Fox Farm Tigerbloom Vs. Big Bloom

calismoke28

Active Member
hey guys!! i love being lazy and just going to a hydro store and picking up some fancy nutes that have nice looking pictures on them and going home watering my plants and destroying my soil microbes and creating a dependency on chemical supplements to increase their sales volume!!!! just so i can go back and pick up the rest of their line of nutes but i hope there labels are color coded so i don't have to read the back of the bottle or anything!!! LOL!!! what do organic growers think they are better than the rest of us or what!?
 

zoso914

Well-Known Member
Growing organically is a personal lifestyle choice. If using chemicals that upset the balance of nature is acceptable to anyone, then that is the alternative. If not, simple research on the web provides instant answers. I personally mix my own grow mediums from commonly available components having enough nitrogen to carry an annual plant through its life cycle and supplement the natural development of a living soil with AACT teas for other nutrient requirements.
Well that was a lot of help maybe I have some better get started information on the thread I started here last night.

Peace out,
zoso914
 

TheRuiner

Well-Known Member
bongsmilie

pour whatever the hell you want on them bro... Good luck.
I can't help but detect a hint of sarcasm (?). I didn't intend to offend or seem as if I was looking down on organic growers.... I'm trying to learn and grow a couple trees in the process bro, no hate comin from these woods homes.... peace
 

gangaman

Active Member
That is what I'm saying... Only thing I use is Humboldt Myco Madness, Molasses and a few weeks into flwering a Bat Guano, Kelp Meal and mushroom compost Tea. My point was if you are adding liquid ferts you are defeating the purpose of "Organics". Once your micro beasties are wiped out (from FF liquid ferts for example) your plants will then need to draw the nutrients from the soil themselves. This takes energy away from the other things the plant should be using that same energy for like FLOWERING! With a healthy micro life population they are feeding your plants and the plant can use all that energy it saves that way towards other things. Micro beasties regulate your pH and you will not have a build up of synthetic salts in your soil from liquid ferts. Think of your micro life as thousands of little farmers in the soil working for you.
That's amazing, seriously. Prior to this post, I honestly didn't even know that was option for an indoor grower. I've spent hundreds, if not thousands on Biobizz nutes alone. Although all their products are 100% organic, I can't think of a better way to grow then just properly amended soil...Let the plant get everything it needs from the soil, and let nature take its place. I've been doing some research, and someone on this forum recommended the book "Teaming With Microbes" which I just ordered. I also came across Subcool's recipe for his famous "super soil" which I am switching to on my next run...

So is it safe to use any 100% organic fert, or does ANY liquid fert, damage the micro life?

Also, if my base soil contains mycorrhizal, and I use a aerated compost tea will the different mycorrhizal compliment each other, or will they compete and be counterproductive?

Thanks
 

stonedmetalhead1

Well-Known Member
That's amazing, seriously. Prior to this post, I honestly didn't even know that was option for an indoor grower. I've spent hundreds, if not thousands on Biobizz nutes alone. Although all their products are 100% organic, I can't think of a better way to grow then just properly amended soil...Let the plant get everything it needs from the soil, and let nature take its place. I've been doing some research, and someone on this forum recommended the book "Teaming With Microbes" which I just ordered. I also came across Subcool's recipe for his famous "super soil" which I am switching to on my next run...

So is it safe to use any 100% organic fert, or does ANY liquid fert, damage the micro life?

Also, if my base soil contains mycorrhizal, and I use a aerated compost tea will the different mycorrhizal compliment each other, or will they compete and be counterproductive?

Thanks
I'm not sure if any organic fertilizers hurt your micro-life but Big Bloom is basically made up of guanos and worm castings so it's kind of like a concentrated tea so I doubt it would hurt anything. I've always found that diversity in your soil is always a good thing and having different types of mycorrhizae is always a good thing. Most products on the market are filled with different types of mycorrhizae and I think Advanced Nutrients Piranha is the most diverse. My buddy use to go to the circus and collect manure from all of the different circus animals for composting so he could have different types of micro-life from all over the world and the finished product was phenominal.
 

