Is Christianity Safe?

[PadawanBater]

This thread is going to be used to show some of the self proclaimed "conservatives", Christians and other believers in general that religion... specifically Christianity, has blood on it's hands.

If you're going to try to refute anything I say, I ask that you do it with sound logic and reasoning. Tell me where I'm wrong, point it out. Don't just come with insults or attacks. It doesn't strengthen your position, it infact weakens it.

So lets get started.

I am personally of the opinion that Christianity and Islam are the two most dangerous religions humanity practices. One because of the actual doctrine and two because of how many believers of each faith there are. There are plenty of other threads that point out the atrocities committed in the name of Islam, so to save time, I'm going to focus only on Christianity.

There is bloodshed all throughout the Bible, with God personally killing (or having killed) an estimated 2,391,421 people.

Detailed list - http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2006/08/how-many-has-god-killed.html

...but dismissing all the deaths, lets focus on the other issue, and in my opinion, the more important one, that indirectly shapes the world we live in today. The indoctrination aspect. This is the most dangerous thing about organized religion. Believers essentially force children to believe or, in most cases, be cast out or shunned from their community. This has been happening since the beginning. It's a mellenia old game of telephone, except in this game, nobody knows they're playing. Indoctrination is one of the hardest forces to escape from, harder than addiction. Those of us lucky enough to live in somewhat secular households while we were growing up witnessed it with our own eyes, and those of us smart enough to keep them open realized it's bullshit. So those kids grow up with the fear of hell ingrained in their minds, influencing every thought that passes through it and every decision they make. Believers simply don't understand morality doesn't come from the Bible and it doesn't come from Christianity, it comes from within. Politicians gain and control power by manipulating these same people, telling them exactly what they want to hear while not straying too far from their most prescious beliefs, those that they hold so dearly nothing will change them, not even reality. These politicians approve and pass legislation that affects us all based on their personal religious beliefs. Their beliefs indirectly affect foreign policy, which consequently lead to indirect deaths.

-most believers cannot list all ten commandments, yet follow some of them (the ones they hear repeated in the mainstream) wholeheartedly, without question

-almost every single believers interpretation of heaven, hell, God, Satan, angels, demons, the soul, etc. are different

-there are over 30,000 different sects of Christianity (all of them are right?)


So, do you think Christianity is completely safe, totally harmless and there's absolutely nothing wrong with practicing it, or do you think it's dangerous, it can be interpreted in many ways that can lead to violence, even today?

 

[Yeah]

Didn't read the whole post as I am tired of reading after reading the bullshit in that ft. hood thread and the dude sucking the long, wart covered dick of fox news and trying to infect the rest of us.

Anyway, yes, christianity is dangerous. Only because it gives power to the high ranking members of the church. Any formal religion with a structure like an army is dangerous, because it gives them the power to inflict their views on others. "Do this or God will punish you! You will burn in HELL!" Sounds like brainwashing to me.

I think there is a higher power or "God" if you will. But I believe he would be more compassionate and less vengeful than the church makes him out to be. After all his son was Jesus and I don't remember Jesus smiting people for being sinners.

 

[tebor]

There is no harm in practicing any religion unless it involves human sacrifice.
I think its not my business what somebody elses religious beliefs are.
If they dont fuck with me I wont fuck with them, I could care less what people believe.
I'm just grateful I live in a society where I can believe whatever I want.


The christians founded this country. I know they can be annoying, but give them a break.
At least they're not trying to see if you can float. or burning non-believers at the stake.
They have come a long way.

And between Christianity and islam, Christianity is the lesser of the 2 evils.
Thank god for the crusades.

 

[PadawanBater]

There is no harm in practicing any religion unless it involves human sacrifice.
I think its not my business what somebody elses religious beliefs are.
If they dont fuck with me I wont fuck with them, I could care less what people believe.
I'm just grateful I live in a society where I can believe whatever I want.


The christians founded this country. I know they can be annoying, but give them a break.
At least they're not trying to see if you can float. or burning non-believers at the stake.
They have come a long way.

