20,000 Watt Medical Grow Op Construction

collective gardener

Well-Known Member
Looking killer wish I was there LOL. I was searching around for seeds and I found the first strain of northern lights, I dont know if it is or not but that is what the claim was. I also found a strain called ice it has trichs on it that it looks like mold becuase its so covered with crystals. It maybe a good strain to make hash with.View attachment 1956068 there is a pic of it man that looks like kief heaven
Let us know how that NL turns out. A dispensary gave me some Atomic Northern Lights for Christmas. I had mentioned that NL is my old fav. Anyways, it wasn't that good. I have a feeling it wasn't real Dr Atomic NL. Kitty said his shit was pretty good and she knows her weed. Just another grower putting a cool name on some bag seed.
 

stonestare

Active Member
Well my plans have changed and I will get a 5X5 tent so I can put 16 5 gallon buckets in it and have a 1 foot wide path around the buckets. I am going to do auto's and going to get the original blueberry its blue bud,carmelicious,ice,and lsd.That will give me 2 full runs to get used to the blocks.Now if feb will get here I can start to grow. I will try that nothern lights when I get through the auto's
 

collective gardener

Well-Known Member
Well my plans have changed and I will get a 5X5 tent so I can put 16 5 gallon buckets in it and have a 1 foot wide path around the buckets. I am going to do auto's and going to get the original blueberry its blue bud,carmelicious,ice,and lsd.That will give me 2 full runs to get used to the blocks.Now if feb will get here I can start to grow. I will try that nothern lights when I get through the auto's

If you look at our "middle area" in the bloom room you will see that wee use 5 gal buckets for drainage where we have no drainage tray. The 6" Hugo Block is placed on top of some loose rockwool and perlite in a 2 gallon container. Another 2 gallon container, upsidedown, is placed inside a 5 gallon bucket to support the plant well above the drainage water. We have a suction pump connected to a 3/4" hose to suck the waste water from the buckets.

With 16 plants under 1 light you probably won't need the loose fill under the Hugo Block. In fact, I would steer away from that settup on smaller plants. The Hugo Blocks should be plenty big enough for that sized plant. One of the problems with rockwool is that it hold so much water. It is important to size the medium correctly. Of course, until you grow some plants, you have no idea how much medium you'll need. I do not water the blocks until they are very lightweight. The rockwool MUST cycle through from very wet and heavy to quite light. Properly sized and perlited medium will go through this cycle in 24 hrs. I like always water every 24 hrs and adjust the amount of rockwool to facilitate that watering schedule. The beauty of rockwool is it provides optimum moisture anywhere between 10% wet all the way to around 80% wet. However, between 80% and 100% is a little too wet. Often I will shake the water out of freshly watered blocks when dealing with smaller plants to get them under 80% saturated faster. Larger plants use the excess water so fast that this isn't needed. Plants will not wilt in rockwool until there is no water left at all in the block. At that point it is so lightweight you could pick up the whole plant and block with a leaf blade without breaking it. Of the hundreds of plants we've grown in this collective, I have only seen 2 plants wilt in rockwool. Both were mothers WAY too big for the block they were in.
 

collective gardener

Well-Known Member
There's alot of bad info out there on drying and curing weed. In fact, no other aspect of growing is so contested. Which is odd because it's really not all that hard. I know we've touched on how we dry, but I don't know if we ever layed out the whole system. If I run out of time I may do this in stages:


What is drying? What is curing?:

You'll get a bunch of answers to this. I can only layout my understanding. I define dry as evenly dry throughout the entire bud. That's it.

Curing is what happen when that evenly dried bud is properly stored for a length of time. I have found very little difference between a properly dried bud 1 week old, and the same bud 3 weeks old. However, buds stored for a couple months takes on some new properties. I find it smoother to smoke. The color also gets a little browner/yellower. That's it.

