Vertical kinda sucks

[tibberous]

No one ever seems to mention the bad points of vertical. Here's a few things to keep in mind before you go vert:

- Most vertical systems are a set size, and made to take a set number of plants exactly the correct size. So when you loose some clones, or your clones grow an extra foot, you just kind of have to make it work.
- Vertical SUCKS for cooling. Sure, you can use A/C's and chillers, but that extra juice could just be powering more lights.
- Apart from Heath, who says he got like 2 gram a watt (which could just be bullshit), I haven't seen anyone with a vert system post yields much better than buckets / E&F tables.
- It's hard to get at the plants

Unless your average temp is below 50 degrees, or you just want to piss around, I'd stay away from vert. It can work. It can even work pretty good - but overall it seems inferior to E&F tables, which are cheaper, and more tolerant of heat and varying plant sizes.

 

[laughingduck]

I have got a pound for 800 watts. The key to the size problems is to have a consistent cloneing procedure to insure identical plant sizes. After you get the sizing correct You don't mess with them and let them grow. Harvest time is the only time you should touch them.

 

[tibberous]

I have got a pound for 800 watts. The key to the size problems is to have a consistent cloneing procedure to insure identical plant sizes. After you get the sizing correct You don't mess with them and let them grow. Harvest time is the only time you should touch them.

I think the best way to do it would be to have 2 identical flowering systems - that way you could take clones from the first system, and in four weeks, be flowering them in the second. Heath said he didn't have moms and took clones from his system, then vegged them until it was time for the next cycle - ime, the clones get WAY too big in 7 weeks.

Still, none of this is an issue if you aren't doing vertical - just put 9-12, or however many plants seem to fit in your E&F and you're good to go.

 

[ZAQ]

The set up I use you can move turn,lean the rack Do what ever you want I run a few extra plants My air cooling take a 26 Watt motor

 

[onlybuilt4]

The yields I get with a vertical setup when compared to a horizontal setup of the same wattage and size speak for themselves, to my mind anyways. At least 1.5x, often close to double what I used to yield in the equivalent space. I can get 1/4lb per plant in 3 gallon buckets with 4-5 week veg and pull a pound with a 400w -- that's not just a pipe dream, I've done it. (see my thread...only ended up being about 3/4lb since there were only 3 plants, but I think that's a fair estimate...) I'd love to see anybody pull anywhere near that with a horizontal setup.

 

[OGEvilgenius]

The biggest downside as far as I can see is the potential eye damage working in your garden. Get high quality eye protection. Or simply work when the lights are off.

 

[jcommerce]

The yields I get with a vertical setup when compared to a horizontal setup of the same wattage and size speak for themselves, to my mind anyways. At least 1.5x, often close to double what I used to yield in the equivalent space. I can get 1/4lb per plant in 3 gallon buckets with 4-5 week veg and pull a pound with a 400w -- that's not just a pipe dream, I've done it. (see my thread...only ended up being about 3/4lb since there were only 3 plants, but I think that's a fair estimate...) I'd love to see anybody pull anywhere near that with a horizontal setup.

I got 6 oz off of one plant under a 250 watt in a 10 gallon tote...3 weeks veg...on my first horizontal grow. I'm very intrigued by vertical, but if you do horizontal right, you can pull big #s. I'm not hating or questioning, it's just all about technique. All I'm saying is that you can't rule out horizontal based on one or two grows...it's still a very effective method.

 

[OGEvilgenius]

If you're looking for big yields, vertical is the way to achieve them. You increase your lit square footage significantly if done efficiently and well. It does present challenges, but that's half the fun.

 

[cary schellie]

I got 6 oz of one plant under a 250 watt in a 10 gallon tote...3 weeks veg...on my first horizontal grow. I'm very intrigued by vertical, but if you do horizontal right, you can pull big #s. I'm not hating or questioning, it's just all about technique. All I'm saying is that you can't rule out horizontal based on one or two grows...it's still a very effective method.

3 weeks veg and 6 oz's, id sure like to know what strains and see proof

 

[tibberous]

If you're looking for big yields, vertical is the way to achieve them. You increase your lit square footage significantly if done efficiently and well. It does present challenges, but that's half the fun.

