scroglodyte
Well-Known Member
don't use leachate, imo. anaerobes dominate that process.
First shot using teas from worm compost high in P and K for BLOOM BOOSTER side/side
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+ WitchDoctor +
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Hey Poly. Pest control for the plants or for the worm bins? I haven't had any problems with the worm bins. I had some mites in it for a months a couple months ago, but they cleared up on there own, I think I needed more carbon in it or something.
And by complete organics do you mean trying not to use bottles? Cause I'm still using bottles a little bit, I'm just working towards a goal of hopefully being able to get everything I need from compost and not have to use bottles at all. While still achieving hydro yields of course, just like you said. I can't believe how sweet my pot has been tasting since I started making my teas like this and feeding every other with them.
And with competing yields to hydro, it seems like a no-brainer to me, especially considering compost is free.
polyarcturus
Well-Known Member
as far as a nutrient source it is awesome you are correct to extent, but introduced to water and aerated it dies quickly and becomes food for the good kind of microbes and fungi. it is not something to be used in large qtys tho. thing about anerobes is hey alter thier envirment, usually end up killing themselves off they have to have ideal conditions to form. a really good example of this is a bandaid. keep the bandaid on or take it off? both on during the day when it risks exposure off at night so it does not become infected.
scroglodyte
Well-Known Member
just as long as ya bubble it up good, and check yer ph. that stuff can be acidic. i let mine run onto the ground.
polyarcturus
Well-Known Member
was aking about the plants.
yeah i dont use anything in a bottle besides ionic, and it lasts me a year i barly use any , i have a super efficient watering sytem, 5 gal a day distributed amongst a lot of plants (a 2x4x4 and a 3x5x5 just to give you an idea of how many plants)
its all teas and im getting hydro yeild and times mixxing it up with coco(reason i water daily) plus the smells and taste, i swear i have yet to taste a bluecheese like mine, and it stinks to heaven(so much so its a danger)
+ WitchDoctor +
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So you don't use it at all, you just dump it basically? And if I want to use it you're saying I should pour it right onto the soil instead?
Ah ok gotcha. I'm using Humboldt Natural Bloom right now on the rest of the plants, but I want to get away from using rock phosphate all together as it's not renewable either. That's the real reason I'm trying to accomplish flowering with just high PK compost, is to prove that we don't have to use bat guano or rock phosphate. And I use a 80/20 coco/casting mix with amendments because coco is more environmentally responsible that peat. I'm one of those "small footprint" guys lol.
So yea, it sounds like me and you are on the same page man.
polyarcturus
Well-Known Member
i think he meant he doesn't use it.
yeah i try to keep my footprint small people are amazed when i tell them what my elec bill is (i dont know how i do it either, just timing i guess) i try to replicate nature as much as possible i thing think this is the key to my best yields( i have a sunrise sunset lightening, full spectrum, both veg and flower, UV all that, drip sytem with mister for morning and evening, co2 its an unsealed room tho.
as far as P goes there isnt much animal matter that can provide and in most cases this is the most renewable resource, the best way is really to compost something like berries which would yeild your P but it would be like trading one harvest for another. i dont know off hand, i have to look into a good renewable source of P with the rock phosphate like properties.
thats why i like the bat guano tho, they collect the berries for me, maybe something like bird compost, but they have more diseases than the bats!
yeah i try to keep my footprint small people are amazed when i tell them what my elec bill is (i dont know how i do it either, just timing i guess) i try to replicate nature as much as possible i thing think this is the key to my best yields( i have a sunrise sunset lightening, full spectrum, both veg and flower, UV all that, drip sytem with mister for morning and evening, co2 its an unsealed room tho.
as far as P goes there isnt much animal matter that can provide and in most cases this is the most renewable resource, the best way is really to compost something like berries which would yeild your P but it would be like trading one harvest for another. i dont know off hand, i have to look into a good renewable source of P with the rock phosphate like properties.
thats why i like the bat guano tho, they collect the berries for me, maybe something like bird compost, but they have more diseases than the bats!
