Root Aphids or Hypoaspis Miles purposely placed in Fox Farm soil?

[Tha206]

Greetings everybody. This is my first post here, however not my first post on one of these forums. I have frequented another forum for quite some time and found a lot of the info I receive there to be useless, so hoping maybe to get some more reliable info here. Not to be rude, but I have been researching root aphids for quite some time after a previous battle and I am not looking for speculative "it sounds like," "it could be" or "neem them" comments. I have seen all the YouTube videos and read numerous other pages. I need some answers from people with experience. I appreciate everybody taking their time to attempt to be helpful, but I would prefer if only people with actual knowledge of these critters reply. Thank you in advance!

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I have been growing for a couple years and didn't have any problems until my last grow when I got hit with root aphids. Never did figure out how exactly, but I suspect they were from infected clones. Or possibly from infected Fox Farm soil. I ended up having to trash my entire grow, pots, everything and start over. Bombed the tent 2x with Dr. Doom, vacuumed and washed with bleach. Left tent dormant for 2 months before re-introduction of plants. Done deal.

I veg with Happy Frog and switch to Ocean Forest for flower. Don't ask why. After losing my entire last crop, I have become paranoid and been taking precautions to avoid RA's in the future. I now water with Azamax upon transplant to kill anything that might be in the soil. I transplanted approx 3 weeks ago into Ocean Forest and sent my girls into flower. About 1 week ago I was inspecting my plants and checking my sticky traps when I noticed a fly on one of them. It didn't look like a RA flyer, but more like a gnat. There was only 1, but I decided to start keeping a very close eye on things. A few days later I was inspecting again and found a shitload of tiny white mites on the rims of all my pots. My first impression was that they were baby RA's. I panicked! I can't lose another crop, so I went nuclear on them with Spectracide Triazicide. I dunked the pots in a bucket of Spectracide solution for 10-15min each and sprayed around the tent. I went back in 24hrs later and the bugs were still there. They were drinking the Spectracide and flipped me off. I also sprayed them with pure rubbing alcohol, which killed the RA's on contact last time, this time they just laughed at me and kept moving. This is odd.

Yesterday I purchased some SNS 203 as a last resort. It has mixed reviews, but I'm desperate. I fed them some straight SNS 203 as a test and it doesn't appear to have had any effect on them. I was doing some more research last night and discovered that Fox Farms has reportedly been putting Hypoaspis Miles (predator mites) in their Ocean Forest soil to battle fungus gnats. Seems like it would be prudent to tell customers that so they don't freak out when they see thousands of tiny white mites running around their pots eating fungus gnat larvae. The Hypoaspis Miles are harmless and are actually helpful, however they look VERY much like baby RA's. They are microscopic and I can't tell if they have the tell tale "dual exhuast" pipes that stick out of RA's ass yet because they are so tiny and white in color. They don't appear to be getting any bigger. Not yet anyways.

Can anybody here verify that Fox Farms has been doing this?? And can somebody tell me if these Hypoaspis Miles are actually that resilient that they would survive through Spectracide Triazicide, rubbing alcohol and SNS 203???

Thanks for reading and your time!

 

[Saldaw]

how do root aphids effect your plant? because i have tiny white bugs in my soil and i dont know if its root aphids or springtails.

 

[Tha206]

how do root aphids effect your plant? because i have tiny white bugs in my soil and i dont know if its root aphids or springtails.

Root aphids suck the life out of your plants by feeding on the roots and live around the root ball. The lowest leaves of your plant will start turning yellow and have brown spots, often times mistaken for nute deficiencies and people who are unaware will attempt to compensate by adding more nutes, which just mess the plant up more. The overall health of your plant will be reduced, which will stunt it's growth and lower yields. They also secrete a substance that doesn't allow the roots to repair themselves, thus making them sucseptible to disease. In my case, there were so many flyers (the final stage of their development) at the end of the grow, they were getting stuck on the buds and laying babies up top. My crop finished, I went to cut them down and realized the buds were infested with bugs too. It was pretty nasty. I should have listened when people told me to cut my losses and throw it away when first discovered, but I thought I could beat them...and failed miserably. Root aphids are the worst thing that can ever happen to your grow room and will more than likely win. Although there are people that have defeated them with a lot of work and various pesticides. It is also better to get them in veg than flower, if you get them in flower you're pretty much screwed. In veg you have systemic weapons to beat them with, not good to use systemics in flower. Root aphids reproductive cycle is like no other, they are asexual, do not lay eggs, born pregnant with the next one and spread fast. Very, very nasty things!

