing outside of Islam are so few and far between that they can not be considered as indicative of anything other than isolated nut jobs committing murder. This is light years different than what we see from Muslims who have orchestrated hundreds of well planed deliberate conspiratorial attacks designed to commit terror in ACCORDANCE with Islam.

Put simply, to compare Muslim terrorism with the isolated acts of non-Muslims is ludicrous.

Comparing the Bible to the Qur'an is equally as foolish. Nowhere in the Bible is there a concept such as jihad or dar al Islam. Nowhere in the Bible is the hatred or murder of people of other faiths promoted. There is a history of conquering and warfare in the Bible, but it does not, as does the Qur'an, promote ongoing warfare against people of other faiths. Nor do an estimated 10% of Christians believe that the World should be converted by the sword as is the case with Islam. That comes to 130 million people by the way.

America must face the reality that we are fighting an enemy that is more insidious than any we have faced before. We are facing an enemy that is highly skilled in deception and infiltration and considers no act to appalling.

Nobody is suggesting a knee jerk reaction that would punish all Muslims. But, we must at the very least recognize the scope of the threat we face and accept that some very unattractive options must be open for debate.

The threat we face from Islam is in no way similar to any threat we have faced before and can not be compared to any other. To do so is to complicate the issue.

 

[Haul me to Heaven]

Well said. Very well said. Keep it simple and to the point. No distracting points or analogies. Well done.

 

[ginjawarrior]

Nowhere in the Bible is there a concept such as jihad or dar al Islam.

have you not read the old testament? obviously not as theres many many passages in there that many many people in christianity believe as word of god

[Ezek. 9:5] And the Lord said, "Go through the city, and smite: let not your eye spare, neither have you pity. SLAY UTTERLY OLD AND YOUNG, BOTH MAIDS AND LITTLE CHILDREN, AND WOMEN

[Num. 31:1] And the Lord said unto Moses, "Avenge the children of the Mid'-an'ites.. They warred against the Mid'-i-an'ites, as the Lord commanded Moses, and they slay all the males. And they took all women as captives, and their little ones, and took the spoil of all their cattle, and all their flocks, and all their goods. And they burnt all their cities wherein they dwelt, and all their goodly castles, with fire. Moses said, "HAVE YOU SAVED ALL THE WOMEN ALIVE? NOW KILL EVERY MALE AMONG THE LITTLE ONES, AND KILL EVERY WOMAN that has known a man by lying with him, but all the young girls who have not known a man by lying with him keep alive for yourselves.

[Josh 6:16] Joshua said to the people of Israel, "The Lord has given you the city (of the Canaanites).. all silver, and gold, and vessels of brass and iron, are c consecrated unto the Lord: They shall come into the treasury of the Lord. The people utterly DESTROYED ALL THAT WAS IN THE CITY, BOTH MAN AND WOMAN, YOUNG AND OLD, AND OX AND SHEEP, AND ASS, WITH THE EDGE OF THE SWORD.

 

[Haul me to Heaven]

Yep. They were told to kill those who commited human sacrifice and many other things. These people followed a religion that was what we would call Satanic. You seem to deliberatly forget many things when you present your version of the bible- in part and not in whole. You should not take an event(s) out of their context.

But having such hate for the bible- you will find exactly what you are looking for and not understand the charictor of events that surround your predisposition of understanding.

And, that is the Old Testimate. It has nothing to do what-so-ever with the New. Let alone Christianity. You should know this if you knew the bible.

 

[ginjawarrior]

Yep. They were told to kill those who commited human sacrifice and many other things. These people followed a religion that was what we would call Satanic. You seem to deliberatly forget many things when you present your version of the bible- in part and not in whole. You should not take an event(s) out of their context.

so they were judged "satanic" so its ok? surley "infedel" might have similar context?

But having such hate for the bible- you will find exactly what you are looking for and not understand the charictor of events that surround your predisposition of understanding.

exactly the same could be said about many peoples veiw on islam

And, that is the Old Testimate. It has nothing to do what-so-ever with the New. Let alone Christianity. You should know this if you knew the bible.

the old testament is joined onto the new for a reason prehaps some part of christianity do not pay much attention to it and favour the new. however there is part of christianity that holds the old testiment true. now the same can be said for islam that the majority do not look for these obscure passages of hate.
but the hate is there in both books to be misinterpreted. christianity is not that different to islam.

