Portland Oregon. The Time is Now. Cannabliss. The New Standard is Set!

[afrawfraw]

If they were operating COMPLETELY within OMMP guidelines you would have a much harder time finding anything at those clubs that is worth a damned. It's one thing to grow for a friend or someone you have some sort of relationship with, many people are willing to give these people a brake and help out. But shit dude, you want to walk into a club and grab a sack of bud for free because you have a OMMP card?

Don't make me laugh. Spend less time bitching about it and grow something. Is there a reason you aren't able to grow?

P.S. I've got 12 dollar grams all day bud. And far superior to the lame as crust at the clubs. Wanna pay my PG&E bill? Toasted ROFLS for you. Oh wait, I'm not one of them. Damn, that would've been an easy way out for me. Damn convictions....

 

[afrawfraw]

How is this any different from any other aspect of the medical industry? Nothing is produced if no one is paid. The problem here is that insurance companies feel they don't have to pay for mmj.

That's the kicker! The clubs are operating JUST like big PHARMA, however, there is no insurance Co's to bill, so you're directly raping the patient. The issue isn't CAN they do it. We all know they can. But that doesn't make it right. Look, here is my position, again. By all means, start a club, mark your weed up, make a fortune. Do it! It's the american way! But don't lie to us by saying "Compassion" and "Care". Any one who knows business law will tell you it is impossible for a NON-NPO to make decisions which cost the business any money. You have a commitment to the investors to make as much profit as possible. Look it up. So just say Weed store. Say Cannabis, not medication. Say customer, not patient. Be real, ya know? And every one arguing against me; Go ahead and sell your $240 zips. Just be aware of what you are doing, and don't pretend to be an angel of mercy....

 

[purklize]

It's not compassionate to tear apart your health care providers for feeding their families and buying health insurance. I have yet to meet a grower who got rich off mj.

 

[geekmike]

I have read the rules and have been growing myself for some time now.

Amazingly enough we are probably on the same page just arguing from different perspectives. The reason many of these "clubs" tote the medical uses of it is because if they start gloating about selling to anyone anytime they are going to get their doors kicked in. It's all shaky still.

The biggest issue here is the OMMP itself and how the law is written. I am looking forward to Washington this year, their legislation is looking like it will pass. Making Washington the first state in the union to have government controlled and licensed dispensaries and regulated like alcohol (there are a couple flaws, but it's at least a change).

I get it though, some shops shove it down your throat about how they are only in it for "compassion" and then make you drop high end prices on seedy buds. That sucks. Just don't go back there, tell your friends not to go there. Easy as that.

 

[geekmike]

also, honestly... again. $240 is a great price dude. That's $7 a day, about twice the cost of Ambien (if I remember correctly). It's not ideal, but these clubs are taking the risk and still dishing out prices that are cheaper than many legit clubs in Cali.Rent, electricity, nutes... dude, it adds up. No one is going to get rich selling weed at 240 an oz. especially if you have a middleman that has additional rent and utilities + employees. All of these things add up. Sure, if we could roll acres of weed outdoors then we can get the prices down. But if you are growing indoors and that's the kind of week you are buying. It's not really a money maker unless you are doing it in mass quantities (but massive investments and risk)

*Edit*

Here's a snipit from this months High Times.

 

[afrawfraw]

also, honestly... again. $240 is a great price dude. That's $7 a day, about twice the cost of Ambien (if I remember correctly). It's not ideal, but these clubs are taking the risk and still dishing out prices that are cheaper than many legit clubs in Cali.Rent, electricity, nutes... dude, it adds up. No one is going to get rich selling weed at 240 an oz. especially if you have a middleman that has additional rent and utilities + employees. All of these things add up. Sure, if we could roll acres of weed outdoors then we can get the prices down. But if you are growing indoors and that's the kind of week you are buying. It's not really a money maker unless you are doing it in mass quantities (but massive investments and risk)

*Edit*

Here's a snipit from this months High Times.
View attachment 1980068

Yes. This is what the market will bear. Umm. Quick question. Are you saying it costs you $200.00 an ounce to grow? Are you saying it costs you a $100.00 an ounce? I'm guessing right around the 40-70 dollar mark, depending on methods. This is an indoor approximation. So if you sell an ounce for $200.00 you are at least doubling your investment. How do you not get rich? I know a few growers. None of them drive gremlins. I think you were right. Were just seeing different sides of a coin. And my model was aimed at low income Americans, remember. Asking a single mother making 1,800 a month to give up $240.00 for 1 gram a day (ROFLS,ROFLS...Any one controlling pain needs AT LEAST an eighth a day, unless supplementing with something else) is a little harsh. "Sympathetic pity and concern for the sufferings or misfortunes of others" This is the definition of Compassion. Just sayin'...

