6weeks and nothing but troubles

[Shanus]

I know this has been covered a million times, Ive read for hours! Ive had nothing but problems out of my White widow since birth. Ive had yellowing lower leaves, but they been the same for weeks; Kinda thin and papery. I watered and then drooping began, I modified the soil to a 100% perlite, and they wouldnt hold enough water. So now, Im running a 20%verm and 80% perlite. The roots looked hairy and white. I did hurt a little bit of em, but this issue was happeneing before any repotting. Aside for a tiny bit of breakage at the ends, the roots are intact on all my babies. This problem is affecting all 8! It hasnt effected the 3 month old cristal I have going, even though its on the same nutes. Perhaps what ever is causing this is slight enough that its not hurting a mature plant. Also Ive battled leaf end upcurling on these since sprout. They grew an inch a day for a week then stopped!

Im fairly sure they drooped because I was having to go over a week between watering and the soiless was 50% verm and 50% perl. Probably lack of oxygen. The vermiculite sucks! it turned to powder, collected on the roots and the sides of the pot. Eventually it all settled to the bottom and blocked my 25 drain holes! I repotted with perlite and added a touch of verm in top.

My temps are always between 78 and 68. humidity is 60% at night and as low as 40%. These plants quit growing taller about 2-3 weeks ago, and cant seem to reach the 11" mark. The yellowing is continuosly climbing the plants to the top, and the dark spots are gettting worse by the day.

Seems like I may have had some nute burn although Im only using Earth Juice. I guess full strenght is too much. Since then, Ive flushed over the last week and repotted. recently Ive watered with 1/4 str grow, and maintained a ph of 6.5 with the nutes.. Somehow, my soil ph is above 8 at times? I dont understand, tap water here is only 7.2-7.4 and Ive buffered all water to 6.5 with sulfuric acid. It doesnt take much! I always leave the nutes to tea for 24-48hrs and recheck before feeding. Im growing under a 1000hps that isnt too hot and i keep it between 16-24 inches above.

Im at a loss. Ive been fighting this issue for 2-3 weeks now. These plants are nearing 2 months under 18/6 lights and they aint gotten any bigger for weeks. Although, they get worse each day! Any suggestions on what esle to try, or what NOT to try? Thanks



fyi : the spredsheet is easiest read on notepad if you undo "wordwrap"

 

[T905]

ur ph should be around 5.5-6?

 

[dodobird]

I know this has been covered a million times, Ive read for hours! Ive had nothing but problems out of my White widow since birth. Ive had yellowing lower leaves, but they been the same for weeks; Kinda thin and papery. I watered and then drooping began, I modified the soil to a 100% perlite, and they wouldnt hold enough water. So now, Im running a 20%verm and 80% perlite. The roots looked hairy and white. I did hurt a little bit of em, but this issue was happeneing before any repotting. Aside for a tiny bit of breakage at the ends, the roots are intact on all my babies. This problem is affecting all 8! It hasnt effected the 3 month old cristal I have going, even though its on the same nutes. Perhaps what ever is causing this is slight enough that its not hurting a mature plant. Also Ive battled leaf end upcurling on these since sprout. They grew an inch a day for a week then stopped!

Im fairly sure they drooped because I was having to go over a week between watering and the soiless was 50% verm and 50% perl. Probably lack of oxygen. The vermiculite sucks! it turned to powder, collected on the roots and the sides of the pot. Eventually it all settled to the bottom and blocked my 25 drain holes! I repotted with perlite and added a touch of verm in top.

My temps are always between 78 and 68. humidity is 60% at night and as low as 40%. These plants quit growing taller about 2-3 weeks ago, and cant seem to reach the 11" mark. The yellowing is continuosly climbing the plants to the top, and the dark spots are gettting worse by the day.

Seems like I may have had some nute burn although Im only using Earth Juice. I guess full strenght is too much. Since then, Ive flushed over the last week and repotted. recently Ive watered with 1/4 str grow, and maintained a ph of 6.5 with the nutes.. Somehow, my soil ph is above 8 at times? I dont understand, tap water here is only 7.2-7.4 and Ive buffered all water to 6.5 with sulfuric acid. It doesnt take much! I always leave the nutes to tea for 24-48hrs and recheck before feeding. Im growing under a 1000hps that isnt too hot and i keep it between 16-24 inches above.