TheRuiner

Well-Known Member
My buddy use to go to the circus and collect manure from all of the different circus animals for composting so he could have different types of micro-life from all over the world and the finished product was phenominal.
Wild, that sounds like how some type of fairy tale starts... talk about poo poo power....
 

madodah

Well-Known Member
That's amazing, seriously. Prior to this post, I honestly didn't even know that was option for an indoor grower. I've spent hundreds, if not thousands on Biobizz nutes alone. Although all their products are 100% organic, I can't think of a better way to grow then just properly amended soil...Let the plant get everything it needs from the soil, and let nature take its place. I've been doing some research, and someone on this forum recommended the book "Teaming With Microbes" which I just ordered. I also came across Subcool's recipe for his famous "super soil" which I am switching to on my next run...

So is it safe to use any 100% organic fert, or does ANY liquid fert, damage the micro life?

Also, if my base soil contains mycorrhizal, and I use a aerated compost tea will the different mycorrhizal compliment each other, or will they compete and be counterproductive?

Thanks
After you read Teaming with Microbes, you're going to be amazed at how much fun growing can be. You know exactly what's going on in your grow medium and can
have a good laugh at some of the threads where posters proudly post images of their extensive and expensive 'nute lineups'.

The point being if your grow medium is properly prepared, you won't need or want to climb on the liquid and soluble nutrient supplement bandwagon. I have well under $100 invested in various components for my AACT teas, which I'll never completely use before their three year pull dates. My AACT brewer cost me $118 to assemble and I'm also using it and my tea ingredients to service my lawns and decorative plants.
 

DankShasta

Active Member
J I suggest the following; go to a farmers market offering organically grown ripe vegetables/fruit and purchase a favorite taste item. Make certain they have their certification posted as there are charlatans in any venture catering to the public, including cannabis. Then go to a supermarket and buy the same chemically grown item. Take a few bites of each. If you're like most people, that simple test could change your dietary and growing habits. Meats and poultry taste differences are equally pronounced, as is cannabis.

While I cannot dispute the facts of your post, the conclusions are not altogether correct. The problem with this theory of yours is actually quite simple. In large scale agriculture it is much more expensive to grow organically. The niche that organic farmers enjoy is based largely on their ability to provide delicious food. The can focus more on this purpose, and they also can charge very high prices for thier crops in comparison to chemical based "super farms"

Growing pot is different, people can grow better, stronger, bigger dope with high tech formulas. That's not to say that organics aren't cool, and I'm not telling anyone not to grow this way, but it isnt superior in any measurable way, including TASTE. Comparing Rieter Ice Cream to Ben and Jerrys, yeah sure B&J's is going to blow it away in any sort of taste test, but that's Ben and Jerry's niche, they also can command 4 dollars a pint! Now what if the were not limited to using only natural ingrediesnts, and earth friendly processes, BUT STILL HAD THE SAME DEVOTION TO QUALITY? You see what I'm getting at here? Growing organically is a decision someone makes because of what they put in their bodies, or what they put out into the enviorment. In this dau and age of super hydo/aero gardening, and addtives for everything, chems would win, even a taste test when done expertly. i know old timers have a hard time with that, but it's true, and I've seen it over and over first hand. Organic growing is more like a persnal coice, a statement, being more natural, observing more than controlling. It's really awesome, but organics is not superior in any way. In fact with the same expert grow skill a modern aeroponic, chemical using farmer could wipe the floor with an organic grower of the same skill. Organic growing is about more than that, and I hate when people get confused about it.
 

