Debate #3

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure what is being suggested about China occupying territory and what role the US gov. should play in that, could someone clarify that for me?

Talking to other countries is the goal of diplomacy, if we don't talk, we eventually shoot. Not talking is the worst strategy a country can have regarding foreign policy, imo. The only time you shouldn't talk is when you're trying to reason with an unreasonable person or government.

I brought up the NPT to make the point that every president since then, including Reagan, the rights supreme leader, has supported it. FW is making it seem like because Obama does too, he's "naive". He does not realistically believe the world will just up and get rid of all the nukes, imo, it's naive to think he does.

He still won the debate.
 

NLXSK1

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure what is being suggested about China occupying territory and what role the US gov. should play in that, could someone clarify that for me?

Talking to other countries is the goal of diplomacy, if we don't talk, we eventually shoot. Not talking is the worst strategy a country can have regarding foreign policy, imo. The only time you shouldn't talk is when you're trying to reason with an unreasonable person or government.

I brought up the NPT to make the point that every president since then, including Reagan, the rights supreme leader, has supported it. FW is making it seem like because Obama does too, he's "naive". He does not realistically believe the world will just up and get rid of all the nukes, imo, it's naive to think he does.

He still won the debate.
How long have we been *talking* to Iran about it's nuclear weapons program?

How has that worked out so far?
 

FreedomWorks

Well-Known Member
China thinks they own us. China is going where they want, and doing what they want. Just like Russia and soon Iran. You want to see proof Pada? I'll show you proof....
 

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
China thinks they own us. China is going where they want, and doing what they want. Just like Russia and soon Iran. You want to see proof Pada? I'll show you proof....
China could make the dollar worth more as recycled linen-paper.

Somewhere in the region of between 3 and 5.5 (some sources report) trillion in Treasury notes?

Don't provoke the sleeping dragon in the East.
 
Politics give the people the illusion they have a choice. I believe we do not, Or at least a lot less than most think. Goverment will be corrupt as long as lobbiest and corporations have congress and seniet in there pocket.
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
How long have we been *talking* to Iran about it's nuclear weapons program?

How has that worked out so far?
Iran doesn't posses a nuclear weapon, so I'd say it's worked great.

What do you suggest we do about Iranian nuclear policy?


China thinks they own us. China is going where they want, and doing what they want. Just like Russia and soon Iran. You want to see proof Pada? I'll show you proof....
What are you suggesting the US's role in regards to China be?

Politics give the people the illusion they have a choice. I believe we do not, Or at least a lot less than most think. Goverment will be corrupt as long as lobbiest and corporations have congress and seniet in there pocket.
100% correct.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Which is essentially ground level... 200feet is SEMANTICs when it comes to the discussion we were having.

The trinity test was close enough to ground level to produce glass out of the sand which was heated and pressurized. It is also what we see when large meteors strike the planet through impact. And yes, vaporization did occur. In fact, Dr. Oppenheimer even put on sunscreen for the blast, which worried the others lol.

Lastly:
"At 5:29:45 (Mountain War Time) on July 16, 1945, in a white blaze that stretched from the basin of the Jemez Mountains in northern New Mexico to the still-dark skies, "The Gadget" ushered in the Atomic Age. The light of the explosion then turned orange as the atomic fireball began shooting upwards at 360 feet per second, reddening and pulsing as it cooled. The characteristic mushroom cloud of radioactive vapor materialized at 30,000 feet. Beneath the cloud, all that remained of the soil at the blast site were fragments of jade green radioactive glass created by the heat of the reaction.



The brilliant light from the detonation pierced the early morning skies with such intensity that residents from a faraway neighboring community would swear that the sun came up twice that day. Even more astonishing is that a blind girl saw the flash 120 miles away."

e;
fuck double post, my bad, thought I was editting and never checked
If it were a test like Ivy Mike or Castle Bravo (technically a ground-level test, but in actuality the bomb's center of action was 15 to 20 feet off the beach) I'd accept that it's just semantics.
However I acknowledge that arguing this is about minutiae. cn
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
romney says the pentagon's perfumed princes claim they need 310 ships to do their job. either way navy funding is CONGRESS' job, not el presidente's

china currently occupies tibet, the land of the uygurs, and portions of the norther steppes that have not been in china's hands since Chin Sher Huang Di went on his fabled quest for the elixir of immortality.

who wants to talk to russia? dude. they dont even have standardized spelling for fuck's sake!

