# of seeds?

[niskos]

I have been through quite a few grows and understand all of this very well. During most of my grows I found myself with a surprisingly high ratio of females to males. Literally never had a male for most of my grows but the last two have been different for me. I use a wide variety of mostly bag seeds of good weed. My last two grows have produced mostly males and it led me to ask myself what # of seeds should I plant to assure that there will be a female, at least most likely.
Also, it has always been my understand that the seeds are predisposed to a certain gender, regardless of any environmental factors, although changing a female to male is pretty easy.
Can anyone, for certain, say that there is any factors at play to lean the gender toward female?
and if not what number of seeds should be sprouted in order to most likely have a female?

 

[Guccizillaa]

Seeds can and can not have predetermined sex. If a male pollenates a female causing it to produce seeds, I'd call those 50 50 seeds. But you can also stress a known female into a hermi via light stress so it produces female pollen. The female pollen is then used on another known female to produce 99% feminized seeds. Onlly trust known distributors though when it comes to feminized seeds. Anything else i call a 50 50. And if your looking to grow 1 plant id say 3 would be a fairly safe bet, 4 if you really wanna be safe. Good luck.

 

[kagecog]

There are actually a lot of ways to increase your female to male ratio to produce mostly females.

• - a higher nitrogen concentration will give more females (at the three-pairs-of-leaves stage and continue for two or three weeks).
  - a higher potassium concentration will give more males (at the three-pairs-of-leaves stage and continue for two or three weeks).
  - a higher humidity will give more females (at the three-pairs-of-leaves stage and continue for two or three weeks).
  - a lower temperature will give more females (at the three-pairs-of-leaves stage and continue for two or three weeks).
  - more blue light will give more females (at the three-pairs-of-leaves stage and continue for two or three weeks).
  - Fewer hours of light will give more females (at the three-pairs-of-leaves stage and continue for two or three weeks).
  - In later stage, as you increase the light, the plants grow faster and show more females/less males. Sixteen hours of light per day seems to be the best combination, beyond this makes little or no appreciable difference in the plant quality.
  - Another idea is to interrupt the night cycle with about one hour of light. This gives you more females.
  - Spray dilute Fish Emulsion ( 1 tablespoon per gallon ). When the plants have three sets of true leaves, plus the top sprout, give them a wetting spray of Fish Emulsion. Do it once a day for three of four days. Top and bottom of the leaves.
  - To achieve 100% female plants is to expose young seedlings for several hours to an atmosphere of Carbon Monoxide. It doesn't hurt the plants, but it could kill you.
  - Treatment of hempseed with ethylene gas will increase the resulting number of female plants by about 50%. Ethylene is produced by certain plants (i.e., bananas, cucumbers and melons), and these can be used to treat hempseed in a simple manner. About two weeks before you plan to sprout theseeds, place them in a paper bag or envelope and put that in a plastic bag with the peels of a ripening banana or cucumber. Replace the peels after a couple of days, and change the bags to prevent mold.
  - When hempseed is treated with the female hormone estrogen, percentage of females that are produced will increase by about 10%. Dissolve a birth control pill in water and soak the seeds overnight in the solution. After the initial soaking, continue to treat the seeds by sprouting them on a paper towel soaked in the solution.​
  
  
  
  

 

[hotrodharley]

• - When hempseed is treated with the female hormone estrogen, percentage of females that are produced will increase by about 10%. Dissolve a birth control pill in water and soak the seeds overnight in the solution. After the initial soaking, continue to treat the seeds by sprouting them on a paper towel soaked in the solution.​
  
  

And if they end up pregnant despite the birth control pill? Huh? Who pays child support then?

 

[Trousers]

Since properly made feminized seeds are 100% it makes sense to me that seeds have the sex predetermined.
If a seed can be female, why can't a seed be male?
I am having a hard time believing that environmental factors at all in sex determination of weed.