For people who can afford it. Rock on. For people who use it for appetite control. Awesome. But what about cancer patients on fixed incomes? Immobile veterans, Etc.

Just sayin'...

I just wish there were an option for the poor. It seams all we're good for these days is scaring the middle class into working. All rights to GC for that...

 

[geekmike]

The options you have for the poor are things like NORML did in southern Oregon and getting involved in networks where people are able to supply for low income patients. These clubs aren't meant to be the regular go to. They are intended to supplement (at least they should be) until someone gets a grower or is just waiting for a good summer crop to come around.

No, it doesn't cost me 200 a ounce to grow, but the time and effort that I put into every ounce that is grown is worth something. I don't sell my weed, just use it for myself but I still think it has worth.

It's not the clubs fault that it is still basically illegal to sell weed (even for cheap) it's just a risky market that limits single growers to no more than 24 mature plants and if you are unable to veg over 12" high or wide this seriously diminishes yields indoor.

@ 2 oz a plant you are looking at about +/- 300oz a year if you follow the rules. If someone is asking $200/ oz that equates to $60,000 a year... then take the expenses off there. To run 24 plants you would need somewhere in the range of what 3 or 4 1k lights... plus veg lights and heater/ac and fans.

 

[afrawfraw]

• "@ 2 oz a plant"​

  Well, if you put it that way, you are right.
  

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[afrawfraw]

As far as selling weed, it SHOULD be illegal. It's what discourages profit. According to the program, you can only receive, through REIMBURSEMENT, donations for power, medium, nutrients, Etc. NO WHERE IN THE TEXT does it provide for profit behavior. If you "Think" your weed is worth 200 a zip, go sell it on the corner, for the BLACK MARKET VALUE!

Why do you think you have to talk in tongues and hold color coded gift cards!? Because you are supposed to be paying for expenses, not what a grower 'Thinks" his medicine is worth.

P.S. They have a monthly convention where they all agree it's worth 280 a zip!

 

[afrawfraw]

Get yer paper, no one's mad at you =)

 

[geekmike]

No where in the OMMP said that someone could basically set up a dispensary either. So, they are basically breaking the law to begin with, why would they follow those shitty rules?

I stated 2oz a plant because you can only Veg a plant up to 12" before it is considered a full grown plant by OMMP standards. Show me a 3-4oz yield from a plant that is goes into flower at smaller than 12x12x12.


I'm not mad brother, text can not express emotion. I just think that the current OMMP rules suck and you shouldn't complain about people that are bending the rules to make things more accessible for more people.

 

[afrawfraw]

No where in the OMMP said that someone could basically set up a dispensary either. So, they are basically breaking the law to begin with, why would they follow those shitty rules?

I stated 2oz a plant because you can only Veg a plant up to 12" before it is considered a full grown plant by OMMP standards. Show me a 3-4oz yield from a plant that is goes into flower at smaller than 12x12x12.


I'm not mad brother, text can not express emotion. I just think that the current OMMP rules suck and you shouldn't complain about people that are bending the rules to make things more accessible for more people.

EXACTLY!

The relationship is supposed to be between Patient and grower! It's much more difficult to deceive someone when they are involved in the garden. EVERY person I know with a grower, pays about $100.00 an ounce.

There shouldn't be dispensaries in Oregon. I will vote them down every time. Patients are SUPPOSED to donate through PG&E and through garden stores, Etc.

The side effect is patients are introduced to the gardening scene. They become involved with the garden and help.

But most growers aren't about that. They want to run it all alone, and sell for the highest price they can get. Don't even get me started on signing up a patient, growing 6 plants for that patient, and then telling them if they don't have a 1,000 dollars, their plants are going to the club...Hmmmm.

 

[hazorazo]

EXACTLY!

The relationship is supposed to be between Patient and grower! It's much more difficult to deceive someone when they are involved in the garden. EVERY person I know with a grower, pays about $100.00 an ounce.

