confused....

asdfkry

Active Member
hey everyone, im slightly confused on nutrient changes or additions during flowering.

for vege i use advanced 3 part system, but ive been told by several ppl i should be adding ff big bloom and tiger bloom when i enter flowering. Does this mean i should change the amount or stop the use of the advanced nutes? or do I just add the ff stuff to the existing dose at the recomended levels?

any info on this would be of great help as i think i could be getting much bigger buds. thanks!
 

Mcgician

Well-Known Member
Those are just bloom boosters. All they are are additions of phosphorous and potassium, for the most part. You don't have to use them, but if you check out AN's website, they recommend their own boosters like Big bud, Overdrive, etc, etc. I say use GH's Kool Bloom, since it's one of the cheapest yet good honest boosters out there and you won't get raked over the coals paying for it.
 

drugzarebadkids

Active Member
big bloom and tiger bloom are just additives for bloom. So you ad them to your 3 part "base" nutrients. I recommend to use half the recommended dose and work your way up if your new to mixing nutrients.

A few additives are good you want that shit! but dont go over bored making nute soups!
my friend uses "big bloom""kool bloom""flora blend" for additives with great success!

By the way i use the advanced 3 part system for "base" nutes and use advanced "bud candy" "big bud" for additives in bloom and i am getting some more but since im far from the closest hydro shop ill just have to wait till the next round.
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
hey everyone, im slightly confused on nutrient changes or additions during flowering.

for vege i use advanced 3 part system, but ive been told by several ppl i should be adding ff big bloom and tiger bloom when i enter flowering. Does this mean i should change the amount or stop the use of the advanced nutes? or do I just add the ff stuff to the existing dose at the recomended levels?

any info on this would be of great help as i think i could be getting much bigger buds. thanks!
The beauty of the 3 part is that you don't need boosters. Your flower formula already has a 0-1-1 ratio so if you feel like your plants can handle a 'boost', give them more of that part.
 

cowboylogic

Well-Known Member
hey everyone, im slightly confused on nutrient changes or additions during flowering.

for vege i use advanced 3 part system, but ive been told by several ppl i should be adding ff big bloom and tiger bloom when i enter flowering. Does this mean i should change the amount or stop the use of the advanced nutes? or do I just add the ff stuff to the existing dose at the recomended levels?

any info on this would be of great help as i think i could be getting much bigger buds. thanks!
If you are using Grow-Micro-Bloom then all you need to is adjust the ratios. 3-2-1 for veg and 1-2-3 for flower. Just a baseline to start with. Big Bloom and Tiger Bloom are base nutes, not boosters. If you want to add a simple booster then Technafloras Awesome Blossoms and some blackstrap added the last 4-6 weeks does wonders. Just add to feeding program.
 

GrizzlyBudz

Member
Big Bloom can be isolated as an organic additive, not a base nutrient or bloom booster. It's just digested Worm Castings, Bat Guano, Kelp, Rock Phosphate.....
If you're in soil, this will be the best flavor enhancer you can buy and will not interact chemically with the other nutrients you are applying.
3-part nutrient formulas contain proper ratios of all the essential elements, and once you start adding base nutrients from other lines, you are asking for a nutrient imbalance. Stick with the bloom boosters, and add some organics for flavor. My two cents!
 

cowboylogic

Well-Known Member
Big Bloom can be isolated as an organic additive, not a base nutrient or bloom booster. It's just digested Worm Castings, Bat Guano, Kelp, Rock Phosphate.....
If you're in soil, this will be the best flavor enhancer you can buy and will not interact chemically with the other nutrients you are applying.
3-part nutrient formulas contain proper ratios of all the essential elements, and once you start adding base nutrients from other lines, you are asking for a nutrient imbalance. Stick with the bloom boosters, and add some organics for flavor. My two cents!
This makes little sense. Big Bloom is a 1 part of FF 3 part(yes it can be used stand alone)Its a base nute no doubt. Grow Big and Tiger Bloom are not stand alone nutes. They need Big Bloom along with them to fulfill a plants nutrient needs. Then you say stick with bloom boosters and add organic flavor. I am lost.....
 

drugzarebadkids

Active Member
If you are using Grow-Micro-Bloom then all you need to is adjust the ratios. 3-2-1 for veg and 1-2-3 for flower. Just a baseline to start with. Big Bloom and Tiger Bloom are base nutes, not boosters. If you want to add a simple booster then Technafloras Awesome Blossoms and some blackstrap added the last 4-6 weeks does wonders. Just add to feeding program.
Ya there's different ratios for the mix on the back of the bottle too 3-2-1 or 1-2-3 are just a suggestion they state for oldschool growers i use the chart on the bottle.
 