 

[PadawanBater]

First, there is nothing in Christianity, Judaism, Catholicism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Taoism, Confucism, Shintoism or any other faith other than Islam that serves as a declaration of war against people of other faiths.

That doesn't matter to me. Like I said before, Christianity is dangerous because of what it does to the mind. Mental health is equally as important as physical health in my eyes, so while Muslims murder people, Christians brainwash them. Though they did used to murder them (similar to your Dar al Islam refrence) before secular laws came into existence, before they realized they could no longer get away with such inhumane treatment for nonbelievers.

Still, today, your Bible says I'm going to hell, to be tormented for eternity. It explicitly says homosexuality is an abomination, which directly led to such animocity that homosexuals face today. Yeah, sure, you guys can say you love everyone, just not their sins or behavior, but that's nothing but a bullshit talking point right from the churches mouth to make you seem "sympathetic" (which in and of itself is offensive to homosexuals, this admition indicates you believe their lifestyle is wrong) or more humane than you actually are. It's a formality, to make it feel like your conscience is clear while still being a good little believer... it's pathetic.

Terrorists are defined as people who use terror as a way to achieve a given political goal. Nut jobs that murder abortion doctors are not really terrorists per se because there is no concerted effort to bring change through terror. That is what separates a lone nut job from a terrorist.

http://www.stephen-knapp.com/christian_terrorism_in_northeast_india.htm

http://atheistexperience.blogspot.com/2007/06/lunatic-baptists-shut-down-summer.html

http://exchristian.net/2/2007/07/christian-terrorism.html

My fav;

http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/52317/

Even if we assume there is an element of terror, examples of this type of thing outside of Islam are so few and far between that they can not be considered as indicative of anything other than isolated nut jobs committing murder. This is light years different than what we see from Muslims who have orchestrated hundreds of well planed deliberate conspiratorial attacks designed to commit terror in ACCORDANCE with Islam.

"However, there is a different sort of Christian terrorism that is far better organized, far more militaristic, and better funded than even the Islamic versions which we so love to despise. When acts of international terrorism are paid for by U.S. taxpayers, supported by U.S. politicians, and justified by Christian leaders within and without our government, it is difficult not to regard them as acts of Christian terrorism."

Put simply, to compare Muslim terrorism with the isolated acts of non-Muslims is ludicrous.

Those acts don't seem so isolated to someone who isn't blinded by religious bias.

Comparing the Bible to the Qur'an is equally as foolish. Nowhere in the Bible is there a concept such as jihad or dar al Islam. Nowhere in the Bible is the hatred or murder of people of other faiths promoted. There is a history of conquering and warfare in the Bible, but it does not, as does the Qur'an, promote ongoing warfare against people of other faiths. Nor do an estimated 10% of Christians believe that the World should be converted by the sword as is the case with Islam. That comes to 130 million people by the way.

I think you need to re-read your Bible Rick. Also, check your statistics. I call bullshit on 10%. Source?

America must face the reality that we are fighting an enemy that is more insidious than any we have faced before. We are facing an enemy that is highly skilled in deception and infiltration and considers no act to appalling.
Nobody is suggesting a knee jerk reaction that would punish all Muslims. But, we must at the very least recognize the scope of the threat we face and accept that some very unattractive options must be open for debate.

What exactly are you suggesting then Rick? Because from where I sit, it looks like you, Jeff, and HMTH are all advocating screening Muslim Americans (has this discussion progressed to the entire population of Muslim Americans, or are we still just talking about the ones in the military?), which would accomplish what exactly? Who would do it? How would it be done? How would you ensure no discrimination... well, no more discrimination takes place? What if you find a Muslim American soldier who communicates with people in the middle east, family members? Automatically a terrorist?

Basically, how would you seperate the extremist ones from the peaceful ones? Still havn't answered that.

 

[medicineman]

Wow, your thinking is like a tangled extension cord. Let me see if I can untangle it.

First, there is nothing in Christianity, Judaism, Catholicism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Taoism, Confucism, Shintoism or any other faith other than Islam that serves as a declaration of war against people of other faiths.