Very few commercial indoor growers perform a true "cure". To do so would entail way too much product on hand. Furthermore, few collectives can afford to have the cash flow behind 2 months. It's bad enough that it takes several months to grow the shit. 3 more months of curing would just asdd insult to injury. Properly dried buds are WAY good enough for 99% of the smokers out there. We'll focus on the drying aspect.

The Drying Shack:
We have a dring shack. It's a 3x7 Rubbermaid tool shed. Inside we have a dehumidifier and a filtered exhaust. There is no temp control. I adjust the RH depending on temp. At 80f I like 50% RH, at 70F I like 40%, and at 60F I like 30%. It is very important to dry in a semi controlled environment. If you can't build a dedicated shed, dry in the grow room. The atmosphere is perfect. A tent or large cardboard box inside the grow room will do fine. It's just to keep the light off the drying buds. A small exhaust fan in the box/tent keeps the atmosphere inside the tent the same as outside. Wires pulled across the tent/box/shed allow coat hangers to be hung.

The Trim:
We trim when the buds are fresh. I like to leave the buds on the branch when I trim. This protects the buds from excess handling. The intial trim is the last trim for us. We call this "trimming for sale". The buds are trimmed as good as we can reasonably get the first time around. While there will be a final quality check before distribution, every effort is made to get the buds perfect the first time around. I like to work with branches from 10" to 20" long.

Initial Drying:
We do not put buds into drying shack as we trim. We hang them on the "holding wire" until the end of the trimming day, and place the entire day's worth of trimming inside the room at once. This ensure the same time period of drying for each branch. The date and time are noted.
We dry for 60-72 hrs. When the buds feel crispy on the outside, they're ready for the next step. If you wait until the stems snap (as many people say), the buds will be WAY too dry. This step really requires some experience. While there is some leeway, removing from the shack at the right time will ensure success. The buds should feel too dry on the outside, but when ripped apart they should feel too wet on the inside. Another way to test is to see if the smallest buds (the tiny ones too small to sell) can be knocked off the stem by hand.


Final Drying:

I'll get this on my next post
 

kamie

Active Member
There's alot of bad info out there on drying and curing weed. In fact, no other aspect of growing is so contested. Which is odd because it's really not all that hard. I know we've touched on how we dry, but I don't know if we ever layed out the whole system. If I run out of time I may do this in stages:


What is drying? What is curing?:

You'll get a bunch of answers to this. I can only layout my understanding. I define dry as evenly dry throughout the entire bud. That's it.

Curing is what happen when that evenly dried bud is properly stored for a length of time. I have found very little difference between a properly dried bud 1 week old, and the same bud 3 weeks old. However, buds stored for a couple months takes on some new properties. I find it smoother to smoke. The color also gets a little browner/yellower. That's it.

Very few commercial indoor growers perform a true "cure". To do so would entail way too much product on hand. Furthermore, few collectives can afford to have the cash flow behind 2 months. It's bad enough that it takes several months to grow the shit. 3 more months of curing would just asdd insult to injury. Properly dried buds are WAY good enough for 99% of the smokers out there. We'll focus on the drying aspect.

The Drying Shack:
We have a dring shack. It's a 3x7 Rubbermaid tool shed. Inside we have a dehumidifier and a filtered exhaust. There is no temp control. I adjust the RH depending on temp. At 80f I like 50% RH, at 70F I like 40%, and at 60F I like 30%. It is very important to dry in a semi controlled environment. If you can't build a dedicated shed, dry in the grow room. The atmosphere is perfect. A tent or large cardboard box inside the grow room will do fine. It's just to keep the light off the drying buds. A small exhaust fan in the box/tent keeps the atmosphere inside the tent the same as outside. Wires pulled across the tent/box/shed allow coat hangers to be hung.

The Trim:
We trim when the buds are fresh. I like to leave the buds on the branch when I trim. This protects the buds from excess handling. The intial trim is the last trim for us. We call this "trimming for sale". The buds are trimmed as good as we can reasonably get the first time around. While there will be a final quality check before distribution, every effort is made to get the buds perfect the first time around. I like to work with branches from 10" to 20" long.

