Messed up soil - any way out of it?

[madmad]

Well I`ve had all sorts of problems on my current grow and another one just popped out - my growing medium which is "universal compost" with a little bit bit of perlite seems to have lost the ability to absorb water
I have no idea how that could actually happen as all was good for over 4 weeks since planting but now it`s exactly how it sounds. My 2.5gal pots will not hold more than 500ml of water and even for that to happen I need to put like 3-4 times more - water just goes through the pots as it if it was filled with pebbles or something, I will get a immediate runoff with just 50-100ml. And the best(or worst) part is that even if I totally drench the soil, scooping about a half inch layer from the top reveals bone dry soil underneath - it`s almost as if some tunnels got created in the soil and the water just goes through them straight to the bottom. What do I do now? My plants don`t seem to like it one bit and look worse day by day. Any ideas?

MaD

 

[Kingrow1]

I would let the water wick to the top from the bottom by watering the saucers they sit in. Soil can resist water but normally because the grower has destroyed its water holding abilities with salts and other such things or it sat dry for too long, sometimes older soil dosent rewet very well after being allowed to dry. Learn to keep the top layer cultivated at all times as well.

All soils should wick water so give it a try, may take a while to start soaking it up. Peace

 

[madmad]

Thx man, I shall try it tomorrow, hope that will work. Thing is I bought the very same compost I used in my previous grow, but as it turned out only the packaging was the same - the old one was beautiful, this one is all fibery as it was 99% composted grass, doesn`t actually look like soil at all - more like chopped hay. I guess I`m paying for my laziness now, should have gone back to the store immediately and get something else :/

 

[Kingrow1]

I just use westlands from homebase or B&Q, they store the small bags indoors normally and do both seedling soil and flowering multi purpose soil. Just add 40% perlite and kick weak nutes of after 2/3 weeks. Peace

 

[madmad]

Yeah I know, I`m using b&q branded peat free multipurpose compost, but even though I bought exactly the same one as last time, seems that only the bag remained the same lol. I`ll try westlands on my next grow. Thx again for your input

 

[Kingrow1]

Yeah I know, I`m using b&q branded peat free multipurpose compost, but even though I bought exactly the same one as last time, seems that only the bag remained the same lol. I`ll try westlands on my next grow. Thx again for your input

Oh yer forgot and didnt see you were in the peat free versions of soil. I tried these a while back and had the same problem as you. The plant just dosent root very well in these soils and they stay too wet and too dry with perlite. Use PEAT, its lovely stuff and cheap and sustainable, black peat and blonde peat are the best and 40percent peat is abouts right for most grows when using soil mixes. Westlands is about 60% peat and some might even be more like 80% peat.

Screw the environmentalists as peat is here to stay till they sort the peat free out. Only peat free i know that really works is either coco or hydro as soils round here arent up to it. Either transplant out or just go with the normal soils that contain peat, that stuffs sh!te unfortunatly, spread rest on garden. Looks more like wood chippings than soil! Peace

 

[madmad]

Will definitely try westlands next time, I just hope my plants can withstand the inconvenience. I flipped the switch 2 days ago so theres still long way to go unfortunately. And I didnt even choose peat free for enviromental reasons, someone has told me that peat based composts are more likely to contain bug larvae and such, which is probably not true but I guess the downside of doing your first grows is that you have to sieve through BS like that and most of the time find out the hard way what to use and what not to use. And strange thing is that I used the same thing previously and it had beautiful texture, held water just right and generally was a really good medium, thats why I went with it this time as well. But I guess thats the problem with "own brand" stuff that they will probably bag and sell anything can get their hands on, hence the inconsistency. Lesson learned I guess.