Terrorists are defined as people who use terror as a way to achieve a given political goal. Nut jobs that murder abortion doctors are not really terrorists per se because there is no concerted effort to bring change through terror. That is what separates a lone nut job from a terrorist.

Even if we assume there is an element of terror, examples of this type of thing outside of Islam are so few and far between that they can not be considered as indicative of anything other than isolated nut jobs committing murder. This is light years different than what we see from Muslims who have orchestrated hundreds of well planed deliberate conspiratorial attacks designed to commit terror in ACCORDANCE with Islam.

Put simply, to compare Muslim terrorism with the isolated acts of non-Muslims is ludicrous.

Comparing the Bible to the Qur'an is equally as foolish. Nowhere in the Bible is there a concept such as jihad or dar al Islam. Nowhere in the Bible is the hatred or murder of people of other faiths promoted. There is a history of conquering and warfare in the Bible, but it does not, as does the Qur'an, promote ongoing warfare against people of other faiths. Nor do an estimated 10% of Christians believe that the World should be converted by the sword as is the case with Islam. That comes to 130 million people by the way.

America must face the reality that we are fighting an enemy that is more insidious than any we have faced before. We are facing an enemy that is highly skilled in deception and infiltration and considers no act to appalling.

Nobody is suggesting a knee jerk reaction that would punish all Muslims. But, we must at the very least recognize the scope of the threat we face and accept that some very unattractive options must be open for debate.

The threat we face from Islam is in no way similar to any threat we have faced before and can not be compared to any other. To do so is to complicate the issue.

I can probably agree with most of what you are saying, I know not the answer to this dillema. I'm confident that there are many more terrorists brewing under the radar. My main suggestion to quell the hatred of Americans by Muslim extremests, would be to leave Muslim lands, IE get the fuck out of Afghanistan and Iraq. Then we could lead by example, not By might. It is not any secret that we are the most powerful Military might on the planet, No country would have the balls to attack us full force. It would take a few years of new foriegn policy, one that did not send military into a country to protect the interests of the corporations. We need to pull our military out of foriegn lands and let them work out their problems. The only thing we should do is offer aid for disasters.

 

[medicineman]

The corporations. War contractors, weapons manufactures, Neo-cons and their imperialistic views, Mostly right wing elites. War is extremely profitable, Just look at the Haliburton experience, Kellog-Brown-and Root, etc. Look at the extreme expansion of private military, for profit private contractors. 99.9% of everything those contractors are doing on our tax dollars for profit, was done by the military, before Cheney and the Neo-Cons took over the military. War is hell for the grunts, but the capitalist pigs are raping and pillaging, and I see no end in sight. There is one thing I am dissapointed in Obama, it is continuation of the Bush war policies, in a word, they're fucked.

 

[RickWhite]

That doesn't matter to me. Like I said before, Christianity is dangerous because of what it does to the mind. Mental health is equally as important as physical health in my eyes, so while Muslims murder people, Christians brainwash them. Though they did used to murder them (similar to your Dar al Islam refrence) before secular laws came into existence, before they realized they could no longer get away with such inhumane treatment for nonbelievers.

Still, today, your Bible says I'm going to hell, to be tormented for eternity. It explicitly says homosexuality is an abomination, which directly led to such animocity that homosexuals face today. Yeah, sure, you guys can say you love everyone, just not their sins or behavior, but that's nothing but a bullshit talking point right from the churches mouth to make you seem "sympathetic" (which in and of itself is offensive to homosexuals, this admition indicates you believe their lifestyle is wrong) or more humane than you actually are. It's a formality, to make it feel like your conscience is clear while still being a good little believer... it's pathetic.



http://www.stephen-knapp.com/christian_terrorism_in_northeast_india.htm

http://atheistexperience.blogspot.com/2007/06/lunatic-baptists-shut-down-summer.html

http://exchristian.net/2/2007/07/christian-terrorism.html

My fav;

http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/52317/




"However, there is a different sort of Christian terrorism that is far better organized, far more militaristic, and better funded than even the Islamic versions which we so love to despise. When acts of international terrorism are paid for by U.S. taxpayers, supported by U.S. politicians, and justified by Christian leaders within and without our government, it is difficult not to regard them as acts of Christian terrorism."