There shouldn't be dispensaries in Oregon. I will vote them down every time. Patients are SUPPOSED to donate through PG&E and through garden stores, Etc.

The side effect is patients are introduced to the gardening scene. They become involved with the garden and help.

But most growers aren't about that. They want to run it all alone, and sell for the highest price they can get. Don't even get me started on signing up a patient, growing 6 plants for that patient, and then telling them if they don't have a 1,000 dollars, their plants are going to the club...Hmmmm.

Again, after all of this banter......when does your store front open? What is the name of your store, and address, so I can come on down and check out your compassion, dude? This whole conversation sounds VERY familiar.....do you know why? It happened in this thread 50 times or so...written by like 4 people.

We get it, dude....you are bitching about how dispensaries have to live under a certain guise to exist....and without that guise they would not be here for the patients in need, in the mean time. Not all med patients know a good grower right off the bat, and many of the good growers are already taking care of the maximum amount of patients allowed by the OMMP.

The bottom line is this....I have seen a handful of folks bitching about the pricing of clubs, and NOT ONE of those people bitching have EVER opened a storefront. Not one.....And my prediction is that you will not either. Opening a business like a dispensary is a lot of work, takes a lot of money to get off the ground, and the people who actually get a store front open deserve some good profit, in my opinion. They are putting their freedom at risk right now, no matter how you look at it....and that does not come cheap.

 

[afrawfraw]

Again, after all of this banter......when does your store front open? What is the name of your store, and address, so I can come on down and check out your compassion, dude? This whole conversation sounds VERY familiar.....do you know why? It happened in this thread 50 times or so...written by like 4 people.

We get it, dude....you are bitching about how dispensaries have to live under a certain guise to exist....and without that guise they would not be here for the patients in need, in the mean time. Not all med patients know a good grower right off the bat, and many of the good growers are already taking care of the maximum amount of patients allowed by the OMMP.

The bottom line is this....I have seen a handful of folks bitching about the pricing of clubs, and NOT ONE of those people bitching have EVER opened a storefront. Not one.....And my prediction is that you will not either. Opening a business like a dispensary is a lot of work, takes a lot of money to get off the ground, and the people who actually get a store front open deserve some good profit, in my opinion. They are putting their freedom at risk right now, no matter how you look at it....and that does not come cheap.

(1) "Patients in need" This is the bullshit I'm talking about!

(2) You obviously haven't read my posts. I have no objection to REAL clubs. Why do you need a "Guise"? Oh, yea. BECAUSE YOUR BREAKING THE LAW!

(3) Your post showed no interest in understanding my POV at all. It was full of anger and disinterest.

(4) "Store front"!!?? See number 3!

(5) I'm done here. I exchanged ideas with another member and we came to common ground. The point remains...If you are operating completely under OMMP guide lines, why the anxiety? Oh yea, because if you run it by the book, you can't profit. You want $280.00 zips and mad profit? Go to Cali or Colorado. Stop fucking with the GOLD STANDARD MJ program, which was written in such a way as to stop the capitalism on patients.

(6) It's hard to say no to a fortune, isn't it? People will do quite a lot for one.

(7) I filed for NPO status last week.

( 8 ) No.

 

[afrawfraw]

I wager if I poured a volcano bags worth of Cannabis pollen into a fan in the middle of cannabliss, I would hear the growers shrieking like burning witches as they realize what's settling all over them...Maybe I'll check stuff out April 1st.


(COMPLETELY KIDDING! Just trying to lighten the mood.)

 

[hazorazo]

(1) "Patients in need" This is the bullshit I'm talking about!

(2) You obviously haven't read my posts. I have no objection to REAL clubs. Why do you need a "Guise"? Oh, yea. BECAUSE YOUR BREAKING THE LAW!

(3) Your post showed no interest in understanding my POV at all. It was full of anger and disinterest.

(4) "Store front"!!?? See number 3!

(5) I'm done here. I exchanged ideas with another member and we came to common ground. The point remains...If you are operating completely under OMMP guide lines, why the anxiety? Oh yea, because if you run it by the book, you can't profit. You want $280.00 zips and mad profit? Go to Cali or Colorado. Stop fucking with the GOLD STANDARD MJ program, which was written in such a way as to stop the capitalism on patients.

(6) It's hard to say no to a fortune, isn't it? People will do quite a lot for one.

(7) I filed for NPO status last week.

( 8 ) No.