 

[Kingrow1]

Will definitely try westlands next time, I just hope my plants can withstand the inconvenience. I flipped the switch 2 days ago so theres still long way to go unfortunately. And I didnt even choose peat free for enviromental reasons, someone has told me that peat based composts are more likely to contain bug larvae and such, which is probably not true but I guess the downside of doing your first grows is that you have to sieve through BS like that and most of the time find out the hard way what to use and what not to use. And strange thing is that I used the same thing previously and it had beautiful texture, held water just right and generally was a really good medium, thats why I went with it this time as well. But I guess thats the problem with "own brand" stuff that they will probably bag and sell anything can get their hands on, hence the inconsistency. Lesson learned I guess.

I prefered the organic soils that were peat and coco but man they held water a lot, canna terra was the one i got and man it also came with a million fungus gnats but these guys are easy to deal with so i didnt mind too much.

Each bag of soil is different, i get the odd one that looks a bit too much wood chippings and bark but the peat free is mainly just the normal soil without the peat so can easily be a bit too coarse. If it wasnt for environmental reasons then dont buy it.

As for the bugs in soil i dont know how well the B&Q, homebase and westlands supposrt the soil microbes or microherd but i never had much of a problem, better growth was had from canna terra organics though and all brands need cutting with 40% perlite just to make the right drainage. I found my peat free soil never drained for like two weeks and was mainly wood chippings and bark.

Cheap buggers cause when that ship ran aground here with all that timber a few months later i started getting lots of timber strands and peices in my soil, stuff was floating in seawater for weeks!

Anyway try the seedling soil and any of the multi purpose soils, some like the B&Q and some the westlands. They also got dolomite lime in B&Q and you can futher crush it to a powder and add to the soil for a pretty complete soil mix. Try the canna terra organics as well at some point if you get the chance, 50L bag is quite cheap like £13 quid or somthing plus p&p but beware it needs crumbling up first and cutting with abouts 50% perlite. I been getting bags of perlite and vermiculite quite cheap from either B&Q or Homebase, one dose some small cheap bags and the other dose some at like over £10, what a ripoff!

Seriously i like the homebase and B&Q soils especially there seedling soils but find the westlands a bit better quality wise. Either way stay clear of the peat free or as well the feeds for four months stuff, thats basically miracle grow in westlands bags or similar. Just their multi purpose stuff is what i get in 10l bags i think, just the same as any normal soil i would say. Peace

 

[madmad]

Seedling soil - you mean growing just in that seedling soil? I actually have a bag of westlands seedling soil with john innes(whatever that is) it`s very fine and sandy, never thought about growing just in that. But actually since you`ve mentioned it it reminded me I have it - so I thought i will put a thin layer of it on top of that shitty compost i have my plants in now thinking that since its so sandy it might drain evenly and subsequently wet that bad soil below a bit more evenly too. It definitely worked to some extent, but i think I`ll try what you suggested with letting the soil wick the water from the tray on my next watering. Having said that, with all the snags that keep coming along I just feel like ripping them plants and starting from scratch, I just dont have the heart to do it ;]] I cant believe that my first grow when I knew sod all went fairly smoothly, second was a total disaster and this one looks like its not far away from being like the second. I`m growing NL/Skunk cross and it doesnt even smell lol, it smells just like any regular plant outside Sigh...

 

[Kingrow1]

This is often the case, my first grow was dank and stank, my second grow was lame and a fail. Keep at it, i can only advise having a constant veg and flowering room, start seeds few weeks apart and move to the flowering room when vegged and start more that way all your hopes arent on one plant.

Dont mess with the soil like that but if you get it wet a layer of fresh soil ontop may help keep the moisture in longer.

Your not alone wanting to rip up your plant and start again, we all go through that stage and for some it is longer than others. Remember the differences between the first grow when you prospered and this when you failed, what was different, what did you overcomplicate or not do etc etc

My reference to seedling soil is that it is pretty low in nutrients, a seedling will do well starting in this then transplanted to stronger soil. Once the seedling has its first true leaves out i see no reason why a very light fertilizer of 400ppm wouldnt do anything but help lots and then you have eased yourself into fertilization but by that time you simply need to do a repot and pick up the ferts again in a week or two.

