General Organics Nutrients Help??

[vectorforever]

Hey guys, whats up? Does anyone have experience with General Organics nutrients in soil? The box says no pH adjustment is necessary after adding the nutes, which is what I've been doing. I've never heard of such a thing, not adjusting pH after nutes, but I assumed that if they recommend not adjusting after adding nutes to water, the ratios of the nutrients when mixed together is completely neutral. However, I just read an older thread on rollitup where growers were arguing if you should follow the directions on the box. The nutrient levels are quite low, so at first I mixed them in at 1/2 the recommended low dose, but the month-old plants showed signs that it was too strong a mix. So I fed them strictly water for several days, and I just fed them 1/4 the recommended low dose last night. Today, some of the bottom (fan) leaves have literally rotated 90 degrees so that the leaves, while healthy looking, are facing left/right instead of up. My first thought was "jesus christ, the nute mix is still too strong", but all of the new growth at the top looks healthy green but a little droopy -- which makes me think the nute mix is too light, or heat stress. I asked the grow shop about the ROOTS ORGANICS soil nutrient content, and they said it only has enough nutes to last a couple weeks maximum. I noticed today that the stalk has some purple vertical lines -- which is either genetics, cold environment, or potassium deficiency. Of course, nearly all of these symptoms could be from a pH problem, which is what I am betting on, and brings me back to my original question: Do you adjust pH after adding GO nutes? It says not to on the box, but I've always adjusted pH after adding. Some people in the thread on GO said after nutes were added to pH neutral 7 water, pH dropped to 4.9-5.5 which would explain all of my symptoms.

The strains are:
MKage (MK Ultra x S.A.G.E.)
Critical Kush (Critical Mass x O.G. Kush)
White Widow
Kandy Kush x Skunk#1

The Mkage are the only ones beyond the seedling stage, and the only one I've added nutes to so far. I'd like to get the correct levels of GO nutes down before these other seedlings start vegging. There is such little written on MKage, I have nothing to measure my own grow against. Anyone having experience with these strains, and especially the RO soil and GO nutes is encouraged to help!

 

[SpliffAndMyLady]

I don't care what anybody tells you, ALWAYS pH your water, unless you've been using it for several runs and absolutlely sure of pH/ppm E.C.

 

[SpliffAndMyLady]

"No pH needed" is false advertisement, they just put that to try and increase sales.

 

[zack66]

I've done 6 runs with the GO line. I have well water with a hi ph. I don't ph anything. On my first run I used ph down cause it was reading 7.8-8.2 after mixing nutes. Plants had alot of rusty leaves and ended up being a average yield and average quality. I took GO's advice and stopped ph-ing all together. Not even checking anymore. I do grow in an organic mix and now grow beautiful hi yielding plants. Not saying you shouldn't ph but, for me using the GO line there's no need. I feel if your soils good whatever you put in your medium will be quickly adjusted anyway. Here's a couple pics using the GO line with no ph adjustments.

 

[vectorforever]

SpliffAndMyLady, I naturally agree with you, that pH is vital to plant health, and would be suspicious of any company advertising "no pH adjustment needed". But that isn't what the back of the box says- it literally says "for optimal results, do not adjust pH after mixing". They explain that adding pH up or down will react with the microbial population that makes up the nutrients themselves, and will change the make-up of the nutrients, making them basically useless to the plant. And it can also react with some microbes, and not others, causing the pH of the nutrient mixture to fluctuate beyond the 6.5-7.0 neutral range.

Thanks zack66, thats exactly what I was looking for- someone who's done the whole trial and error thing, to share their experience so that I don't make the same mistakes. Those girls look beautiful, by the way.

 

[MoonRaver]

This is common with GO and Roots Organics Soil. If you plants are a month old, you should be feeding heavily. To prevent the phosphorus def that results from using the GO according to the instructions in veg, Half and half your Biothrive Grow and Biothrive Bloom. 10ML Grow + 10ML Bloom per gallon. Also, you should be using the CalMG+ at 20ML per gallon. That will fix your problem. Now, to make sure you dont run into that problem in the future, add some Rock Phosphate to your soil prior to planting in it.

 

[zack66]

This is common with GO and Roots Organics Soil. If you plants are a month old, you should be feeding heavily. To prevent the phosphorus def that results from using the GO according to the instructions in veg, Half and half your Biothrive Grow and Biothrive Bloom. 10ML Grow + 10ML Bloom per gallon. Also, you should be using the CalMG+ at 20ML per gallon. That will fix your problem. Now, to make sure you dont run into that problem in the future, add some Rock Phosphate to your soil prior to planting in it.

