jstone1633
Well-Known Member
Ha. And I was worried about my cab hitting the upper 80"s and dropping to the 60's
LED temps vs CFL temps
- Thread starter jstone1633
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idontlikefoxnews
New Member
right, so your opinions are based on crappy led ops that dont grow very dense bud but actually grow.
yeah I agree kudos, personally you need a wider spectrum to get some improvement
CFLS do produce some heat, really just measure ingoing amp draw and all that light radiation and electricity consumed will turn into heat whether inside or outside the plant. Everything that has electricity flowing unless its a superconductor will produce heat. The temp is merely the concentration and the actually flow, current draw converted to watts to btus will tell you how much heat you have.
Then if you can do enthalpy calculations u can calc how much airflow you will need to absorb and move that heat. The best way is to isolate those sources from the room with ducted lights.
Anyways i've grown nice stuff with the right led spectrum and wattages. It does take hundreds of leds, and if you dont build them yourself they will be very expensive upfront. They do produce a good amount of heat, but are more efficient than most conventional lights.
however lots of the heat produced by leds is usable radiation for photosynthesis and not so much the infrared spectrum like a toaster (or a MH/HPS) which you cant actually see except maybe a deep deep red, the elements also produce reds, yellows and oranges so the eye will see that when you look inside the toaster/ect.
My next op im looking into doing salt concentrations less than 400-500 throughout the whole grow. Then increasing transpiration until i get nute burn. I will raise temp or drop humidity until the plants cant take it. I have lots of airflow, so probably wont be loading up on too much c02 if at all. I exchange the room like 24 times a day, if not more.
BlazedMonkey
Well-Known Member
None at all. I went with pro grow because at the time they had nice journals and seemed reputable. There might be a better cheaper 90w available but i like my 180 and i assume the 90 is made with the same diodes and power supplies.
Oh and just heads up from what I've heard, higher wattage CFLs are less efficient in terms of watts/heat. Aka if you are concerned with heat its better to have more smaller ones. Unless you can have a fan extracting the heat from a big one but then might as well go HID.
Good luck in your search for an LED sir.
Bad Karma
Well-Known Member
The 90 uses 1W diodes, not 3W diodes like the rest of Pro-Grow line up, still should be a decent light none the less.
jstone1633
Well-Known Member
How does that compare to other manufacturers? Is there another 90W you would recommend?
Daemonn789
Active Member
I own a PG180 and I am really pleased with it. I have a few pics posted of my plants flowering under it right now. It's a pretty serious light for the size and cost. Really bright, switchable spectrums and it runs pretty cool. I think it might run a little warm for your space. You would also need to flower and train the plants almost immediately because they will rocket towards this light.
Can you mount the light on the top of your cab but cut out the top so the three fans on the top can just blow freely into the room? Also it has venting all around the sides of it. Anyway you can work out 1-3 exhaust fans running in the top of the cab? If you can either have lots of venting up top near the light or have the light not fully enclosed in the cab I think your temps would be fine.
That would be a killer micro with that light. Def post it up if you get it goin!
Can you mount the light on the top of your cab but cut out the top so the three fans on the top can just blow freely into the room? Also it has venting all around the sides of it. Anyway you can work out 1-3 exhaust fans running in the top of the cab? If you can either have lots of venting up top near the light or have the light not fully enclosed in the cab I think your temps would be fine.
That would be a killer micro with that light. Def post it up if you get it goin!
jstone1633
Well-Known Member
Everything must be inside and quiet. It is a 4 drawer chest from walmart with the front drawers all attached as a single door. I have a PC fan intake and exhaust. I cant remember the rate of flow of the fans. Entire box is lined with mylar. Im thinking about changing the intake to a new location and making it another exhaust. Then make the entire floor a passive intake by using a light trap I saw somewhere on here. Basically 90° angles stacked up with spacers in between. The light won't bend through the angles but air can flow through them. I thought if I make it out of something strong enough it could be used as a large section of the floor like a grate. The floor of the cab sits about 2" off of the actual floor so air can be drawn from underneath the cab.
BlazedMonkey
Well-Known Member
Very good point bad karma. Yes 1w diodes will not penetrate as far but they are great for efficiency. 1w won't burn the plants as bad either so better for smaller spaces. If you are keeping the low height i would actually go for a 1w vs 3w lol. IMHO
Jogro
Well-Known Member
When plants stretch towards light it generally means they aren't getting enough of it, or not the right spectrum.
Ideally, what you want is plants to remain short and bushy with short internodal length during vegetative growth.
If plants are quickly stretching towards lights, they're creating extra stem, and that's not good because you're growing "lumber" and not bud.
Jogro
Well-Known Member
To answer the question, LEDs are more intrinsically efficient than fluorescents, by probably about 20-30%.
So if you're looking at a certain amount of light output, LEDs should be able to get you there with less power draw, and therefore run cooler. If the LED panel is designed right, LEDs also have a potential advantage of more specifically tailored spectrum, meaning less light is "wasted" in spectra that plants can't readily use. Again, a way of saving energy, and therefore creating less waste heat.
But the fact is, neither LEDs nor fluorescents are all that efficient in converting electricity to light.
BOTH of them will ultimately convert MOST of the electricity they draw into waste heat. If you are running 200-300 actual watts of ANY light in a small cabinet, be it CFL, LED or HID, its going to get hot, period.
