High Soil PH and leaves deficiencies

[charlieplaza]

Plants: 1 x Cream Caramel (auto-flowering) & 1 x Pineapple Express (auto-flowering)
Life span: 44 days since sprout, 4 weeks into flowering: Hopefully will live until 62-63 days.
Temperature: 23º-29º C (73-84ºF)
Average humidity: Veg 55% - Flowering 35%
Watering: every 2 days
Lamps: 250w CFL (dual spectrum) + 2 neon tubes 55w (dual spectrum).
Total light: 360w dual spectre (180w 2700ºK + 180w 6400ºK)
Soil: Canna Terra Professional Plus+ (with Perlite mixed in)
Nutes: GHE Biothrive Grow + Bloom
Feeding: 1 time every week, 2ml per liter of water.

Hey guys, my plants are looking pretty bad with yellow and brown leaves from bottom to the top. One of them also has some brown colors in the border of new growth and brown spots in older leaves.

I guess it's a deficiency of some sort... I read it could be a lockout because of high soil PH, since the runoff is always at 7 (or higher) when watering at PH 6.5.
I tried to lower the soil PH with water at 5.9 (using PH Down) but PH won't go lower than 7 anyway.

This morning I flushed the plants using PH'd water to 6.0 and the initial runoff came out at 6.2 (so I assument the soil PH was good around 6.4) but several hours later I checked the late runoff and again it was over 7 (so the soil PH must be well over 7). I also flushed 3 weeks ago because fan leaves started showing yellow spots and the flush solved the problem, so I'm hoping it will help this time but I have the feeling that flushing every 2 weeks is not ideal.

Is the deficiency caused by salt build up locking out nutrients? Am I not giving them enough food? What would you recommend? I really hope my plants will reach 62-63 days before harvest but it looks like they won't make it to 50 days

On a side note, as a bonus, I must say that half of the pistils are orange already, and the trichomes are ALL milky/cloudy. It's like if the plants were ready to be harvested but they are only 44 days old from sprout! Isn't it way too early even for autos?



Hope you guys can help, as it's my first grow and even tho I read a lot I don't know how to help them Thanks in advance.

 

[dannyboy602]

Don't do anything drastic like flush or add any extra anything. (I know that sounds pretty vague) water normally.
The leaves will continue yellowing and dropping but you only need two more weeks. Idk what the def is. Looks like N but it's my best guess. But even if it is, N is a mobile element and it's all being sucked out of the fan leaves anyway. I might try spraying some Magic Green on the leaves but not the buds. And it only might help. (you can always use it next time)

 

[jcdws602]

Looks like n def to me.....do you know the ec ppm of what you are feeding them.......they don't look too bad....you can up the grow a little more see if that fixes your prob.....if it was nutrient lock out you would see more deficiencies or toxicities.......I doubt it is a ph issue...

 

[charlieplaza]

Thanks for the quick replies guys.

I already flushed this morning (at ph 6.0) and gave it a feeding right after of 2ml in 1l (each plant). It helped a couple weeks ago so I figured it could help this time :/
I don't know the ec or ppm of what I give them, I only control the ph of the nutrient solution and the runoff. I keep lowering the ph of the solution hoping to correct the runoff.

But here is some information of the bloom nutes I'm using:

BioThrive Bloom
NPK 2 - 3 - 4
Guaranteed analysis :
Nitrate nitrogen 0,02%
Ammoniacal nitrogen 0,65%
Organic nitrogen 1,53%
Total Nitrogen 2,20%
Phosphorus P2O5 3%
Sulphates SO4 6%
Potassium K2O 4%
Magnesium MgO 1,8%
Iron (Fe) 320 ppm
Copper (Cu) 60 ppm
Zinc (Zn) 110 ppm
Boron (Bo) 36 ppm
Manganese (Mn) 100 ppm

@dannyboy, I'll try the magic green on the leaves, I should avoid spraying the buds?

@jcdws602, you think I could try to feed them more? I've been feeding them every third watering (feed-water-water-feed) but the product description does say every second watering (feed-water-feed-water). I keep reading everywhere that n00bs like me tend to overfeed, so I was afraid I might have caused a lockout because of salts building up in the soil by overfeeding.

And talking about salt build ups, I read somewhere that watering everyday is a good way to avoid salts drying up in the soil and creating lockouts. Would that help or can that rot the roots by overwatering?
https://www.rollitup.org/members/jcdws602-106129.html

 

[jcdws602]

Watering often can and will cause over watering symptoms......not saying you can't find the right amount to do it safely...but I wouldn't advise it.....feeding every other watering is fine.........it gives you ample time to see if you have over or under fed prior......you said you flushed....well if the symptoms get worst you know you definitely need to feed more......it is good you are trying to under feed because most new growers tend to over do it with nutrients.......and to me it does look like n def....so wait a couple days and see if your flush just made things worst....if so just up the grow by a little....for example if your at half strength try 3/4 strength......give them another few days it should clear up...

 

[past times]

i think you need to give more nutes. water feed water feed. also, maybe feed a little more. are you sure its not 244 NPK biothrive bloom? If so, the light feeding is 2.6mL/L and 5.2mL/L for the heavy heeding. I would at least do the light feeding, and start adding molasses in between feeds. like 5mL/L. i think your pH might go down with more nutes also.

 

[past times]

Dont spray the buds either. Not a good idea. Don't want to run into mold problems

 

[charlieplaza]

I fed them right after the flush so I guess I can't get too much information about the symptoms getting worse after the flush hehehe

My Biothrive Bloom bottle says 234, and I had no idea what was the correct nute/water proportion so I googled it and found this.

