NoGutsGrower
Well-Known Member
I figured! They got me from stem to stern.... My "stem" to my sternum...
How many of you are going to bitch about Obama care after 2016?
- Thread starter canndo
- Start date
canndo
Well-Known Member
Written by someone who has no concept of eventuality, no ability to peer into the spread of possible futures one of which they will enter every day for the rest of their life. This is someone who has a problem with imagination when it pertains to personal disaster and this person is not by any means alone.
says the guy who builds his house on a flood plain "everything is gone, I can't BELIEVE it, now what do I do?"
Says the guy who did everything in his life by the book "he came out of NO Where, how was I supposed to avoid that accident"
Says the guy who insists that HIS habits won't ever get him into trouble, that just happens to the other guy.
This post "forsees" a "comfortable" disaster that he can rave about, how the country will fail, how everything will turn to shit when the reality is far different.
I am reminded of my now favorite show "doomsday preppers", where a 450 lb man is stocking up, preparing his bug out proceedure, certain that the world will end with riots in the street and dust clouds from the super volcano and HE is going to be the one to have the vision and temerity to survive.
oh never mind that his resting heartrate is 102 and his blood pressure is 211/103. His imminent heart attack, his next year's stroke isn't what drives him. He can't seem to figure out that there is no difference between the end of the world and the end of his life and he is prepping for the wrong thing.
canndo
Well-Known Member
Three? THREE? There are busloads of folks crossing the Mexican border from the U.S. - so many that there is an entire industry surrounding it. The busses are filled with old people who can't afford their meds - head down to mexican pharmacies and pick them up at a fraction of the cost, then smuggle them home (well - that is currently a grey area). There are medical "vacations" to india where folks can get their gall bladders removed and their hips replaced for far cheaper than that same proceedure in the U.S. including their stay and round trip flights. The right points to the odd rich person from another country who decides to travel to the U.S. cause he doesn't want to wait in line for some proceedure - story, patting ourselves on our collective backs for our wonderous health care system that everyone wants to emulate.
While they never point us to the thousands who LEAVE for Thailand or Mexico or south America because the medicine is good and the proceedures are cheap enough for these people to afford at all.
so which is better? the mostest, wonderfulest, greatest health care system on earth that most of us can't afford? or the "it's ok, I'll take my chances, not so heavenly health care system that has the singular advantage of being accessable and affordable to those who are at the end of their rope in the U.S.?
canndo
Well-Known Member
As I said, contrary to what the right believes, not everyone does what they do strictly for the money they will get out of it.
Who pays for government incentives? those who will in all likely hood benefit from the results of such a system,those tax payers - the ones who will need to be treated by the doctors that their money helped educate.
Yes, there are huge flaws in Obama care and there were no flaws in what the Republicans put up as an alternative because.... they put nothing up (don't insult us with the "tort reform and competition" tired refrain, that wasn't a plan, it was a sound byte.
If you don't want to go to school for 7 years and make less than a lawyer who spends half that time becoming a lawyer - it is your right and privelege to do so but not everyone thinks like you. There are plenty of ways to make more money than the average doctor without the grueling hours,the mind bending education and the pain entailed in becoming a doctor yet people still become doctors and many good doctors - GP's especially don't make all that much money ever.
Curing someone of a disease, aleviating their pain, correcting a defect in another human being has an appeal that in many cases is worth more than money to those people. I know a very few doctors who are only in it for the money, and I wouldn't go to those doctors anyway. Would you?
NLXSK1
Well-Known Member
You seem to think that success in life should be guaranteed and government should legislate against every possible pitfall in people's lives...
canndo
Well-Known Member
That is a matter for an interesting debate. Gates was and is instrumental in saving lives - hours at a time, he has taken some of the drudgery out of work in an information based society. His products have assisted doctors in helping patients. Does he deserve the billions he has? Does anyone? OF course your doctor likely deserves more than he gets, as do many teachers, many policemen, many lawyers. Perhaps that should be the overall cap on pay in the United States, no one should ever be rewarded in pay more than the highest paid doctor.
canndo
Well-Known Member
Where do you get that from my post? I think that success is different for each person. I feel successful, I have a beautiful, loving wife, I have a collection of cigars that cause other cigar lovers to druel. I have a small collection of various mind altering substances that tend to make my rainy days very enjoyable. My income is realatively secure and I have enough extra money to embark on any project i so desire. The government helped me to get where I am but were it not for my own work, a modicum of luck and a proper attitude as to what "success" actually means, I would not be nearly so "successful"
Do I think that governemnt should guarantee my "success"? even if I thought that,they would be incapable of doing so unless the government could find a way to ensure I found a good woman and had a decent brain.
I don't want the government to insure against every pit fall but I do want them to aleviate the unecessary pain of some of the things that could befall any individual. My post was in response to someone who, upon looking down from his mountain claims that he and he alone got himself to the top and that his superior planning indemnifies him from all danger. The right often pats itself on it's collective backs for their own success when in fact they may have had only a portion of influence on their standing.
