Why so little lime in supersoil?

[Buggins]

Sub's supersoil seems to be very low in a couple areas, specifically dolomite lime, which is usually applied at one to two tablespoons per gallon of soil, but in his recipe, comes in at a miniscule 1/2 teaspoon per gallon. Same goes for epsom salts, and even the humic acid, which comes in at less than 1ml of powder per gallon.

Also, there is virtually zero potassium added beyond any contained within the base soil.

So my questions.
...Is there a particular reason the recipe is so low in these area? Are they getting potassium/calcium etc from something I'm not aware about?
...Has any one noticed deficiencies caused by low levels of these nutes when growing in supersoil?
...Has anyone 'beefed up' the supersoil in these areas that lack and seen any substantial improvement?

I am considering making two batches of supersoil this next round, one as is, and one with additional amendments.

To sub's soil, I will be adding or increasing the following (all of these measures broken down to per gallon of soil)

Dolomite Lime 1 tbsp/gal
Epsom Salts 1tbsp/gal
Humic Acid 1tbsp/gal
Kelp Meal (for potassium) 2tbsp/gal
Greensand (for potassium and micro) 2tbsp/gal

I will also be treating with a myco innoculant (Great White) twice per grow, in addition to a soil drench of a humic acid/fulvic acid/mollasses/earth worm casting tea once every 2 weeks or so.

Opinions on these additions? Should this take care of the areas that supersoil lacks, without risking burning plants?

Thanks for your opinions.

Bug

 

[RawBudzski]

Great White is supposed to be great stuff. <3

I have some basic Myco inocc. :]

 

[subcool]

I'll let all the people using Super Soil answer this question but my response is it lacks nothing and needs nothing.
Theres nothing you can add or subtract that we havnt already tried. But I do invite you to experiment and tweak it just how you like it thats the whole point.
Super Soil works as is and produces amazing quality flowers.

Sub

 

[dannyboy602]

i am tweaking the recipe as well. if for no other reason than i like to experiment. so i'm adding:
greensand
rock phosphate
also i wanted to add that these minerals dont burn. well not exactly. too much dolo lime gives me a drawstring effect on leaf margins. but in general i'm a little more liberal with the amount then the suggested rate. and just to be analytical i am sending out three samples to a lab to have it tested. the azomite was a great tip. it doesn't burn and i use more than the recipe calls for.

 

[boneheadbob]

SUB!!!!!!!!!!
I get my one year chip feb 1. I will step up from boot to a official semipro grower of dank!! I have grown Vortex and Plushberry useing SS just like your recipe calls for. Tickled to death with both, trichs everywhere, under the leaves, down the stem, stalk, everywhere!!

After tasting those two I am a fanboy. The best part is sharing with friends and seeing them get all bugeyed (when they see and smell it) and red eyed and smiley faced 10 minutes later. They cant believe herb taste/smell that delicious. PB is from another galaxy. The smell and stickyness at harvest = out of the world!

Two, no, make that three pats on the back and an attaboy to you and the gang. I am buying three, maybe 4 five packs. I want DQ and more PB.

One question. When will PB hit tude?
I thought you were blowing some of your dank smoke when you said theres a keeper in every 5 pack ( I think it was your DJ BB grow thread). Easily a keeper or two in both. No need for 10 beans.

 

[RawBudzski]

I have to mix mine today little white web on top of soil. mMmm.. .

 

[boneheadbob]

i am tweaking the recipe as well. if for no other reason than i like to experiment. so i'm adding:
greensand
rock phosphate
.

I am pretty sure Sub use to use Rock phosphate in an earlier version of SS.
You say Azomite was a great tip. What was that tip? I used the azomite like the recipie calls for and it was not very much. I think the stuff is very potent.

 

[boneheadbob]

Little white web = Stuff is working!! Ready to grow!

 

[laxfiz]

Sub's supersoil seems to be very low in a couple areas, specifically dolomite lime, which is usually applied at one to two tablespoons per gallon of soil, but in his recipe, comes in at a miniscule 1/2 teaspoon per gallon. Same goes for epsom salts, and even the humic acid, which comes in at less than 1ml of powder per gallon.

Also, there is virtually zero potassium added beyond any contained within the base soil.