Those acts don't seem so isolated to someone who isn't blinded by religious bias.



I think you need to re-read your Bible Rick. Also, check your statistics. I call bullshit on 10%. Source?



What exactly are you suggesting then Rick? Because from where I sit, it looks like you, Jeff, and HMTH are all advocating screening Muslim Americans (has this discussion progressed to the entire population of Muslim Americans, or are we still just talking about the ones in the military?), which would accomplish what exactly? Who would do it? How would it be done? How would you ensure no discrimination... well, no more discrimination takes place? What if you find a Muslim American soldier who communicates with people in the middle east, family members? Automatically a terrorist?

Basically, how would you seperate the extremist ones from the peaceful ones? Still havn't answered that.

You would really do a lot better if you would stop trying to free roll (invent your argument as you go).

You know NOTHING of the Judeo-Christian philosophy or its greater roll through history. It was this philosophy that introduced justice, law, order and compassion to a world of barbarism. The fact that you falsely attribute a host of malicious things means nothing and is in fact a sign of your ignorance. And I don't know how many times I need to repeat that I am a non-religious Jew. The fact that you assume I am a devout Christian again only demonstrates your ignorance. And to suggest that there is Christian terrorism visa vi the policies of the American Government is stupid and untrue and can not be demonstrated with any specific examples.

Your attacks on Christians based on their belief that there is punishment in the after life and their belief that homosexuality is a sin only shows that you are intolerant of the belief's of others.

You clearly believe that some people are deserving of tolerance (Gays) and others are not (Christians) and that the latter should be forced to be tolerant of the former but not vis versa. That opinion is stupid on its face. Should we pass laws that force Christians to approve of Homosexuality? Is that your concept of tolerance? And BTW, Jesus taught to hate the sin but love the sinner so by rights Christians MUST love Gays. Do you know what they do to Homosexuals in Muslim countries Copernicus? They murder them in case you didn't know.

As far as your questions about what I would or would not do about Muslims in the Military - I have not even tried to come up with any of these answers. I have only suggested that we begin a dialog concerning these questions.

In closing, I must say that I find this conversation to be boring and quite frankly, stupid. When I hear someone try to compare Christianity with Islam I can only shake my head, roll my eyes and assume I am talking to someone with a complete lack of ability to see issues clearly. You have proved this to be true time and time again. I know you think your ideas are brilliant - these days everyone does. But I promise you, you are only making a fool of yourself.

Perhaps you should try spending your time on video games or something more suited to you because you simply are not very good at this. I don't mean that as an insult - it's just that the things you post are not even thought provoking. Really it sounds like the rantings of a brainwashed, party line, Leftist ignoramus - sorry.

 

[RickWhite]

The corporations. War contractors, weapons manufactures, Neo-cons and their imperialistic views, Mostly right wing elites. War is extremely profitable, Just look at the Haliburton experience, Kellog-Brown-and Root, etc. Look at the extreme expansion of private military, for profit private contractors. 99.9% of everything those contractors are doing on our tax dollars for profit, was done by the military, before Cheney and the Neo-Cons took over the military. War is hell for the grunts, but the capitalist pigs are raping and pillaging, and I see no end in sight. There is one thing I am dissapointed in Obama, it is continuation of the Bush war policies, in a word, they're fucked.

Can you show evidence of this massive profit and that this is why we go to war? And I mean evidence, not some opinion from the Huffington Post or Moveon.org.

You know MM, the way out of poverty is hard work. Bitching about how "the man" is holding you down and waiting for a revolution to lift you out of poverty will never work. Why don't you buy a lawn mower and start a landscaping business or something.

 

[jeff f]

No country would have the balls to attack us full force. It would take a few years of new foriegn policy, one that did not send military into a country to protect the interests of the corporations. We need to pull our military out of foriegn lands and let them work out their problems. The only thing we should do is offer aid for disasters.

so when we werent in afghanistan they DIDNT knock down the towers? you vastly underestimate and dont understand jihad. they blew subways up in london, spain, discos in germany...and on and on and on. you dont have to be in their country to be attacked. all you have to be is NOT muslim.