+ WitchDoctor +
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Set up sounds nice. I'm still working on mine, I've gotta finish the new mom/cloner in the veg room and build one more flowering room. We don't flower with all the space though, we use half of it to juice leaves. I don't use any extra UV though. Have you tried the dual arc bulbs? I need to get new 600s for a few reflectors and I was gonna grab a few and try them out. Not gonna take the glass off of the reflectors or anything though...
And yea, I have nothing against using poop, I'm just under the impression that even the companies that say they harvest responsibly don't. I'd use guano before seabird though...yuck.
Have you ever seen the list of NPK values for organic materials? I've got a list if I haven't posted it on this thread yet.
This is what I go by to separate my kitchen scraps. My high PK bin is mostly banana peels, cucumber peels, sweet potato peels, potato peels, and orange and lemon peels.
http://bestlawn.info/home/faqs/51-npk-of-organic-materials.pdf
And yea, I have nothing against using poop, I'm just under the impression that even the companies that say they harvest responsibly don't. I'd use guano before seabird though...yuck.
Have you ever seen the list of NPK values for organic materials? I've got a list if I haven't posted it on this thread yet.
This is what I go by to separate my kitchen scraps. My high PK bin is mostly banana peels, cucumber peels, sweet potato peels, potato peels, and orange and lemon peels.
http://bestlawn.info/home/faqs/51-npk-of-organic-materials.pdf
+ WitchDoctor +
Well-Known Member
My bad, I forgot to even answer your question. I use AzaMax mostly to be honest. We use a wash my wife makes too sometimes for veg, but I use AzaMax as a foliar every 10 days or so till flower, and as a soil drench 3 times while vegging. And I use the EndAll concentrated insect killer, so I can mix it into my sprayer and just mist the undersides of the leaves if I need to kill them on contact.
polyarcturus
Well-Known Member
ive seen the list but you get the point varity is key and your hitting it on the head really. if you could find large supply of compost matierial you could create a whole line of specialized worm poop. it all works the same, microbes break it down plants eat it up. but on one hand i just dont have the time to compost or be able to do it discreetly or i would.
hmm from the list possibly, rabbit shit? or captive fed rabbits perhaps?
as for the pesticide that end all works dont know about azamax, more interested in organic pesticide really. i use some chemical and some organic but im rying to make the move to 100% organic and come up with a fool proof system for indoor plants. it seems like chemicals are more orientated towards indoor plants and organics outdoors, i want to fix that. plants make tons of byproducts that repel kill and disrupt bugs they just need to be utilized and mixed properly.
its not that i dont think people have looked into it, and i believe it works, but i think most troubles come from preserving it. got to keep it refrigerated and add things to preserve in order to make a good organic pesticide/
hmm from the list possibly, rabbit shit? or captive fed rabbits perhaps?
as for the pesticide that end all works dont know about azamax, more interested in organic pesticide really. i use some chemical and some organic but im rying to make the move to 100% organic and come up with a fool proof system for indoor plants. it seems like chemicals are more orientated towards indoor plants and organics outdoors, i want to fix that. plants make tons of byproducts that repel kill and disrupt bugs they just need to be utilized and mixed properly.
its not that i dont think people have looked into it, and i believe it works, but i think most troubles come from preserving it. got to keep it refrigerated and add things to preserve in order to make a good organic pesticide/
+ WitchDoctor +
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Oh, I forgot to mention AzaMax is plant-based and OMRI. If you haven't tried it yet I think it's right up your alley, it's awesome stuff. Apparently Azatrol is the same thing as well, but cheaper. They're both Azadirachtin baseds, which is supposedly the main component in Neem oil that gets the job done...but to be honest it's probably just the easiest effective component of it for them to produce...either way it works awesome as a preventative measure.
And yea, I think hydro was really marketed to growers back in the day, and mites and pests are definitely more hardcore indoors, so it was easy to promote chemical products. People probably felt like it was ok too since it's not going into the ground or anything outside....