drugzarebadkids

Active Member
This makes little sense. Big Bloom is a 1 part of FF 3 part(yes it can be used stand alone)Its a base nute no doubt. Grow Big and Tiger Bloom are not stand alone nutes. They need Big Bloom along with them to fulfill a plants nutrient needs. Then you say stick with bloom boosters and add organic flavor. I am lost.....
Hes rite it is just part of the fox farm 3 part system. I did not know this lol woops
But as i said before my friend uses big bloom as a booster with his advanced 3 part and it works for him.
 

cowboylogic

Well-Known Member
Hes rite it is just part of the fox farm 3 part system. I did not know this lol woops
But as i said before my friend uses big bloom as a booster with his advanced 3 part and it works for him.
Ya Big Bloom has alot of the little things that help enhance a plants growth.
 

GrizzlyBudz

Member
I was saying that Tiger bloom is a complete nutrient base with micros and everything. Adding this to a 3-part nutrient formula that is also complete is not necessary.
By recommending boosters and additives, I was referring to high PK boosters such as Beastie Blooms or Shooting Powder. Additives would be molasses, worm castings, kelp, generally mild organic fertilizers that will not cause imbalances in nutrition but significantly add to flavor.
You're right Big Bloom has some nutrition in it, but is not stand alone fertilizer, more of an additive....
Not trying to start an argument, but help categorize nutrients and raise caution to mixing nutrient lines in the right way. Peace!
 

decrimCA

Active Member
hey everyone, im slightly confused on nutrient changes or additions during flowering.

for vege i use advanced 3 part system, but ive been told by several ppl i should be adding ff big bloom and tiger bloom when i enter flowering. Does this mean i should change the amount or stop the use of the advanced nutes? or do I just add the ff stuff to the existing dose at the recomended levels?

any info on this would be of great help as i think i could be getting much bigger buds. thanks!
Well, while you could use super good base nutes and have a good result on your grows. But the reason why you use bloom BOOSTERS is to make the harvest even more amazing.

I like to add:

Voodoo Juice
Big Bud
Overdrive

I also like Bud Candy.

I say invest in one, see how it helps, and chances are good you might end up with another the next go round. That happened to me, at least.
 

gobbly

Well-Known Member
the FF site has great info on their lines (http://www.foxfarmfertilizer.com/products_liqfert1.html). Tiger bloom is the primary NPK flowering line. Big-Bloom is a supplement with trace elements, enzymes, and microbes. Different things, and I see a lot of conflicting info go back and forth on the 3 part FF, but the info I am giving you is from the source :)

What I think you are really asking is if the fox farm brand is going to be necessary instead of the advanced, and for that the easy answer is no, and the real answer is that there is no answer. As far as which is better, that's an endless debate filling a plethora of threads, but really both are high quality nutes, and good results are had with both. However, nutes are delicate, it's not something where more is better, more can be deadly fast, deficiencies can take quite a while to kill a plant. In short I'm trying to say that I think it's less important which of these brands you pick, as that you only pick one and don't overdo it thinking more is better :)

edit: oh, and most of these bud enhancers, especially the raw sugars (carb loads) are fairly independent of the micro/macro nutes. Almost anything organic, including carbs, need to be broken down, that's where microbe supplements come into play (assuming you don't have good colonies in soil already, which tends to cover organic growers).
 

asdfkry

Active Member
thanks for all the responses! this time around i will be using advanced and following their chart and i will be using the following

grow micro bloom 3-part.
voodoo juice
big bud
b-52
bud candy
piranha
tarantula

i still have the fox farm nutes kickin around, would using BIG BLOOM and/or TIGER BLOOM durring FLOWERING be a mistake?
and does overdrive make a big difference?

thx :P
 

gobbly

Well-Known Member
be careful... That's a pretty big list of chemicals, especially if you throw in the FF stuff...

Always remember, the result of underfeeding is slow growth, and an extremely long death. Overfeeding can cause irreversible leaf damage and potentially kill a plant in a very short time. When in doubt, start out small and increase slowly.

I'm not familiar with everything you list, but it's quite a hefty list, and leaves one feeling like you are focusing too much on nutes. The list of what bud needs it not really that large, especially when you consider what is in most public water supplies, and soil...
 

asdfkry

Active Member
be careful... That's a pretty big list of chemicals, especially if you throw in the FF stuff...

Always remember, the result of underfeeding is slow growth, and an extremely long death. Overfeeding can cause irreversible leaf damage and potentially kill a plant in a very short time. When in doubt, start out small and increase slowly.

