Has anybody read Antonin Scalia's latest book, "Reading Law"?

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
but i already am disallowed my opposition to forced multiculturalism by YOUR decree, and as i understand, your bestiality preferences are prohibited in oregon.
which is the fallacy of his reductio ad absurdum.

homosexuality does not cause harm to others. murder does. how does a hack like that get to wear such a nice robe?

by the way, most of us call it desegregation, not forced multiculturalism.
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
which is the fallacy of his reductio ad absurdum.

homosexuality does not cause harm to others. murder does. how does a hack like that get to wear such a nice robe?

by the way, most of us call it desegregation, not forced multiculturalism.
multiculturalism is not "desegregation"

multiculturalism is the distinctly postmodern idea of deconstructionism at work to re-shape society in their perverse image of moral and ethical relativism.

it's angsty blind rebellion against everything viewed as old fashioned, disguised as anti-racism. it's a mao style cultural revolution, with the book burnings still to come.
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
multiculturalism is not "desegregation"

multiculturalism is the distinctly postmodern idea of deconstructionism at work to re-shape society in their perverse image of moral and ethical relativism.

it's angsty blind rebellion against everything viewed as old fashioned, disguised as anti-racism. it's a mao style cultural revolution, with the book burnings still to come.
persecutedconservativewhitemaleitis. take two heaping helpings of cannabis and alcohol, resist the urge to take loaded firearms to clock towers, wash your sheets, and call me in the morning.
 

desert dude

Well-Known Member
Just an odd after thought: my two favorite supreme court justices are Scalia and Thomas. Both are textualists.
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
[h=2]I Get To Determine Whether Gay People Can Marry[/h]





Last week, the Supreme Court decided to take up a pair of cases related to gay marriage, cases that will for the first time determine the constitutionality of laws denying marriage rights to same-sex couples. As a member of the nation’s highest court for the past 21 years, I can remember few rulings of such consequence as these two, which will affect the lives of so many people. So as the time approaches, I ask all Americans to think long and hard on what these decisions will mean for the future of our nation, and also think long and hard about the fact that I, Clarence Thomas, will get to determine whether gay people can marry each other.


That’s right, me: an embarrassingly undistinguished justice with a history of ethical misconduct who hasn’t spoken during an oral argument in almost seven years. I get to rule on whether gay people should have basic human rights.


Pretty crazy, right? I’m one of only nine Americans in a position to decide, in a matter of months, whether our democracy values the right of a group of human beings to get married.

Now, if you’re having a hard time wrapping your head around that one, you’re not alone. If you had told me in 1991 that I would one day have the power to decide the basic rights of millions of people, I would have laughed in your face. Back then, I was a 43-year-old appeals court judge with a flimsy record on civil rights and abortion who thought affirmative action was a form of “social engineering”—not exactly the kinds of views you’d expect in a jurist destined for the Supreme Court.


Yet lo and behold, that same year, despite accusations that I sexually harassed attorney Anita Hill, my appointment to replace retired justice Thurgood Marshall was confirmed. Soon enough, I was abstaining from oral arguments for years at a time and failing to disclose my wife’s sources of income.


I’ve spoken maybe two times in the past decade, for Christ’s sake. Think about that. That’s hundreds and hundreds of cases during which I’ve sat silently and twiddled my thumbs as my colleagues actively interrogated lawyers and posed tough questions about the scope and applications of laws—cases to which I barely paid attention, sometimes appearing to nap on the bench. And I get to have a say in deciding on a constitutional level whether or not all adult members of the human race have the right to recognize their unions? That historic judgment falls on my shoulders?


I’m not trying to belabor the point here. I just want you all to be fully aware that the future of gay and lesbian citizens in this country comes down to the opinion of nine people, one of whom—me—fell asleep during the inauguration of the first black president and believes states have the right to arrest illegal immigrants without a warrant.


Speaking of, here are some other things I believe: felons have the right to bear arms unless the state explicitly forbids it, Roe v. Wade was wrongly decided and should be overturned, corporations and unions should be permitted to spend unlimited amounts of money on political campaigns, and those campaigns should not be required to disclose donors.

Oh, and in 2003 I dissented in the court’s decision to strike down a Texas law prohibiting homosexual acts.


Yet in six months, in the year 2013, I’ll have the opportunity to decide whether hospitals can legally bar gay people from visiting their loved ones.