I wouldn't say 'big yields' so much as efficient yields. 6000 watts over E&F tables will out yield a 2000 watt vertical system that took as long and cost as much as to make (and uses as many plants). The whole theory with vertical is that a bigger canopy is better than a reflector - you still loose some light to the top and bottom though.

Thing is, %20 better light usage doesn't matter if your needing to run a 1/2 hp chiller, or a bunch of AC's, or your plants get pests that you can't deal with because you can't get to them.

Guess my point is that, before anyone goes vertical, they need to realize it isn't 'better', it's just different. It's pretty disappointing to put together a super-elaborate system, just to realize that (except in the winter), it's no better than normal ebb and flow tables.

 

[Joedank]

If you can cool the room with air cooled hoods logic says that same amount of cooling without the hoods works too...
It's just getting your system dialed... My yeilds were down until I started Puttin indica dom plants in the middle and sativas around the sides...

 

[tibberous]

3 weeks veg and 6 oz's, id sure like to know what strains and see proof

Well, it's 168 grams on 250 watts, which is .67g/w, which is certainly possible.

 

[tibberous]

If you can cool the room with air cooled hoods logic says that same amount of cooling without the hoods works too...
It's just getting your system dialed... My yeilds were down until I started Puttin indica dom plants in the middle and sativas around the sides...

Hoping Dinafem's industrial plant isn't just a bunch of marketing bullshit. They seem to make good seeds though, so we'll see.

 

[jcommerce]

3 weeks veg and 6 oz's, id sure like to know what strains and see proof

Here you go. It was my first grow a long time ago in a 4 ft. tall box. As you'll see, there were 4 plants, but one was male. The other two got drawfed out by the plant that yielded 6 oz. Mandala Satori.

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/35671-dwc-bubbler-grow-4-plants.html

 

[vein5]

So whats the best way when going vertical? Would having many small plants or a couple large plants be best when going verticle? I keep getting mixed veiws on this method.

 

[bboybojo]

I like vertical because you don't have to worry about differing plant heights and training to create a flat horizontal canopy. My temperatures are also lower using a fan blowing up at the light than they were with a cooltube. My problem with it at the moment is the plants growing into the light, I thought I could get away without using a screen but no, gotta hook one up very soon.

 

[Geezy101]

Yes! that is the best way. going vertical with a cool tube and blowing the air upwards IMO. just make sure u have no leaks and ur fine. i tested sucking the air and blowing the air. my light was way cool when it was blowing the air up and sucking cold air from outside my tent thru the lighting system (400w). ive had my plants litterlly touching my cool tube (fan leaves) no symtoms yet for a good 2 3 weeks.
with my tent in the basement my temps are 72-80 in which i couldnt ask for better temps..

i have tied down some fan leaves and branches with fly fishing line and tied it to my pots.. it can be effective in vertical gro for a couple of reasons.

allows branches facing the light to get exposed more from the tip to the beggining of the branch. and also allows the light to effectvily shine thru to to the other side of the plant.

vertical is a great way to go as long as you have it at plant level. if its up and above the plants quite a bit. its not that effective.

lollipoping sativas and or tall plants are essential.

keep ur vertical lightiing maye an inch higher or even level with ur highest canopy and u will be blasting ur girls with mad lumans.

 

[Geezy101]

here is my setup. i put one plant on each side of the light to allow for max lumans per plant. 4 would be perfect. clearly more is fine. but IMO 4 is prefect

that plant on the left is veging. its an indica free seed the other 3 are afhgan kush autos.. just vegging that free seed for now and gonna clone the shit out of it and plant them outdoors soon. then prolly plant the mother outside and see how it goes.. shes not gonna have much left of here when im done cloning.

 

[PJ Diaz]

If you can cool the room with air cooled hoods logic says that same amount of cooling without the hoods works too...

No, it doesn't work like that. I can use the exact same exhaust fan to pull out of my room either through and cooling the reflector or just pulling hot air out of the room, and my 4x4 tent with a 600w hps is 6 degrees F cooler when I pull through the hood.

 

[laughingduck]

I like vertical because you don't have to worry about differing plant heights and training to create a flat horizontal canopy. My temperatures are also lower using a fan blowing up at the light than they were with a cooltube. My problem with it at the moment is the plants growing into the light, I thought I could get away without using a screen but no, gotta hook one up very soon.

Yes, use a screen. Rabbit wire work wonderfully, the plants will pile up on it like a bunch of school kids.