Plz help before i kick my growroom to bits...(heads gone)

[scunkworm]

Hey guys' im in real need of help and at the same time cant get over what im about to ask but im at the most my head can take! I.ve spent weeks and maybe months on reading about nutes and everthing that go's with it, but when it comes to looking at something or someone else's problem then no probs but when it comes to my self i do this and still fuck it up. I was using john innes no.2 soil which i found abit hot, so i poped along to the hydro shop and talked to the guy there about it and he gave me some soil called vitamix-pro' ive looked it up on the net and its a reall good holland soil thats been used for years and got some made stuff init but like i said its been used years, anyways he said to put 10% worm castings in with the soil and your good to go, ive been using it without worm castings as he also said there was hardly any nute in the soil, I planted two fem lemon skunk seeds and put them into the soil once the opened and just watered with ph'd water. i did the same on my last grow and again no end of nute burn and problems, about 8 days into the seedlings growing there was signs of something coming on the leaves tips' i took a reading of the soil ruuoff for ec and ph' the ec was 1.0 which is high for seedlings if im right, so i flushed with loads of water' i put small bits of bio bizz bio-grow/bloom/top max/ coz when using them you got to use all 3, got an ec reading of 0.4 and flushed like i siad, and now today theres loads of nute burn evrywhere on the frist two sets of leaves and the ph' has gone from 6.6 to 8+, i just dont get it, so i flused again tonight with jsut ph'd water and got one pot down to 6.7 and the other to 6.8, could someone plz give me a feeding chart or something i can follow from start to finsh, ive got two failed grows under my belt, first one grow really big and then just went to bits 2weeks into flowering and my last one well just got to flowering, ive spent loads of mony and a year and half and i havn't even had one harvset so you can understand why im very pissed lol, i got to laugh or ill fucking cry, (no lie) plz guys scunk

 

[303]

I have the solution for you. Don't feed your seedlings or small clones. Yep, just water. Until they "pop" meaning growing aggresively don't put any nutrients in the mix. Really until week 3 when they generally "pop" I'll start to feed, at a 1/4 strength, or whatever makes the ppm less than 400. Fresh soil will have enough nutrients for months to feed your plants plenty. Unless you run hydro vegging nutes are only for the strong with a large root system. Just use water when pots are light, until they are 18 or so inches tall with plenty of shoots. Soil growers need not feed like hydro growers, fuck all those charts, they're certainly not ideal for cannabis, most all too hot, I don't go over 800 ppm week 4 of bloom for some strains. Although a tired old man with a shitty attitude read some of uncle bens threads, he's got nutrients and NPK values explained well.

 

[scunkworm]

Thanks my friend, thats the mad bit i didnt give my last grow any nute for 6 and half weeks and i know if the pot is big enough you wont need to feed' found that out on my frist grow the hard way, ill have alook at uncle bens thread' ive got a dwc grow running along said this soil grow, anyways thanks dude scunk

 

[TWS]

With that said. Just don't feed to feed. Feed when needed. Less is better. That means less feedings and half of what the directions say to use. Different strains react different to nutes. some can't have as much as other strains and some will just gobble it down and seems impossible to burn. Untill you know that strain, start slow and listen to when the plant requires it then you can tweek the nutes to run on the
at the ragged edge.

 

[tibberous]

With that said. Just don't feed to feed. Feed when needed. Less is better. That means less feedings and half of what the directions say to use.

Not necessarily - a lot depends on the size of the plants, but not feeding or under feeding will kill your plants the same as over feeding. I've seen a ton of threads where a plant will have an obvious deficiency or screwed up PH, and the grower will mistake it for nute burn.

That said, you can go a couple weeks without feeding clones and seedlings. For cuttings, I like to use three part Spray and Grow with Dyna Gro protekt and Super Thrive - it's cool because you just spray it on the plant, which means the plant doesn't need roots to absorb it. Before I used it, my cuttings would look all sick and yellowy, now they are green as shit.