Initial Drying:
We do not put buds into drying shack as we trim. We hang them on the "holding wire" until the end of the trimming day, and place the entire day's worth of trimming inside the room at once. This ensure the same time period of drying for each branch. The date and time are noted.
We dry for 60-72 hrs. When the buds feel crispy on the outside, they're ready for the next step. If you wait until the stems snap (as many people say), the buds will be WAY too dry. This step really requires some experience. While there is some leeway, removing from the shack at the right time will ensure success. The buds should feel too dry on the outside, but when ripped apart they should feel too wet on the inside. Another way to test is to see if the smallest buds (the tiny ones too small to sell) can be knocked off the stem by hand.


Final Drying:

I'll get this on my next post
Thanks for that CG. i just finished my first run a week ago. i was drying in the grow room and decided i should have a separate dry room so that i can move the veg plants into bloom room. so i ordered a grow tent with a carbon filter and inline fan. i ended up not needing it because it dried to the point where most of the buds cracked that was what i was told to do. but luckily i thought it was too dry on the outside so i turkey bagged everything. it looks great so far. ive gotten alot of great feedback from people. next round i'm gonna make sure i get it right this time. also CG not sure if you read my post about commercial j's lighting method. i'd really appreciate it if i get your thoughts on it. i run all magnum xxxl's as well
 

collective gardener

Well-Known Member
When the buds are ready to come out of the shack and off the stem, the real tricky part starts. This is where you can really fuck things up. Your best weapon now is the paper bag. While it is possible to go right into a turkey bag, it's playing with fire. Most people think the buds are drier than they are. Going into a turkey bag too early can cause a moldy smell in just 24 hrs that will NEVER totally go away. I have ruined POUNDS before doing just this.

We like to remove the semi dried buds from the stem and go into paper bags. If you have alot, fill the bags about 1/3 full. Roll up the bag right down to the top of the buds. Let stand for 24 hrs.

After 24 hrs open the bags. The buds should feel much wetter than when they went in. This is the moisture from the bud's center wicking into the outside of the buds. Depending on just HOW wet they feel, you have 2 options. #1 dump the buds into a wide tray and place them back into the drying shcak for an 1-3 hrs. #2 Place the open bag into the drying shack and stir up the buds every 30 minutes or so. #2 is the safest method and should be used if you're not sure what to do. After this the outside of the buds should feel dry again. Roll the bag up and wait another 24hrs.

After 24 hrs remove a bud and break it. If it still tears, repeat step 2. If there is ANY snap to it, you're ready for the turkey bag. If you have any doubt, repeat step 2.

Once in the turkey bag the buds may feel very wet when removed. Ignore this. The real test is to break the buds and feel/listen for that distinct snap...not a tear. After the first 24hrs in the turkey bag I like to remove the buds and place them on a tray in the shack for about 30 minutes. You'll find that every day you do this it will take less and less time for the outside of the buds to feel dry again.

From when my buds are removed from the stems until they are 90% ready only takes me about 3-4 days. Then, I simply open the turkey bag everyday, stir the buds, and re-seal. If the buds are to be stored long term, this process should be done for a week or so. If you are working with pounds to be given to a dispensary, they should be delivered slightly wet. You MUST keep in mind that they will be opening and closing the bag several times. If the buds are delivered to them perfectly dry, they will be petrified by the time they are halfway into the pound. This, of course depends on how long they take to unload the whole LB. But, I assume it will be over a week.

This concept is very simple. You're just trying to evenly dry the buds without overdrying or placing in plastic too early. There is no recovery from either mistake. The beauty of the paper bag is that I have never developed any moldy smell in a paper bag. AND, it is very hard to overdry buds that are in paper bags and are only removed once per day.

