Soil Choices for makeing supersoil.

[<Grasshopper>]

Hey there everyone. I wanted to get some advice on types of soil. I have been useing roots organic soil but its not been great lately. Happyfrog seems to be good but gets kinda muddy and heavy....even with lots of chunky perlight. So what do you all use? Now I like to make subs supersoil and need to make a fresh batch today so what to use for the soil? I have heard of people useing ocean forrest and happyfrog 50/50 mix to grow in but not make supersoil from. If I did that would it be to hot...I think the ocean forrest is kinda hot soil right?

What should I get? Its not my first batch of supersoil but Its my first batch without the roots organic. I cannot get biobiz light which subcool recomends to mix with roots.

Thanks

I know.....another supersoil question......

 

[freedombegins]

I just made a batch with happy frog. I used 4 2cf bags and 2 2cf bricks of coco coir to make my base soil. havent ran it yet but i know quite a few people using that as there base soil because they were not happy with roots soil at the moment.

 

[ghettorigger]

E.B. Stone Edna's Best Potting Soil.

I've used fox farm, pro mix, roots, and miracle gro. Edna's best is my hands down favorite, gives a more sweet taste for some reason too i have found. i Have not had a chance to see what its like after being recycled though so i am excited about that.

I like Edna's better than my recycled roots soil by far. I don't use sub's mix i kind of like to add a little of this and a little of that and give a pretty diverse range of amendments in the mix and all my plants are happy.

plus when i was looking for soil at the nursery the guy who works there even said sort of nonchalantly that this is the soil that a lot of cannabis growers are using. Its cheaper than fox farm too.

 

[Endur0xX]

I like promix, second supersoil run with it and it has been great, I have nothing to compare it with though but I like the soil texture

 

[RawBudzski]

I have used Happy Frog + Ocean Forest w/ great results. My next batch is the original Roots, w/ some extras added in like Kelp meal, alfalfa meal, insect frass, & some great white.

 

[Kalyx]

My 2 cents:

I used to use both of these soils regularly indoors at my old job. I'd say that roots orginal soil is pretty equal to FFOF as far as how hot they are. They actually use more amendments (variety wise, not sure about dose) If you mixed FFOF and FFHF 50/50 id say your supersoil would be 'less hot' than compared to what youve already done or just using 100% FFOF. Seems like Sub himself wont ever use any FF soils, I think he says his source stores them outdoors and they always get real thick with gnats by when its purchased. My main complaint of FF mixes is that they compost thistles into their piles and the spikes dont break down well and always micro-stab into my fingers when I'm working the mix together. Hope this helps you.

What about the roots soil has "not been great lately"? Results, pH, bugs, etc. please elaborate.

I have a bag sitting in back slated to be mixed into my first batch of supersoil. Sounds almost to good to be true.

 

[RawBudzski]

True about the little thistles! I work w/ bare hands & I anticipate on pulling little pricks out of my fingers. I have only used roots once in the past w/ a bad experience, my girls did not seem to enjoy it as much as ffof, it seemed to begin yellowing, losing its OOMPH! several wks before ffof would.

I am now using roots the original way sub uses, I am sure gnats are in ffof & roots, which is why I used insect frass.

 

[Wetdog]

I like promix, second supersoil run with it and it has been great, I have nothing to compare it with though but I like the soil texture

^^^^^^Word^^^^^^

I make my own mix, but using the peat moss from the makers of promix (Premier), and end up with a promix+++++.

Been using this basic mix for close to 40 years.

Wet

 

[freedombegins]

What about the roots soil has "not been great lately"? Results, pH, bugs, etc. please elaborate.

I have a bag sitting in back slated to be mixed into my first batch of supersoil. Sounds almost to good to be true.

I havent personally ran roots organics but multiple friends told me it was a little hot and there were experiencing i believe fungus gnats. so nothing too bad and the bugs could be how it was stored. But like i said i havent personally used roots soil.

 

[Kalyx]

Yeah. Word around the shop here is that Roots has been extra HOT recently with many also questioning the pH (low, and thats with high tap water pH in our area too). I'm still gonna go with it b/c I am new to supersoil and will stick to Subs recs for my first go. Except I'll probably tea it much more than water-only for extra flavor!

Also the Roots seems to have more aggregate than the FFOF (roots uses pumice AND perlite) and is a bit lighter out of the bag, plus coir which I add to any FF mix.
Gnats are par for the course until you learn how much/often is right to apply waterings. So many people blame gnats on a bag of soil when they just need to water less, even here in the desert it is very common to hear about.

 

[GreenChile]

Aww, man, I just made up a mix with some Roots.
I added guano, blood meal, lime, epsom salt, and some Fruit and Flower and the ppm was like 1800, so I cut that with another bag of soil and a little lime.
I didnt recheck the PPM and just transplanted so hopefully all goes well and my presidential kush's dont self combust.
Hey Kalyx, by "shop" are you talking bout AHL?

 

[GreenChile]

Oh yeah, I forgot to add:
Ive grown with Subs supersoil multiple times and have mixed it up in different base soils.
Ive made it with ocean forrest and fertiloam, ocean forrest and roots, ocean forrest and happy frog, and just plain roots. There really isnt that much of a difference to be honest. The PPM usually was around 1200-1800 and every now and then I would experiance a Zinc lockout from too much phosphorus.
I personally found the soil to work better by replacing the High Phosphorus Bat Guano with Kelp Meal since the mix has too much phosphorus and not enough potassium.

You get plenty of phosphorus from the bone meal, in my opinion. Plus if you want, you can always add a little bit of guano a few weeks into flowering via top soil feeding or tea if your plants really needs it.
Also, If your plant has been in the supersoil mix for longer than 3 weeks, you need to add a little epsom salt with your feedings.