And between Christianity and islam, Christianity is the lesser of the 2 evils.
Thank god for the crusades.

Great post tebor! This is a great example of the kind of post I'm looking for, totally civil and to the point, exactly stating your position. Damn, refreshing, thank you for that!

To your first point. I pretty much agree with you for the most part. I don't really care what anyone believes to be honest, that's life right, everyone is just as able to figure it out for themselves as the next guy. But after giving it a lot of thought, I've concluded that when it comes down to advancing humanity and positively progressing, making smart decisions about the environment, smart decisions about our future as a species, thinking about the bigger picture, the planet and humanity at large and getting away from the individual greedy aspect of the majority of the population, the beliefs people hold are an obstacle doing nothing but holding all these goals we all collectively need to get accomplished back. They're holding up progress. How can we reflect on ourselves as a species and be content with leaving the place worse off than when we got here for the next generations? Honestly, I think that's a tragedy.

 

[fulbright]

I vote that Christianity is dangerous. Not because I believe there is imminent death at their hands or that they'll physically harm me in any way, but because their ideologies are harmful.

It's a religion that allows and encourages weakness. It's a religion that preaches a hatred for life and man. And things that are integral parts of life are declared sins.

In my mind, Christianity (and Islam) are standing in the way of the evolution of Man.

 

[iNVESTIGATE]

lol.. you reminded me of what addicts always come to say when attempting to help themselves. "Admitting that there is a problem is the first step to a solution."

Looks as if the Church needs to step forward with a little statement parallel to that one haha.. yah right!



But as far as rights go and while personal beliefs are a factor. It goes without saying that when some one decides to lay down their foundational beliefs and play the faith card. They are subjugating themselves to the unjustification of thought. Critical and analytical thought process is what differs us from the other species. And in some circles of discourse unjustified beliefs is considered lunacy. But the thing that worries me most of all would be the fact that more and more academics are being intertwinded with religious ideals. Succumbing the cold-hard facts of modern science to the whim of a 'miracle'. Taking away all of the fun and excitement out of exploring and discovering new worlds and possibilities with our intellect. And not reducing it to our correct choice of piety.

A hierachical system of beliefs is a dangerous one. And the superiority that one intercepts and follows it is just as annoying. Fuck religion.

 

[Vindicated]

lol, this is probably a shocker to anyone who has followed my posts. But I *don't* think Christianity is dangerous. In fact, I think more people should read the Bible. I think it's this lack of reading or just skipping over all that confusing stuff and picking bits and pieces is what's really dangerous. Reading a book is never a bad thing, especially if that book inspires you or makes you a better person. I'm not a believer, but I love a good story. Romeo and Juliet, The story of Troy, The story of Moses ordering the killing of babies (http://www.reasonworks.com/Audio/BS/BSPart1A.mp3); all of these stories should be in everyone's personal library. People just need to actually read it and god willing (pun intended) not accept it as Dogma. But there is so many damn pages (and they're really thin pages with tiny font) that a lot of us just say fuck it, and go to church to get the Idiots Guide version.

I think what we really have is a case of people in power finding creating ways of getting us into a war. Hell, I'm sure after a good vape session I could use Dr. Suse's Green Eggs and Ham to justify the killing of kittens. The Bible just happens to give presidents & kings a cleaver line or two to use in their speeches. You want to know what's really dangerous? Nukes, guns, and midgets with knives.

 

[undertheice]

it's sad but true, the greatest threat to world peace is knife wielding midgets. they steal into your house at night on those crafty little feet, slicing open milk cartons and rending draperies. they are everywhere, but they remain unseen. this is the new enemy of the twenty-first century.

 

[fish601]

-almost every single believers interpretation of heaven, hell, God, Satan, angels, demons, the soul, etc. are different

almost every single believers.... wow thats alot how many have you ask?

-there are over 30,000 different sects of Christianity (all of them are right?)

30.000 denominations thats alot or did you use the same caclculator you used for "every single believer" .....
however there is no infallible interpreter of Scripture. All christians are still tainted by sin. We all make mistakes. No denomination has absolutely perfect doctrine on every issue. All christians will agree on essentials of the faith which are abundantly clear in God’s Word.