Take a second and think about the gay people in your life. Your best friend, your mom, your dad, your teacher, your coworker, your partner, you. I get to decide whether these people face institutional discrimination. The same goes for bisexual people, transgender people, and anyone else whose right to marry may be prohibited at the state or federal level. They are all searching for happiness, and their happiness all depends on the opinion of a man who once asked if someone put pubic hair on his Coke.


You want to hear something even weirder? Antonin Scalia gets to decide all this too.


So before these two judicial decisions are upon us, take a moment to reflect on what they mean for the future of our nation. As the tide of history turns and decisions of tremendous importance reach the highest court in the land, I will be there to judge them. Now, tomorrow, and for the rest of my life
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Just an odd after thought: my two favorite supreme court justices are Scalia and Thomas. Both are textualists.
no wonder.

bigots stick together.

I dissented in the court’s decision to strike down a Texas law prohibiting homosexual acts.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
multiculturalism is not "desegregation"

multiculturalism is the distinctly postmodern idea of deconstructionism at work to re-shape society in their perverse image of moral and ethical relativism.

it's angsty blind rebellion against everything viewed as old fashioned, disguised as anti-racism. it's a mao style cultural revolution, with the book burnings still to come.
Perverse, or perverted?
And in re moral relativism, the alternative is moral absolutism, which has a deep history of being awful. cn
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
desert dude, proclaimed "libertarian", stands with judges who believe that the government should be able to legislate what sex acts two consenting adults perform in the privacy of their own bedroom.

:clap:

yay for liberty!
 

ginwilly

Well-Known Member
desert dude, proclaimed "libertarian", stands with judges who believe that the government should be able to legislate what sex acts two consenting adults perform in the privacy of their own bedroom.

:clap:

yay for liberty!
That's consistent with States rights though. All states have idiotic laws but if the Republic is going to work we have to let the people in those states work out those idiotic, civil rights infringing laws. One state won't let you pump your own boyfriend, another won't let you pump your own gas. There can be escape from state law without suffering, the same can't be said about idiotic Federal laws. Even if our lawmakers batter a hall of fame 1 out of 3 bills being a hit, that leaves us with 2 out of the three being outs. Some outs are uglier than others in politics. Please do not encourage them to pile on, all they need is an excuse.

I think this is just reason eleventygabillion to limit the powers we grant our central government.
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
That's consistent with States rights though. All states have idiotic laws but if the Republic is going to work we have to let the people in those states work out those idiotic, civil rights infringing laws. One state won't let you pump your own boyfriend, another won't let you pump your own gas. There can be escape from state law without suffering, the same can't be said about idiotic Federal laws. Even if our lawmakers batter a hall of fame 1 out of 3 bills being a hit, that leaves us with 2 out of the three being outs. Some outs are uglier than others in politics. Please do not encourage them to pile on, all they need is an excuse.

I think this is just reason eleventygabillion to limit the powers we grant our central government.
comparing sodomy laws to gas pumping laws is slightly less retarded than comparing sodomy laws to bestiality. i would prefer you on the SCOTUS to scalia or thomas.
 

ginwilly

Well-Known Member
comparing sodomy laws to gas pumping laws is slightly less retarded than comparing sodomy laws to bestiality. i would prefer you on the SCOTUS to scalia or thomas.

lol thanks man. I couldn't do the SCOTUS thing, every time I read one of their decisions I'm convinced by both sides. I don't speak legaleze.

18 states still have sodomy laws. I found that amazingly disturbing.

I guess the point I was trying to make is the central government was designed in such a way to be as non-intrusive as possible. It was left up to the state to make laws like mine where it's illegal to keep my donkey in a bathtub.

The hierarchy of power was designed to go my house -> my community -> my city -> my state -> my country with each having a diminishing role on my life than the former. The way central planners make rules is just the opposite. My household has less power over me than anything. It was not supposed to be that way. We set up a system that promotes the individual, his freedom and autonomy to make decisions right and wrong without interference from the State as long as I'm not infringing upon others to do the same.

Liberals want to protect me from me and force their ideology on my way of life. Governing in the name of the collective almost always neglects the individual. What they fail to recognize is neglecting the individual in the name of the collective is actually the worst thing you can do for the collective. I just want you guys to leave me alone and let me live my life my way, not yours.
 

Canna Sylvan

Well-Known Member
You don't rewrite, shit! Once something is written it's dead.

The only way the construction lives is if a NEW ammendment is written. If you don't like the slave language in the constitution, write a new ammendment to get rid of it like we did. You cannot reinterprit.

The meaning is the author's intent based on the knowledge at the time. That's why new ammendments were allowed.