To the OP

Many times bag seed is the result of a female that becomes stressed and pollinates a few buds. Those seeds are feminized seeds, that is possibly why you have been getting so many females from bagseed.

 

[kagecog]

Since properly made feminized seeds are 100% it makes sense to me that seeds have the sex predetermined.
If a seed can be female, why can't a seed be male?
I am having a hard time believing that environmental factors at all in sex determination of weed.

To the OP

Many times bag seed is the result of a female that becomes stressed and pollinates a few buds. Those seeds are feminized seeds, that is possibly why you have been getting so many females from bagseed.

Actually no this is not true! Feminizing just increases the chances of a female it does not guarantee 100% that the seeds will turn out female. I've gotten female, hermies, and even males from feminized seeds. The way that companies create feminized seeds is by breeding a female with a hermie. From what I've seen personally, environment plays a key role in whether a plant becomes male or female

 

[Guccizillaa]

Since properly made feminized seeds are 100% it makes sense to me that seeds have the sex predetermined.
If a seed can be female, why can't a seed be male?
I am having a hard time believing that environmental factors at all in sex determination of weed.

To the OP

Many times bag seed is the result of a female that becomes stressed and pollinates a few buds. Those seeds are feminized seeds, that is possibly why you have been getting so many females from bagseed.

the reason there are not "malinized" hell if i know, seeds is because a male plant can not pollinate a male plant.
yet a hermie can pollinate a female.

 

[Trousers]

Actually no this is not true! Feminizing just increases the chances of a female it does not guarantee 100% that the seeds will turn out female. I've gotten female, hermies, and even males from feminized seeds.

Where did you get your feminized seeds?

Properly made feminized seeds are 100% female. I do not believe you have gotten males or "hermies" from feminized seeds, it is impossible.

I have made thousands of feminized seeds. Every one that I have germinated was a female plant. There has not been one male or hermaphrodite.

I do not believe you when you say you have gotten "hermies and even males from feminized seeds."
Properly made feminized seeds produce 100% female plants. Feminized seeds do not have a Y chromosome and can not be male.

First we have to make sure we are talking about the same thing.
A hermaphrodite can not come from a properly made feminized seeds. A feminized seed does not have a Y chromosome. Hermaphrodites have both an X and a Y chromosome.

If you had plants from properly made feminized seeds that produced male flowers, it was most likely because you stressed the plants, not because of the genetics. The parents of that plant are just as likely to produce male flowers under the same conditions.

The way that companies create feminized seeds is by breeding a female with a hermie.

No, that is not true at all.
This is probably the biggest myth surrounding feminized seeds.

Feminized seeds are produced using a female plant, not a hermaphrodite. You are the victim of a myth perpetrated by bad growers and/or people with no feminized seeds experience.

Again, a hermaphrodite has an X and a Y chromosome. Female plants do not have a Y chromosome.

If you use colloidal silver, one of the most common methods, you trick the plant into activating natural hormones that will produce male flowers. Only the sprayed areas will be effected.

The spray does not add a chromosome or even change dna. All that happens is a natural part of cannabis, a survival mechanism, is activated.

The resulting seeds will not have a Y chromosome. They can not be male or hermaphrodite. Environmental factors can not make a feminized seeds male, the Y chromosome is not there.

The sprayed plant is not a hermaphrodite, it is a female plant that has had its hormones activated on a specific part of the plant. The genetics remain the same, dna is not altered.

From what I've seen personally, environment plays a key role in whether a plant becomes male or female

How do you quantify that? How do you know you get more males or females? Did you have a control group?
From what I have seen personally, environment plays no role in determining sex of cannabis from seed.

Again, if there are feminized seeds, why can't there be male seeds?

I have not come across any evidence that environment plays a role in sex determination. All I have heard is stories.

I have heard of people that claim they can tell the difference between a male and female seed by looking at it.
I saw a chart on another site that showed differences. I pulled out some of my regular and feminized seeds to compare and was struck how the seeds compared to the chart.