Commercial J, who deals with 20+ pounds at a time uses a very objective technique. Once the buds go into the turkey bags, he places a relative humidity gauge in every plastic bag. That's right...he has 30 gauges. I think he uses what's called a calliber 3? It's a meter for cigar boxes. I have used a digital temp RH gauge, as well. After 24 hrs in the bag, he checks the rh. 50% is dry enough for long term storage, 55% - 60% for delivery to a dispensary. If you use this technique it is important to seal the bag while in an environment with an RH under 50%. Otherwise, you'll always read a high RH.

That's it. I'm sure there are folks that do it very different. My method is based on my experience and the experience of many commercial growers much more experienced than myself.

One of the things I've heard people do is to do the initial dry slow. This is wrong! It's a waste of time and risks mold. I have dried buds in am 80F room with an RH of 30% before. It takes less than 48hrs before going into the paper bags, but the end result is just fine.
 

kamie

Active Member
Hey Cg,

Have you started the Flora Nova test yet? i just started mine. heres my line up for bloom phase.

Flora Nova Bloom
Floralicious Plus
Flora Blend
Diamond Nectar
Both Kool Bloom
Bud Blood first week only
Hygrozyme
Bud Candy
Liquid Carboload
budswell
Final Bloom


Vs.

3 part GH
Diamond Nectar
Bud blood first week only
Big Bud
budswell
Hygrozyme
Bud Candy
Liquid Carboload
Overdrive
FINAL Bloom

I'm using too many nutes huh? my friend told me to use those. what do you think i should keep out? on the last run i was able to get 3.25 oz per plant. it was my first time growing as well.
 

collective gardener

Well-Known Member
Hey Cg,

Have you started the Flora Nova test yet? i just started mine. heres my line up for bloom phase.

Flora Nova Bloom
Floralicious Plus
Flora Blend
Diamond Nectar
Both Kool Bloom
Bud Blood first week only
Hygrozyme
Bud Candy
Liquid Carboload
budswell
Final Bloom


Vs.

3 part GH
Diamond Nectar
Bud blood first week only
Big Bud
budswell
Hygrozyme
Bud Candy
Liquid Carboload
Overdrive
FINAL Bloom

I'm using too many nutes huh? my friend told me to use those. what do you think i should keep out? on the last run i was able to get 3.25 oz per plant. it was my first time growing as well.
It's certainly inclusive.
 

collective gardener

Well-Known Member
Thanks for that CG. i just finished my first run a week ago. i was drying in the grow room and decided i should have a separate dry room so that i can move the veg plants into bloom room. so i ordered a grow tent with a carbon filter and inline fan. i ended up not needing it because it dried to the point where most of the buds cracked that was what i was told to do. but luckily i thought it was too dry on the outside so i turkey bagged everything. it looks great so far. ive gotten alot of great feedback from people. next round i'm gonna make sure i get it right this time. also CG not sure if you read my post about commercial j's lighting method. i'd really appreciate it if i get your thoughts on it. i run all magnum xxxl's as well
He either runs 1000's dimmed to 750, 48" on center; or 600's, 36"on center.
 

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
I have tryed nova and most of those sups and theres alot of waisted $ there! You will not get what you can from
Gh as you can from AN! Now im not invoking you buy all an shit either! Stay simple any of there base line and
Big bud and b52 also overdrive and i promiss you will rock the house!

For veg i use lucas but the AN lucas version!

For bloom i go
Grow 11ml per gal.
Micro 11ml per gal
Bloom 11ml per gal

Sups
Bigbud 2ml per gal
B52. 2ml per gal
Overdrive 2ml per gal
Sensi cal b 1ml per gal

This seems like alot but its not
And nothing gh makes will come
Close to it, this feeding chart is
One ive put together and is a shure
Fire method= zero burn or def.
 

collective gardener

Well-Known Member
I have tryed nova and most of those sups and theres alot of waisted $ there! You will not get what you can from
Gh as you can from AN! Now im not invoking you buy all an shit either! Stay simple any of there base line and
Big bud and b52 also overdrive and i promiss you will rock the house!

For veg i use lucas but the AN lucas version!