So my questions.
...Is there a particular reason the recipe is so low in these area? Are they getting potassium/calcium etc from something I'm not aware about?
...Has any one noticed deficiencies caused by low levels of these nutes when growing in supersoil?
...Has anyone 'beefed up' the supersoil in these areas that lack and seen any substantial improvement?


I will also be treating with a myco innoculant (Great White) twice per grow, in addition to a soil drench of a humic acid/fulvic acid/mollasses/earth worm casting tea once every 2 weeks or so.

Opinions on these additions? Should this take care of the areas that supersoil lacks, without risking burning plants?
Bug

the most simple answer to your question is : try supersoil as is first. then ammend as needed

1: actually cant answer this. -.

2: 90% of time, no deficiency! just use supersoil and you will be super happy. its magic basically. sometimes there is yellowing during flowering, due to lack of N. (solution below) I dont beleive I have ever seen calcium or K deficiency mentioned in regards to super soil.

3: the deficiency can be fixed with:
i)adding supersoil on top of the pot
ii) feeding with some tea. this is usually strain dependent.
(my comments are experience that many many people experience as well as myself)
as subcool said, dont let this stop you from trying you own mix. many things work for many people.

IMO, and in my experience:
if you really like to 'push' you plants to the max, Id recommend adding a little more nutes(ive never done this).
There are people who ammend, and feed with teas and blah blah, but it doesnt seem to make a difference. adding more stuff to supersoil + teas = waste of $$ and nutrients. it works extremely well.

supersoil produces very dank buds and is a very good mixture as is. Im ok with the myco and humic, everything else, i vote no.

 

[laxfiz]

I am pretty sure Sub use to use Rock phosphate in an earlier version of SS.
You say Azomite was a great tip. What was that tip? I used the azomite like the recipie calls for and it was not very much. I think the stuff is very potent.

rock phosphate showed no change in quality of buds in his supersoil recipe. that is why he removed it.


in addition: azomite is one of the most important ingredients in supersoil. let alone any gardening soil. (minerals that is.. not just azomite..) For anybody who is curious, read the link -- http://www.azomite.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=60&It emid=41#will azomite work on any soilhttp://www.azomite.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=60&It emid=41#what is azomite

 

[T Ray]

This question about the K (Potassium) in supersoil is by no means a new one. Google works wonders.

https://www.rollitup.org/subcools-old-school-organics/453084-where-k-super-soil-i.html

Buggins when I read your go at Supersoil you didn't follow it to a "t".

Link-- https://www.rollitup.org/organics/496378-super-soil-not-yielding-well.html --

Your Recipe

20 gallons organic generic potting soil
5 gallons perlite
5 cups worm castings
150 ML Bat Guano (high phos)
150 ML Fish bone meal (high phos)
300 ML rock phosphate
300 ML Green Sand
400 ML Blood Meal
250 ML Dolomite lime
250 ML Epsom salts

So for before you talk about what supersoil lacks how about you try it right first and then you could have a say one way or another.

Your not going to get Sub's results unless your following the recipe with all said ingredients. You are missing some key parts to the recipe (Azomite, Powdered Humic, Roots soil). For starters Sub said that any soil other than Roots was ok to use if you had to, but that Roots got the best results.

So give the real recipe a try and I can tell you from experience you will not be disappointed. The results speak for themselves.

 

[KushDog]

I tweaked his methad to get bigger yeailds. 10 gallon tote and longer veg time... LOL

 

[Buggins]

Appreciate the input T Ray.

Just so you know, I'm not one of those lazy buggers who just posts questions rather than doing the research himself. I have spent the last two days combing through my various hard-copy growing books, and googling my ass off, but couldn't find a satisfactory explanation to the potassium question. The best thing I could come up with was an explanation in my Marijuana Plant Saver book that said potassium doesn't really seem to effect yield or health of the plant, only cosmetic concerns and a lack of it can possibly a little extra stretch (I'm paraphrasing here). Not an acceptable explanation, so was hoping I could get a little more input here from people who have actually used supersoil in their grows.

As for "my recipe" that you dug up, this wasn't meant to be actual "sub's supersoil", I was using the term supersoil generically. Of course I can't expect the same results if I don't follow the same recipe, I was just trying to do my best with what I had available at the time. I ran that soil once, was very disappointed with the results, but I also learned a lot in the process.