I have no idea if it is true, but one guy claimed to be about 90% able to tell the sex of a seed by looking at it.
the next time I grow from seed, I am going to give it a try.

I also have an opinion about regular cannabis seeds that I can not verify. I think that cannabis seeds naturally produce more females and not because of environment.

If you think about it, it kind of makes sense. In a wild population, one male could seed hundreds of plants. I think that cannabis produces more females because only a few males can seed a lot of plants and provide genetic diversity.

That part is opinion based on all the regular seeds I have grown over the years. I have always seemed to get way more females. This is in wildly varying environmental conditions - outside/inside, soil/hydro.

 

[LeafGnosis]

Where did you get your feminized seeds?

Properly made feminized seeds are 100% female. I do not believe you have gotten males or "hermies" from feminized seeds, it is impossible.

I have made thousands of feminized seeds. Every one that I have germinated was a female plant. There has not been one male or hermaphrodite.

I do not believe you when you say you have gotten "hermies and even males from feminized seeds."
Properly made feminized seeds produce 100% female plants. Feminized seeds do not have a Y chromosome and can not be male.

First we have to make sure we are talking about the same thing.
A hermaphrodite can not come from a properly made feminized seeds. A feminized seed does not have a Y chromosome. Hermaphrodites have both an X and a Y chromosome.

If you had plants from properly made feminized seeds that produced male flowers, it was most likely because you stressed the plants, not because of the genetics. The parents of that plant are just as likely to produce male flowers under the same conditions.



No, that is not true at all.
This is probably the biggest myth surrounding feminized seeds.

Feminized seeds are produced using a female plant, not a hermaphrodite. You are the victim of a myth perpetrated by bad growers and/or people with no feminized seeds experience.

Again, a hermaphrodite has an X and a Y chromosome. Female plants do not have a Y chromosome.

If you use colloidal silver, one of the most common methods, you trick the plant into activating natural hormones that will produce male flowers. Only the sprayed areas will be effected.

The spray does not add a chromosome or even change dna. All that happens is a natural part of cannabis, a survival mechanism, is activated.

The resulting seeds will not have a Y chromosome. They can not be male or hermaphrodite. Environmental factors can not make a feminized seeds male, the Y chromosome is not there.

The sprayed plant is not a hermaphrodite, it is a female plant that has had its hormones activated on a specific part of the plant. The genetics remain the same, dna is not altered.




How do you quantify that? How do you know you get more males or females? Did you have a control group?
From what I have seen personally, environment plays no role in determining sex of cannabis from seed.

Again, if there are feminized seeds, why can't there be male seeds?

I have not come across any evidence that environment plays a role in sex determination. All I have heard is stories.

I have heard of people that claim they can tell the difference between a male and female seed by looking at it.
I saw a chart on another site that showed differences. I pulled out some of my regular and feminized seeds to compare and was struck how the seeds compared to the chart.

I have no idea if it is true, but one guy claimed to be about 90% able to tell the sex of a seed by looking at it.
the next time I grow from seed, I am going to give it a try.

I also have an opinion about regular cannabis seeds that I can not verify. I think that cannabis seeds naturally produce more females and not because of environment.

If you think about it, it kind of makes sense. In a wild population, one male could seed hundreds of plants. I think that cannabis produces more females because only a few males can seed a lot of plants and provide genetic diversity.

That part is opinion based on all the regular seeds I have grown over the years. I have always seemed to get way more females. This is in wildly varying environmental conditions - outside/inside, soil/hydro.