Next issue is that LEDs generally don't really draw the energy they're rated at; they're specifically designed to run at less than full wattage in order to run cooler and preserve diode life. For example, the so-called "Blackstar 240" actually only draws 130 watts, and the same is true of most of the LEDs on the market.
So of course the (so-called) 240 watt LED is going to run cooler than 10 23 watt CFL bulbs. . .the LED is only drawing 55% of the energy!
So if you're looking at a certain amount of light output, LEDs should be able to get you there with less power draw, and therefore run cooler. If the LED panel is designed right, LEDs also have a potential advantage of more specifically tailored spectrum, meaning less light is "wasted" in spectra that plants can't readily use. Again, a way of saving energy, and therefore creating less waste heat.
But the fact is, neither LEDs nor fluorescents are all that efficient in converting electricity to light.
BOTH of them will ultimately convert MOST of the electricity they draw into waste heat. If you are running 200-300 actual watts of ANY light in a small cabinet, be it CFL, LED or HID, its going to get hot, period.
Next issue is that LEDs generally don't really draw the energy they're rated at; they're specifically designed to run at less than full wattage in order to run cooler and preserve diode life. For example, the so-called "Blackstar 240" actually only draws 130 watts, and the same is true of most of the LEDs on the market.
So of course the (so-called) 240 watt LED is going to run cooler than 10 23 watt CFL bulbs. . .the LED is only drawing 55% of the energy!
Mellowman2112
Well-Known Member
What strain is that? It looks delicious!!
psychedelic son
Well-Known Member
Its a little big but think about future expansion where it will shine plus it has a veg bloom switch so you could run it at half strength which would cut heat output/wattage in half I think. I just got my first led and switched out 4 26w cfls for it and temps dropped by 10F plants are growing good to. If you redesign your cab so that it has openings on the top where the exaust fans are on the light you would effectively vent almost all the heat out.
PrezDickie
Well-Known Member
led tech and prices are changing all the time, new models, different spectrums, better deals. if you've already got the cfl's test the temp in your set up and wait to get the led. because depending on when your ready to upsize to a closet or whatever there might be a whole new generation of led's on the market.
oh and a personal note i grow with a 180W Blackstar high output led in a cabinet i built. but it was too cold with just the led so i added some cfl's to boost my temps
super happy with my light thou i'm sure its really more of a 90w if you tested the draw but for $200 or so its growing my girls just fine and it runs very silent if your concerned about noise
i was concerned about noise too so i lined my cabinet with insulating foam board with mylar backing. helps with sound and provides reflective surface two for one
cheap stuff too at most lowe's or home depots
oh and a personal note i grow with a 180W Blackstar high output led in a cabinet i built. but it was too cold with just the led so i added some cfl's to boost my temps
super happy with my light thou i'm sure its really more of a 90w if you tested the draw but for $200 or so its growing my girls just fine and it runs very silent if your concerned about noise
i was concerned about noise too so i lined my cabinet with insulating foam board with mylar backing. helps with sound and provides reflective surface two for one
cheap stuff too at most lowe's or home depots
superbub52
Well-Known Member
My cab is also small 36 by 17 by 17 ran like 6 26w CFls and temps were mid to high 90 even 105 with PC fans had to buy a ball bearing fan from radio shack and temps were still around the same just swapped out for a progro 180 running only the top fan by itself and temps are mid 70's a low 80's the leds are definitely cooler
jstone1633
Well-Known Member
Thats great to hear. Could you elaborate on your setup? I was afraid the 180 would be too much for me. If it won't fry my plants that would be the way to go. I just relocated my intake to another exhaust so now i think I should be good.
superbub52
Well-Known Member
My box is a desk I sealed up the front on and our a door on the back I ran chops in there and the most u got was an ounce from one plant the led panel fits just right in the box I plan to run 5 plants in there and veg for like 2 Weeks and lst them to keep space usable the panel gives if more heat in veg that flower so right now my temps are at low 80's high 70's I have space on the sides to put in cfls when I'm flowing if I need to I have a thread running now with pics called led and coco grow
chazbolin
Well-Known Member
Watts convert into BTU no matter what the source. Like when I sized my room for 12kwatts of HPS (40,920 BTU/hr on a 4 ton AC) compared to 6000watts of LED I still had to factor the heat generated by the consumed watts. This is going to fuck up the HVAC LED equation when I size the AC for the Blackstar 240; 25 x 240 = 6,000 total watts (23,460 BTU/hr on a 3 ton AC) and it's actually only consuming 25 x 130= 3,250 total watts (11,082 BTU/hr where I could get by or a 1 ton AC).
If I do run 25 of these Blackstar 240's then I should be able to run a 1 ton AC which I wire to a 2 pole 20 amp circuit as opposed to the 3 ton AC which I wire to a 2 pole 50 amp circuit. Always assuming equal or near equal production between HID or LED grows why should I have to upsize the AC and pay more for the AC equipment and commensurate utility power when it's not necessary?
If I do run 25 of these Blackstar 240's then I should be able to run a 1 ton AC which I wire to a 2 pole 20 amp circuit as opposed to the 3 ton AC which I wire to a 2 pole 50 amp circuit. Always assuming equal or near equal production between HID or LED grows why should I have to upsize the AC and pay more for the AC equipment and commensurate utility power when it's not necessary?