Im at a loss. Ive been fighting this issue for 2-3 weeks now. These plants are nearing 2 months under 18/6 lights and they aint gotten any bigger for weeks. Although, they get worse each day! Any suggestions on what esle to try, or what NOT to try? Thanks



fyi : the spredsheet is easiest read on notepad if you undo "wordwrap"

1) Ph is too high as the other guy said.
2) That soil looks terrible that it's in. I would plant that sucker in ProMix soil. You can get it at Home Depot.
3) Have you been using a 1000W HPS for the entire grow? Cause HPS is for flowering only, not veg.
4) You should buy proper nutrients for marijuana such as; Foxfarm, FloraNova, etc. They have nutes for veg stage and nutes for bloom stage.

So many people try the cheap way or easy shortcut way and trust me....it just creates a bunch of bullshit. Do it right or don't do it at all.

 

[mrCRC420]

One big mistake growers make is changing too many variables too quickly. Plants take time to react to everything you do to them, results aren't usually obvious right away. Make one big change at a time, wait 3-7 days, see if it helped and go from there; either keeping the change, undoing it, or making a different change. It's tough to over-nute with Earth Juice (cause [i believe] it is an organic fertilizer). You should only use 1/4 strength nutes starting out. You shouldn't use nutes until like 2 weeks into flowering. You're not... using soil? At all? What? I must have read that wrong. Don't use acid to fux w/ ur plants, it'll make them sick; they have to drink whatever you put in the soil. Just get better water, Invest in some poland springs.

 

[dr.skunkfunk]

whoa dude yup get rid of that soil.

promix is a good one if you can get it if not miracle grow peat mix is also good ..

ease back on nutrients to about 1/2 trim of those damaged leaves.

get your watering on schedule like every 3 rd day or so ...
add b1 each watering

plant should recover

 

[Shanus]

You guys are awesome. Thanks for the input. Actually, Im not going cheap this time. Earth juice has both a grow and bloom formula. I also have the meta K , molasses and microblast. Im only using the grow for the most part w/a touch of bloom. The meta and micro are fed about every 4 weeks in 1/4 strenght.

As far as soil, I did a ton of research here, and thought that perlite/vermiculite made a dandy soiless mix? Perhaps I'm mistaken? I had as a mix: equal parts of perl/verm. I think I'm at about 4parts perlite and 1part vermiculite w/a touch of lime now.

So, I should scrap the mixture I've got and go back to the soil mixture I've got made from leftovers? Anyone else going to agree or disagree, before i put these girls thru repotting again and lose about $60 worth of perl/verm? I think my leftovers soil mix in the bag is about 6parts peatmoss, 3parts MG time released soil, 2part perlite and probably a touch of lime. I was under the impression that soiless mixes did fine if you do it right. Course, thats "if you do it right", which im obviously not.

Currently the mix in my pots seems a decent weight when watered, and light as a feather 5 days later. I was scared my mix was too wet (over a week between waters), so i redid it with tons of perlite. Im just worried about repotting them again! Hell, theyve been repotted twice in 2 days already.

So, the sulfuric acid 1% is hurting the plants? I only use about 1/4 cupof 1% per 10 gallons, so its very diluted. I believe I read here (somewhere) that sulfuric acid is okay. I tried vinegar, but it doesnt hold the ph long. Should I buy a ph down? For as much water as I use, I really dont think that importing water other than my city's supply is very feasible. Of course, if i have to, I will.

Thanks again and please feel free with any other advice or questions.

Heres a pic from my last bagseed grow. I used miracle grow fert soil and peat moss w/a 400hps and MG nutes on that one. This is why im pissed! The bagseed in cheap walmart soil with crap nutes and a cheap 400w did fine. Now I've soiless from the plant store, organic earth juice nutes and a 1000w swithable ballast with both mh and hps enhanced bulbs. Things have gone to shit!

 

[serialkiller]

Where are your White Widow seeds from?

 

[dodobird]

you've definately transplanted alot, but i'm just worried about that soil....it looks very cement-like and super tight compact. Is it like that?

 

[Shanus]

you've definately transplanted alot, but i'm just worried about that soil....it looks very cement-like and super tight compact. Is it like that?

