Why flushing is a myth yes and no explained!

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Nightmarecreature

Active Member
The reason why flushing is such a heated debate is because it is misunderstood. I wrote this in laymans terms for everyone to understand. Does flushing work? Yes! Does not flushing also work? Yes!

Flushing:
In nature Chlorophyll breakdown can be seen in the seasonal changes as the plants lose their green color in the autumn; it is also evident in fruit ripening and flowering. People flush their plants mimicking the fall harvest where plants lose their green color.
In turn flushing starves your plants of Nitrogen and stresses them out. It is my opinion that this is the #2 reason for hermies. #1 is genetics #2 stress(Flushing) The plant wants to make seeds and when it knows the end is near, it tries to pollenate itself. Not all marijuana does this but some strains are very prone to it. While it's a natural process it's not what we want. What I mean by that, is we don't want pollen flying around our grow rooms or our plants making S1's (selfed first generation).
Back to the maintopic. What flushing does is breaksdown most of the chlorophyll prior to drying. This makes the marijuana less harsh and gets rid of that hay taste and smell. Where the confusion comes in, is that it takes less time for the buds to be ready to smoke. Here's an example; One grower dries his flushed buds for 7 days. The same grower dries another unflushed batch for 7 days. Of course the flushed buds are going to be a better smoke because there is less chlorophyll in the flushed buds. The conclusion is flushing does work at the expense of stressing out your plants and the possibility of having a smaller yield. The upside to flushing is that is takes less drying time compared to unflushed buds to get a good smoke.

Unflushed:
Unflushed buds have the advantage in that your plants can uptake nutrients all the way through flowering and up to the chop. I believe this increases yields and I know it reduces stress.Unflushed buds will smoke as well as flushed buds if the drying time is increased. It's best to chop the whole plant from the base and remove all the fan leaves while keeping all your sugar leaves. You want to keep your sugar leaves because removing those leafs causes your buds to dry faster and traps chlorophyll.You can trim your sugar leafs wet but your buds will dry faster and I think it reduces the taste of the buds. The drying process is more important than the curing process. In order for your buds to smoke as good as unflushed bud, you will need to dry them for about 12 days in 55%-65% humidity.This will remove the chlorophyll and it's basically the same as flushing except your flushing the plant once it's finished. The disadvantage of unflushed buds is the longer drying time.
Both methods work and when someone says flushing is a myth, it's both yes and no. It boils down to which method you like to use. I prefer the latter one.

Doing a cure on both methods will reduce harshness of the smoke even further.
 

zubey91

Well-Known Member
So it has nothing to do with nutrients being in the plant, where flushing forces them out so it only retains mostly water? How des that work
 

Nightmarecreature

Active Member
"nutes" dont go straight into the plants. by the time it gets up there it's converted into sugars
Exactly!

Also Chlorophyll does not evaporate, it gets broken down by a bio chemical reaction during the drying process. I was trying to keep this simple.

"Chlorophyll breakdown in green plants is a long-standing biological enigma. Recent work has shown that pheophorbide a (Pheide a) derived from chlorophyll (Chl) is converted oxygenolytically into a primary fluorescent catabolite (pFCC-1) via a red Chl catabolite (RCC) intermediate. RCC, the product of the ring cleavage reaction catalyzed by Pheide a oxygenase, which is suggested to be the key enzyme in Chl breakdown in green plants, is converted into pFCC-1 by a reductase."
 

Nightmarecreature

Active Member
Mine tastes much better flushed. But I know a lot of folks who don't mind the taste of unflushed bud.
There is no difference in taste from flushed or unflushed bud. It's all about the approach of harvesting and drying.

Where you went wrong with the unflushed bud, is that it's best to chop the whole plant from the base, remove the fan leaves and hang the entire plant. Then trim the sugar leaves dry after 12 days and then put them in jars to cure.

Cutting the buds stem from stem and trimming the sugar leaves wet doesn't work well with unflushed buds. It interrupts the biological process. From a previous post, this is how you do it.

Unflushed buds require a different approach and this is where the flushing myth is created.
 

MrStickyScissors

Well-Known Member
if your in soil no need to flush unless you have a salt build up. flushing will not make your weed better. its your fault that its shitty not that you didnt flush. i feed all the way up tell harvest and vomr dummer the clubs are fighting over it
 

Ninjabowler

Well-Known Member
The reason why flushing is such a heated debate is because it is misunderstood. I wrote this in laymans terms for everyone to understand. Does flushing work? Yes! Does not flushing also work? Yes!

Flushing:
In nature Chlorophyll breakdown can be seen in the seasonal changes as the plants lose their green color in the autumn; it is also evident in fruit ripening and flowering. People flush their plants mimicking the fall harvest where plants lose their green color.
In turn flushing starves your plants of Nitrogen and stresses them out. It is my opinion that this is the #2 reason for hermies. #1 is genetics #2 stress(Flushing) The plant wants to make seeds and when it knows the end is near, it tries to pollenate itself. Not all marijuana does this but some strains are very prone to it. While it's a natural process it's not what we want. What I mean by that, is we don't want pollen flying around our grow rooms or our plants making S1's (selfed first generation).
Back to the maintopic. What flushing does is breaksdown most of the chlorophyll prior to drying. This makes the marijuana less harsh and gets rid of that hay taste and smell. Where the confusion comes in, is that it takes less time for the buds to be ready to smoke. Here's an example; One grower dries his flushed buds for 7 days. The same grower dries another unflushed batch for 7 days. Of course the flushed buds are going to be a better smoke because there is less chlorophyll in the flushed buds. The conclusion is flushing does work at the expense of stressing out your plants and the possibility of having a smaller yield. The upside to flushing is that is takes less drying time compared to unflushed buds to get a good smoke.