Everything that you pointed out that I was missing T Ray, was missing because I simply could not get it. I live in the middle of nowhere Canada, and have very limited access to the types of ingredients sub uses, and many times the cost of shipping was simply too prohibitive, and no grow shops within 100 miles of here. I've been very ill the past few years and haven't been able to work, so I have an extremely tight budget.

Anyway, over the past year I have slowly been able to accumulate nearly all the required ingredients from various budget suppliers and donations from some compassionate fellow growers. I still can't get roots or fox farms soils in Canada, and it's illegal to import them, but I can just re-use my last organic soil batch. Other than that, I think I'm set.

I will certainly give the "real deal" supersoil an actual honest try, but at the same time I guess I am a little concerned about fucking it up again. My yields were so poor last time that and had to resort to purchasing my cannabis from health canada's supply - which was absolutely terrible, so terrible in fact, it actually made my pain and nausea worse if you can believe it. Guess I might sound a little overly-concerned, but now that you know where I'm coming from, maybe you can understand.

Anyway, I appreciate everyone's assistance. Thanks very much for taking the time to offer some advice.

Bug

 

[KushDog]

It's like Brownies, if you follow the directions on the box, you will have good resalts. if you use all the ingerdants but in the wrong ratio, it anit going to turn out so swell

 

[subcool]

I also lived in Winterpeg in mid winter and yes it was much harder to find the ingredients. Wrm castings were the really hard part when it was 40 below.

But I actually created Super Soil while I was in Winterpeg so......where there is a will there is a way.

Sub

 

[althor]

I may be completely wrong but here it is anyway.

I see alot of people claiming lime to be a "ph balancer". I guess that is the case, IF you have low ph and need to raise it to "balance" it. If you are adding something very acidic, add lime and your ph will be restored.
Also, from what I have read in a place or two and from my very limited experiences, supersoil starts out high ph when you mix it, part of the cooking process allows the ph to lower. Adding more lime to an already high ph mix isnt going to help, in my very limited experienced opinion.

 

[Buggins]

I think it's the opposite. Blood meal, guano, and the like are very acidic and the lime would need to bring the ph up to a more manageable level. The humid acid and fulvic are supposed to help make nutrients available over a much wider range of ph and perhaps that is why less lime is required?

Could be wrong, just spit balling here.

Sub, when you were in winterpeg what were you using for your base soil?

 

[Senseimilla]

Beneficial bacteria thrive in the soil and help create a balanced soil that will be exactly 6.5. It may start a little lower or higher, but over time the bacterial colony is going to equalize it to 6.5 in the absence of an external source causing an increase/decrease in ph. If supersoil weren't balanced, the colony wouldn't thrive and you wouldn't get the results people see from it. This may be why when some people alter the formula too much it doesn't work as well. Want proof? Start with water not ph 6.5, brew aerated organic tea, and check the ph in a day or two once the bacteria are really thriving. It'll be exaclty 6.5 no matter what ph you started at. One of the reasons with good compost teas you don't have to even check ph of the water.

 

[nugbuckets]

I may be completely wrong but here it is anyway.

I see alot of people claiming lime to be a "ph balancer". I guess that is the case, IF you have low ph and need to raise it to "balance" it. If you are adding something very acidic, add lime and your ph will be restored.
Also, from what I have read in a place or two and from my very limited experiences, supersoil starts out high ph when you mix it, part of the cooking process allows the ph to lower. Adding more lime to an already high ph mix isnt going to help, in my very limited experienced opinion.

super soil freshly mixed will be acidic, until it "cooks", or sits moistened for 3-6 weeks.... the decomposition of the organics, and the metabolism of the micro beasties will bring it up to perfect.

 

[nugbuckets]

Beneficial bacteria thrive in the soil and help create a balanced soil that will be exactly 6.5. It may start a little lower or higher, but over time the bacterial colony is going to equalize it to 6.5 in the absence of an external source causing an increase/decrease in ph. If supersoil weren't balanced, the colony wouldn't thrive and you wouldn't get the results people see from it. This may be why when some people alter the formula too much it doesn't work as well. Want proof? Start with water not ph 6.5, brew aerated organic tea, and check the ph in a day or two once the bacteria are really thriving. It'll be exaclty 6.5 no matter what ph you started at. One of the reasons with good compost teas you don't have to even check ph of the water.

exactly..............