For bloom i go
Grow 11ml per gal.
Micro 11ml per gal
Bloom 11ml per gal

Sups
Bigbud 2ml per gal
B52. 2ml per gal
Overdrive 2ml per gal
Sensi cal b 1ml per gal

This seems like alot but its not
And nothing gh makes will come
Close to it, this feeding chart is
One ive put together and is a shure
Fire method= zero burn or def.
Those mixes look very similar to my first go around with AN. Only I used Cutting Edge 3 Part (also in a 1/1/1 porportion) every other day. I originally used your AN bloom booster choice and have stuck with it. If I could pick only one base and one additive, I'd use Connoiseur base and B-52. The B-52 is Humic Acid and Seaweed (the 2 additives Simon of Grotek told me would be his first choice if allowed only 2 additives). Since the B-52 gets used in veg too, all that would really be needed is to add Sensi Grow for a complete nute line start to finish.

People can say what they want about AN. Hell, I avoided their products for years cause I thought they were all hype. They do have their fair share of hype, but the products work great and are very easy to use. The only thing I'm having some trouble working out is exactly when to stop the Big Bud and start the Overdrive. I really don't like basing these decisions on what week in bloom the plant is in. My plants finishing time can vary up to 2 full weeks depending on size, room temps (just a few very hot days can knock a week off my finishing times). I prefer to determine stages by looking at the pistils. Are new pistils still growing? Have any started to turn brown? What percentage is brown? Last run I used the Overdrive when about 50% of my pistils were brown. This run I've started when all pistils are still white...but just before they start to go brown. Basically, when the plant starts to come off that big run of heavy nute and water usage. It's so easy to tell by just lifting the pots prior to watering. One week they'll be almost feather light, the next week they still have lots of water. It seems to be around week 5-6. Overdrive is advertised to give the plants an additional surge of bud growth. We'll see. This is typically the time I start reducing ppm and watering frequency.

All I can say to the Haters is go out and try some. You don't have to tell anyone. This, of course, doesn't apply to Kitty. When we hear about some maniac driving a truckload of explosives through the AN factory....well....we all know who that is.
 

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
Im confused about kushie kush word is its the same as bigbud but a bit stronger, also it call to start using alot sooner
Than big but, so if there close to the same thing why not start using big bud sooner?

I to am trying to dail in when to stop the bb and start overdrive! Plus finding a starting point for yellow bottle finish!
 

veggin'

Member
I have tryed nova and most of those sups and theres alot of waisted $ there! You will not get what you can from
Gh as you can from AN! Now im not invoking you buy all an shit either! Stay simple any of there base line and
Big bud and b52 also overdrive and i promiss you will rock the house!

For veg i use lucas but the AN lucas version!

For bloom i go
Grow 11ml per gal.
Micro 11ml per gal
Bloom 11ml per gal

Sups
Bigbud 2ml per gal
B52. 2ml per gal
Overdrive 2ml per gal
Sensi cal b 1ml per gal

This seems like alot but its not
And nothing gh makes will come
Close to it, this feeding chart is
One ive put together and is a shure
Fire method= zero burn or def.
So you're using the bloom boosters at 1/4 strength?
How does that compare to using them at full strength?
 

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
My reasoning for this is an feeding charts are way to strong! And theres no reason to waist nutes when less = the same!
So that = less is more :)
 

collective gardener

Well-Known Member
Im confused about kushie kush word is its the same as bigbud but a bit stronger, also it call to start using alot sooner
Than big but, so if there close to the same thing why not start using big bud sooner?

I to am trying to dail in when to stop the bb and start overdrive! Plus finding a starting point for yellow bottle finish!
I'm not too clear on the real difs between Big Bud and Kushie. I tried the Kushie, but ended up back on the BB. I start the BB day 1 of bloom and run it till the Overdrive.

It looks like we're really in the same boat with regards to getting the Overdrive and Final timing right. I'm happy with my Final timing...one dose day 1 of flush and one dose day 3 of flush. Whatever you guys do, DO NOT apply Yellow Bottle Final too early in the bloom phase. You can get new pistil growth and some foxtailing that really fucks with your bag appeal.