Bro, I just get tired of people bitching about prices. You can change the world all you want. Just get off the internet and do it, and I will be right there when you open.

I think the thing YOU misunderstand is this....I am not against good prices for med patients, I am tired of hearing people bitch about the problem all the time, and not do anything about it. Open up your storefront and have sub 5 dollar HIGH QUALITY meds, and I will be ready for my 60 dollar ounce. I gave away over 20K in meds last year (more like 30-40K street prices), so my heart is not heavy.

Overall, if you end up being the only one that ever bitched in the Oregon section to ever actually OPEN a store, then I will be pleasantly surprised. I think there are a lot of ways to do good with this great plant of ours, but I will believe you when I see you doing it.

I, personally, am a believer that MOST corporations should be set up as non profit, and marijuana is no exception. As far as the laws go right now, those entrepreneurs are risking their freedom (especially federally), and with risking freedom, comes higher profit margins. Just a fact.

Your best bet is to crusade to get Marijuana off Schedule 1, so we can all decide for our own states how to handle our own stuff.

 

[afrawfraw]

Bro, I just get tired of people bitching about prices. You can change the world all you want. Just get off the internet and do it, and I will be right there when you open.

I think the thing YOU misunderstand is this....I am not against good prices for med patients, I am tired of hearing people bitch about the problem all the time, and not do anything about it. Open up your storefront and have sub 5 dollar HIGH QUALITY meds, and I will be ready for my 60 dollar ounce. I gave away over 20K in meds last year (more like 30-40K street prices), so my heart is not heavy.

Overall, if you end up being the only one that ever bitched in the Oregon section to ever actually OPEN a store, then I will be pleasantly surprised. I think there are a lot of ways to do good with this great plant of ours, but I will believe you when I see you doing it.

I, personally, am a believer that MOST corporations should be set up as non profit, and marijuana is no exception. As far as the laws go right now, those entrepreneurs are risking their freedom (especially federally), and with risking freedom, comes higher profit margins. Just a fact.

Your best bet is to crusade to get Marijuana off Schedule 1, so we can all decide for our own states how to handle our own stuff.

Nope. I got that point. You stated yourself in this very thread you thought the prices were a little yikes.

I will never have a "store front". This is illegal. I will never sell by the gram. This is illegal. I will never collect any moneys other than a monthly membership cost. This would be illegal. The monthly membership cost can NOT be paid in cash, but must be handled through an online payment center. Medication will NOT be delivered the same day that Membership dues are collected.

AGAIN, this is a model. I'm not saying I'm going to change the world. I'm not going to say I'll change Oregon.

What I am saying is I will run a Licensed Garden, catering to low income residents, without worry of profit, but to ease suffering.

The more you "Don't get" my attempt, the more confident I become. Thanks stranger.

P.S. $42.00 a month for 1 ounce, more if the garden over produces.

If you have more than you are allowed to possess, you can LEGALLY give it away. For $42.00, I'll give it to a patient. If a LEO ever sweats me, there isn't even cash at the transaction, and the donation was made on a different day for a 1/4 of the Black Market Value. This a lawyer can work with. Especially given the patient makes the same payment every month, recorded online...Just saying.

Unfortunately, you'll just have to call BS. I can't announce the program, or a bunch of greedy little dealers will try to resell the donations. I've seen it happen. Besides, I'm working with 2 patients who are very interested and who need the help.

If it works, however, I'll probably be on some local news coverage.

Did I mention we will be constructing and donating Hydro Systems to those capable of growing? Fun times. Notice I never said you were greedy, or that these prices are yours, but to defend the prices and system, kinda fingers you as part of the problem. I think it is YOU who would like MJ taken off the Schedule I list. I'm not talking about a couple who pops into a coffee shop for a puff or 2. I'm talking about an affordable, constant, organic supply of medicine for those who don't have it. Why is this concept so foreign? If you donated a pound+ for free, why are we arguing again!?

I think people forget, MJ as a recreational use SHOULD be more expensive. Some dip shit at a NORML meeting with a rolex, wearing a $500 outfit is NOT a patient, nor a grower. They are Entrepreneurs, risking prosecution trying to double their investment. A vet in a wheel chair seeking pain relief because his oxy's make him barf, is a patient. To insinuate that both should pay equal prices for medicine is COLD.

Can we drop this now? Please?

On another subject, I am required by law to register with the department of justice because of the NPO status. Do Corporations have to as well? If you have any business experience, it would be nice to know what to expect from here on out...