 

[jeff f]

Mental health is equally as important as physical health in my eyes, so while Muslims murder people, Christians brainwash them.

so you are making the moral equivalency of murder to brainwashing. plus the "brainwashing" is your opinion. you dont have any evidence of these nutcases (christians) performing attrocities....like what? feeding hungry children? setting up medical facilities in the middle of war zones in africa? going to south america and building housing for the poor? running food pantries in our country? treating your neighbors as you would yourself? which atrocities commited by those foul christians are you talking about? please inform me what terrible things , other than what you call "brainwashing" are they committing? i think i know who is brainwashed and its not christians....the govt standards just call it bigotry. i hope you dont supervise any christians. and if you do, i hope they bring civil suit against you because you clearly are a bigot.

 

[RickWhite]

Here is a partial list of Muslim terrorist attacks in the last 2 months.

This website claims 14,427 since 9/11/2001.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks

 

[PadawanBater]

You would really do a lot better if you would stop trying to free roll (invent your argument as you go).

You know NOTHING of the Judeo-Christian philosophy or its greater roll through history. It was this philosophy that introduced justice, law, order and compassion to a world of barbarism. The fact that you falsely attribute a host of malicious things means nothing and is in fact a sign of your ignorance. And I don't know how many times I need to repeat that I am a non-religious Jew. The fact that you assume I am a devout Christian again only demonstrates your ignorance. And to suggest that there is Christian terrorism visa vi the policies of the American Government is stupid and untrue and can not be demonstrated with any specific examples.

Your attacks on Christians based on their belief that there is punishment in the after life and their belief that homosexuality is a sin only shows that you are intolerant of the belief's of others.

You clearly believe that some people are deserving of tolerance (Gays) and others are not (Christians) and that the latter should be forced to be tolerant of the former but not vis versa. That opinion is stupid on its face. Should we pass laws that force Christians to approve of Homosexuality? Is that your concept of tolerance? And BTW, Jesus taught to hate the sin but love the sinner so by rights Christians MUST love Gays. Do you know what they do to Homosexuals in Muslim countries Copernicus? They murder them in case you didn't know.

As far as your questions about what I would or would not do about Muslims in the Military - I have not even tried to come up with any of these answers. I have only suggested that we begin a dialog concerning these questions.

In closing, I must say that I find this conversation to be boring and quite frankly, stupid. When I hear someone try to compare Christianity with Islam I can only shake my head, roll my eyes and assume I am talking to someone with a complete lack of ability to see issues clearly. You have proved this to be true time and time again. I know you think your ideas are brilliant - these days everyone does. But I promise you, you are only making a fool of yourself.

Perhaps you should try spending your time on video games or something more suited to you because you simply are not very good at this. I don't mean that as an insult - it's just that the things you post are not even thought provoking. Really it sounds like the rantings of a brainwashed, party line, Leftist ignoramus - sorry.

Wrong again Rick. Modern law dates back to the Egyptians at around 3,000BC. After that the Sumerians used a code of law. You ever hear of the Code of Hammurabi? 1790BC buddy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Hammurabi

, finally the OT comes along and builds on top of already established codes of law around 1280BC, and most believers of their own faith don't even recognize it as part of their official doctrine that should be followed just as the NT because of all of the other crazy shit that takes place throughout. After that, the ancient Greeks and Romans established what would become democracy.

What, you think that nobody followed any kind of law and everything was all chaos and no order before ol' Jebus came along?

A non-religious Jew, well that's the first time I've ever read anywhere where you stated your faith. You sure seem to be able to point out all the negative aspects of Islam, but turn a blind eye to the negative aspects of Christianity (or Judaism for that matter). Care to tell me why this is? You dismiss all the good peaceful Muslims do because a part of their doctrine (they do not follow) tells them to kill or convert all non believers, but when the exact same thing is turned around on Christians and the OT, somehow it's different? Like I said, most Christians don't recognize the OT, so using your logic, we should dismiss all the good Christians do because of that, just like you do with the Muslims. You gotta see the hypocricy in that.

Specific examples?

Invasion and occupation of Iraq
Invasion and occupation of Afghanistan
The Bush Doctrine - pre emptive strikes
Guantanamo Bay - torture instituted

No. I believe in equal rights for everyone. You don't have the right to discriminate against homosexual people by denying them the same equal rights you enjoy. That's not a "right" you have. Believing you have that right doesn't give you the right. If you have the right to discriminate against a group of people and vote on a policy that takes their rights away, then I don't see any reason why I shouldn't have the same right to discriminate against you and vote on a policy that takes your rights away.