Normally by the time root aphids are discovered, they have either become adult flies (often mistaken for fungus gnats) or small juvenile black/brown beetle looking bugs. Their signature is the "dual exhaust pipes" sticking out of their ass. The root aphid babies are white and resemble the Hypoaspis Miles I am asking about. Mine however don't appear to be growing past the baby white mite stage, which is leading me to believe they are not root aphids. I am keeping a very close eye on them. But, considering the circumstances with me already trying sveral chemicals to kill them and nothing is working....I'm pretty much screwed. Also, if they are indeed root aphids, then I have probably discovered some new drug resistant strain that will eventually kill everything on the planet...lol

This is what root aphids generally look like by the time people find them. If you do see them, you'll usually see them running around the rims of your pots. Otherwise they're being a silent killer from inside the pot. Pull your plant out of it's pot and inspect the roots.

 

[Tha206]

Found somebody else with the same problems and the pics are identical to what I have. Apparently I'm one of the few people this has been happening to over the past few years? SMH

http://thehotpepper.com/topic/13286-problem-with-tiny-white-bugs-in-the-soil-how-do-i-get-rid-of-them/

 

[PsYcO420]

I was fortunate enough to pickup root aphids last grow and just pushed on with the grow while battling them. I ended up having to harvest early and move out of that closet and into my garage. Last grow i tried numerous attempts to kill them even going nuclear and they still won. I tried SNS 203 , SM90, Predator Neematoads, Azamax, and Pymethrin. The only thing that would even dent them was the Pymethrin. As far as your soil question goes i used Roots(aphid) Organic soil last round. This time its strait Coco and peralite and so far so good.

Sexy looking? Kinda looks like a tic almost

 

[Tha206]

I was able to beat the root aphids down pretty well with H202 (hydrogen peroxide) when I got them. That was recommended to me by my local grow shop and it's super cheap as well. I guess it kills them off a bit and cleans up the root damage really well (dual purpose). Only reason I had to scrap my grow was because the flies had gotten pretty bad and were landing on the sticky buds and getting stuck. They figured fuck it, why not just have my babies right here on these buds? When I started chopping & clipping I started noticing my buds were infested with root aphids too. It was pretty nasty. I had to take 29 of my 30 girls to the dump and cried all the way. I salvaged 1 plant and literally had to vacuum the bugs out of it...lol.

I didn't end up with root aphids this time BTW. The bugs are Hypoaspis Miles that must have been placed in the soil by Fox Farms to battle fungus gnats, which I found 3 of on sticky traps a couple weeks ago, but they're gone now. Finding thousands of tiny mite-like creatures crawling around your pots is quite disturbing, Fox Farms should put some kind of warning on there for potential predatory soil mites. Just fed my girls a few hours ago and they're doing lovely.

Root aphids in the center hanging out on the leaf in all life stages...and my Lemon Kush getting tossed.

 

[sully98115]

I have a huge outbreak of aphids right now and am lookin for any advice, i've been using neem oil but its not doing a whole lot.. I think im going to make up a tobacco, cayanne spray and see how that does...

 

[Tha206]

If you're in veg, then you can beat them with some of the really bad systemic pesticides. I think Bayer Tree & Shrub has been reported to work on them, amongst others. Sorry I can't advise you better on which ones work. It will take at least 2 months for the poison to get out of the plant.

If you're in flower, you're pretty much fucked. It's gonna be painful, but you're gonna have to trash EVERYTHING, sterilize your place and start over. Plants, pots, saucers, trays, fans, stakes...anything those fuckers can hide in. Then you need to bomb the place with Dr. Doom foggers twice, 1 week apart. Then go in there and vacuum and wipe it all down with bleach water. It sucks brother, I know, but you have to do it. Neem oil will do NOTHING to this scourge of the earth. Trust me, I fought and lost. You just don't have very many options when you're in flower. I didn't listen either when people told me to cut my losses ASAP. Do yourself a favor and listen to what I'm telling you.