Unflushed:
Unflushed buds have the advantage in that your plants can uptake nutrients all the way through flowering and up to the chop. I believe this increases yields and I know it reduces stress.Unflushed buds will smoke as well as flushed buds if the drying time is increased. It's best to chop the whole plant from the base and remove all the fan leaves while keeping all your sugar leaves. You want to keep your sugar leaves because removing those leafs causes your buds to dry faster and traps chlorophyll.You can trim your sugar leafs wet but your buds will dry faster and I think it reduces the taste of the buds. The drying process is more important than the curing process. In order for your buds to smoke as good as unflushed bud, you will need to dry them for about 12 days in 55%-65% humidity.This will remove the chlorophyll and it's basically the same as flushing except your flushing the plant once it's finished. The disadvantage of unflushed buds is the longer drying time.
Both methods work and when someone says flushing is a myth, it's both yes and no. It boils down to which method you like to use. I prefer the latter one.

Doing a cure on both methods will reduce harshness of the smoke even further.
When you tested unflushed buds what was the ppm that you ran at the end of the plants life cycle? High or low? Was it a full nutrient concentration until finnish or based on necesity? Dont you want a longer cure regardless for better final quality??
Youve provided opinions based on observation but havent given the technical details of the grow and that can lead to missinformation and crop failure..................please explain.
 

VTMi'kmaq

Well-Known Member
you can inundate me with this experts opinion and all the literature at the smithsonian, im good i know what works for me and i dont need a disertation on plant root mechanics to know what works for me. thats laying off anything but straight water for the last two weeks. Call it what you will. It works for me and thats all i care about. have fun! I eat lego's too!
 

Ninjabowler

Well-Known Member
So it has nothing to do with nutrients being in the plant, where flushing forces them out so it only retains mostly water? How des that work
From what ive learned on the topic water retention causes a fermentation reaction ripening flowers.
 

Nightmarecreature

Active Member
Unflushed bud contains more N and chlorophyll and require a longer drying time. By drying them differently you are allowing the unflushed buds time to dry slower. My friends runs a dispensary and he flushes his buds but he dries them quickly. I don't flush, but if I dry my buds fast like he does, they don't smoke as smooth. If I dry them say about 5 days longer, they smoke just as well. All it does it give the buds more time to break down the excess chlorophyll. A longer drying time is more important than anything. Wet trimming does decrease taste, try it for yourself.

Fact! leaf nitrogen content and chlorophyll concentration are closely linked.
Fact! Wet trimming causes buds to dry faster.
Fact! Whole plant drying takes longer.
Fact! The longer the buds take to dry the smoother it will smoke, flushed or unflushed.
 

Ninjabowler

Well-Known Member
There is no difference in taste from flushed or unflushed bud. It's all about the approach of harvesting and drying.

Where you went wrong with the unflushed bud, is that it's best to chop the whole plant from the base, remove the fan leaves and hang the entire plant. Then trim the sugar leaves dry after 12 days and then put them in jars to cure.

Cutting the buds stem from stem and trimming the sugar leaves wet doesn't work well with unflushed buds. It interrupts the biological process. From a previous post, this is how you do it.

Unflushed buds require a different approach and this is where the flushing myth is created.
i like your post, pleeze elaborate. Seems like you know of both sides of the debate, your opinion is non topic generalized which means that you explore science rather than listen to the accepted norm. Any insight would prove benificial at this point.
 

Ninjabowler

Well-Known Member
if your in soil no need to flush unless you have a salt build up. flushing will not make your weed better. its your fault that its shitty not that you didnt flush. i feed all the way up tell harvest and vomr dummer the clubs are fighting over it
What did you feed with at what ppm of what type of fertz?
 

Nightmarecreature

Active Member
When you tested unflushed buds what was the ppm that you ran at the end of the plants life cycle? High or low? Was it a full nutrient concentration until finnish or based on necesity? Dont you want a longer cure regardless for better final quality??
Youve provided opinions based on observation but havent given the technical details of the grow and that can lead to missinformation and crop failure..................please explain.
1200-1500 PPM.
High
Full Nutes
Yes. The longer the cure the better. Curing distributes moisture evenly for a better burn.
 

Ninjabowler

Well-Known Member
Flushed and unflushed buds don't require to be dried differently. That is totally false and adding to the confusion. Did you make up that theory yourself? I'm glad you're trying to shed some light here, but come on man, keep it real.
Glad to see that you are looking past the end of your nose once again. How many times do i have to tell you that if you plan on making statements factually you have to possess facts initially. Were not here to listen to what youve been doing for years in an optimal non flush environment. Annnd were not here to listen to your angry bullshit. Produce facts or ride back to the last thread you almost hung yourself on.
 

CashCrops

Well-Known Member
Exactly!

Also Chlorophyll does not evaporate, it gets broken down by a bio chemical reaction during the drying process. I was trying to keep this simple.

"Chlorophyll breakdown in green plants is a long-standing biological enigma. Recent work has shown that pheophorbide a (Pheide a) derived from chlorophyll (Chl) is converted oxygenolytically into a primary fluorescent catabolite (pFCC-1) via a red Chl catabolite (RCC) intermediate. RCC, the product of the ring cleavage reaction catalyzed by Pheide a oxygenase, which is suggested to be the key enzyme in Chl breakdown in green plants, is converted into pFCC-1 by a reductase."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9624113
 
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