Educate Me On Blowing.

researchkitty

Well-Known Member
Awesome! i think i'm gonna go with the phantom 4 stud then. Since its running 2 gas 2 oxygen do i just pick and choose which was i want to run correct?
I have been looking at a couple oxygen generator online as well any specific one you would suggest. If they are need of course. I was gonna get a foot pedal :-D Good to know it make it that much easier one less thing i would have to worry about. Can just concentrate on the technique.

If your ever interested in selling any tools or accessories let me know. Rather put the cash in a fellow glass blowers pocket. Then some website.
For tools go to theblastshield.com. Just buy theirs. They might be 10% more than other tools but they will LAST you forever. I've broken most of my non-blast shield tools by now. :)

Phantom 4 stud. What does this mean? There's 2 stud and there's 4 stud. The "studs" refer to the torch being built like legos. There is an "Inner" torch, and an "Outer" torch, all in one! The first set of knobs on the front of the torch are for the center/inner fire. The second set of knobs is for the outer torch.

[youtube]DRkl2qi4jkY[/youtube]

The video above I put on Youtube myself. :) Its a copy of the GTT Phantom/Mirage/Lynx/Kobuki/etc instructional DVD that you get with a torch. It shows you how to use the knobs, how to use it safely, and how to use it dangerously. Be sure you watch it. Just remember, no long yellow candles and always inner fire on if you have the outer fire on. As from the factory, you will have to mess with knobs to turn on both the inner fire and outer fire. The foot pedal is just a simple gas on/off switch that way you leave the outer fire on all the time, and it only uses gas when you press the pedal on. You still have to adjust knobs for flame characteristics and thrust per say, but its really easy to figure out in a matter of minutes.

i welded before i blew glass. a lot of it carries over.

kitty built a really nice oxygen concentrator. maybe we can get him to pop in. :cool:
Aaaah yes, the oxy concentrator days. My thread ( https://www.rollitup.org/galleries/320294-trying-my-hand-glass-pipe.html ) in my signature will show you ever torch, concentrator, and oxygen setup I've ever had. At first, I started with a Nortel Red Max. It's a piece of elephant shit. Dont buy one. I also bought (3) of the M-15 Oxygen concentrators to power it. They powered it about 60% of the torches capacity. It was not worth investing in, unless you want to just make beads and are a fat old lady. Then I upgraded to the GTT Mirage (the big brother of the Phantom). The Mirage has twice the ports (or so) as the Phantom on the outer fire, while sharing the same inner fire. You wont need the Mirage unless you want to do some vac stack pulls or work very large tubing, say 50mm in diameter or larger. Anyhow, the Mirage wont work on an Oxygen concentrator, the concentrators may match the PSI requirement of the torch, but it wont have enough oxygen in litres-per-minute of flow to satisfy the torch. It would be like using a motorcycle engine to power a tractor trailer because you are cheap to buy enough gasoline.

So now, I use the MIrage on tanked oxygen. Except, I make my own oxygen still. What I do is use an Invacare Homefill, an Invacare Platinum Oxygen Concentrator, and plug them into my tanks. It takes about one full day to fill one tank completely full. Perfect for the amount I use. A tank lasts me about 6 hours of fucking around. Instead of paying $21 to fill my oxygen tanks, I pay the electricity company $1.90 to run the units. There are pictures and more info on them in my glass thread, but that's the general overview.

To summarize, if your getting a Phantom, expect to run on Liquid Oxygen, tanked oxygen, or homefill to tank oxygen. And it requires Propane, which is easy as you just use a BBQ tank for it and Propane lasts about 2 weeks for me! Very inexpensive for propane.

Whats your opinion on something like this?

http://www.littonengr.com/Oxygen_Generators_1.cfm
Other than them being triple the price than if you buy direct from them, they are good solid units, if you want to make beads and cute stuff. Dont be fooled by the pictures showing monster size flames with the torch. Just because the flame is big doesnt mean it has the flow to get it as hot as the size flame they show should actually be. Beads or chillums/easy spoons at best is all I would recommend them for.

Plus, if you get a Homefill ($400-$800) and the Platinum XL concentrator ($300-$400), your tanks can spit out oxygen as fast as you want! And, if you bought 3 oxygen concentrators instead to power the torch, you could have bought the homefill setup instead for the same money.

Because of the Homefill, I would never recommend an oxygen concentrator to anyone other than bead ladys.






Remember too, I'll help you at no charge as long as it takes to answer your questions and show you what I know. I'm not the best, I'm very very far from it, but learning is caring and caring is sharing! :)
 

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
i want a homefill set up. i need more info. i'm being lazy. kitty needs to start a thread to hold my hand, please. :)

or i'll talk to kim, have you dealt with her yet? i got my torch from her and she's cool in my book. :cool:

or i'll look into more research after i play xBox.
 

researchkitty

Well-Known Member
The homefills are so new that I dont think many people know about them yet. The ability to connect them to tanks has only been around for a few months, previously it required some welding. :) I'll get a thread up soon. Not sure who Kim is, but if she's hot...........................
 

dankshizzle

Glassblowing Moderator
I'm sick of hauling oxygen. Its only 14$ for my tank to get filled cause I get hooked up, but don't like putting it in a 95 grand am backseat.. more Indo please
 

researchkitty

Well-Known Member
The homefill costs $2 to fill a bottle and I dont have to move a tank. You guys arent lazy, just not getting the special kitty treatment. :)
 

suTraGrow

Well-Known Member
Whats the down and up sides of using natural gases instead of propane?
Got a natural gas line i can run under concrete into my workshop for a direct hook up.
Good, bad idea?
 

researchkitty

Well-Known Member
but it costs how much to set up? ;)
It costs less in the amortized unit cost, less than the amount of gas you pay to drive to the oxy store. :)

<-- THE SAVER!


