Flood cycle. Why not more often?

[budherder]

I'm just tryi. To figure out why it's recommended to flood ebb and grow buckets only 3 to 4 times during the light cycle? I guess that's pretty often in flower but in veg it's not at all. Why would it be a problem to flood every couple hours in hydroton or lava rocks? Seems like it would just lead to more fresh air and more fresh nutes...

 

[TriPurple]

You could go with DWC, 24/7 watering. But in hydroton you can go every two hours for 10 minutes. You want more watering cycles in bud mode because they suck up more water & nutes.

 

[Taviddude]

Yes Sir. I flood every 1 1/2 hours.

 

[PetFlora]

I use Air Pots + Lava Rock (fast draining, but holds some moisture between feed cycles). From ~ 10" on, I 'flood' every 20 minutes. Actually use low mist heads from the top down. Each AP gets ~ 3-5 ozs each cycle

Here's a couple pics from last Friday. Pic #1: Plant on far right is My DIY 21st Century F & D in action: plants on left are in HPA. Pic 2 is the top cola. HPA is said to be the fastest, baddest method. Well, My DIY 21st Century F & D consistently runs neck and neck, plus, uses much less nutrient. I have a thread over on IC

 

[budherder]

I use Air Pots + Lava Rock (fast draining, but holds some moisture between feed cycles). From ~ 10" on, I 'flood' every 20 minutes. Actually use low mist heads from the top down. Each AP gets ~ 3-5 ozs each cycle

Here's a couple pics from last Friday. Pic #1: Plant on far right is My DIY 21st Century F & D in action: plants on left are in HPA. Pic 2 is the top cola. HPA is said to be the fastest, baddest method. Well, My DIY 21st Century F & D consistently runs neck and neck, plus, uses much less nutrient. I have a thread over on IC
View attachment 2440702View attachment 2440703

You flood every 20 minutes after they are ten inches tall? Are you supposed to water more often when using lava rock? What's is your flood cycle befor 10"?

 

[drgreentm]

If you want to flood more often just get a good air pump and throw a stone in each site and flood whenever, problem is roots like oxygen just as much as water so if you flood to much they don't get sufficient air and would completely drown out the point of hydro (which is not highly saturated root done but rather highly oxygenated root zone).

 

[dadio161]

I also use a flood system to grow. You don't need to flood as oftem during veg because the roots don't drink up the nutes as fast yet. I let the nutes drain and draw in oxygen. Trying not to drown them .

 

[PetFlora]

Young (small) root systems are easily 'drowned'. Keep in mind lava rock drains very quickly, BUT, has lots of tiny crevices which hold a small amount of nutes in reserve, which hungry roots can draw from in between feed cycles, BUT, they are not soaking in it, like they do in rock wool/S2G... AND clean up is a snap + they are reuseable oh, and very inexpensive. Like hydroton, LR needs to be pre-washed to remove grit that can clog your drain return to the rez.

My pvc tube feed system is not glued. I swap out pieces with more or fewer mist heads to assure adequate coverage throughout the lava rock, thus avoiding dry spots. This, combined with a small pump, provides a 'perfect' combination, essentially turbocharging/supercharging the grow.

My timer is analog with 2 knobs, so I watch the flood and cut back once I feel the LR is sufficiently wet

During early veg I lower the on time and increase the pause time.

 

[kushnotbush]

The biggest factor in how often you flood is how fast your medium dries and how adequate the drainage is. Rockwool and mediums that hold water tend to need to be watered less while hydroton, lava rock, and perlite need to be watered more at varying levels as they each hold more or less or drain faster than the others. Really you just have to find what works best for your strain and medium but the general times above are good starting points.
KnB

 

[haole420]

I'm in hydroton and flood constantly. 9min fill, 3min drain with Autosiphon. The Autosiphon (aka bell siphon) simplifies things. No timers needed.

Aquaponic folks thatrun flood and drain seem to always run constant flood and drain with no problems, usually with hydroton or gravel or lava rock.

Unless you're in rockwool or coco, i really don't think you can flood too often. When it drains, you're getting virtually unlimited access to oxygen, much more than you would with dwc.

If i were to guess, the reason why a lot of folks run longer dry intervals between floods is because that's how they HAD to do it when the only hydro medium around was rockwool.

I'm not saying that there isn't a "perfect"dry interval, but it's a moving target. As the plant grows, that ideal dry interval is going to change, albeit slowly. To suggest that there's a one size fits all schedule you can run on throughout your whole grow that is optimal defies common sense.

Bad things that can happen because of constant flood and drain? Very little unless you're in rockwool or coco. Bad things that can happen if you run too long of a dry interval? The roots dry out, even partially, which would be less than ideal.

For me, id rather give up dubious claims of better performance and not run the risk of not flooding often enough.

 

[ringlead3r]

really dont understand why you would flood so often it really does nothing when the lights are off.. in hydroton you can flood as often as you want during lights on due to the fact hydroton really doesn't hold water. You wont get any better results flooding ever 20mins 24/7 than you will 4-6 times during lights on but it also wont hurt anything

 

[haole420]

For me, 24/7 was the default. It was the simplest design: 1 pump, 1 bell siphon. If the results will be more or less the same, why fuss with timers and scheduling? I'm in total agreement with you: it doesn't make a difference. But why not do things simpler?

Someone once suggested it would heat up the res, but i haven't had any issues. Then again, I'm running 10-12gal/plant, so my system isn't going heat up as quickly as someone running a minimal nft res with a lower volume/plant ratio.

The pump also powers my venturi aerator inthe fish tank (aquaponic), so it needs to be running constantly. Between the bell siphon Outlet and the venturi aerator, i think I'm getting plenty of "free" aeration. I'm actually thinking of turning off the air pump.

 

[TriPurple]

really dont understand why you would flood so often it really does nothing when the lights are off.. in hydroton you can flood as often as you want during lights on due to the fact hydroton really doesn't hold water. You wont get any better results flooding ever 20mins 24/7 than you will 4-6 times during lights on but it also wont hurt anything

This is true no need to water at night. You can, but like you said they don't take in nutes at night. It does work in DWC but that's diff. you have to because they sit in water(heavily aerated). I've never watered at night with Hydroton or rockwool.

 

[WWG]

haole420
Did you say that you have an aquaponic grow? That would be an interesting topic.