TheRuiner

Well-Known Member
While I cannot dispute the facts of your post, the conclusions are not altogether correct. The problem with this theory of yours is actually quite simple. In large scale agriculture it is much more expensive to grow organically. The niche that organic farmers enjoy is based largely on their ability to provide delicious food. The can focus more on this purpose, and they also can charge very high prices for thier crops in comparison to chemical based "super farms"

Growing pot is different, people can grow better, stronger, bigger dope with high tech formulas. That's not to say that organics aren't cool, and I'm not telling anyone not to grow this way, but it isnt superior in any measurable way, including TASTE. Comparing Rieter Ice Cream to Ben and Jerrys, yeah sure B&J's is going to blow it away in any sort of taste test, but that's Ben and Jerry's niche, they also can command 4 dollars a pint! Now what if the were not limited to using only natural ingrediesnts, and earth friendly processes, BUT STILL HAD THE SAME DEVOTION TO QUALITY? You see what I'm getting at here? Growing organically is a decision someone makes because of what they put in their bodies, or what they put out into the enviorment. In this dau and age of super hydo/aero gardening, and addtives for everything, chems would win, even a taste test when done expertly. i know old timers have a hard time with that, but it's true, and I've seen it over and over first hand. Organic growing is more like a persnal coice, a statement, being more natural, observing more than controlling. It's really awesome, but organics is not superior in any way. In fact with the same expert grow skill a modern aeroponic, chemical using farmer could wipe the floor with an organic grower of the same skill. Organic growing is about more than that, and I hate when people get confused about it.
I hear you man, interesting as well. When I first started getting interested in growing about 10 years ago I was amazed by the incredible tech surrounding the grow world, so many items in those catalogs! I loved it and since I came from a line of green thumbs I thought, this is my kinda garden... :)
I have tried hydro tomatoes before and didn't have the best luck determining the issues when they arose. Wasn't able to find much help either so I decided to go with soil this time and maybe still give the hydro a try on the side, I have two of one plant growing and might try transplanting one of them into the waterfarm I have to give it a shot again... it would also be a great test for me to see for myself if taste is affected by the hydro (though I imagine that all that will really factor into that is if I flush properly the last couple weeks)...
I also think that it would be a good idea to better understand the plant growing process the way God got it going, understanding the building blocks of the process, and knowing what's happening under that soil could do nothing but help give you that experience to not only recreate it in water, but build on it even more and give your plants that specific attention your referring too.... hehe get it? referr ...nevermind...
 

madodah

Well-Known Member
While I cannot dispute the facts of your post, the conclusions are not altogether correct. The problem with this theory of yours is actually quite simple. In large scale agriculture it is much more expensive to grow organically. The niche that organic farmers enjoy is based largely on their ability to provide delicious food. The can focus more on this purpose, and they also can charge very high prices for thier crops in comparison to chemical based "super farms"

Growing pot is different, people can grow better, stronger, bigger dope with high tech formulas. That's not to say that organics aren't cool, and I'm not telling anyone not to grow this way, but it isnt superior in any measurable way, including TASTE. Comparing Rieter Ice Cream to Ben and Jerrys, yeah sure B&J's is going to blow it away in any sort of taste test, but that's Ben and Jerry's niche, they also can command 4 dollars a pint! Now what if the were not limited to using only natural ingrediesnts, and earth friendly processes, BUT STILL HAD THE SAME DEVOTION TO QUALITY? You see what I'm getting at here? Growing organically is a decision someone makes because of what they put in their bodies, or what they put out into the enviorment. In this dau and age of super hydo/aero gardening, and addtives for everything, chems would win, even a taste test when done expertly. i know old timers have a hard time with that, but it's true, and I've seen it over and over first hand. Organic growing is more like a persnal coice, a statement, being more natural, observing more than controlling. It's really awesome, but organics is not superior in any way. In fact with the same expert grow skill a modern aeroponic, chemical using farmer could wipe the floor with an organic grower of the same skill. Organic growing is about more than that, and I hate when people get confused about it.
I'm not confused, organics is a lifestyle decision.