I hear you so just keep repeating grow after grow and aim to keep it simple. I get best results with westlands and 40% perlite. I use small pots with seedling soil and perlite and bigger re-pots with their multi purpose or any flowering soil. keep it cut with 40% perlite and buy some fine grade lime from B&Q, futher pestle and mortar this till poweder and fine grade equal amounts and add one level teaspoon per litre of soil or ten per ten litre bag of soil and mix in very well.

After this its just getting the ferts right, we take care of pH with the lime, we simply add one grow fert and one flowering fert with somthing like liquid seaweed or similar to take care of the micronutrients. Nothing more is needed and really keeps it simple. I prefer to go non organic with westlands but get ok results organic wise.

Dont give up but get more continuous and more chance to practice every step of the grow. Reason my first grow was so good and the next failed was because the first grow i just added perlite and ferts and nothing else, cal/mag and pH were unknown to me, even today the only things i have changed are some cal/mag for my soft tap water and extra lime in my soil, the rest is the same and i do well.

Still i have a lot to learn and am in the same boat as you dude, not all my problems are solved but i have ideas to try and eliminate, growing continuously with both a veg and flower tent means i can do this quickly and learn at max pace, i have many plants at different stages. Patcience is what growing really teaches you, dont chase the harvest but learn from your mistakes and look to the next grow to improve. Peace

 

[Weedle1]

I would try submerging the whole pot until it is water logged then pull it out and let it drain.

 

[madmad]

Hey man thx a lot, I did actually think about splitting my growroom into two and grow smaller plants perpetually but then decided to only do a bigger grow once a year, might rethink that. Funny that this little experiment of mine with thin layer of that seedling soil(it is very thin, like 0.3 inch at most) definitely worked because today my plants look as good as they have before the problems struck, they started to smell a bit again and the posts are still fairly heavy, so I`m a bit happier now Hopefully the "wicking" trick will yield even better results, I will find out soon. Thx again for all your help and support mate, it`s most appreciated.

 

[madmad]

I would try submerging the whole pot until it is water logged then pull it out and let it drain.

Hey, thx for suggestion but its not really possible for me to try that for various reasons.

 

[Kingrow1]

Hey man thx a lot, I did actually think about splitting my growroom into two and grow smaller plants perpetually but then decided to only do a bigger grow once a year, might rethink that. Funny that this little experiment of mine with thin layer of that seedling soil(it is very thin, like 0.3 inch at most) definitely worked because today my plants look as good as they have before the problems struck, they started to smell a bit again and the posts are still fairly heavy, so I`m a bit happier now Hopefully the "wicking" trick will yield even better results, I will find out soon. Thx again for all your help and support mate, it`s most appreciated.

All soil should wick, some plants are fed by placing them above a fert and water resovoir and wicks inbetween making the water run vertically up the wick to the plant medium, often not soil.

I would not use the wicking method too much, i suggested it for a quick fix not a grow method, in soil bottom feeding is not recomended. Should hopefully find that once you got the soil mass wet again it should not dry to those bad extremes again. Try top watering if you feel confident at the next watering if possible.

There are many reasons a soil might crust over, read up on cultivating the top inch of soil to help keep it nice and breathable as well as stop crusting over. Alkaline soils and too much alkaline things like lime etc etc can cause soil to resist water and crust over but dont read into things too much , simply you might have been letting the soil dry too much, many of our soiless mixes are hard to re-wet, they sell re-wetting solutions and stuff like washing up liquid (must be the right type and some washing up liquids contain unsafe plant ingredients) etc etc dose similar jobs.

You are the best judge but use this situation to work out what went wrong and not let it happen again, simple stuff like poor drainage means the top dries way too quickly whilst the bottom stays water logged, pot feels heavy so you dont want to water but the top soil looks too dry. Hope you have this problem nailed down and dosent happen again. Peace