"Prop 19 written to take away medical growers rights"

vertise

Well-Known Member
man you guys who say 60,000 tax on 5x5 ect are just dumb i read it all over the place. Big tobacco try again when its federally legal. 600 dollar tax lol a foot, does anyone get that you cannot collect tax when taxes are fucking ridiculous. its better to have 1,000,000 people paying 1000 dollars a year to grow then 1,000 people paying 100,000 dollars a year. So many people just think out of their asses.
 

squarepush3r

Well-Known Member
man you guys who say 60,000 tax on 5x5 ect are just dumb i read it all over the place. Big tobacco try again when its federally legal. 600 dollar tax lol a foot, does anyone get that you cannot collect tax when taxes are fucking ridiculous. its better to have 1,000,000 people paying 1000 dollars a year to grow then 1,000 people paying 100,000 dollars a year. So many people just think out of their asses.
the purpose of the tax was to basically make it impossible to grow, it was intentionally ridiculous
 

vertise

Well-Known Member
That one county that is thinking about it will collect nothing in taxes because no one will grow there, the counties that keep there taxes low will see alot of money in return. 1,000,000 people growing paying 1,000 a year in tax for personal use brings in 1,000,000,000 in tax to the state/local govs. Thats just from growers who use and do not sell. The people who just buy casually from smoke shops because they dont want to grow will bring in more then a billion a year easily in tax
 

vradd

Active Member
EXACTLY!
its the casual smoker who choses not to cultivate who will be the biggest market. and really i think thats fair game. if it becomes legal thats what will seperate everyone instantly, those who chose to grow it and put work in to keep their personal costs down, and those who are lazy and can afford the conveniance now factor.

the more i read into it the more i wanna vote no, but at the same time its stupid that everyone and their moms are trying to capitalize on the same easy to grow product. i wish we could revamp the collectives we have now, half of them still have the prices fucked up. how is it that something that requires so little is marked up 100x what its really worth.
 

Dinosaur Bone

Active Member
That one county that is thinking about it will collect nothing in taxes because no one will grow there,
Plenty of people will grow there... they just wont pay the tax. Even if the tax dodger is a registered Democrat. The IGNORANT, vile and filthy politicians who dreamed up this tax do not deserve to collect revenue from this tax, or any other for that matter. When those filthy beasts are voted out of office, and rational human beings are elected to take thier place.... then and olny then would it be Ok to pay taxes in that municipality.

John Kerry... "Mr. Paying taxes is your patriotic duty" is notorious for parking his luxurious new Yacht in Rhode Island to dodge $500,000 in Mass. Tax...

This tax is every bit as ignorant as capitol Gains Tax. When Capitol Gains taxes are higher, to punish the rich or whatever.. the Gov. collects less revenue. When the Capitol Gains Tax is lower, and more moderate... they collect MORE revenue. Even the "dumbest human in history, and progenitor of all bad ideas", G.W. Bush was smart enough to figure this out.
 

growone

Well-Known Member
it should be pointed out that these will be tax attempts, municipalities can try what ever they want with a tax bill
not getting it tossed by the courts is another thing, i believe it's Rancho C(something) that got attention with this tax bill
it hasn't even been passed yet(from what i understand), and they don't seem really hopeful that it will
taxing a legal activity for a non-commercial activity in your home is a stretch
commercial sales is another story, that will be taxed, but there is no clear picture of how that will work yet
i'm sure there will be other attempts, but they may all go down in flames
 
5x5 is the minimum?!? Stop lying!!! You'll be lucky to even be allowed that much space after code enforcement tell us its unsAfe. the yes on 19 promoters are saying its about PUBLIC SAFETY. if you think means safety from drug cartels your wrong, thats mean safety from yourselves. they don't want you to grow, just consume.
 

tip top toker

Well-Known Member
I wish people would just read the damned proposition instead of hanging off "professional" opinions on it. It is an extremely simple and clear document, i don't understand where all these myths are coming from, are Californians illiterate? I wouldn't have thought so but it makes you wonder.
 

Moldy

Well-Known Member
I wish people would just read the damned proposition instead of hanging off "professional" opinions on it. It is an extremely simple and clear document, i don't understand where all these myths are coming from, are Californians illiterate?
I've read through the posts and this one seems to be on target. Rep+
 
So you don't believe the professional opinion of a non-bias lawyer that read the bill and posted a detailed reason for her decision to vote no. Or the professionAL opinion of a dispensary owner who stands to gain from the passing of prop19, but is still against the bill because she feel moral conviction to tell us the truth. if you don't believe these people then your just ignorant or don't know how to read and comprehend.
 

squarepush3r

Well-Known Member
check this out


In California, Prop. 215 keeps the Legislature from adopting rules that hurt patients. That is why Prop. 19, another initiarive measure, is necessary to take away patients' rights. In places like Montana, the Legislature can do Prop. 19-like damage without a vote of the people. See article below.
Vote No on 19
Demonstrators Protest Proposed Changes to Medical Marijuana Laws

http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/25093932/detail.html
 

vertise

Well-Known Member
Vote yes, stop putting out guess' on tax and things of that nature. Use more facts then opinions.
 

vertise

Well-Known Member
Prop 19 makes no changes to prop 215. To many people have killed way to many brain cells thinking it does. Prop 19 will not affect the medical guidelines as it is illegal to prevent medicine recommended by a doctor to be perscribed. The creator of 215 said 19 has no affect on patients.
 