If you know who gave them to you, I suggest you go pound their face in. I got mine from a shitty clone dealer on Craigslist. He denied it, but I know better. The people at the grow shop told me they're not even native to Seattle, they came here in infected clones from California and that it has become a rampant problem here and in Colorado over the past couple years.

 

[physiologia]

I used Bayer Fruit and Citrus. The tree and shrub has potassium chloride and a bunch of other random stuff that I'm not comfortable with. The imidacloprid in Fruit and Citrus is 7x less concentrated. I've hit them with it more than once.
It hasn't worked. It was good as a knock down. Bayer Fruit and Citrus has no effect on root aphids.
I do not have flyers, most of what I see are white bodied with a few, 10% brown bodied aphids crawling around.


Bayer makes Intercept, its 60% Imidacloprid and I think it's not legal to sell it in the US. In fact I think the Canadian government regulates it. You have to declare an emergency and petition the Canadian government to use it.

Azatrol does not work, SNS 203 does not work. Fruit and Citrus does not work. I have quadrupled the doses and have administered them over a two week period and I still have them.
Root aphids will win.

 

[physiologia]

these threads are slow

update:
I purchased Pyganic, a 1.4% OMRI pyrethrins concentrate in some type of oil base

$90.00 for a quart

recommendation is 8 mL per gallon


I was dripping it full strength on individual root aphids I could see crawling around on the coco surface


no effect at all

 

[HeartlandHank]

these threads are slow

update:
I purchased Pyganic, a 1.4% OMRI pyrethrins concentrate in some type of oil base

$90.00 for a quart

recommendation is 8 mL per gallon


I was dripping it full strength on individual root aphids I could see crawling around on the coco surface


no effect at all

8/ml will have no effect... 30-40ml/gallon...

I treated with pyganic ec 1.4 as a drench at 40ml/gallon. Twice, spread by about 4 days... The mites were nowhere to be found for almost two weeks. They came back, but they are in very small numbers.

To be more effective you need to continue treatments. Also dunk rather than drench. However, the oils hurt your roots. So you need to get on with rhizotonic or root excel after a string of treatments.

Really, it is just good for fighting them back enough to finish a flower off... for veg, use merit 75, quarantining plant, bug bombs, and a serious detailed cleaning.

If you use pyganic though. 40/ml gallon. raise your lights, it makes them photo sensitive.

 

[Lunchbox442]

Need to get rid of root aphids in your soil and on your plants. This will also work on fungus gnats. Can be used as soil drench and as foiler spray. It's called merit 75 made by bayer. Ask your local grow shop or look online. People in the landscape industry can get it. Reminder it is an insecticide so if you wanna stay all "ORGANIC" your just a retard waiting to fail. But if your smart you will listen to me get rid of them in 24 hours. Good growing.

 

[Kite High]

Malathion and be done with it

 

[AliCakes]

Need to get rid of root aphids in your soil and on your plants. This will also work on fungus gnats. Can be used as soil drench and as foiler spray. It's called merit 75 made by bayer. Ask your local grow shop or look online. People in the landscape industry can get it. Reminder it is an insecticide so if you wanna stay all "ORGANIC" your just a retard waiting to fail. But if your smart you will listen to me get rid of them in 24 hours. Good growing.

There are many reasons to stay "all organic" other than being a retard.

Having said that, I got a pretty bad infestation of root aphids a while back and did try non organic solutions. After spending a lot of money and killing a lot of plants with harsh chemicals, the only solution to work for me was an organic product. Botanigard is made up of an all natural fungi that eats the bugs from the inside out. It worked beautifully and I highly recommend it but it is very expensive. If you aren't willing to shell out the money for it, then you are probably going to need to start over.

 

[cc2ss]

Has anyone tried Lady bugs and pirate bugs to battle aphids and mites ? I had not heard of this until just the other day. Seems like great way to go if it works.