the non proliferation treaty is a running joke. it is a blind and toothless jackal snapping at it's own tail. either way you slice it Jack Johnson and John Jackson both spent the debate arguing over who went too far, and who didnt go too far enough in their identical separated at birth foreign policy positions.

at least Romney followed the rules of the debate when The O-Man and even the "moderator" spent the evening violating them.
Tibet was incorporated in the '50s. East Turkestan (land of the Uighurs) became Chinese in '49. Not sure about which northern steppe regions you mean, but your examples do not appear to support NL's (edit: No; 'twas FreedomWorks' ) claim that China is "starting to" ( = in the current process of) take (taking) over new territory.
It strikes me as baseless alarmism. cn
 

timbo123

Active Member
Obama isn't reducing the number of ships, fleets get outdated, that's what happens over time. Though some ships are becoming outdated, the newest ships and Carriers are top of the line and will remain in service for decades.

Our Air Force is the strongest, most advanced AF in the entire world by 10 fold. F22, Joint Strike Fighter, F117, all technologically superior aircraft. Not to mention the track record of the F15 and F16.

It's terrible strategy to increase the defense budget when it's not needed, especially at a time of economic crisis.
Obama made an excellent point that the US spends more on our military than the NEXT 10 COUNTRIES COMBINED. This is clearly unnecessary. It is supremely foolish to borrow trillions from other countries so that we can act as the police force of the world. It is outdated thinking.
 

NLXSK1

Well-Known Member
Tibet was incorporated in the '50s. East Turkestan (land of the Uighurs) became Chinese in '49. Not sure about which northern steppe regions you mean, but your examples do not appear to support NL's (edit: No; 'twas FreedomWorks' ) claim that China is "starting to" ( = in the current process of) take (taking) over new territory.
It strikes me as baseless alarmism. cn
Not mine.. I think China is flexing it's muscle on territories in question but I dont know enough about it to really comment.
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Obama made an excellent point that the US spends more on our military than the NEXT 10 COUNTRIES COMBINED. This is clearly unnecessary. It is supremely foolish to borrow trillions from other countries so that we can act as the police force of the world. It is outdated thinking.
10 is conservative, it's much more than 10

and I agree
 

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
If it were a test like Ivy Mike or Castle Bravo (technically a ground-level test, but in actuality the bomb's center of action was 15 to 20 feet off the beach) I'd accept that it's just semantics.
However I acknowledge that arguing this is about minutiae. cn
You won't win with that guy, important details don't really matter to him.
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
Tibet was incorporated in the '50s. East Turkestan (land of the Uighurs) became Chinese in '49. Not sure about which northern steppe regions you mean, but your examples do not appear to support NL's (edit: No; 'twas FreedomWorks' ) claim that China is "starting to" ( = in the current process of) take (taking) over new territory.
It strikes me as baseless alarmism. cn
as long as tibet as "incorporated" thats ok. i thought they got invaded and occupied.

east turkistan "became" chinese. ohh i guess i was misinformed.

i guess turkey is just "borrowing" 1/3 of cypress

and we are "just chillin at our homey's crib" in afghansitan.

thats the part of politics i despise most. the weasel words.

im just venting, no offense mister Klondike spokesman.
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
Uhh! Uhh! Uhh!

Yeah that beat's tight, imma rock this shit,

Yeah! Uhh! Yeah! You know it!

Gimme that mic!


Back the fuck up
'cause im comin in swingin
got a car elevator
you know that shit be blingin!
on the streets of funky provo
my homeys call me mitt
down ass mormons
you know we dont take shit!

jammin on the sabbath
with my tabernacle choir
never hit the reefer
it could never get me higher
seven houses on my balance sheet
you know that shit's on fire!
got accountants on the payroll
you cant prove that im a liar!

been three generations
since a romney swung a hammer
my attorneys got my back
they can keep me out the slammer!

yeah, my man ryan got the mic, slang it homey!


romney and ryan gonna turn this motherfucker out
campaigning for the whitehouse is what it's all about
droppin smooth rhymes on a plutocratic tip
tax breaks for the wealthy
thats how we let it rip

from janesville to kenosha you know that im the man
pimpin fresh electorate they be down with my plan
cuttin off the geezers, gonna put em in the street
no security in yo' social when i rock that funky beat

take it R-Money!

uhh uhh uhh! yeah!

dancin horses in my stable
you know that i am able
to lay it down and turnaround an e-con-omy unstable!

i laid it down in utah,
then i rocked the mic in boston
look at all my money
you know that i am awesome!

one position monday, by tuesday i be switchin
you cant nail me down
on all the bullshit i be pitchin!

yo buck, git yo liberal ass in here and lay it down in position contra!!

yeah, uhh uhh yeah!

we gonna let the beat loop while buck gets his verses together.

mmmhmmm yeah karl rove scratchin the track

wicket wicket waaaahhh wicket wicket waaaahh!

yeah. you know this one's goin platinum, just like mah grillz.