 

[hazorazo]

Nope. I got that point. You stated yourself in this very thread you thought the prices were a little yikes.

I will never have a "store front". This is illegal. I will never sell by the gram. This is illegal. I will never collect any moneys other than a monthly membership cost. This would be illegal. The monthly membership cost can NOT be paid in cash, but must be handled through an online payment center. Medication will NOT be delivered the same day that Membership dues are collected.

AGAIN, this is a model. I'm not saying I'm going to change the world. I'm not going to say I'll change Oregon.

What I am saying is I will run a Licensed Garden, catering to low income residents, without worry of profit, but to ease suffering.

The more you "Don't get" my attempt, the more confident I become. Thanks stranger.

P.S. $42.00 a month for 1 ounce, more if the garden over produces.

If you have more than you are allowed to possess, you can LEGALLY give it away. For $42.00, I'll give it to a patient. If a LEO ever sweats me, there isn't even cash at the transaction, and the donation was made on a different day for a 1/4 of the Black Market Value. This a lawyer can work with. Especially given the patient makes the same payment every month, recorded online...Just saying.

Unfortunately, you'll just have to call BS. I can't announce the program, or a bunch of greedy little dealers will try to resell the donations. I've seen it happen. Besides, I'm working with 2 patients who are very interested and who need the help.

If it works, however, I'll probably be on some local news coverage.

Did I mention we will be constructing and donating Hydro Systems to those capable of growing? Fun times. Notice I never said you were greedy, or that these prices are yours, but to defend the prices and system, kinda fingers you as part of the problem. I think it is YOU who would like MJ taken off the Schedule I list. I'm not talking about a couple who pops into a coffee shop for a puff or 2. I'm talking about an affordable, constant, organic supply of medicine for those who don't have it. Why is this concept so foreign? If you donated a pound+ for free, why are we arguing again!?

I think people forget, MJ as a recreational use SHOULD be more expensive. Some dip shit at a NORML meeting with a rolex, wearing a $500 outfit is NOT a patient, nor a grower. They are Entrepreneurs, risking prosecution trying to double their investment. A vet in a wheel chair seeking pain relief because his oxy's make him barf, is a patient. To insinuate that both should pay equal prices for medicine is COLD.

Can we drop this now? Please?

On another subject, I am required by law to register with the department of justice because of the NPO status. Do Corporations have to as well? If you have any business experience, it would be nice to know what to expect from here on out...

Getting marijuana off Schedule 1 will HELP medical patients, so you should check it out.

I think you have some pretty cool ideas, and it sounds like you are out to help. If you end up on the news, then I commend you. Your hydro idea sounds promising, are you paying for lights and fans, etc, or just helping them get a hydro setup going? Whatever it is, it sounds nice.

As for what I give away, I said I gave away $20,000 ($30,000-40,000 street prices) in free weed. It sounded from your post like you thought I gave away just over a pound. And that total is not even including the salves, tinctures, kief, hash, edibles, etc that are all given away for free, also.

Overall, if you are doing good by patients in some way, you are good by me. And the dispensaries are filling a need, otherwise there would not be customers there, paying the very prices you bitch about.

So, my point to you is this.....until more people give more meds away, I am a BIG fan of having dispensaries around, so the newbies can find meds at SOME level. Regardless of how sick you are.

I think you and I see eye to eye on many things....I just disagree with you throwing shit at the dispensaries, just because of their choice of business model. They serve a purpose, and if they did not, they would make no money and close down, right?

 

[mcpurple]

i could have swore that MJ was now schedule 2 in the state of oregon?

 

[Zildjian]

Afrawfraw, I'm going to chime in here for a quick sec. I would personally like to attest to Haz's statement about GIVING meds away. I personally know this to be true. When I first became a patient before even meeting Haz I got burned by not one but two growers who took my card, and when it was time to get my meds they dropped me without giving me my meds. Haz stepped in when hearing about my story, and gave me meds, and hash on more than one occasion to hold me over until I found a new grower. Did not ask for any donations of any kind in return. This was to a perfect stranger. I would also like to add Uncle Buck has been there in times of need as well. There are many here that do not seek to make a buck off of their craft, and time.

It sound like your heart is in the right place as well, I just wanted to point out in your last post that the last thing Haz on his mind is trying to get rich off of patients in need.