 

[TWS]

I think in general thats what I tried to say. Hopefully one catches the diff between a PH lockout or nute burn. If you don't over feed your plants it generally is a PH thing.
Funny you say that though. I just had a bad PH lockout and has been a bitch to overcome and costly for sure. Threw off the cal-mag and I can't get enough water-cal mag to them due to the buckets staying wet for 4-5days. I wanted to foliar feed but I don't know what with. 4 of the same strain and 1 different that is fine. I've lost alot of upper leaf. Talk about wanting to kick in the grow room LOL! I just take it as a learning curve. I never PH'd anything. Thought it was a Hoax or a hydro thing. I knew I wasn't over feeding them and the upper fan leafs got theses little rust spots that progressed kinda slowly. Tried to give them epsom salt but it still progressed. As the rust spots got more and more the upper leafs started to dry out and die still green. I couldn't figure it out but it was serious.So we flushed them with tap water. It still was progressing after that.So I got to thinking and grabbed the pool test kit and PH'd the tap water. It came out dark pink in the pool test kit wich is above 7.0. I went and got a meter and the test the tap water, it was 8.0. we are only 5 weeks in and it's the Sativa hybrids, if they don't get better before the one Indica is ready They're going in the bubble bags! Still have the outdoor grow to count on. The next cab will be PH'd from day 1 and mostly Indica strains. The plants outside still get tap water.


We just use root drench and rooting hormone. The root drench we just started useing and it has increased a better and quicker take on the clones. No yellowing

My fastest and one of our best looking clones right now is from a broken branch from outside that was smashed in the dirt and muddy when I found it(I broke it with the hose) I stuck it in the dog's water bowl til I was done watering and 45'd a cut (no rooting hormones) and stuck it in a beer cup with used potting soil and left it in the shade outside and it took in week.

 

[tibberous]

I wanted to foliar feed but I don't know what with.

Like I said, I'm pretty happy with the three part spray and grow - it's cheap and never hurts the leaves.

 

[scunkworm]

Thanks guys' i really dont understand it (well i do) there must be too much ferts already in the soil, i know that you dont feed anything in soil untill its 4-6wks old or it has 3-4 sets of true leaves, and everytime i feed with 1/4 0.4ec it also seems to burn and i know now that some can take more than others thanks to you guys.
What would be a good startting point if 0.4 seems to burn? ive put some pics up, 1, pic is of my seedling on this grow after i got the ph back down in the 6+ and flushed with 0.4 bio bizz which i read is harder to burn plants than hydro nutes' 2, pic is one of my seedlings on my last grow without it having nutes, 3pic is also my last grow without nutes added, 4,pic is this grow bebefore the flush, 5,pic is of my last grow. i killed all the seedlings you see in the pics of my last grow. I shouldn't have but my head just went lol

 

[scunkworm]

anyone know if these are nute burn leaves of def?

 

[Kingrow1]

I see some mag problems ther, twisting leaves and interveinal chlorosis, have you considered a cla/mag def or just a mag def? Just an idea but leaf twisting on young plants feels mag problematic to me.

As your about to kick your grow room in i hesitate to post anything as so not want to futher compound problems, ph and ferts should be easy and not really problems that stop you from harvesting a good crop, cal/mag now theres somthing that stumps a lot of growers. Peace

 

[mansoorjane36]

ok, so a feeding schedule is not set in stone then, and each plant uptakes differently than others.
you might have to start off with 1/2 or 1/4 strength in order to wean the plants into fertz
that's great info, thank u guys. i have a question though, with those who use hydro, how often do you water? not tryin to jack a thread, just a simple question

 

[Kingrow1]

Basically what im trying to say is there is a variable thats not right in your grow and affecting adding ferts and other things etc etc. Sometimes if one thing is wrong it can have a knock on effect, probably not ferts or pH, look elsewhere. Peace

 

[scunkworm]