I respectfully withdraw my comparison of food and cannabis tastes as being a generalization.
 

stonedmetalhead1

Well-Known Member
While I cannot dispute the facts of your post, the conclusions are not altogether correct. The problem with this theory of yours is actually quite simple. In large scale agriculture it is much more expensive to grow organically. The niche that organic farmers enjoy is based largely on their ability to provide delicious food. The can focus more on this purpose, and they also can charge very high prices for thier crops in comparison to chemical based "super farms"

Growing pot is different, people can grow better, stronger, bigger dope with high tech formulas. That's not to say that organics aren't cool, and I'm not telling anyone not to grow this way, but it isnt superior in any measurable way, including TASTE. Comparing Rieter Ice Cream to Ben and Jerrys, yeah sure B&J's is going to blow it away in any sort of taste test, but that's Ben and Jerry's niche, they also can command 4 dollars a pint! Now what if the were not limited to using only natural ingrediesnts, and earth friendly processes, BUT STILL HAD THE SAME DEVOTION TO QUALITY? You see what I'm getting at here? Growing organically is a decision someone makes because of what they put in their bodies, or what they put out into the enviorment. In this dau and age of super hydo/aero gardening, and addtives for everything, chems would win, even a taste test when done expertly. i know old timers have a hard time with that, but it's true, and I've seen it over and over first hand. Organic growing is more like a persnal coice, a statement, being more natural, observing more than controlling. It's really awesome, but organics is not superior in any way. In fact with the same expert grow skill a modern aeroponic, chemical using farmer could wipe the floor with an organic grower of the same skill. Organic growing is about more than that, and I hate when people get confused about it.

BANK vs. DANK
The only way that chemical ferts in hydro are going to out-do organics is speed of growth and yeild. You are completely wrong about the quality. Organically grown weed is going to taste 10 billion times better. No matter what you say, the taste of hydroponicaly grown weed is never the same as a good organic plant. I've grown in hydro and in living soil and the difference is night and day I also have freinds that still grow hydro and have done so for years and have some of the same cuts I do and they never come out the same as mine grown organically. Even breeders will tell you they use organic soil for head stash and hydro for wholesale and there's a reason.
 

TheRuiner

Well-Known Member
I love this debate! I feel like a gamer and Sony and Microsoft are hydro and organic... fight for my affections! Go!
 

gangaman

Active Member
While I cannot dispute the facts of your post, the conclusions are not altogether correct. The problem with this theory of yours is actually quite simple. In large scale agriculture it is much more expensive to grow organically. The niche that organic farmers enjoy is based largely on their ability to provide delicious food. The can focus more on this purpose, and they also can charge very high prices for thier crops in comparison to chemical based "super farms"

Growing pot is different, people can grow better, stronger, bigger dope with high tech formulas. That's not to say that organics aren't cool, and I'm not telling anyone not to grow this way, but it isnt superior in any measurable way, including TASTE. Comparing Rieter Ice Cream to Ben and Jerrys, yeah sure B&J's is going to blow it away in any sort of taste test, but that's Ben and Jerry's niche, they also can command 4 dollars a pint! Now what if the were not limited to using only natural ingrediesnts, and earth friendly processes, BUT STILL HAD THE SAME DEVOTION TO QUALITY? You see what I'm getting at here? Growing organically is a decision someone makes because of what they put in their bodies, or what they put out into the enviorment. In this dau and age of super hydo/aero gardening, and addtives for everything, chems would win, even a taste test when done expertly. i know old timers have a hard time with that, but it's true, and I've seen it over and over first hand. Organic growing is more like a persnal coice, a statement, being more natural, observing more than controlling. It's really awesome, but organics is not superior in any way. In fact with the same expert grow skill a modern aeroponic, chemical using farmer could wipe the floor with an organic grower of the same skill. Organic growing is about more than that, and I hate when people get confused about it.
I would have to respectfully disagree.

It's been my experience if your top priority is quality, IE: terpene production, bouquet, smell, taste, etc Chemicals don't even come close to organics, regardless of growing medium.
 

DankShasta

Active Member
I respectfully disagree with both of you. I've had hydro-set ups where i was very aware of the micro-organism cultures on my root systems, and there are enzymic additives available now that replicate the processes of soil in-discernibly. I used to think organic, and in fact I'm growing...hmmm maybe 96% organic at the moment in a promix 5 gallon bucket grow. I just don't think anybody would be able to tell the difference when both are done expertly. I've been smoking kind buds everyday for 10 years now, and weed for over 20 years, and I've been fooled. Most recently I was fooled by an exquisite WWxBD that turned out to be grown with artificial ferts but there was no way anybody, nobody, could have known. It was just too tasty, too fucking perfect.