What does rock phosphate do?

 

[zack66]

SpliffAndMyLady, I naturally agree with you, that pH is vital to plant health, and would be suspicious of any company advertising "no pH adjustment needed". But that isn't what the back of the box says- it literally says "for optimal results, do not adjust pH after mixing". They explain that adding pH up or down will react with the microbial population that makes up the nutrients themselves, and will change the make-up of the nutrients, making them basically useless to the plant. And it can also react with some microbes, and not others, causing the pH of the nutrient mixture to fluctuate beyond the 6.5-7.0 neutral range.

Thanks zack66, thats exactly what I was looking for- someone who's done the whole trial and error thing, to share their experience so that I don't make the same mistakes. Those girls look beautiful, by the way.

Thanks man. No problems here not adjusting ph. I'm not saying you shouldn't adjust ph but, i've found no need with the GO line. As earlier said when feeding my ph is over 8.0 and haven't had any problems. I figure good medium good results.

 

[vectorforever]

Hey MoonRaver and zack66, as far as the other components of the GO set -- Bioroot, bioweed, biomarine, diamond black-- will these all enhance plant health through harvest? or should you cut diamond out of the feeding schedule after the 2nd week of vegging, like GO recommends?

 

[zack66]

Hey MoonRaver and zack66, as far as the other components of the GO set -- Bioroot, bioweed, biomarine, diamond black-- will these all enhance plant health through harvest? or should you cut diamond out of the feeding schedule after the 2nd week of vegging, like GO recommends?

I use it through all of veg. It also works great mixed in a tea.

 

[MoonRaver]

Hey MoonRaver and zack66, as far as the other components of the GO set -- Bioroot, bioweed, biomarine, diamond black-- will these all enhance plant health through harvest? or should you cut diamond out of the feeding schedule after the 2nd week of vegging, like GO recommends?

According to the directions, diamond black should only be used on rooted cutting or seedlings which I find to be true, there is no benefit of using it later on once the soil microbes get well established in the soil. Myself, I dont use the biomarine (cough-fukushima-cough-squid-cough). Bioroot and Bioweed should only be used through out the veg stage. The bioroot simply helps the roots develop and feeds the soil. The Bioweed is a growth stimulant and adds organic matter to the soil for the microbes.

 

[bigbubba227]

when u use organic fert. the PH down kills the micro bugs ur useing to feed you soil. the Calmag and Root accel in the kill auto puts it in the right range that u need. my tap water is PH 9.3 and 34 ppm. i used half the recommended feeding for everything and perfect 6.3 PH

 

[boofhacks]

my tap water after dechlorination sits around 7.2p.h. and when i add the g.o. nutes along with the micros myco and bacillus, nomatter 1x strength or 2x strength the ph is always 5.5 to 5.6 every time! also every 3 weeks u should flush soil,and test the value of the runoff water toward the last of the draining water to get the most accurate reading of wht the soil p.h. is currently at. always flush with 5.5ph water and never let the runoff/soil value ever go past 6.0ph. comfort zone is 5.5 -6.0 for soil.
feed once a week til 20% runoff and water once the same! typically will get u through a week. hope this helps a bit!

 

[SpliffAndMyLady]

SpliffAndMyLady, I naturally agree with you, that pH is vital to plant health, and would be suspicious of any company advertising "no pH adjustment needed". But that isn't what the back of the box says- it literally says "for optimal results, do not adjust pH after mixing". They explain that adding pH up or down will react with the microbial population that makes up the nutrients themselves, and will change the make-up of the nutrients, making them basically useless to the plant. And it can also react with some microbes, and not others, causing the pH of the nutrient mixture to fluctuate beyond the 6.5-7.0 neutral range.

Thanks zack66, thats exactly what I was looking for- someone who's done the whole trial and error thing, to share their experience so that I don't make the same mistakes. Those girls look beautiful, by the way.

Well we are using general organics aren't we, I use apple cider vinegar or baking soda if needed. Did I say use pH up or pH down?

 

[MoonRaver]

Honestly I think the CalMG+ is the major Ph buffer in the go line. It has fermented mollases (VINEGER) and calcium carbonate. Can ANY1 correct me if I'm WRONG?