I'll try feeding them every other watering now, which is every 4 days since I water every other day. But I have no idea what are Molases... I've read this a couple times but I never saw them, I think.

 

[jcdws602]

I fed them right after the flush so I guess I can't get too much information about the symptoms getting worse after the flush hehehe

My Biothrive Bloom bottle says 234, and I had no idea what was the correct nute/water proportion so I googled it and found this.

I'll try feeding them every other watering now, which is every 4 days since I water every other day. But I have no idea what are Molases... I've read this a couple times but I never saw them, I think.

Okay...........and do you water when your pots are really light.......every other day seems like a lot unless your environment is really dry or hot....

 

[jcdws602]

This be molasses

 

[max316420]

that is a magnesium def, you have to get some calmag to fix it.. I don't recommend botanicares calmag cause it doesn't work worth a shit. The calmag that works the best is general organics calmag (must be how it chelated). The more you try to fix it the worse it's gonna get. Trust me brotha, you need MAGNESIUM

 

[max316420]

Its not a nitrogen def, its not your soils ph. I had this same exact problem with a stain I have and it took me 2 years to finally figure it out. I tried every possible thing you could to fix it, killed hundreds of plants in the process.. I promiss promiss promiss you that is you get the GO's calmag it WILL stop doing that. Next grow start supplementing right when you flip your lights

 

[jcdws602]

that is a magnesium def, you have to get some calmag to fix it.. I don't recommend botanicares calmag cause it doesn't work worth a shit. The calmag that works the best is general organics calmag (must be how it chelated). The more you try to fix it the worse it's gonna get. Trust me brotha, you need MAGNESIUM

I disagree......first I have use botanicare cal/mag for many years,it works.......2nd it might be slight magnesium def but it is mainly n def......his nutrients have magnesium in them....only use cal mag when using ro water or sever lock out.....plus if it was because of that he would be seeing a cal def as well..

 

[charlieplaza]

Okay...........and do you water when your pots are really light.......every other day seems like a lot unless your environment is really dry or hot....

Yeah, I think I might have put too much perlite, and the bottom of the pot has clay balls. Also the temp with lights is usually 29,5ºC and humidity 35% or less, so every other day the pot starts to feel light again. But I guess I could water every 3 days instead.

This be molasses

And what are molases used for? I really have no idea what that is and how to use it bro, lol

Its not a nitrogen def, its not your soils ph. I had this same exact problem with a stain I have and it took me 2 years to finally figure it out. I tried every possible thing you could to fix it, killed hundreds of plants in the process.. I promiss promiss promiss you that is you get the GO's calmag it WILL stop doing that. Next grow start supplementing right when you flip your lights

I have no idea about leaf problems but when I looked up cannabis pic problems I also thought that all that yellow matched with N deficiency... but the brown/rusty borders looked like a separate issue too. So it could be Mg?? Since I'm already going with General Organics I guess I could pick up a bottle of CaMg+. Is that to be mixed with the nutrient solution everytime?

 

[charlieplaza]

And by the way, what do you guys think about all trichomes milky + orange pistils at day 44? Are they "premature" or something?

 

[jcdws602]

The rust spots are form cal def......what kind of water do you use????molasses feeds beneficial microbes and enhances flavor and aroma.....it also contains calcium and magnesium

 

[max316420]

i disagree......first i have use botanicare cal/mag for many years,it works.......2nd it might be slight magnesium def but it is mainly n def......his nutrients have magnesium in them....only use cal mag when using ro water or sever lock out.....plus if it was because of that he would be seeing a cal def as well..

you are wrong!! infact your wrong to the 5th degree.. To OP, if you try and feed nitrogen it's not gonna do anything but get worse.

 

[jcdws602]

you are wrong!! infact your wrong to the 5th degree.. To OP, if you try and feed nitrogen it's not gonna do anything but get worse.

TO the 5th degree,,,,lol......we'll see I guess...I could be wrong he did show that pic with cal def.....which I couldn't see in those other pics.......

 

[max316420]

Listen I wasn't trying to come off as being ignorant, I'm only stating it because I almost drove myself crazy with my blueberry strain. Started using promix and the exact same thing happened to me.. Time after time after time and NO matter what I did, I couldn't fix it. Tried heavy feeding, light feeding,veg)g feeding, heavy vegg feeding (all in bloom) calmag, epsom salt, seamag, calmag (botanicares) and about 25 different kinds of foods and additives. So right before I was about to put my head thru the wall and off this beautiful beautiful strain that I have had for 5+ years my cousin accidentally bought some calmag by general organics and I said fuck it I'll give it one more shot. Started supplementing with it as soon as I flipped my lights and I'LL BE DAMNED... It hasnt happened even a tiny bit. I don't know why this calmag works so well but could be that its only calmag and not a npk ratio too or maybe what its derived from or even what it's mixed with but all I know is that I haven't had the 2 year problem that I was having ever since. I understand where your coming from thinking that its a N def because that's what it looks like but I promise you that its a calmag issue. Now i'm not saying botanicares doesn't work in hydro but it doesn't work worth a shit in soil and or promix. I was so happy when It started working I wanted to go to general organics place of business and give a big hug to whomever formulated that calmag. good luck brotha and hope you fix your issue

 

[max316420]

I also thought it was my ph, my waters ph so even bought a ro machine. Tried adding dolomite lime too, there is nothing that you could think of that I didn't try. My appologies for comin off sounding like a dick