Question about PPM measurement.

[GooberGrape]

Ok, I think it was probably a combination of high nutrients and pH changing too rapidly. I flushed overnight and then I got the nutrients at 750 ppm. I did this on Thursday and then changed reservoir on Friday. It seems to have stopped. I was told that I should let the pH go up and down naturally as long as it stays in a specific range; 5.5 to 6.3. I have been doing this since Friday, I haven't had to add any pH up or down, and things are looking better. My pH has stabilized at 5.92 to 5.95. It hasn't gone any lower or higher than that range. Now, was it good advice to let the pH drift up and down naturally as long as it stays in that range? Also, before when I wold top off the water level every day I would do it with water that wasn't pH adjusted. I would adjust the pH in the reservoir every day after adding water that was WAY alkaline. I have also switched from tap water to reverse osmosis water since Friday. I have to pay $1.25 for every five gallons I buy but it is probably worth it. Any comments?

 

[Krondizzel]

Yes. 5.5-6.1 is your optimum range. Reason being, different nutrients uptake at different PH levels. I will post a picture that will help you.

Basically what I have found, is when plants eat food, your PPM will drop, and your PH will raise.

As they drink water, the ppm will rise, and the PH will lower.

Stability means, either they aren't eating/drinking, or they are doing it at a steady rate (which is ideal)

My PH is always changing. Up/down, left right, whatever. It's gonna change. Learning your trend patterns, almost like a stock chart will help you along the way too. My PH will be low when I wake up, and throughout the day, I am adjusting it by adding 6.1 water. I will let it rise throughout the day and it usually checks out at 6.0-6.1 when I go to bed. When I wake up, sometimes I find it at 5.2 and I have to start adding water again.

Going outside of your 5.5-6.1 doesn't mean your plants will be screwed immediately, but @ 5.2, you don't have long before your plants start getting angry and you start suffering from nutrient lockout (the inability to uptake nutrients even if your in the proper PH range)

Back to the fluctuation: If you look at the picture, you'll see that @ 5.8, your plant can uptake the nutrients CA and MG. If you go up or down, you'll miss one. So yes, letting your PH wander will allow you to pick up certain nutrients along the way. I hope this helps you because the same information was given to me and it has helped out a lot.

 

[Krondizzel]

View attachment 2420799View attachment 2420800

Here you go. This has helped me quite a bit!

 

[GooberGrape]

That helps a lot!

 

[Krondizzel]

I forgot to mention, that I had changed up my feeding schedule to try to stabilize my PH. Doing nutes/water/nutes/water watering schedule was making my PH fluctuate a lot too. Now, I always feed, but I make sure my PPM is consistently lower and feed around the same time of day. (instead of 400ppm every other day, i now go with 200ppm daily) This has helped me keep a bit of stability. Instead of adding 540ppm (400 nutes + 140 base) and then the next day only adding 140ppm (0 nutes + 140 base)... the 200ppm daily is much more consistent for me. You could try it and see if it works for you. If not, well, we can just call it trial and error at that point!

Good luck!

 

[waterdawg]

it will make the leaves curl?? i dunno man, mine were doing it because my PH was off.

They will bow, twist, ends of leaf tips will start rounding off, yellowing at tips, blackened tips on new growth, and they will do this weird arching also if its nute burn. But I also had this from PH being off as well.

With well water its harder to stabalize things and PH is usaully high (mine is 7.5) out of tap and requires PH down.

 

[Krondizzel]

I'm on city and it's 8.3 out of the tap. PH down is a must.

 

[GooberGrape]

Ok, I wasn't adding nutrients throughout the week. I would just check the water pH during the week. How would I go about adding nutrients throughout the week in a DWC setup? What I was told to do was make up my nutrient solution and add water that has no nutrients in it to top off the water levels on a daily basis. And, as soon as I've topped off the water levels with half the total number of gallons the reservoir holds it was time to change the reservoir. This is every six days for me right now.

 

[^Slanty]

You should let the PPM drop for several days and then top up with water and mixed in nutes. You should also be topping up to the same level each day with water! You should not be using PH down and PH up at the same time. By adding water to your fill line each day, you should see a gradual drop in PPM as well as a rise in PH. I let mine drift from 5.7-6.0. If you are on a feed day, make sure you add in your nutes and mix it up good before you adjust your PH, as the nutes will have an affect on the PH.

 

[Krondizzel]

2 options:

a: if you change your rez out on a routine basis like you should, you would measure your ppm to last you for the week. Depending on your rez size and the amount of them that you have, it can be quite easy or quite a chore to change water out. most people change their entire rez out once a week or so. some every other week. all depends on your preference really. 1 week for a DWC would be ideal if you ran an 18gal tote setup.

b: to top off, simply make a new batch of nutes in a separate bucket. get your PPM and PH there. when you mix the two, your still gonna have to make your PH adjustment. the combination of the two PH's will obviously alter the numbers. so ensure that your PH is good to go before walking off.

so, with your DWC, I would just wait till the regular rez water changeout day and make a new batch of tea. I would only really recommend adding water/nute combos to recirc/undercurrent systems, as they are rather bothersome to change the entire system water all at once. reason being the ph is very difficult to balance back again when changing out so much water at once. refer to the waterfarm kit design and you may understand. water stays in lines and you cant quite get all the water out of the system like you can with a DWC. (referring to say, a single bin setup where your only controlling 1 tub of water).

uh, I got stoned and started rambling so ill get back to this in a minute.