Hey guys thanks for all the good info' i transplanted them and everything is normal now, i went back to the soil i used on my frist grow and so far its ok now' i know what your saying there kingrow and im hoping to get some cal-mag soon as £40 is alot for 5ltrs and they dont sell any smaller, boron is another that makes leaves twist and got some same signs as cal def/cal-mag, ill throw so pics up soon as my camera i found as ive seemed to miss layed it somewhere,

 

[scunkworm]

the leanes that are twisted in the pics that plant and and one other in the pics i killed and just kept the two i transplanted,

 

[Kingrow1]

Maybe a slight mag deficiency causing the leaf twist but i dont know.

basically if you put in new soil and they now show good growth for a while that really tells you somthing, could mean you added too much ferts to soil and when they got new fresh soil they could grow out roots into non toxic soil, or maybe somthing else but if the soils not the problem think hard and try to see what is. Got to take somthing positive out of this, dont wana be kicking that grow room to peices in another few weeks time.

Whilst they are going good now would be a good time to look over and discuss all your variables like fert levels etc etc. Lets try not to let this happen again dude. I have duffed in a few grow rooms and roughed up plants for not growing properly, still gets frustrating now. Peace

 

[scunkworm]

Hey kingrow, hows things my friend' yeah its a mad one as the new soil i had was ment to have hardly any nutes what so ever and you seen the pics before these if just put up which look good, but like you said i need to learn from it instead of thinking yes sorted. I grow a really big plant frist grow when i hadn't a clue what was what, i found a seed in some stuff i had to smoke and my mind got the better of me' didnt ph the water, just sit it sit over night and gave to the plant. But yeah same water, same nutes, soil,
but different soil, im using the same soil now as my frist grow and agian they have growen, my frist grow i kept adding nutes when it was growing well like thses are now, so if i dont give them any nutes im hoping that will be enough because they will have another transplant to go yet with the final pot i use so they will get more nutes from that so no nutes lol, but the soil i was using was really good holland soil plus i never gave them any nutes apart from the 1/4 to replace the nutes that was flushed out so i wouldn't get a def' plus never needed cal-mag on my frist grow with this soil but never ph'd my frist soil and still grew well, its a mad old thing yeah. still gone get that cal-mag soon just incase its needed as like you said its always good to have some laying around for that time its needed yeah.

 

[scunkworm]

is silicon good for soil?

 

[Kingrow1]

They look like they may have just been overferted from some of the leaves. I think you said you were gona go with plain water for now so sounds like a good choice, maybe aim for a third runoff to keep soil nice and should be good. I just overferted a few plants, really sucks, they look great so you give them more ferts and then problems out of nowhere.

I got too cocky with the ferts and had to flush a lot of plants, should look good in 2-3 days. I learnt to fertilize a lot less now. Plants look good at the mo anyway, lucky you didn't smash the grow room up. I got a couple of leaves that look similar to yours so i take it salt build up from overferting.

Do you think it might make sense here? Peace

 

[scunkworm]

Yeah the frist plant i grew was really nice but i didnt have that much of a clue what i was doing (saying that not much has changed lol) like you said i kept giving nutes because it was looking good and i just ended up killing it, if i had knowen what i know now then i could have saved it but there you go' just gonna water untill the plant tells me otherwise,
where you said aim for a third runoff how should be the best way to do that? My dwc grow has taken a turn for the worse' i red something somewhere and the guy said that he put 1ltr of water into a jug and the add nutes untill he got an ec reading of 0.4 and then put it into the res, well thats what i was doing untill someone said that its the res that needs to be 0.4 or whatever, the other night i got the res up to 0.4 which is not much considering how much its growen, but i didnt want to burn any leaves as coz ive been under feeding it startted to get like nute burn but it was from the plant starving, and now theres drooping everywhere and some leaves are startting to shrivled so im gessing that coz of the underfeeding theres now a def startting?

 

[scunkworm]

Forgot what i was goona say then, it must have been the soil that was too hot as i never feed them at all, i flushed at the frist sign of anything happening to the leaves' i flushed with boi bizz bio grow and only at 1/4 0.4ec so i couldnt understand how they got burned apart from the soil which is a good holland soil.