Homosexuals want equal rights. That's all. Homophobes want to take those rights away. See the difference?

You cannot love someone you've never met before Rick, and if you can, you sure as fuck don't know what the word love means. Again, that "hate the sin, love the sinner" bullshit doesn't fly with me. It's a front to clear your own conscience that you know is fucked because if it wasn't, you wouldn't need the formality to begin with, and an honest person knows that. Same as the preacher who won't marry interracial couples saying "I like black people, they've even used my toilet" - bullshit.

...and they'd be killing homosexuals here too if it wasn't for the fucking enlightenment. Dude, have you ever read a history book in your life, goddamn!

You don't understand the dangers of organized religion because you yourself are diluted by one. So carry on, it's expected. Though I do love your charming posts...

I must be making a huge fool of myself! Take a look at the rep Jack, people seem to like the things I've got to say, what's that tell ya?

Oh I've got plenty of other hobbies Rick, pwning Right wing nut job religious fanatics is just one of them.

 

[RickWhite]

Wrong again Rick. Modern law dates back to the Egyptians at around 3,000BC. After that the Sumerians used a code of law. You ever hear of the Code of Hammurabi? 1790BC buddy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Hammurabi

, finally the OT comes along and builds on top of already established codes of law around 1280BC, and most believers of their own faith don't even recognize it as part of their official doctrine that should be followed just as the NT because of all of the other crazy shit that takes place throughout. After that, the ancient Greeks and Romans established what would become democracy.

What, you think that nobody followed any kind of law and everything was all chaos and no order before ol' Jebus came along?

A non-religious Jew, well that's the first time I've ever read anywhere where you stated your faith. You sure seem to be able to point out all the negative aspects of Islam, but turn a blind eye to the negative aspects of Christianity (or Judaism for that matter). Care to tell me why this is? You dismiss all the good peaceful Muslims do because a part of their doctrine (they do not follow) tells them to kill or convert all non believers, but when the exact same thing is turned around on Christians and the OT, somehow it's different? Like I said, most Christians don't recognize the OT, so using your logic, we should dismiss all the good Christians do because of that, just like you do with the Muslims. You gotta see the hypocricy in that.

Specific examples?

Invasion and occupation of Iraq
Invasion and occupation of Afghanistan
The Bush Doctrine - pre emptive strikes
Guantanamo Bay - torture instituted

No. I believe in equal rights for everyone. You don't have the right to discriminate against homosexual people by denying them the same equal rights you enjoy. That's not a "right" you have. Believing you have that right doesn't give you the right. If you have the right to discriminate against a group of people and vote on a policy that takes their rights away, then I don't see any reason why I shouldn't have the same right to discriminate against you and vote on a policy that takes your rights away.

Homosexuals want equal rights. That's all. Homophobes want to take those rights away. See the difference?

You cannot love someone you've never met before Rick, and if you can, you sure as fuck don't know what the word love means. Again, that "hate the sin, love the sinner" bullshit doesn't fly with me. It's a front to clear your own conscience that you know is fucked because if it wasn't, you wouldn't need the formality to begin with, and an honest person knows that. Same as the preacher who won't marry interracial couples saying "I like black people, they've even used my toilet" - bullshit.

...and they'd be killing homosexuals here too if it wasn't for the fucking enlightenment. Dude, have you ever read a history book in your life, goddamn!

You don't understand the dangers of organized religion because you yourself are diluted by one. So carry on, it's expected. Though I do love your charming posts...

I must be making a huge fool of myself! Take a look at the rep Jack, people seem to like the things I've got to say, what's that tell ya?

Oh I've got plenty of other hobbies Rick, pwning Right wing nut job religious fanatics is just one of them.

The same stupidity repeated over again - well done moron.

American foreign policy, specifically our response to Islamic terror is all dictated by the Bible which of course is the supreme law of America. Yep, you are a real deep thinker alright.