 

[Krondizzel]

You should let the PPM drop for several days and then top up with water and mixed in nutes. You should also be topping up to the same level each day with water! You should not be using PH down and PH up at the same time. By adding water to your fill line each day, you should see a gradual drop in PPM as well as a rise in PH. I let mine drift from 5.7-6.0. If you are on a feed day, make sure you add in your nutes and mix it up good before you adjust your PH, as the nutes will have an affect on the PH.

Yes, you really need to keep an eye on this and babysit this at first, to establish a stock like trend for yourself what the plant is doing. sometimes you'll be adding PH down. other times you'll be adding with water to raise the PH. sometimes you'll stick with a low ppm mix a consistent basis. but once you figure out what they are doing, you will be able to tweak and alter how you add nutes and figure out which numbers suit you and your strain best.

 

[GooberGrape]

Well, thanks for all the advice! The plant is looking healthy now. It is appreciated!

 

[Krondizzel]

anytime. that's what we are here for.

 

[waterdawg]

Here's what I do as topping off res can be quite a chore for me as I dont have water in shed. My main res's hold 100L and that is large enough that I refill once every seven days. I have kept enough notes to know how much of each item I need to add to get real close to ideal. I do watch my levels everyday but mainly to spot issues and to slightly adjust PH, the nutes I leave alone for the seven days until change out. I feel that if not using destilled or RO water this is the only way of keeping things balanced kinda lol. I have let res's go longer due to tds and PH staying the same but plant still shows distress after 8-9 days. This was my first grow and PH was the most frustrating thing until i dialed it in with notes and reading and posting lol. BTW I bought a litre of PH up when started and havn't opened it...but have went through a shit load of down lol. This is the Latest bud that happened to fall off my White Russian grow thats not quite ready but I ran out .

 

[Krondizzel]

I bought ph down and ph up and after a while..... I started wondering why they make PH up in the first place lol

as far as PH down, just start buying buy Qt/G because you'll eventually go through a pint of PH down in no time. Well, depending on if its your first time or not. I sure as hell had to figure out the ph up/down thing and went through a lot of down that I really didn't need to. (when they say add drops, add drops, they aint jokin lol) GH ph down is some concentrated stuff.

 

[mountainboy]

I'm not sure if one could do this in DWC, but it solved all my problems in my E&F system. I doubled the size of my rez. I needed 50 gal rez for my tables,after some trial and error I went to 100 gallon rez. Now my EC & ph are rock solid for two weeks. Even when water level drops things stay stable. I dont have to do any ad backs because theres always more then enough juice in the rez. I guess maybe if one was using a 5gal bucket,they could try using a 10gal. If using a 25gal tote try a 50. I know space is always an issue in the grow room so this may not be an option for some,but wanted to let you know what worked for me.

 

[Krondizzel]

Actually it will work great for dwc. I use an 18 gallon tote for my DWC's. PH is usually stable as hell (1 plant per 18 gallon tote)

 

[waterdawg]

I have to add 200ml to 100L res to get it to 6ish and good for 7 days. And yes I buy it by the gallon!!! lol. I think it is 17% phosphoric acid but could be wrong!

 

[^Slanty]

I have to add 200ml to 100L res to get it to 6ish and good for 7 days. And yes I buy it by the gallon!!! lol. I think it is 17% phosphoric acid but could be wrong!

I am not sure what kind of nutes and PH down you are using, but 200ml to 100L seems ridiculously high?! My UC setup holds a guesstimate of 150L. I use ~30-40ml to get my PH adjusted after my nutes have been added in.(maybe 50ml at most).Your statement about having to use RO or distilled water in order to run the same solution longer between change outs is BS. I run tap water and change my system 1-2 times per grow. I am in week 6 of flower now and have only changed out once the entire grow.

 

[waterdawg]

The RO thing was not to mean longer changes just that you know where your starting at so easier to monitor things, but like I also said, I really dont know that much about hydro, its my first attempt!!!!! and I am using 17% phosphoric acid (tried 3 different companies) and I guessed it is what it is! Perhaps my tap water is different from yours.....lol. I have read that alot of people change out there res every 7-10 days so I kinda thought it was a good thing, but let me stress again this is my first hydro grow. Also everyone I talked to has said I should be using RO water, I really dont want to, fuckin things are expensive...lol. And my nutes are not very well known as they are mixed locally and yes that may be an issue, is there something I should I should be doing different, because yes I would love to stop buying the PH shit by the gallon? I even was thinking of battery acid.... a bit stronger I think!!!