Current language changes. But things written in the past MUST use the past definitions or they become gibberish. You think the writer of the Flinstone theme was talking about old homosexuals buggering wrinkly assholes with leakage?
 

canndo

Well-Known Member
We are in complete disagreement. The law means what it says at the time of its writing, nothing more and nothing less. It does not evolve, its meaning does not change over time. We live in a Republic where our laws are determined by our representatives, it is up to them to change a law that needs changing. Theoretically, they are accountable to voters. If your representative displeases you then throw him out on his ear and elect somebody more in tune with your own thinking.

For a law to "evolve' means that it is changed by a judge to mean something that it did not originally mean. Sorry, but that is the job of legislators.

I am not seeing a dilemna here. "Effects" covers cell phones, email, computer, shoe box under your bed, etc.
What you are saying is that if effects didn't mean cell phones back then, then it can't mean it now. As I said, if the document was written using 200 year old meanings for words then it cannot apply to current meanings. Meanings change, hell, we can see that all over the place - do you recall when the word gay meant carefree and happy?
 

canndo

Well-Known Member
according to scalia, if we can't be morally opposed to homosexuality, murder will be all the rage before we know it.

. “If we cannot have moral feelings against homosexuality, can we have it against murder? Can we have it against other things?”

he is a bigot, a douchebag, and a self righteous blowhard. no wonder desert dude identifies with him :lol:
How does such a learned and perportedly logical man come fall victim to such ordinary semantical and argumentative tricks? slippery slope and false comparisons. Beyond that, I was fairly clear that there is a distinct difference between moral "feelings" and moral actions, the feelings being at least so far, beyond the reach of even the supreme court.
 

Canna Sylvan

Well-Known Member
What you are saying is that if effects didn't mean cell phones back then, then it can't mean it now. As I said, if the document was written using 200 year old meanings for words then it cannot apply to current meanings. Meanings change, hell, we can see that all over the place - do you recall when the word gay meant carefree and happy?
Now you're getting it! You read it as "having a carefree and happy time." You don't read it as two guys going at it bareback.

The cellphone is an unknown device. It needs a new law. Then once you write the law, you write it as "any device used for mass communication," that way when brain nano-spores get invented, they're covered too!

Another solution is, "if X happens, this ammendment becomes void. A new ammendment must get written and agreed upon within Y days defining the new without infringing upon the old."
 

canndo

Well-Known Member
Now you're getting it! You read it as "having a carefree and happy time." You don't read it as two guys going at it bareback.

The cellphone is an unknown device. It needs a new law. Then once you write the law, you write it as "any device used for mass communication," that way when brain nano-spores get invented, they're covered too!

Another solution is, "if X happens, this ammendment becomes void. A new ammendment must get written and agreed upon within Y days defining the new without infringing upon the old."

I think this is a grand idea but it seems the founders figured it should be very hard to create an amendment. Considering the state of our political system today, it would be impossible and so your grand idea will remain just an idea. Let us look at something as simple as prohibition. There could be found no instance in the constitution that would allow for a law prohibiting the production or consumption of alcohol and so they had to go back and change the basis of all of our laws, they had to get to the root and alter it.

Why did they not see it necessary to do the exact same thing when it came to the prohibition of drugs in this country? What changed?
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Now you're getting it! You read it as "having a carefree and happy time." You don't read it as two guys going at it bareback.

The cellphone is an unknown device. It needs a new law. Then once you write the law, you write it as "any device used for mass communication," that way when brain nano-spores get invented, they're covered too!

Another solution is, "if X happens, this ammendment becomes void. A new ammendment must get written and agreed upon within Y days defining the new without infringing upon the old."
We tried "have a balanced budget on time, or else" laws. They were pathetically ineffective.
We have a very difficult task: law by inflexible codex doesn't work.
Law without a codex doesn't work either.

Both approaches eventually fail, leading to senility of the existing order and the need for reform. In all our history nobody has yet found a self-perpetuating form of government and model for social health. We are of a generation that gets to watch our way come into crisis. Interesting times, as per the Chinese curse. cn
 

desert dude

Well-Known Member
What you are saying is that if effects didn't mean cell phones back then, then it can't mean it now. As I said, if the document was written using 200 year old meanings for words then it cannot apply to current meanings. Meanings change, hell, we can see that all over the place - do you recall when the word gay meant carefree and happy?
What I am saying is 'effects' means your belongings. If you own a cell phone it is among your belongings. Gay still does mean carefree and happy, although it is gay to use gay in that context.

A textualist uses the definition in use at the time of writing.
 
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