buds under developed

riddleme

riddleme

Well-Known Member
BusterBawls said:
Indeed. The plants will let u kno when the leaves aren't needed. I.e. They will turn yellow or fall off. U can bend them and push them out of the way if they are blocking buds.
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Buds don't need light, it's the leaves that use it to make the buds with, bending them away from WHERE THEY WANT TO BE IS WRONG!
 
riddleme

riddleme

Well-Known Member
Smrt said:
They do need some nitrogen in the first lil while of 12/12 but what gets me is that people "mix" the 2 together. From what I know, the nutes should be used alone, either veg nutes or bloom nutes. Mixing them causes binding of the nutes so why mix ? Use nitrogen for the first week of 12/12 then give them a flush before going to bloom food.
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depends on what your mixing, the real nute companies tell you how to do it, the canna specific rocket fuels are different

plus most don't have a clue how or when to mix em, But Dark is right the plant needs N going into the stretch and here is one for ya it NEEDS N for proper curing
 
lovemug

lovemug

Well-Known Member
im just going off the fox farms feeding schedule. it says it also needs nitrogen mixed with flowering nutes for the next 2 weeks.
 
BusterBawls

BusterBawls

Active Member
riddleme said:
Buds don't need light, it's the leaves that use it to make the buds with, bending them away from WHERE THEY WANT TO BE IS WRONG!
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I agree buds don't need light, however new bud sites and new shoot growth does. I'm not about saying any one way is wrong, but I do stand behind moving around some fat ass indica fan leaves so I can get lots and lots of long thick tops. The plant has no idea where it wants it's leaves. It will put them wherever the light shines. Besides If this was totally true supercropping your plants would be a disaster. Plants are dumb, will favor any part of the plant that produces sugar. Cykotinins are produced when a bud site or shoot gets light and will make that par of the plant flourish. A leaf mildly bent down, or pushed to the side so a top can receive light has produced me some massive bushy plants with more cola tops than topping alone. The pushed aside leaf still has much light shining on it, and still produces sugar for the plant. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it. I've proven it to myself in side by side comparisons and that's the only person I need to convince.

P.s. On full sized plants I can see this method as being pointless, but in my sog, this method produces incredibly bushy plants with zero topping.
 
JonnyBlaze1980

JonnyBlaze1980

Member
Beansly said:
Thats not true. Bud thrives under direct light, thats why people grow with scrog technique.
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I agree, usually I thin my crop before flowering (Removing fan leafs from any bud sites that are not receiving adequate light). I normally only take the main fan leafs off of the main trunk, maybe some off of limbs. You don’t want to take all the fan leafs off, fan leafs help create sugar. Sugar is need for the photosynthesis. Remember plants are building blocks, their cells stack on top of each other. So with that said even buds generate sugar but no as much as the "primary fan leafs". With both in hand you will yield nice amounts.
 
lovemug

lovemug

Well-Known Member
they seem to be catching up. i eather think the sweet tooth is a slow starter to flower or the i ended up getting god pheno of seriouse seeds white russian because the thing has crystals starting to pop up at 3 weeks of 12/12.
 
riddleme

riddleme

Well-Known Member
Plant is not stupid, it will totally adapt to it's enviroment for the best optimum results, and better yet that adaptation is then encoded into any seeds that are produced, why things vary from what breeders say as their seeds are encoded to perform (adapt) to breeders garden.

allowing the plant to do its thing is what gives the best overall yields, also why clones perform better than seeds as they have already adapted, you should understand a bit of basic botany before spreading myths & forum folklore
 
riddleme

riddleme

Well-Known Member
So instead of sharing perhaps a link to prove your therory you resort to name calling?

I'm one of the few on this forum that is not misinformed and spend a lot of time spreading the truth here to dispelled the hype and myths

do what you want in your garden but don't spread bad info to the new growers looking to learn
 
jondamon

jondamon

Well-Known Member
Beansly said:
I may not completely understand basic botany prick-o, but i know enough to know that your misinformed. Sorry your just wrong.
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OK so if your buds use light to develop try cutting all your fan leaves off except for your buds and see how FAT they get.


Dont come on here with your 14 posts and start bashing long serving members who have given countless people good information already.

This forum is full of people spreading myths and half truths.

You believe one thing to be right continue to do whatever it is that you do and dont be open minded enough to listen to those with more experience than you about how you can improve.



Mucho respect RIDDLEME i know i dont have to say it but dont listen to this kid.

J
 
Beansly

Beansly

RIU Bulldog
jondamon said:
OK so if your buds use light to develop try cutting all your fan leaves off except for your buds and see how FAT they get.


Dont come on here with your 14 posts and start bashing long serving members who have given countless people good information already.
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Well all you have to do is read any information on scrogging, from someone who knows how to do it that is, to know that buds benefit from direct light. I dont need to post "proof" because its retarded. it would be like me having to post proof that plants need water to live. Any part of a plant that receives direct sunlight/artificial light is going to have a growth spurt, its "basic botany". I resort to name calling prick-o because of riddle's agro response to me saying he was misinformed. If riddle could argue like a big boy(and all by himself i might add) i never would have come at him like that.