As for the rabbit shit, I used to keep Burmese Pythons lol...but I'm not into keeping rabbits around.
And I think it would be totally awesome if I could make separate specialized worm composts that are high in PK and higher in N....I need to find some time this week to read some of the bigger downloads I have on worm compost..the scientific ones lol. I keep reading conflicting info. I've read that worm-compost retains more of it's original NPK because the worms don't actually digest it...then I've read that they absorb the nitrogen and phosphorus, leaving less of it behind...
But then I read that it's richer in NPK either way because of the worms...so that leaves me with absolutely no "facts" about whether it's gonna retain NPK...but it doesn't make a lot of sense for it not to...it would blow my mind honestly if I started putting 20% high PK compost in my flower mix and I still had to use a P boost lmao.
And yea, I think hydro was really marketed to growers back in the day, and mites and pests are definitely more hardcore indoors, so it was easy to promote chemical products. People probably felt like it was ok too since it's not going into the ground or anything outside....
As for the rabbit shit, I used to keep Burmese Pythons lol...but I'm not into keeping rabbits around.
And I think it would be totally awesome if I could make separate specialized worm composts that are high in PK and higher in N....I need to find some time this week to read some of the bigger downloads I have on worm compost..the scientific ones lol. I keep reading conflicting info. I've read that worm-compost retains more of it's original NPK because the worms don't actually digest it...then I've read that they absorb the nitrogen and phosphorus, leaving less of it behind...
But then I read that it's richer in NPK either way because of the worms...so that leaves me with absolutely no "facts" about whether it's gonna retain NPK...but it doesn't make a lot of sense for it not to...it would blow my mind honestly if I started putting 20% high PK compost in my flower mix and I still had to use a P boost lmao.
+ WitchDoctor +
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Ok, so I read through the last page again and now I understand my confusion about the leachate. I was using it hoping for some PK, not for microbial life. That's why I put another scoop of worm compost in as well....but it's not counter-productive is it? Are you guys saying it will kill off the life from the other compost or something?
polyarcturus
Well-Known Member
no the leachate is good just not in qty. maybe a cupful to a five gal tea, essentially (without the microbes and what not) it is a hydroponic nutrient. pure Nutes.
yeah ill stick to regular neem and pyrethrins for now, should that not work i migh mess with azamax(ive heard good things about them)
as far as nutrient retention, molecules can shape and form but never leave. as they say what you put in is what you get out. so yes nutes values put in come out the other end. also worms need to eat thier thru their own shit several times b4 it is really composted but this doesnt matter so long as you microbe pop. is healthy.
ive got some turtle i wa sthinking about using thier water as fertilizer.... but something told me not to.(salmonella)
yeah ill stick to regular neem and pyrethrins for now, should that not work i migh mess with azamax(ive heard good things about them)
as far as nutrient retention, molecules can shape and form but never leave. as they say what you put in is what you get out. so yes nutes values put in come out the other end. also worms need to eat thier thru their own shit several times b4 it is really composted but this doesnt matter so long as you microbe pop. is healthy.
ive got some turtle i wa sthinking about using thier water as fertilizer.... but something told me not to.(salmonella)
+ WitchDoctor +
Well-Known Member
Well I know that the worms need a nitrogen diet, so I'm sure they will be depleting some of the N out of the high N bin, but I mean...there's way more N in most food wasted I'm sure. But you're right, I should get out what I put in for the most part.
I'm gonna read up a little more about leachate. I figured worm leachate would be extremely beneficial, but I didn't think about the fact that it just sits around stagnant before being used.
I wonder if leachate is more beneficial if it's used immediately. I mean the new worm composter I'm making is going to make around 100 lbs a month of compost...so I could probably get a few fresh cups of leachate every day if I wanted to...I'll answer that question on my own though. I need to study up anyways. No point in smoking all this pot if I don't take advantage of how good by brain works when I'm high all day.