The seeds are from a friend of mine who orders from overseas. Im wondering about their genetics cuz they took so long to germinate from the go, and I lost a ton (about 60%), where's Ive always had 80-90% success. So, im not too sure, but my next starters are from sensible seeds. I got them direct. mmm lemon skunk

The soil LOOKS misleading. It was never that compact cept at the sides/bottom of buckets. They are actually sitting in about a 90% perlite mix, and I decided the buckets were too light when watered, so I ditched the top 2 inches of soil and added a heavy vermiculite mix. I know its tight up top for now, but that shitty powdered vermiculite will water to the bottom at an extreme pace.

 

[dodobird]

if you think the soil is alright then just leave them for a few days like buddy said, and let's see how they do. just make sure the soil isn't waterlogged. plants need to breathe too..let the soil dry out first b4 u water.

 

[Shanus]

Its been long enough now i should have seen some changes. My watering routine went nearly every other day, but still no growth, and if anything.....the tips continue to burn and is now reaching the top leaves. I havent been using much fert at all.

Upon rechecking the soil, the ph is up to 7.6? Having enough of wasting electricity, Ive repotted them one last time. The roots were bunched up very tightly in the pots. I went back to what was a success my first grow. I am using 1 part miracle grow potting soil, 1 part peat moss, 1oz lime per gallon, and .75 oz dolomite. The ph has settled at about 6.3 and thats with the tap water here of 7.4. Since it worked really well once, this is my last ditch effort to not lose anymore babies.

Since my last post, I lost 3 of the plants to extreme yellowing and drooping. 6 weeks in to these and the tallest is about 8-9" sheesh. Anyhow, Im tiring of such close records, but I will keep you guys posted periodically.

Thanks for all the help, looks like I'm following everyone's advice. Hope it turns out that I havent wasted all the time for nothing.

 

[Shanus]

Since repotting, all have shown drastic improvement. After a 2 day shock period, the plants grew 3" in 4 days. They are growing in green again. Say what you will about miracle grow potting soil, but it has seemd to have saved my ass again. My ph with MG/peat moss w/lime is about 6.5 or so. I think the ph being too high was the issue from the go. They are getting tall enough now im lst'ing them again! Guess its basics for me, soiless was not workin' out. Thanks all for the help, looks like I may be smokin some in about 10-12 weeks

 

[Shanus]

They survived, went into flower, went back to veg, and now im in to flower again. These little bitches are taking some crazy abuse. Over ferting, over watering and light changes, ect. .

YET, they still may yield something. Oh did I mention they have also had the crap bent out of them for some not-so-Lst training. So here they are at week one of second time around flowering.

Nope, they aint great, but they aint dead!

There are about 4 strains in there, but 3 or 4 of em are the widow's. Can you tell which is the nearly dead ones?

 

[JoeCa1i]

soil temps,might be too cold,add lime,nutes,water when the soil is bone dry.

 

[EdGreyfox]

Shanus,

I think the problem with your perlite/vermiculite mix is that it is intended as a soiless medium to be used in the cups for hydroponics, not as a complete substitute for soil in a non hydro/aero grow. Mixing a bit into your potting soil mix is a good idea because of the water retention abilities and because it forms air pockets, but I don't think it's capable of providing an environment that will keep the micro organisms your plant needs for mineral uptake healthy all by itself.

The nice thing about soil is that it has a lot more tolerance for PH problems and other mistakes. As long as you're using something that's good quality it should have enough nutrients in it to last at least a few weeks with nothing more then watering, and once you do start giving it nutes you have a lot more time to react and correct a problem before it becomes toxic unless you've really given it a major overdose. I don't know what your miracle grow soil ran you, but a bag of FF ocean forest that will fill five 5 gallon pots runs $20. Their nutes are a bit pricey (especially the flowering set), but other then that I don't have any problems with how they work.

 

[Shanus]

I ended up transplanting that into soil. Im not so sure its white widow. I was told it was, but the damn thing is very sativa like, tall and lanky. It has gone to veg and back, and into flower again, then pollinated at about 6weeks, then tossed back into veg. This little bastard is just one I add water or leftover hydro nutes with, and let it get whatever the hell is going on for lights. It was almost done flowering, but lights went back to 18 on and it seems to have stalled a tad for about 4 more weeks. I dont know if its in veg for a 3rd time, but the nuggets are still there, and the trichs are still tiny and barely cloudy.

Good news is the seeds are developed nicely. Big and brown babies. I know what i pollinated them with, so its a viable cross. Anyhow, to save the plants ass, I quite simply mixed 50% miracle grow 50% peat moss, and prety much added water. The less I do to the thing, the more it grows. Ill post a pic soon.