And yes, Homosexuals, would fair much better in Muslim countries where they stone them than in the US, because in the US people are free to disapprove of them (contrary to your beliefs). Being stoned is better than being disapproved of. We should make disapproval illegal. Again, you demonstrate what a genius you are - well done.

You are right, when you go to the airport, all that beefed up security is to guard against Christian fundamentalists. God forbid they should start handing out literature and proselytizing.

I'm sure most Americans fear Christian proselytizing and disapproval far more than being blown to bits while boarding a buss with their children.

You sir are a freaking rocket scientist!

 

[PadawanBater]

The same stupidity repeated over again - well done moron.

American foreign policy, specifically our response to Islamic terror is all dictated by the Bible which of course is the supreme law of America. Yep, you are a real deep thinker alright.

And yes, Homosexuals, would fair much better in Muslim countries where they stone them than in the US, because in the US people are free to disapprove of them (contrary to your beliefs). Being stoned is better than being disapproved of. We should make disapproval illegal. Again, you demonstrate what a genius you are - well done.

You are right, when you go to the airport, all that beefed up security is to guard against Christian fundamentalists. God forbid they should start handing out literature and proselytizing.

I'm sure most Americans fear Christian proselytizing and disapproval far more than being blown to bits while boarding a buss with their children.

You sir are a freaking rocket scientist!

Suuure...our foreign policy "responds" to Islamic terror... It's not designed to protect American interests or anything... It's all about protecting Americans and keeping everyone safe..

If a foreign nation bombed our country for decades and instituted puppet governments as they saw fit, then we attacked that country with the limited means we had available, would you be a traitor to this nation and side with the country that has been bombing us for decades? (I guarantee you won't answer that, coward)

But I guess it's all good huh, listen and believe whatever people tell you. I mean the people who spread American propaganda don't have any interest in keeping America at the top of the capitalist pyramid. Expenses to other countries? Fuck em! They deserve it for being so poor and brown eh Rick? Or for being Islamic..

Our response to Islamic terror is dominantly a response from the Islamic world for western terror.

So you openly admit you disapprove of homosexuals. Unbelievable. I don't think I've actually ever seen someone come out and admit they're a biggot, so I guess points for you for your one shred of honesty this entire forum. The thing you don't seem to understand though is that sexual orientation is not a choice, no matter how much you think it is. A very simple way for you to test this, which science is all about, is think to yourself for a moment, could you change your sexual orientation on the fly, right now? Could you become homosexual right now, if you chose to? (again, your coward ass most likely won't answer that) Of course you couldn't, so I really don't understand how you can then dismiss your own direct evidence against your own biggoted theory. Are you that stupid or, as I expect, that stubborn? Homosexual people don't have a choice, just like people don't have a choice of their skin color, or their gender. So openly "disapproving" of it is boggotry. Congrats on that...

I'm not going deeper with the Christian extremism. You're not getting it at all. All you know is "Islam - bad, Christainity - good". Like I said before, you're blinded by religious bias, it's expected.

You also can't grasp the simple fact that Christianity is dangerous because of the mental barriers it builds in childrens minds, disabling them from learning important information correctly, which keeps the cycle of bullshit going for eternity. Those retards who were indoctrinated by Christianity go on to have kids (most likely because they believe condoms and birth control is evil and their parents spouted off the "abstinence only!" bullshit policy), and teach their idiot kids the same bullshit story they grew up believing based on no evidence, they then get instilled with such virtuous qualities you yourself are so great at presenting, biggotry towards other equal human beings, open discrimination, believing that bad science is actual science simply because it suits your broken world view that's teetering on the brink of extinction because people like me aren't taking your bullshit anymore Rick. Religion doesn't belong in the 21st century. Get the fuck used to that. I sure as hell won't miss it when it's gone.

 

[Leothwyn]

you dont have any evidence of these nutcases (christians) performing attrocities....like what? feeding hungry children? setting up medical facilities in the middle of war zones in africa? going to south america and building housing for the poor? r which atrocities commited by those foul christians are you talking about? please inform me what terrible things , other than what you call

I won't claim that christianity is as dangerous or backwards as islam. It does its share of damage occasionally though. While catholics are off in those poor countries helping people, maybe they ought to take their heads out of their asses for a while and stop preaching against condoms in countries where AIDS is ridiculously out of control.