vertise

Well-Known Member
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-borden/prop-19-would-help-not-hu_b_735846.html

Prop 19 Would Help -- Not Hurt -- Medical Marijuana Patients

Are they misinformed or deliberately lying? I don't know anymore.
A group of medical marijuana dispensaries organized as the California Cannabis Association has come out against Prop 19, California's "Tax and Regulate Cannabis" initiative to legalize marijuana.
The coalition claims that Prop 19's provisions giving local jurisdictions the power to regulate cannabis sales, including the right to choose whether to allow commercial or other outlets, would enable them to prohibit the sale of medical marijuana to patients, something that under California they currently can't do. In the words of Cascade Wellness Center head Amir Daliri, quoted in the Associated Press, "The people who would be most affected are the sick, the elderly - patients who cannot grow their own and cannot travel to pick up a prescription."

The claim is completely false. As attorney J. David Nick explained in a widely disseminated legal analysis exhorting people to get on board and support the initiative, section 2B of the Prop 19 text explicitly guards against that:
Section 2B presents the controlling and relevant purposes for understanding what Prop. 19 can and cannot do. This section EXPRESSLY excludes the reach of Prop. 19 from the CUA and MMP. Sections 2B (7 & 8) specifically state that the purpose of this initiative is to give municipalities total and complete control over the commercial sales of marijuana "EXCEPT as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9."​
Even without that protection, Nick further explains, it would be virtually impossible for the courts to interpret Prop 19 as allowing cities or counties to gut the state medical marijuana law, because of the rules of statutory construction:
Although extrinsic materials (such as legislative committee memos or voter pamphlet arguments) may not be resorted to when the legislative language is clear, courts may never ignore the purpose of the legislation. Every interpretation a court gives a statute must be consistent with the purpose of the legislation. This is why statutes have long "preambles" which explicitly state the purposes of the legislation.​
Unfortunately, the press has largely given the group a pass. In the press mentions I could find of the story, LA Weekly, Capital Public Radio, KTVU and the aforementioned AP piece, campaign spokeswoman Dale Sky Jones is quoted making the opposite claim, that the initiative actually would clarify and improve protections for medical marijuana patients. But that important information appears toward the end of the articles, and the casual reader is left with the impression simply that different activists are saying different things, not necessarily knowing what to believe. I think the media professionals covering this should have taken the extra few moments needed to glance at the initiative text, or better yet spoken with a qualified attorney or legal analyst about it. They then could have verified that the campaign quotes were right and the opposition's wrong, and reflected that in their reporting.
Fortunately, only some medical marijuana people are so shortsighted as to oppose this historic and important measure. Harborside Health Center in Oakland, and the Berkeley Patients Group are among the top quality groups lending their support to Prop 19. But it's still worth asking, why are some other medical marijuana providers opposing it?
Famed Canadian Marc Emery, from his US prison cell offered the obvious explanation: money. I've been charitable about this in saying that there's a little more to it than that. The medical marijuana providers have by and large created a good and wholesome environment, bringing dollars in for sure, but providing high-quality, compassionate services for their clientele. They've risked a lot to do it -- Daliri's center is among those to suffer raids on their operations -- and they don't want to see the world they've brought into being fall into nothingness in the face of the hugely increased competition that legalization of marijuana for anyone will surely bring. I happen to think that legalization will bring more opportunities for everyone in the industry, including the current medical marijuana providers, but I could be wrong. Maybe they will be put out of business.
But that's not a reason to allow the continued mass law enforcement campaigns against marijuana users and sellers to continue -- more than 61,000 people were arrested for marijuana possession in California in 2009 alone. And these people were smart enough to start and maintain successful businesses, therefore they're smart enough to accurately understand the Prop 19 legislation, if they want to, so I say enough is enough. Whether they are doing it deliberately, or out of deliberate ignorance, they should stop spreading misinformation about Prop 19. Shame on the California Cannabis Association. And YES on PROP 19!
 
All the they have to do is get Richard lee in front of the press and out of his own mouth tell the people that this bill that this ABSOLUTELY WILL BORG NOT EFFECT PATIENT IN ANY WAY AT ALL. a statement like that would bridge the gap between supporters and non supporters. If he has already done so show me the link.
 

The Ruiner

Well-Known Member
Why are people still debating what people say? The bill is what it is and it sucks. Dick lee could get up just like all these other DB's and say there will be no consequences but it would mean nothing. Anything anyone says is pointless. The bill speaks for itself, and if there is this much contention I would wager that there are some serious defects and this thing needs to be scrapped.

CCHHI
 

vertise

Well-Known Member
Its not debating on what people say, its debating on how the bill is interpreted. People who understand the bill know it is a good thing. Know that it does not affect medicinal patients. Also, those who think CCHH will ever have a fucking chance is an idiot. Who in hell thinks that 99 plants and 12 pounds of personal product will ever be legal. Thats just simply ridics
 

The Ruiner

Well-Known Member
Its not debating on what people say, its debating on how the bill is interpreted. People who understand the bill know it is a good thing. Know that it does not affect medicinal patients. Also, those who think CCHH will ever have a fucking chance is an idiot. Who in hell thinks that 99 plants and 12 pounds of personal product will ever be legal. Thats just simply ridics
You can't back any of that up, dude. And I dont care for your insults either. It's funny when faced with an alternative you get hostile, what do you have to lose if 19 doesnt pass? You sound VERY INVESTED in its passage....
 
Top