I was thinking of trying the final WAY earier on a trial plant. Since it seems to stimulate new pistil growth, maybe application as new pistil growth is slowing would be productive? Could it actually increase the pistil/calyx count? That's really the determiner of bud size. Is the Overdrive designed to do the same? Are they made of similar compounds? Do we need them both? So many questions.

I know that I've got the first 5 weeks of bloom totally dialed in. My nde spacing has never been tighter and the bud size has never been bigger. Those last few weeks are so strain and atmosphere dependant, it seems like starting over every new grow op and strain. Not to mention the fact that we never had any "bloom boosters" when I started this racket. Back then it was all "snake oil", and no real grower would touch it. We all had the Uncle Ben attitude. Fortunately we've discovered the true benefits of quality additives. Kamie will have trouble testing results with so many nutes being used. With only 3-4 bottles of shit to deal with, testing is much easier and more effective.
 

CourageToGrow

Well-Known Member
Wow, just found this thread, absolutely fantastic info. Great set up too, thanks CG for sharing all this online! I would love to head over to your collective sometime though. I like your curing method, I'm about to flower my plants and when they are ready I'm going to try your method. I'll let you know how that goes once they are ready.

subscribed

Peace and Happy Growing
 

kamie

Active Member
I'm not too clear on the real difs between Big Bud and Kushie. I tried the Kushie, but ended up back on the BB. I start the BB day 1 of bloom and run it till the Overdrive.

It looks like we're really in the same boat with regards to getting the Overdrive and Final timing right. I'm happy with my Final timing...one dose day 1 of flush and one dose day 3 of flush. Whatever you guys do, DO NOT apply Yellow Bottle Final too early in the bloom phase. You can get new pistil growth and some foxtailing that really fucks with your bag appeal.

I was thinking of trying the final WAY earier on a trial plant. Since it seems to stimulate new pistil growth, maybe application as new pistil growth is slowing would be productive? Could it actually increase the pistil/calyx count? That's really the determiner of bud size. Is the Overdrive designed to do the same? Are they made of similar compounds? Do we need them both? So many questions.

I know that I've got the first 5 weeks of bloom totally dialed in. My nde spacing has never been tighter and the bud size has never been bigger. Those last few weeks are so strain and atmosphere dependant, it seems like starting over every new grow op and strain. Not to mention the fact that we never had any "bloom boosters" when I started this racket. Back then it was all "snake oil", and no real grower would touch it. We all had the Uncle Ben attitude. Fortunately we've discovered the true benefits of quality additives. Kamie will have trouble testing results with so many nutes being used. With only 3-4 bottles of shit to deal with, testing is much easier and more effective.
Hey CG,
You're right, i feel like I'm using too many nutes and i want to use only what i need and not all the other stuff i been adding. i came into this blind, but after my first run i quickly learned alot. My set up is:

bloom room 1 6x magnum xxxl's
- 9 plants each light
- all topped except for 9
- 9 topped and 9 untopped plants are getting floranova, florablend, floralicious plus, both liquid and dry koolbloom, and then yellow bottle final.
- 36 topped are using the same nutes i used the first run
- first watering for 12/12 on tues. i hit it with bud blood. im watering again tonite, but this time im keep it out. i have the 6 gal. diamond nectar as well not sure if i should hit it too or just leave it out this run.

Bloom room 2 i haven't switched to 12/12 yet and i'm debating if i should get conniseur base and use b52 over drive and big bud. i'd only have to get the base and b52 since i already have big bud and over drive.

my friend who helped me set up the first run doesn't even measure ph or ppm and told me i didn't need it. i need to go get myself a meter so i can measure everything.
i just don't know what brand and model to get. i also need to get a RO system, ive been running tap which i think is at 200 ppm. any advice would be great.
 

veggin'

Member
CG,

Are you using BB, B52 and Overdrive at full strength (per AN's feeding chart)?

BTW, Thank you for this awesome thread! Read every post.
 
Top