Root zone ph question.

[dimebag87]

Hi. Since my plants have been in flower I have had serious ph issues I grow in a wilma that I have moded into what is basically a DWC type system. Cut a long story short my PH has been plummeting from an optimal level of 5.8 to 4.8 at exactly the same time every third day after a res change (probably due to left over P after all the N has been taken) because its only 30 liters which is not enough for four plants.

This is probably causing them considerable stress even though they are not left in the low ph solution very long. This brings me to my question. I read recently that in hydro that even if your nutrient solution isn't in a optimal range that the actual "root zone" PH still quite possibly could be fine. E.g nute solution is at 4.8 but root zone is stil in the 5.5 range. Is that a possibility or is this misleading info?

On top of that I have light burn and suppercropping to do in week five from too tall plants. Hermie time for me this grow I think!!


Thanks for any input!

 

[BigEasy1]

The PH on my last plant would drop like that every day or two at one certain stage of the grow cycle. I had to stay on top of it but it survived and turned out great. I'd say if you keep it balanced everyday it will eventually stop dropping as fast as it does now and the plant will be alright.

 

[jin420]

Sounds misleading to me you need to keep the nute solution between 5.5-6.5ph and not let it deviate for too long to avoid problems.

 

[LadyZandra]

Hate to tell ya hun-- you have to check and ADJUST the Ph in DWC EVERY DAY! the aeration process and the diminishing nutes then adding more etc.. changes the ph through the day every day.. so you MUST check and adjust every day...

you don't check the individual solutions you use, you check the entire nute solution in the rootzone after it is all mixed together and circulating for a few hours....

what feeding schedule you following???


Hence- why after 6 years of DWC this old Lady said "Screw all this work!" and went back to soil & organics!

 

[jin420]

The ph should go up naturally as it uses up nutes when it drops steadily that usually indicates a problem such as root rot or something. The ph in my drip systems rises pretty fast but the strain I'm growin eats pretty fast. The only time my ph drops is when I first add nutes other than that it only rises.

 

[LadyZandra]

Drip is a bit different than DWC tho- since the DWC sits and 'perks" and is in constant contact with the roots...
We only changed the rez 1x in veg, at transition, and 1/2 way thru flower-- just followed a phasic feeding schedule meant for DWC... but you still have to add extra water as needed and pH up/down daily as the pH changes...

again... too much F'in work...plus, our recirculating system kept leaking... was tired of mopping-up floods! LOL!

 

[jin420]

Hate to tell ya hun-- you have to check and ADJUST the Ph in DWC EVERY DAY! the aeration process and the diminishing nutes then adding more etc.. changes the ph through the day every day.. so you MUST check and adjust every day...

you don't check the individual solutions you use, you check the entire nute solution in the rootzone after it is all mixed together and circulating for a few hours....

what feeding schedule you following???


Hence- why after 6 years of DWC this old Lady said "Screw all this work!" and went back to soil & organics!

Yeah I hear you on that I grew in DWC systems for a while before getting tired of root rot and all the other problems associated with DWC. I went to top drip systems and it's been smooth sailing for years(knock on wood). As long as I'm not totally lazy I never have any problems other than a daily ph check especially with the hungry strain I'm currently flowering.

 

[dimebag87]

Hate to tell ya hun-- you have to check and ADJUST the Ph in DWC EVERY DAY! the aeration process and the diminishing nutes then adding more etc.. changes the ph through the day every day.. so you MUST check and adjust every day...

you don't check the individual solutions you use, you check the entire nute solution in the rootzone after it is all mixed together and circulating for a few hours....

what feeding schedule you following???


Hence- why after 6 years of DWC this old Lady said "Screw all this work!" and went back to soil & organics!

Yeah to be honest I'm overly paranoid about PH. I check it several times daily to the point I can accurately pinpoint the time in which it drops the way it does. Like I say the reservoir size of 30 tr/6.5 gallons just isn't enough to support four large plants for a long period of time I would of thought.

In terms of feeding they are on near full strength at week five of flowering. They handle it fine and the buds are still growing but it's now going to be a case of a full res change every third day just before the PH change. Far from ideal and a huge waste of nutrients. Another lesson learnt I suppose

 

[jin420]

You had a drip system that kept leaking LadyZandra? My systems have never leak on me and are fairly simple and a daily ph check only takes 5m and I like spending the time with my ladies. My system consists of a 35 gal tote sitting on top of a 5 gal bucket which is the res. The pump has a 6" section of 1/2" tubing which serves as a manifold. The only time I ever had any leaks was when I was first starting and I was splitting the 1/4" line up on top of the tote to run one line to multiple net cups. The solution was to run individual lines to each net cup directly from the manifold and presto no leaks.