Candy, i believe the gentleman's time has expired, and it is now my turn to speak.

Thank you miss crowley, ill be brief.

gentlemen, im afraid that beat is unacceptable.

Miss Pelosi, please take control of the turntables and lay me down something smooth, on the Chi-town tip

mmm yes... thats optimal.

to my esteemed opponant i have but one thing to say,

will you please drop the mic, and take a step back
Barrack and Joey B are here to boost this track
your beat was unimpressive, and at rhyming skills you lack
we have checked out your plan, and you must be smoking crack!

I was born in honolulu, this is established fact
I released my birth certificate, and yet still i'm attacked
Documents and evidence to the ceiling i have stacked
between you and mister trump you display your lack of tact!

I was raised in jakarta, i admit this much is true
but im not a secret muslim, any more than i'm a jew!
i've attended christian churches since the time i was two
but you've pushed this silly story till your faces have turned blue!

i put a muzzle on joe biden
to keep his gaffes in check
he'll not say a word that sounds absurd,my campaign he will not wreck
Ive got this down, i run this town, my prompter's too high tech!

Gentlemen, you see how i stepped up the tempo there? That's just how i do when i've got my flow on.

but enough exposition, i believe it's time to continue versing you on your own track.

Mister Biden, if you would be so kind...

thank you Mister President. Nancy, would you mind terribly switching up to some old school Wu-Tang Flavour? Thank you.

WEEEEEEEEEELL...

you can see that I am Old, But you know that i aint Dirty
Treat you like Deliverance Cuz Damn your mouths are Purty!
Jon Voight's up in your posse so i think you know whats comin
My dick up in yo ass, cuz damn my cock loves slummin!
Im in it to my balls when im ridin on your colon
i'll drop my load, then drain my choad and leave your asshole swollen!

Hung like a donkey, thats how my party rolls.
Ill ride you rough and strut my stuff until we hit the polls
Up between your hams, thats where i'll make my play
youll feel my meat until youre beat, on the next election day!

yeah, you GOP motherfuckers, the election aint the only thing comin, yeah you heard me, im commin too, up in your GUTS! Bitches! you aint got shit! how do i know? cuz I'M UP IN YA! Up to my nutz! yeah you dont want none of this! but youre gonna get it anyhow!

umm yes, thank you Joe, that was... needlessly descriptive.

I believe the distinguished gentleman from the great state of Texas, Representative Paul would like a word as well. Congressman, the floor is yours.


Hold on, Hold on! The Donald has something to say!

move over gramps! im taking this verse, youre too old anyhow.

Youre Fired!

The Donald's in the house reppin NYC
i got a fly show, it's on NBC
I get my face in the papers, you know i dont be trippin
I'm a media whore and so much more, i think my toupe' might be slippin.

That kenyan said my name
it was a few verses back
He said my name, increased my fame
now im here on the attack!

a cert of live birth
thats all that he's displayed
my stable of well paid "experts"
can prove in photoshop it's made!

You know my name, you know my fame
I got my name on a tower
Iv'e got a a show, just so you know
it airs in the eight o'clock hour

if you want proof i speak the troof
tune in to NBC
just watch my show, and then youll know
IT'S ALL ABOUT ME!

security, security, could somebody get this idiot out of here? please?

Umm, Candy, if i may, let the president handle this.

SECRET SERVICE! HE'S GOT A GUN! ASSASSIN! Donald Trump is an ASSASSIN!!

Thank you, gentlemen. Really choke up on the backswing.

Yes... Thats Optimal.

you might want to do a cavity search. theres rumors al quaeda is experimenting with anally concealed bombs. dont be afraid to get in there. up to your elbow at least.

Finally, i can grab the mic.
My Name's Ron Paul, and this is my Real Conservative All Star Orchestra. we're going to slow it up for you tonight and give you the kind of music you might not be familiar with.
I brought my pal Gary Johnson on the drums. let me have a little of that sinatra beat. yeah, brushes on the snare. thats how we did it when we still had a real constitutional republic. gary, my man, get up on the kick drum too, Put some bottom in it. show these kids how we used to swing.

over on the standup Bass i got my main man Alan Keyes, take that bassline for a walk alan, and dont be afraid to get it a little dirty.