And who ever said anything about cutting off all the fan leaves? Not even the dumbest stoner would do some dumb shit like that. And you really are stupid if you think the amount of posts someone makes is a good barometer of how good a gardener they are.
-next
 
S

Smrt

Active Member
riddleme said:
depends on what your mixing, the real nute companies tell you how to do it, the canna specific rocket fuels are different

plus most don't have a clue how or when to mix em, But Dark is right the plant needs N going into the stretch and here is one for ya it NEEDS N for proper curing
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Mixing veg and bloom foods is news to me. They need N going into the bloom phase and I agree with this, thats why I keep them on N for the first week on 12/12, then flush and switch over to bloom food. Mixing, Ive never read on any nute bottle to mix the 2 together. If thats the way you want to go, I'd use something like General Hydroponics 3 part formula cuz the 3 parts are veg (green) micro(brown) and pink(bloom) so the mix can be tailored to suit the plants needs. But take for example the food Im currently using, it's a veg A + B and bloom A + B mixed at equal ratios. This type of nute is NOT designed to be mixed together. Im all game to hear a response to my thoughts, so please do so. (not bein sarcastic)

Now regarding the cure, Ive never added more nitrogen for the sake of the cure, nor have I ever been told that N is necessary for a proper cure and Ive cured some damn good dank. So please enlighten me on this situation cuz if it makes sense to me, Im all over it.
 
Vento

Vento

Well-Known Member
Hey Guys :)

Know what? .... I kind of knew when i wrote my first post on this thread that it might spark debate ... as i said above ... It's one of them topics ... Some swear blind it works ... Some totaly disagree , And BOTH have a good case to put .

I'm really sorry i opened my mouth on this one now :(

I'm not going to make any excuses ... i prolly fucked up here ... But i do want to put the record straight on what i was trying to get across to the OP ...

And that was " Relax ... wait ....see what happens ..... If things dont look right in a while ..... TRY and direct energy by removing SOME of the Lower leafs that may just be taking up resorces .

Now people here know im a new grower in comparison to many here ... But they allso know i read ... A LOT ... And in that reading i see the argument for both cases , Thats whay i asked the OP to read up .... BUT .... i allso know People ...and i know all the OP needed was somone to tell him to realx ... wait and watch ....And we ALL know that in a week or so them bud's will have doubled in size :)

I hope this makes sence , My intention was good , And to try and put the OP at ease with some encouragment and offer a bit of advice ...Not to cause an argument .

On that point ...Beans ...I have to agree with Jon .... Riddle is a WELL respected member of this forum and devotes a LOT of his time to help people , His experiments are legendary here , It can be said that not everyone agrees with his tone at times ... But i can asure you ... He would have put it exactley the same way to any one of us ... He was not being nasty ... Just a bit of cross Translation between you and him thats all :)

So guys ... Just relax a little .. lets remember why we are all here ,Let people have opinions ... even if you disagree .... But if you do disagree ... Offer some kind of data to back your end up .. Remember ... No one Is Right ALL of the time ...and some people are willing to be shown whats right and whats not :)

Enough hate in the world ... lets unite and learn together :)

Peace and good thing's


V :peace:
 
riddleme

riddleme

Well-Known Member
I don't use canna specific rocket fuels, I use just plain old chem nutes from JR Peters who has been a top name in nutes for over 50 years

here is a qoute from his website,
Try "The Dynamic Duo" in Combination​
​
​
Instead of alternating products, try All Purpose and Blossom Booster in combination! In a typical TWO-gallon watering can, add 1 TBL. of All Purpose and 1 TBL. of Blossom Booster.
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found here,
http://www.jacksclassic.com/dynamic_duo.html

trick is in understanding that when you mix em the NPK changes, if mixed in equal amounts you divide by 2 so as example,,,
the all purpose is 20-20-20 and the bloom is 10-30-20 mixed the numbers added are 30-50-40 divided by 2 the actual NPK = 15-25-20

hope that helps
 
S

Smrt

Active Member
Beansly said:
Well all you have to do is read any information on scrogging, from someone who knows how to do it that is, to know that buds benefit from direct light.
-next
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Just because "someone" decides thats how it works, doesnt mean it's right. Cuz I think the bud dont absorb much light at all. As I stated in another thread, take a tomatoe for example. How much light does the "tomato" absorb and how much does the fruit itself affect the yield ??? Leaves are what do it, and like I said before, without leaves, you basically have no plant.
 
Beansly

Beansly

RIU Bulldog
Smrt said:
without leaves, you basically have no plant.
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I agree. I never said anything about cutting all the leaves off. All I said is that buds benefit from direct light. They just assumed i meant that leaves play no part in bud development, which of course isn't true. Scrog, my preferred method, has a whole canopy of leave right below the screen, but if there are any big fan leaves blocking another bud site, its gotta go, not to mention all the fan leaves below the screen that arent directly pushed against it.
Im starting to see why most people dont use scrog method. Its obviously beyond the ability and knowledge of a lot of growers.
Dont get me wrong, im no Jack Herer; ive done this for about 5 years and im still learning new things. But there are some things this idiot stoner does know, and thats the fundamentals of gardening.
 
lovemug

lovemug

Well-Known Member
as far as mixing im just going by the fox farms feeding scedule. it makes sence my last grow i ended up with deficient leaves by the time i harvested. not normaly defecient like all of them went yellow.
 
Easter1916

Easter1916

Active Member
lovemug said:
they seem to be catching up. i eather think the sweet tooth is a slow starter to flower or the i ended up getting god pheno of seriouse seeds white russian because the thing has crystals starting to pop up at 3 weeks of 12/12.
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Ill have updated pics in my journal tomorrow after there 5th week of 12/12 , Serious seeds White Russian is my best plant in the grow and has the most crystals and biggest buds I think all the seeds are the same from Serious they certainly are after catching my attention and like yours mine started getting frosty after 3 weeks of 12/12 :-)
 
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