And from what I hear turtle water is the cat's meow as far as aquaponics go. I guess they recommend a good filter. We've been looking for a turtle with a 20gal setup on craigslist so that we can do a little aquaponics setup in the kitchen window for a couple trays of wheatgrass. You can't get salmonella from just flooding the roots can you? Wouldn't it have to touch the plant, and then not be washed off?
I'm gonna read up a little more about leachate. I figured worm leachate would be extremely beneficial, but I didn't think about the fact that it just sits around stagnant before being used.
I wonder if leachate is more beneficial if it's used immediately. I mean the new worm composter I'm making is going to make around 100 lbs a month of compost...so I could probably get a few fresh cups of leachate every day if I wanted to...I'll answer that question on my own though. I need to study up anyways. No point in smoking all this pot if I don't take advantage of how good by brain works when I'm high all day.
And from what I hear turtle water is the cat's meow as far as aquaponics go. I guess they recommend a good filter. We've been looking for a turtle with a 20gal setup on craigslist so that we can do a little aquaponics setup in the kitchen window for a couple trays of wheatgrass. You can't get salmonella from just flooding the roots can you? Wouldn't it have to touch the plant, and then not be washed off?
polyarcturus
Well-Known Member
been wondering that myslef dumped the water out instead of on the vegis when cleaning it, yeah i would guess if you wash the plant its good to go. a 20 gal setup will do 1 turtle, im experiecing trouble now that the turtles have places to hide they also have territoy now. with a 20 gal setup your gonna want a canister filter, not a power head and not a little wannabe filter they are messy. for a 20-30 gal the smallest canister filters they make are the perfect size. i have a 100gal filter on my 20 gal tank filled half way so it will be easy for me to upgrade, too bacd you not nearby i would sell you a turtle and the aqaurium cuz i know a place i could a bigger aquarium and a canister filter for you for a deal. that would fix my problems get you what you wanted and get me a bigger tank so i can get some more turtles. lol
i do plan on doing a dwc in the turtle water with a tomato plant just to see how it does.
i do plan on doing a dwc in the turtle water with a tomato plant just to see how it does.
polyarcturus
Well-Known Member
midwest eh just noticed that? the heart possibly?
+ WitchDoctor +
Well-Known Member
MI.
Yea I figured a 20 gal would be about right for one turtle. I keep the filter advice in mind.
Yea I figured a 20 gal would be about right for one turtle. I keep the filter advice in mind.
polyarcturus
Well-Known Member
about 3-4 hours north west of me, darn was hoping to get a bigger tank, and help get you hooked up with the turtle i dont know why but the whole turtle thing was fun, it was just like setting up a grow, pretty cool, i kept my design as simple but mostly automated once i get some aquatic plants and feeded fich tho i wont ever have to pay attention again just fill up th fish once a month. the thing about the filter is its like the carbon filter of turtles, they are super messy so you want to oversize no matter what.
+ WitchDoctor +
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I made 1 1/2 gallons of tea adding 1 cup of leachate to the normal ingredients that I use in the tea. I watered the other 2 OGs with regular wormcompost and 0-10-0...and both got 15ml of Bio Flores as well, just because they needed it and I didn't want to wait 3 days for the pots to dry out.
The canopy looks good, not as many colas as I wanted inside the cages though...I'm gonna strap a few of the longest ones down a little because I can't get that light any higher. I should have a pretty good canopy after that. I'll dial things in better once I have a light mover and 2 600s in each room.
The canopy looks good, not as many colas as I wanted inside the cages though...I'm gonna strap a few of the longest ones down a little because I can't get that light any higher. I should have a pretty good canopy after that. I'll dial things in better once I have a light mover and 2 600s in each room.
+ WitchDoctor +
Well-Known Member
Oh, I didn't see this the other day. Ah, yea I totally would have done some trade lol.
I used to keep a bunch of snakes, mostly burmese pythons, but I had to give them up to a rescue when my back started getting worse...they just kept getting bigger lol. They used to mess the shit up outta their cages though...it was such a pain in the ass to clean up after them.