So, do you think Christianity is completely safe, totally harmless and there's absolutely nothing wrong with practicing it, or do you think it's dangerous, it can be interpreted in many ways that can lead to violence, even today?

1 john 4:7 Dear friends, let us love one another, because love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born again because of what God has done. That person knows God.

1 john 3:11 For this is the message that you heard from the beginning, that we should love one another,

 

[krustofskie]

30.000 denominations thats alot or did you use the same caclculator you used for "every single believer" .....

Just a quick bit of looking and you would have found this to be about right fish.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations

actually wiki says its more like 38000 denominations

 

[krustofskie]

All christians will agree on essentials of the faith which are abundantly clear in God’s Word.

1 john 4:7 Dear friends, let us love one another, because love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born again because of what God has done. That person knows God.

1 john 3:11 For this is the message that you heard from the beginning, that we should love one another,

Where is this abundantly clear word of god. You have quoted some verses from scripture which was written by a man, this is not the word of god.

 

[krustofskie]

There is bloodshed all throughout the Bible, with God personally killing (or having killed) an estimated 2,391,421 people.

Detailed list - http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2006/08/how-many-has-god-killed.html

You are far to kind PB, you should have gotten the full revised list from the same site where the number of deaths associated to god climbs up to 33,041,220

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2007/01/how-many-has-god-killed-complete-list.html

 

[krustofskie]

And to give my two cents, I do believe that Christianity can be safe but is not. Many of my family found solace in their beliefs at times when its needed, not to say that solace could not be found another way as I do but for them it is what works and in this sense it is good for them on a personal level, but this is only personal faith and not the religion as an organisation that it is. The problem and where it truely goes wrong is the so called leaders of the faith and of countries. Wether its to wage war or dictate law leaders have abused the people for millenia by using their religion against them. Even when the religion goes against the 'leaders' plans, they can simply change the books word to suit them, take out this scripture add another, rewrite this part and that part. So in this sense as a man made organisations form of control over the people it is wrong. Keep it as personal faith and to yourself and I can see some benifits but as a whole the organisations known as Christianity push their agenda onto others, even when contradictory to proven facts, are an unnecessary obsolete form of control.

 

[DubsFan]

There are pretty much two types of Christians. You've got Catholics and Protestants. That covers a good 90%. Other than that this thread is sort of blah.

I like how you have a precise number of deaths. LOL. You clearly have counted them all.

 

[DubsFan]

And to give my two cents, I do believe that Christianity can be safe but is not. Many of my family found solace in their beliefs at times when its needed, not to say that solace could not be found another way as I do but for them it is what works and in this sense it is good for them on a personal level, but this is only personal faith and not the religion as an organisation that it is. The problem and where it truely goes wrong is the so called leaders of the faith and of countries. Wether its to wage war or dictate law leaders have abused the people for millenia by using their religion against them. Even when the religion goes against the 'leaders' plans, they can simply change the books word to suit them, take out this scripture add another, rewrite this part and that part. So in this sense as a man made organisations form of control over the people it is wrong. Keep it as personal faith and to yourself and I can see some benifits but as a whole the organisations known as Christianity push their agenda onto others, even when contradictory to proven facts, are an unnecessary obsolete form of control.

There are pretty much two types of Christians. You've got Catholics and Protestants. That covers a good 90%. Other than that this thread is sort of blah.

I like how you have a precise number of deaths. LOL. You clearly have counted them all.

Faith like everything is shared with people that have the same beliefs. There is nothing wrong with organized religion if the people there want to be there. Nobody should have to keep their faith to themselves.

You say practice by yourself yet in the same sentance you say their beliefs are forced onto others. So you think people should listen to you (practice by yourself) but not their fellow parishioners. Interesting...I don't think you recognized the hypocracy and narcacism in your post.

 

[krustofskie]

There are pretty much two types of Christians. You've got Catholics and Protestants. That covers a good 90%. Other than that this thread is sort of blah.