Maybe you're right, but here's the thing: Do you think you would know the difference? Oh and I'm not talking about some shitty beasters, lol : P
 

stonedmetalhead1

Well-Known Member
I respectfully disagree with both of you. I've had hydro-set ups where i was very aware of the micro-organism cultures on my root systems, and there are enzymic additives available now that replicate the processes of soil in-discernibly.
Are you saying you had a micro life using chemical ferts? I highly doubt it. Enzyme's are not the same as micorrhizae and beneficial bacteria but do have some of the same benefits (some), enzymes can help clean your medium and do things like help protect your plants from UV rays. Micorrhizae and other beneficial bacteria process the raw nutrients in your soil for better uptake and ward off pests and disease.

I used to think organic, and in fact I'm growing...hmmm maybe 96% organic at the moment in a promix 5 gallon bucket grow. I just don't think anybody would be able to tell the difference when both are done expertly. I've been smoking kind buds everyday for 10 years now, and weed for over 20 years, and I've been fooled. Most recently I was fooled by an exquisite WWxBD that turned out to be grown with artificial ferts but there was no way anybody, nobody, could have known. It was just too tasty, too fucking perfect.

Maybe you're right, but here's the thing: Do you think you would know the difference? Oh and I'm not talking about some shitty beasters, lol : P
"96% organic" ROFLMFAO! I'm pretty certain that means you're not growing organic.

I checked out your soil grow and your using chemical ferts which is defeating the purpose and not giving you the benefits of a true organic grow and I can always tell if something was grown in hydro. Sure the averge pot head might not be able to tell the difference but people who grow aren't your average pot heads. I'm also not saying hydro can't have a good taste I'm saying if the same plant was grown in proper organic soil it would be better. I've been growing for 15+ years and I've tried just about every method out there and if I want quality I go with a well built organic soil. I've personaly have seen the difference from the same plants in different mediums and enviroments.
 

cody.young11

Active Member
USE NEITHER... Any liquid fert will kill all the microbeasties living in your soil on contact. It's all about the micro life in your soil. Use a good organic mix and add some Mayan Microzyme along with a carb. That is all... A healthy population of micro life in your soil makes all the nutes already in the soil available. Make your soil a "Living Ecosystem". You will be over dependant on nutes and pH the second you start adding anything with synthetic salts in them like FoxFarms nutes. This will only open the door to other problems like nuking them, pH or deficiences. Just because it says "organic" on the bottle does not mean that it is.
No it won't https://www.gardenmyths.com/does-fertilizer-kill-soil-bacteria/
 

cody.young11

Active Member
Are you saying you had a micro life using chemical ferts? I highly doubt it. Enzyme's are not the same as micorrhizae and beneficial bacteria but do have some of the same benefits (some), enzymes can help clean your medium and do things like help protect your plants from UV rays. Micorrhizae and other beneficial bacteria process the raw nutrients in your soil for better uptake and ward off pests and disease.



"96% organic" ROFLMFAO! I'm pretty certain that means you're not growing organic.

I checked out your soil grow and your using chemical ferts which is defeating the purpose and not giving you the benefits of a true organic grow and I can always tell if something was grown in hydro. Sure the averge pot head might not be able to tell the difference but people who grow aren't your average pot heads. I'm also not saying hydro can't have a good taste I'm saying if the same plant was grown in proper organic soil it would be better. I've been growing for 15+ years and I've tried just about every method out there and if I want quality I go with a well built organic soil. I've personaly have seen the difference from the same plants in different mediums and enviroments.
 

shotnva777

Well-Known Member
I would just like to say, I use Fox Farms regularly and always have for my grows. Perfectly happy. Use grow big during veg, with big bloom occasionally, then after a week of turning to 12 and 12 start with the tiger bloom.


Yet to have a plant fail.
 
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