Whats the down and up sides of using natural gases instead of propane?
Got a natural gas line i can run under concrete into my workshop for a direct hook up.
Good, bad idea?
Biggest two downsides for natural gas are that 1.) resale of those torches are hard, because propane is only $20 for a bbq sized tank refill that lasts weeks to begin with, and you cant retrofit torches to other gas types once they are made. 2.) natural gas burns differently than propane, so when working in a oxygen rich environment and striking colors, you'll have a difficult time.

Since the BBQ tanks are portable for propane, and so small, and so easy to fill anywhere, it's the far better route to go versus some piped in line for a hobby you havent even tried yet......
 

suTraGrow

Well-Known Member
Biggest two downsides for natural gas are that 1.) resale of those torches are hard, because propane is only $20 for a bbq sized tank refill that lasts weeks to begin with, and you cant retrofit torches to other gas types once they are made. 2.) natural gas burns differently than propane, so when working in a oxygen rich environment and striking colors, you'll have a difficult time.

Since the BBQ tanks are portable for propane, and so small, and so easy to fill anywhere, it's the far better route to go versus some piped in line for a hobby you havent even tried yet......

So i need a different kind of torch if i ran natural gases? The GTT wouldn't work?
I do have a 300 gallon propane tank. I also do have access to a portable fill up so they come to me to fill it up ;)
Or extremely easy access to a natural gas line. The line is only 1" in diameter and since i build the workshop from the ground up the concrete floor still has to be poured in so it really would be no hassle.
All i have to do is screw in the line from one point and drag it about 10'. Maybe 10min of work.
 

RawBudzski

Well-Known Member
I am going to spend 3k on my 1st blowing supplies @ the end of the year as a b-day gift to me.. I will then get whatever I need after that.. then you shall see me on stickam with fdd & kitty !!! <3

My first project is going to be a melted deformed glass rod.. . I want to stick to the simple solid stuff.. .like making glass dildos. :D
 

suTraGrow

Well-Known Member
I am going to spend 3k on my 1st blowing supplies @ the end of the year as a b-day gift to me.. I will then get whatever I need after that.. then you shall see me on stickam with fdd & kitty !!! <3

My first project is going to be a melted deformed glass rod.. . I want to stick to the simple solid stuff.. .like making glass dildos. :D
Only reason I'm taking it up ;)
 

researchkitty

Well-Known Member
So i need a different kind of torch if i ran natural gases? The GTT wouldn't work?
I do have a 300 gallon propane tank. I also do have access to a portable fill up so they come to me to fill it up ;)
Or extremely easy access to a natural gas line. The line is only 1" in diameter and since i build the workshop from the ground up the concrete floor still has to be poured in so it really would be no hassle.
All i have to do is screw in the line from one point and drag it about 10'. Maybe 10min of work.
You would have to special order the torch for use with natural gas, and then your color work will suck compared to mine. Why would you do it to do it worse? Dont do it unless you use Propane. :) Once a torch is set to run on one type of gas, you'd have to change out the entire manifold and many other parts to convert it, which would cost about the same as buying the torch new. Its not like an oven that can use either or depending on how you install the gas hookup kit, unfortunately.....
 

suTraGrow

Well-Known Member
You would have to special order the torch for use with natural gas, and then your color work will suck compared to mine. Why would you do it to do it worse? Dont do it unless you use Propane. :) Once a torch is set to run on one type of gas, you'd have to change out the entire manifold and many other parts to convert it, which would cost about the same as buying the torch new. Its not like an oven that can use either or depending on how you install the gas hookup kit, unfortunately.....
Awesome. That's excatly what i was looking for :)
Propane it is. Gonna pour the floor today let it set and start building the propane tank housing was thinking of something along these lines..
Propane Tank Cover.jpeg
 

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
So i need a different kind of torch if i ran natural gases? The GTT wouldn't work?
I do have a 300 gallon propane tank. I also do have access to a portable fill up so they come to me to fill it up ;)
Or extremely easy access to a natural gas line. The line is only 1" in diameter and since i build the workshop from the ground up the concrete floor still has to be poured in so it really would be no hassle.
All i have to do is screw in the line from one point and drag it about 10'. Maybe 10min of work.
i always thought one could use natural gas instead of propane. i know i've heard of people who do. i think the problem might be that there's not enough pressure in your typical house lines. i don't think the torch needs to be changed in any way. i could be wrong.
 
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