In the end, its not really about what soil mix you use for a base, aslong as you know how to keep the soil healthy. Use lots of beneficial microbes and enzymes so your plant can break down and use everything in the soil. Dont over water, and mix your water with 50% aeriated tap water and 50% reverse osmosis water.
The supersoil mix can get a bit overwhelming, and truth is you can actually get really good results by simply mixing Ocean Forrest, Happy Frog, and Light Warrior and adding a few oz's of Organicare Dry Fertilizer and watering with a tea.
When you grow in soil, its more important to keep the soil healthy. The plant itself is a by-product of healthy soil, not the other way around.
Microbes, magnesium, and enzymes should always be used!

Ive been farming for about 6 years now, Ive tried lots of different growing methods, hit me up if you got any questions

 

[purplekushmane]

Very well put

 

[Kalyx]

GreenChile
I personally found the soil to work better by replacing the High Phosphorus Bat Guano with Kelp Meal since the mix has too much phosphorus and not enough potassium.

Thanks for substantiating this, I've pondered where the K to balance out the feed was coming from. +rep for the suggestion I think I'll do that. (saves a purchase of guano, I already have Kelp meal!)

GreenChile

Aww, man, I just made up a mix with some Roots.
I added guano, blood meal, lime, epsom salt, and some Fruit and Flower and the ppm was like 1800, so I cut that with another bag of soil and a little lime.​

NO KELP MEAL? GUANO INSTEAD? ARE YOU GOING MORE TRADITIONAL RECIPE THIS ROUND? I DONT THINK THE ROOTS IS BAD IM STILL PLANNING ON USING MY BAG

GreenChile
Hey Kalyx, by "shop" are you talking bout AHL?

WHY DO YOU ASK? "THE SHOP" USED TO MEAN AHL IN THIS STATE NOW THERE ARE MANY OPTIONS BESIDES THE OLDEST ONE

GreenChile
Ive been farming for about 6 years now, Ive tried lots of different growing methods

DO YOU GROW MANY PLANTS (VEGIS, ETC) OR JUST DA HERB?
WHY 50/50 CRAP (TAP HERE) / RO? MICROS OR Ca OR?​

 

[ZigZagXain]

Happyfrog seems to be good but gets kinda muddy and heavy....even with lots of chunky perlight.

Hi Grasshopper, I wanted to address the muddy thing real quick, I used big&chunky perlite for 2 years and realized it was too chunky to do what its supposed to, now I use super coarse perlite and enough of it will make any soil way more loose and not muddy, it just mixes better. I wouldn't be able too much give advice on which soil would be the best substitute for roots when making supersoil, but I agree with a lot of what Greenchile said, its not so much about the base. To me it seems like the base soil has a lot to do with the consistency(heavyness/lightness) and water retention of your final mix. Some bagged soils are peat/coco based, some are more composted forest wood based, like foxfarms. Im using ocean forest this year and doing a toned down version of supersoil, ocean forest isnt as hot as ppl say, but its probably hotter than roots right outta the bag. Anyways good luck with your mix.

 

[Wetdog]

Ya know, if you read labels, with a few more ingredients PLUS the amendments that you will be adding to make the 'super soil', you can also make the *base* soil for way cheaper than bags of whatever.

I mean, with the amendments used for SS you are close to having everything that's in FFOF or Roots, or any other of these expensive, bagged, base soils.

Wet

 

[ZigZagXain]

Ya know, if you read labels, with a few more ingredients PLUS the amendments that you will be adding to make the 'super soil', you can also make the *base* soil for way cheaper than bags of whatever.

I mean, with the amendments used for SS you are close to having everything that's in FFOF or Roots, or any other of these expensive, bagged, base soils.

Wet

I hear ya, but it seems like that would only work for a very small amount of soil, I mean, even with all the supersoil ingredients, the base soil(bagged potting soil) makes up a big majority of the final mix, w/o doing the math, its like 65% or more is the base soil. So that would be almost impossible for ppl that need the equivalent of a pallet of dirt. To do as your saying, it seems like it would be quite a task, your making the entire soil. You would have to go get a bunch of sphagnum moss, peat, coco, sand etc...on top of the amendments.

 

[sourskunkd]

Ive looked high and for the supersoil mixes and subs is ok but i been looking on youtube and found koma and he uses 1 big bag happy frog 3 cups ancient forest 2 cups worm castings 2 tbs oregonism. Works great semi cheap great results.

 

[farmerjoe420]

I hear ya, but it seems like that would only work for a very small amount of soil, I mean, even with all the supersoil ingredients, the base soil(bagged potting soil) makes up a big majority of the final mix, w/o doing the math, its like 65% or more is the base soil. So that would be almost impossible for ppl that need the equivalent of a pallet of dirt. To do as your saying, it seems like it would be quite a task, your making the entire soil. You would have to go get a bunch of sphagnum moss, peat, coco, sand etc...on top of the amendments.

its not as hard as it seems. if you mix up a whole batch of ss , you have to mix over 12cu ft of soil anyways. a basic base soil is peat, perlite, and some sort of compost with lime. 3 bails of peat along with perlite and a bag or two of compost would be almost the same as 8 1.5 cu ft bags of bag soil. either way its work and for a little more effort, you can save alot of $$$

 

[hardknox72]

Right now im using FFOF mixed 50/50 w/ coco. Aerated tap water w/age old sea kelp and humic acid ph'd to 6.8. every two weeks i use hygrozyme . any recomendations? switching from 100% coco.