Given your experience, I am very curious to your findings on seed/chart comparison. I would think that the seed would be more strain, and possibly pheno type of particular strain, related with size, shape, and color/markings.. but I am making wild guesses for sure. I would still love to hear your opinion on regular seeds vs. fem seeds etc... even if you can not verify.
I also agree that the environment places no major factor in sex determination or you can alter this to gain more females. I also must say that your female/male ratio is spot on as well.. simply due to the fact that a male plant can easily pollinate dozens of females.
I do think that there are females that have higher hermi hormones than other females which would show nut sacks during the early stage of flowering (collecting at node sites). Then there are females that may have a 'if I am not pollinated by certain stage of flowering throw nanners' genetic code where there is still no Y involved. I grew two bag seed one that hermied on me in early stage clustering at the node sites, and the other threw nanners in the final weeks of her life (no seeds at any stage in finale smoke).
Now, let us say that there is a 'grow cycle' where the environment is very harsh and causes every female to hermi.... would the resulting seeds 'remember' the harsh environment and throw hermies easier next grow cycle? No clue here LOL


I might delv into the world of male hermies and learn about the hormone that causes this, or since it does have an x in it does the seeds also carry xy... I would have to think yes. I have not heard of 'stressing' males to hermi either... whole different ball of wax.

 

[Trousers]

Given your experience, I am very curious to your findings on seed/chart comparison.

I'll go and find it. I planned on giving it a try when/if I pop some regular seeds I have been meaning to try.

I would think that the seed would be more strain, and possibly pheno type of particular strain, related with size, shape, and color/markings.. but I am making wild guesses for sure. I would still love to hear your opinion on regular seeds vs. fem seeds etc... even if you can not verify.

I just thought it was interesting and noticed I could see some of the things on the chart in the seeds I had.

Fem seeds are just like regular seeds, but they produce female plants. Period. They are just as likely to "hermie" as there parents, even if the parents were from regular seeds. Feminizing a seed does not change its dna or add anything. There is no such thing as the "hermie trait" as the term is used here.

I also agree that the environment places no major factor in sex determination or you can alter this to gain more females. I also must say that your female/male ratio is spot on as well.. simply due to the fact that a male plant can easily pollinate dozens of females.

It is still my opinion. I do not want anyone to think otherwise.

I do think that there are females that have higher hermi hormones than other females which would show nut sacks during the early stage of flowering (collecting at node sites).

Absolutely. Sativas are notorious for being more likely to show male flowers or become actual hermaphrodites. Good breeders weed this tendency out, but it is still there. when someone has a pure, stable indica that shows male flowers, I immediately think it is grower error, not genetics. Most people over fert their plants, that can cause a lock out and stress later in budding and cause the plant to show male folowers. It is really common and can be avoided.

Then there are females that may have a 'if I am not pollinated by certain stage of flowering throw nanners' genetic code where there is still no Y involved.

Yep.

I grew two bag seed one that hermied on me in early stage clustering at the node sites, and the other threw nanners in the final weeks of her life (no seeds at any stage in finale smoke).
Now, let us say that there is a 'grow cycle' where the environment is very harsh and causes every female to hermi.... would the resulting seeds 'remember' the harsh environment and throw hermies easier next grow cycle? No clue here LOL

No. Environment does not alter dna like that. Plants that survive are more likely to reproduce more plants. They then pass on their set of dna.

I might delv into the world of male hermies and learn about the hormone that causes this, or since it does have an x in it does the seeds also carry xy... I would have to think yes. I have not heard of 'stressing' males to hermi either... whole different ball of wax.

Yep.

I was going to make some fem seeds. When I went to order seeds I found out I could get clones for cheap.
I don't have room to search for phenos, etc. so I am not breeding, just chucking pollen.

Since I can get clones/seeds plants locally no problem, there is no reason for me to make fem seeds anymore.
My veg/seed room is now a small flower room. I may run another auto seed crop in my shed. Regular seeds can not handle the temp swings and humidity, they either die or get powdery mildew. /sweet blog

 

[Trousers]

I found it on this site.
https://www.rollitup.org/seed-strain-reviews/240691-how-tell-difference-between-male.html#post8663362

I am curious to give it a try. I have a handful of blueberry and NYCD regular seeds that have been sitting there doing nothing since I became a feminized seeds convert. Now I almost always grow from clone.

 

[kagecog]

Where did you get your feminized seeds?