Wavels
Well-Known Member
I have my fingers crossed in hopes of Obamacare being hoisted on it's own petard! Poetic justice underway! (I sincerely hope)
Higher health care premiums could cause Obamacare to death spiral.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/higher-health-care-premiums-could-cause-obamacare-to-death-spiral/article/2517939#.UO9XhG93jRq
Higher health care premiums could cause Obamacare to death spiral.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/higher-health-care-premiums-could-cause-obamacare-to-death-spiral/article/2517939#.UO9XhG93jRq
kinddiesel
Well-Known Member
we need to do some thing about insurance in the us , i pay 150 a month and have a 5k dedutable before even 1 penny insurance kick in thats bull SHIT ! so its all out of pocket , bull shit insurance only plan i can afford pisses me off, i say obama cant make it worse
Canna Sylvan
Well-Known Member
I don't know if I'd take that line bet.
ginwilly
Well-Known Member
It's Canada for cheap drugs for those in the north.
So is the solution to mandate that medicare prescriptions must be name brand and all other insurance MUST use US pharmaceuticals as part of Obamacare or would it make more sense to let us purchase drugs that do the same thing at a fraction of the cost legally?
You seem to be pleased with the fact that we can't buy drugs made in Canada that have proven tracks records because Obama negotiated with big pharma (I know Cheesus watched this on CSPAN, but the rest of us missed it) making us buy ONLY US drugs (made in Malaysia). I can't justify this type of logic in the name of "team".
There is so many things we could have done had we not passed this bill to actually reduce healthcare costs instead of raising taxes to match the increases caused.
Obamacare is my Zimmerman I guess. I don't understand why there are still seemingly intelligent people singing it's praises.
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
You are blaming the wrong president for the ban on Canadian drugs
That was Bush and medicare Part D
I'd like to touch on that 60% figure, the fact that drugs under this plan are 60% more expensive than those available through Canada. Since the plan has been implemented, the government has taken the unusual step of cracking down on Canadian drug importation. Before Plan D took effect, drugs from reputable Canadian companies were waived through. Now, those who await to receive the drugs they need in their mail get a letter from the Department of Homeland Security instead:
BOSTON --Citing increased concerns about the quality of drugs entering the United States from Canada, federal authorities have stepped up seizures of the prescriptions and sent strongly worded legal warnings to consumers, including some in Massachusetts, who have ordered the discounted drugs. [...]The government crackdown marks a shift in policy for the Bush administration, which has rarely acted against individuals who buy drugs from Canada, reports The Boston Sunday Globe.
The stricter enforcement policy began Nov. 17, and applies only to mail-order shipments, not to U.S. citizens who cross into Canada to pick up their drugs, Hollinger said.
Salem-resident Nancy Popkin was among the consumers who recently received a letter. She has been ordering the osteoporosis treatment Fosamax from Canadian pharmacies for years and said she was surprised when she received a form letter in the mail from the Department of Homeland Security rather than her usual shipment of 12 tablets. The letter said her medication had been seized because "virtually all" drugs imported by individuals into the United States are unapproved for consumption here or are dispensed without a valid prescription.
The stricter enforcement policy began Nov. 17, and applies only to mail-order shipments, not to U.S. citizens who cross into Canada to pick up their drugs, Hollinger said.
Salem-resident Nancy Popkin was among the consumers who recently received a letter. She has been ordering the osteoporosis treatment Fosamax from Canadian pharmacies for years and said she was surprised when she received a form letter in the mail from the Department of Homeland Security rather than her usual shipment of 12 tablets. The letter said her medication had been seized because "virtually all" drugs imported by individuals into the United States are unapproved for consumption here or are dispensed without a valid prescription.
ginwilly
Well-Known Member
Bush sucked. Was he also the one that mandated we can't take any prescriptions drugs not sold by a US company? Obama should have fixed that with his healthcare "reform". A golden opportunity wasted.
At least we get 20,000 new IRS agents because of it though, we've got that going for us.
Since you made the claim that you watched the negotiations on Cspan, can you tell us what the concessions Obama got big Pharma to give? What did they get in return?
At least we get 20,000 new IRS agents because of it though, we've got that going for us.
Since you made the claim that you watched the negotiations on Cspan, can you tell us what the concessions Obama got big Pharma to give? What did they get in return?
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
There was no drug negotiations.
ginwilly
Well-Known Member
3000 pages and we couldn't find space to undo another Bush wrong. Obamacare was supposed to be health care reform and it doesn't even reform the stupid shit Bush did. That must mean the dems who wrote the bill agree with him. Either that or Big Pharma cut a deal. You watched the negotiations, what happened?
ginwilly
Well-Known Member
You don't remember the press conference where Obama bragged about the deal he cut with big pharma? I'm guessing you are still oblivious to all things Obamacare related. You just know it's some good shit.
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
Obamacare demands everyone that can afford private insurance get it.
Private health insurance companys have no rules against importing drugs from canada