On guitar we have Tony Brown, and hes going to keep the melody going strong. why dont you give us something in D minor.

over here in the horn section we have Arnold Schwarzenegger on trumpet, and Fred Thompson with the french horn.

Just to make sure we keep it tight, and keep it real, we got Joe Lieberman on the viola. work those strings Joey Baby. Rosin isnt that expensive. use some up.

slow and easy boys,
a one and a two and a three..

The Autumn chill
up new england way
the sweet sea breezes
of a sunny day
the sound of the gulls
on san francisco bay

The sweet song of birds
on a blackberry vine
the scent of the wash,
fresh in off the line

These are the things
that make life worthwhile
the laughter of children
and your sweetheart's smile

all of these things
could soon be no more
by the lobbyists greed
and interminable wars

our bold ship of state
has crashed on the rocks
who is to blame?
it's these fucking cocks!

Molto allegro boys!

Do you have any work?
No No No No!
do you trust these jerks?
No No No No!
can you buy enough fuel?
No No No No!
Do you want to eat gruel?
No No No No!
can you pay all your bills?
No No No No!
can you afford all your pills?
No No No No!

Well we've voted for this guy,
and we've voted for that
our pockets stay empty
while the bankers get fat!

the federal reserve
has been fucking us all
theyve protected their cronies
and now they must fall!

their wars in the east
have drained all our wealth
but they've got a plan
to make us pay for our health!

does this seem fair?
No No No No!
do you think they care?
No No No No!

well ive got a new plan
and it may seem insane
to unseat the bankers
and let them feel our pain!

they say it's impossible
that it just cant be done
well i tell you right now
it's not gonna be fun!

we're aground on the rocks
with these dicks at the helm
no more fiat currency
we need coin of the realm!

do you know what in sayin?
are you catchin my drift?
we need to stop playing
and institute thrift!

skeep a dap a deedely yap
skeebadee doo!

is gold the best?
Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah!
will you invest?
Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah!
can we pay down the debt?
Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah!
can we take care of our vets?
Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah!

well youve heard from the singer
and youve heard from the band
give these assholes the finger
and vote for my man!

Gary's still in it
he needs your support
vote Gary Johnson
He's our last resort!

dont write in ron paul
i dont want the job
vote Gary Johnson
and throw out these slobs!
 

kelly4

Well-Known Member
Uhh! Uhh! Uhh!

Yeah that beat's tight, imma rock this shit,

Yeah! Uhh! Yeah! You know it!

Gimme that mic!


Back the fuck up
'cause im comin in swingin
got a car elevator
you know that shit be blingin!
on the streets of funky provo
my homeys call me mitt
down ass mormons
you know we dont take shit!

jammin on the sabbath
with my tabernacle choir
never hit the reefer
it could never get me higher
seven houses on my balance sheet
you know that shit's on fire!
got accountants on the payroll
you cant prove that im a liar!

been three generations
since a romney swung a hammer
my attorneys got my back
they can keep me out the slammer!

yeah, my man ryan got the mic, slang it homey!


romney and ryan gonna turn this motherfucker out
campaigning for the whitehouse is what it's all about
droppin smooth rhymes on a plutocratic tip
tax breaks for the wealthy
thats how we let it rip

from janesville to kenosha you know that im the man
pimpin fresh electorate they be down with my plan
cuttin off the geezers, gonna put em in the street
no security in yo' social when i rock that funky beat

take it R-Money!

uhh uhh uhh! yeah!

dancin horses in my stable
you know that i am able
to lay it down and turnaround an e-con-omy unstable!

i laid it down in utah,
then i rocked the mic in boston
look at all my money
you know that i am awesome!

one position monday, by tuesday i be switchin
you cant nail me down
on the bullshit i be pitchin!

yo buck, git yo liberal ass in here and lay it down in position contra!!
Word...that was illin'.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
as long as tibet as "incorporated" thats ok. i thought they got invaded and occupied.

east turkistan "became" chinese. ohh i guess i was misinformed.

i guess turkey is just "borrowing" 1/3 of cypress

and we are "just chillin at our homey's crib" in afghansitan.

thats the part of politics i despise most. the weasel words.

im just venting, no offense mister Klondike spokesman.
And yet this doesn't help me understand the proposition that China is "starting to invade" anywhere.

You do realize that the demure historical terms like "was incorporated into" do nothing to either describe or deny the nastiness of the process.
And if Turkey borrowed any cypresses, do you thing they'd trade them back to Lebanon for, perhaps, some nice bologna? cn
 
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