Properly made feminized seeds are 100% female. I do not believe you have gotten males or "hermies" from feminized seeds, it is impossible.

I get my femenized seeds from either herbies or attitude usually. Both respected seed banks if you ask me. And if you look around on the forums a bit, you will see that I am not the only one who has gotten males and hermies from femenized seeds. In fact, hermies are relatively common with feminized seeds!

How do you quantify that? How do you know you get more males or females? Did you have a control group?
From what I have seen personally, environment plays no role in determining sex of cannabis from seed.

The only test I have actually done was experimenting with the effects of light spectrum on plants. I set up 2 groups each with 5 plants, I used a 6500k light for the first group and had 5 females, and I used a 2700k light for the second group and had 2 females and 3 males. I mean it could be just random chance but I have been getting a vast majority females when using a cooler light spectrum while vegging.

 

[kagecog]

I found it on this site.
https://www.rollitup.org/seed-strain-reviews/240691-how-tell-difference-between-male.html#post8663362

I am curious to give it a try. I have a handful of blueberry and NYCD regular seeds that have been sitting there doing nothing since I became a feminized seeds convert. Now I almost always grow from clone.

I would love to see how that turns out, if you can predict 100% which of those seeds turn out male and which ones turn out female, I will totally retract my statements.

 

[LeafGnosis]

I found it on this site.
https://www.rollitup.org/seed-strain-reviews/240691-how-tell-difference-between-male.html#post8663362

I am curious to give it a try. I have a handful of blueberry and NYCD regular seeds that have been sitting there doing nothing since I became a feminized seeds convert. Now I almost always grow from clone.

"you must wait before giving this user a rep..."
hehe, already gave you a rep on the lumii glasses.... will remember and back rep for this 'very' interesting information. I have a lot of bag seeds and feminized seeds... I will be checking this info against physical making of seeds. Thanks again for this info.

 

[Trousers]

I get my femenized seeds from either herbies or attitude usually. Both respected seed banks if you ask me. And if you look around on the forums a bit, you will see that I am not the only one who has gotten males and hermies from femenized seeds. In fact, hermies are relatively common with feminized seeds!

Properly made feminized seeds produce female plants 100% of the time.
If you got "hermies" it was your fault and would have happened with regular seeds of the same variety.

What you are talking about is a female plant that is stressed by the grower, you, into producing male flowers. That is not the plant's fault, it is the grower's fault. Give it a better environment and it will not show male flowers. All female cannabis can be stressed or manipulated into showing male flowers. It is hard wired into the dna and a survival mechanism and one of the reason cannabis grows successfully all over the world in very different environments.

The only test I have actually done was experimenting with the effects of light spectrum on plants. I set up 2 groups each with 5 plants, I used a 6500k light for the first group and had 5 females, and I used a 2700k light for the second group and had 2 females and 3 males. I mean it could be just random chance but I have been getting a vast majority females when using a cooler light spectrum while vegging.

I can find nothing that makes me think that cannabis sex isn't predetermined in the seed.
I need some smart guy in a lab coat with machines that go 'ping' and shit to back me up, but that is my opinion.

 

[kagecog]

I can find nothing that makes me think that cannabis sex isn't predetermined in the seed.
I need some smart guy in a lab coat with machines that go 'ping' and shit to back me up, but that is my opinion.

Obviously this is a hot topic that will definitely not be settled anytime soon! I guess we are just gonna have to wait until a professional botanist can come up with an answer forsure. Or until someone completes a large scale experiment

 

[Frisko]

That's why I buy Feminized seeds..

 

[smokeytokeybear]

you must spread the
reputation around before
giving it to trousers again

 

[JSJ]

[QUOTE=LeafGnosis;8663195]Then there are females that may have a 'if I am not pollinated by certain stage of flowering throw nanners' genetic code where there is still no Y involved.[//QUOTE]
Yep.

Care to answer that a little more in depth than a YEP. Would an isolated strain grown for a decade or more with this same trait ever produce anything other than a female seed?