I'm not familiar with everything you list, but it's quite a hefty list, and leaves one feeling like you are focusing too much on nutes. The list of what bud needs it not really that large, especially when you consider what is in most public water supplies, and soil...
yeah for sure. well these are not all used at the same time, they are used at different weeks and such.. theres a whole chart... thing...

but. I just read this on fox farms website.

We were thrilled to open up the Sunset Western Garden Book and see that our Big Bloom fertilizer was featured in their section on organic fertilizers. While the Big Bloom name implies that it's a great fertilizer for flowering plants --- and it is -- we found so many more uses for it in our gardens and greenhouses over the years.



As an organic, low NPK fertilizer, it won't burn plants or overload the soil with unnecessary nutrients. For this reason, we use it on young seedlings after two or three sets of leaves have emerged, and we also use it as a drench on stressed plants that have been impacted by adverse weather, pests or disease, or other problems. We have also found that it is indispensable during transplanting -- adding a little Big Bloom to that first watering after new plants go on the ground can really help get them off to a great start.



And remember, Big Bloom is about so much more than NPK. It’s a live culture of vitamins, amino acids, natural growth hormones, enzymes, and beneficial organic microbes. We add earthworm castings, bat guano and other delicious organic ingredients like Norwegian kelp for nutrient uptake and higher yields, plus rock phosphate, which helps transfer energy from one part of the plant to another, delivering bigger buds and more fragrant flowers.



Use Big Bloom on every plant you own, every time you water. It is actually the only fertilizer that can be used over its recommended dosage. In fact, we say the more the merrier. Your plants will love you for it! Give it a try this spring and watch your garden thrive.

does anyone have expereice using big bloom with AN stuff?
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
thanks for all the responses! this time around i will be using advanced and following their chart and i will be using the following

grow micro bloom 3-part.
voodoo juice
big bud
b-52
bud candy
piranha
tarantula

i still have the fox farm nutes kickin around, would using BIG BLOOM and/or TIGER BLOOM durring FLOWERING be a mistake?
and does overdrive make a big difference?

thx :P
You got some good advice in this thread but for some reason you went the opposite direction :roll:. More bottles often times equates to more complicated feeding schedules, nutrient burn and smaller yields. It looks like this lesson will be costly but if you're lucky, you'll eventually learn. Good luck.
 

gobbly

Well-Known Member
does anyone have expereice using big bloom with AN stuff?
not I, but big bloom isn't really an NPK. The ratios are ridiculously small, and are more a side effect of the other ingredients than the purpose of the nute. It's an enzyme, microbe, and trace element supplement. It can be an improvement, but as I keep trying to stress, you don't want to use it if those are things you are getting from the boatload of other stuff you are planning to dump into your substrate.

You really are kinda just disregarding the advice you are getting. The best thing you could do is to get your basic three part nutes (veg, flower, supplement - meaning micro nutes absent from water/soil), and picking one 'bud booster' which are usually based on carb loading and microbes. Get a crop down, journal it in some way so you know everything that happened along with precise dates. If you feel you can do better, and have exhausted the other environmental components to bud/plant growth, take an educated guess at what your nute bottleneck is and address that particular thing, then get feedback from the plants and adjust if needed. Far too many people start this out buying the hype that they need these boatloads of chemicals to grow good buds. Though there is some science behind it, those people are in the business of selling bottles, not giving your plant the perfect balance it needs to thrive :)

Read any good book on growing (try something by mel frank or ed rosenthal), and read their section on what plants require, it's really not as complicated as most people try to make it :)
 

asdfkry

Active Member
You got some good advice in this thread but for some reason you went the opposite direction :roll:. More bottles often times equates to more complicated feeding schedules, nutrient burn and smaller yields. It looks like this lesson will be costly but if you're lucky, you'll eventually learn. Good luck.
i dont really think ive gone in the opposite direction of everyones advice, maybe i went in the opposite direction of your advice :O

but.. i am really trying to avoid the FLUFF i just harvested =/

i mean if Big Bloom is only guano castings and kelp... will it fuck with my npk?
FFs website says that big bloom will NOT burn any plant....

im not trying to ignore anyones advice, plz dont take it that way :P

thx ;)
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
i am really trying to avoid the FLUFF i just harvested =/
'Fluff' could be the result of over or under watering, over or under feeding, your genetics, and/or your lighting. The 3 part you're working with now is a copy of GH's 3 part which is something I've been using for years. That 3 part formula does not grow 'fluff'. Maybe if you post your feeding schedule, we'll be able to help you dial in something that works a little better instead of recommending more products.
 
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