I like how you have a precise number of deaths. LOL. You clearly have counted them all.

Faith like everything is shared with people that have the same beliefs. There is nothing wrong with organized religion if the people there want to be there. Nobody should have to keep their faith to themselves.

You say practice by yourself yet in the same sentance you say their beliefs are forced onto others. So you think people should listen to you (practice by yourself) but not their fellow parishioners. Interesting...I don't think you recognized the hypocracy and narcacism in your post.

I think I put it badly, might have something to do with it being 7am where I am and 11 hours into a 12 hour shift. What I am trying to say, hopefully I am putting it better this time, is that I dont see anything wrong with personal faith and this includes as a collective of like minded people (don't confuse what I mean by collective of like minded people with the organisation that is Christianity). By keeping it to yourself I dont mean locking yourself away on your lonesome to practice your faith but rather don't force your faith onto others, wether this be door knocking, street preaching or teaching the bible as fact in schools. My problem with Christianity, apart from not believing it or any religion for that matter, has always been the hiarkey that controls it and has changed it to suit its means for hundreds of years.
Maybe it is hypercritical of me for speaking my mind, but the need to speak my mind on the matter would not be there if Christians would stop 'spreading the word' and trying to indoctrinate my children.

 

[PadawanBater]

I like how you have a precise number of deaths. LOL. You clearly have counted them all.

That's another thing... Believers don't get how those of us that don't buy into it simply don't follow it at face value... they can't fathom how/why we would get into the details or read any of it if we didn't believe it...

I personally have not counted all the deaths within the Bible, yet, as I haven't read the whole Bible, yet. When I gather my data together, I'll let you know.

 

[Vindicated]

A lot of people of faith and non-faith choose to share their opinion, because that's what they believe is right. They're not trying to hurt you or disrespect you in anyway. I expect a priest to talk to me about God. I expect a doctor to talk to me about my health. And a mechanic to talk to me about my car. Now, when my mechanic goes on a rant about god, it can be a little annoying for obvious reasons. I just want my car fixed.

The people that come door to door are sales people. I treat them differently from regular people of faith. These sales people are working for their organization, either for profit or voluntarily. They're asking for you to work, buy, or donate to their cause.

I'll donate a few bags of clothes to the Salvation Army. That's because this is an christian organization that I trust and has a reputation for doing a lot of good work. I'm sure some of the smaller churches are good too, but I don't know enough about them, to be willing to donate to their cause.

I'll choose to hold on to my money when I see an organization that is anti-science or against my ethics. For example, if you hold a sign that says, fuck the jews, abortion is murder, god hates fags, etc. I won't care if your a doctor or a minister, you aren't getting my support or my money. And I'll think your below dirt and are doing more harm then good with your hate speech. Everyone else on the other hand, are just talking and are trying to do good things for their communities.

I can't hate someone for that.

 

[krustofskie]

A lot of people of faith and non-faith choose to share their opinion, because that's what they believe is right. They're not trying to hurt you or disrespect you in anyway. I expect a priest to talk to me about God. I expect a doctor to talk to me about my health. And a mechanic to talk to me about my car.

Its fine for a priest to speak to me about god, if I go to him for answers. Don't come looking for me to tell me about god. Don't try to have children forced to learn the bible as fact in state schools, if I want my children to learn that way then I will send them to a faith school. I dont want religion (of any faith) to come looking for me to tell me how to live my life, if I want religion to tell me what to do I will come and ask. I believe in a seperation of state from the religion but religion keeps trying to force its way back into state. If religion stops trying to force itself upon me then I would be happy to stop putting down religion as it would then have become truely a personal choice to take.

 

[tebor]

Its not really fair to blame deaths and wars on Christianity or religion.
People were killing each other and going to war long before Christianity.
War is human nature.
so is conquering those that are weaker.
atrocities will occur with or without religion.

Look at the Americas, Australia, Africa.
People were killing and waring before white people or Christianity showed up.

Look at European religion before Christianity. Even more violent and warlike.