 

[jondamon]

Has anyone tried Lady bugs and pirate bugs to battle aphids and mites ? I had not heard of this until just the other day. Seems like great way to go if it works.

This thread is about root aphids.

How often do you see ladybugs digging into a plants root system???


J

 

[FrozenChozen]

This thread is about root aphids.

How often do you see ladybugs digging into a plants root system???


J

I definitely recommend HYPOASPIS MILES! I'm on the hunt for some to battle some thrips right now, they work great for thrips, gnats, white flies, spider mites, and even root aphids. I have battled most of these pests with these AWESOME predator mites and would recommend them to anyone in flower or veg!

 

[darkcycle]

Okay, I've lived with these bastards now for over three years. I have run a perpetual harvest now in the same location for ten years because it's my only source of medicine. You can keep your plants going with a minimum of loss, although they may not be pretty by harvest time. As soon as you see the signs, you need to act and stick with this till harvest. Most people who get these bastards are using soil, although they like DWC too (for the huge accessible root balls).
These damage the plant by going after the roots, feeding on them (while leaving a substance that doesn't let the root heal), and moving on to a fresh root. The roots will wind up severely yucky and brown, and about three weeks into flower you will see the damage visibly on the lower leaves. It starts as various deficiencies, and is irreversible. In fact, because of the wounds in the roots, if you try adding a chelated product (ANY chelate) it's like putting salt on a wound, and the damage will accelerate. I don't use fertilizer, I use cooked amended soil. If you DO fertilize, stop when they show up. Your girls will be a lot hungrier of you try feeding them, trust me.
Here's the products and how and whys: You need to get Dutch Master Zone, and begin using it at the highest recommended strength. This will kill lots of beneficials, but won't fully sterilize the soil, but it does give the wounds a nice, antiseptic rinse, and seems to inhibit the root aphid cycling...fliers will be way fewer. Also, an enzyme product, like Hygrozyme or Cannazyme. This will help digest the dead root material, and also help keep the wounds clean. And equally important is a B vitamin product (I prefer Superthrive), this will help the plant develop new root material and deal with the stress. When I hit on this the first time, I actually though they had gone away, but within DAYS of stopping they plants looked like I'd never done anything. Some strains are clearly more affected by them than others. I have pretty good luck with diesel and Blueberry, as well as Afgooey. But they went after the Cherry OG I tried like ants after cotton candy. They looked like a flame thrower hit them. I have no issues with them living in the room now, although they do flare up worse when the weather outside causes the temps in my room to go up. They subside when the temps at night go down into the low fifties. Honestly, they don't cause enough damage now to make me feel like I need to shut down, although they have reduced my yields a bit.
The lower leaves will yellow and die. Leave them hang on the plant, they won't come off with a touch like a really dead leaf, the plant will try to hang on to them. When you pull one of these dead, necrotic-spotted and upwardly clawed leaves, the next leaf up will be gone by the next day. After buds have got to be their full size, but haven't hardened yet, they can be removed, but usually I just leave 'em. If the populations get so that they're costing you too much, you can knock them back a little with Azamax, Botanigard, or SNS 203, but that's only going to knock them back a little.
On top of pots in Veg, I put a layer of perlite and when it dries between waterings I'll sprinkle a little Diatomaceous Earth on for good measure. Makes it harder for the fliers to emerge and seems to confuse 'em, they don't like walking around in it. Clone in rockwool miniblocks....they will infest peat pellets and eat the roots before they have had a chance to appear. They seem to hate rockwool, and the only folks I know who've killed them were growing in it. I'm considering changing entirely to see if that let's me get rid of them...but really, not that bad to live with them.

 

[Dannabis!]

Predatory Nematodes as a root drench should help to destroy root aphid colonies.

Whenever we are nematoding at my grow, I find nearly no root aphids.

 

[Ed_h]

Tha is this the same crawler you have? I have tried a barrage of solutions and nothing takes these things down! Worried they're bad bugs and don't want to willingly transfer to the bloom room if so. They don't really like the plants, more the cup rims and top of soil from what I can tell. Plants are doing some funky things here and there but I think it's all the stuff I tried to kill these bastards. They seem to be getting healthier so I was unsure of aphids. But I do have fliers of some sort. Confused