 

[dimebag87]

Yeah I hear you on that I grew in DWC systems for a while before getting tired of root rot and all the other problems associated with DWC. I went to top drip systems and it's been smooth sailing for years(knock on wood). As long as I'm not totally lazy I never have any problems other than a daily ph check especially with the hungry strain I'm currently flowering.

There is no root rot I'm sure of that. I make sure to keep everything clean and I use a beneficial bacteria in there to protect against such nasty's

 

[jin420]

There is no root rot I'm sure of that. I make sure to keep everything clean and I use a beneficial bacteria in there to protect against such nasty's

Hmm that's good but it's odd then that you're ph keeps dropping. You need to definetely keep on top of it then and keep adjusting it back up the some ph up and keep it in the low 6's which is where you want to be in flowering.

 

[LadyZandra]

Well there's the problem! Only 6.5 gallons for 4 plants????
Should be a minimum of 4 gallons PER PLANT!!! They are sucking it up faster than you can replace it (nutes that is) bet you have to top off the water constantly too??

Better off in 5-gallon Walmart/Lowes/HomeDepot buckets with a net-pot lid on top and a good aerater with airstones.. cheap, efficient, and fewer issues!!


Our recirculating system was DWC-- 6 5-gallon buckets all linked together to a 30gallon rez that flowed thru them and back to the rez... but the hoses kept popping loose.. so would have 50 gallons or so spouting all over...
EEEK!!!

After 2 full-blown floods-- we threw in the towel (*hee hee*) and went back to individual buckets without the circulatory system... worked well, but didn't have the same results.

Much happier in soil with organics.. Feed once a week, water as needed... only have to check the pH when I feed (our water is consistent 6.7-6.9) so I'm a happy camper

 

[dimebag87]

Here are some pics of them about a week ago. Some freaky shit has gone on with some of the newest leaves since then due to heat stress and ph issues. Still far from dead but I'm pretty much guaranteed some hermie action here.

 

[jin420]

Well there's the problem! Only 6.5 gallons for 4 plants????
Should be a minimum of 4 gallons PER PLANT!!! They are sucking it up faster than you can replace it (nutes that is) bet you have to top off the water constantly too??

Better off in 5-gallon Walmart/Lowes/HomeDepot buckets with a net-pot lid on top and a good aerater with airstones.. cheap, efficient, and fewer issues!!

Our recirculating system was DWC-- 6 5-gallon buckets all linked together to a 30gallon rez that flowed thru them and back to the rez... but the hoses kept popping loose.. so would have 50 gallons or so spouting all over...
EEEK!!!

After 2 full-blown floods-- we threw in the towel (*hee hee*) and went back to individual buckets without the circulatory system... worked well, but didn't have the same results.

Much happier in soil with organics.. Feed once a week, water as needed... only have to check the pH when I feed (our water is consistent 6.7-6.9) so I'm a happy camper

Oh I see I thought you weren't talking about a top drip system I didn't know you meant a RDWC. Never used that type of system it does sound pretty complicated the thing I like about drip totes is that the root system gets to sit in open air and breathe easily. To each is own though whichever method of growing is the most comfortable to you is the best

 

[jin420]

Here are some pics of them about a week ago. Some freaky shit has gone on with some of the newest leaves since then due to heat stress and ph issues. Still far from dead but I'm pretty much guaranteed some hermie action here.


View attachment 2610114View attachment 2610115View attachment 2610116View attachment 2610114View attachment 2610115View attachment 2610116

Do you have some Dutch master reverse? If not get ready to do some plucking!

 

[dimebag87]

Well there's the problem! Only 6.5 gallons for 4 plants????
Should be a minimum of 4 gallons PER PLANT!!! They are sucking it up faster than you can replace it (nutes that is) bet you have to top off the water constantly too??

Better off in 5-gallon Walmart/Lowes/HomeDepot buckets with a net-pot lid on top and a good aerater with airstones.. cheap, efficient, and fewer issues!!

Our recirculating system was DWC-- 6 5-gallon buckets all linked together to a 30gallon rez that flowed thru them and back to the rez... but the hoses kept popping loose.. so would have 50 gallons or so spouting all over...
EEEK!!!

After 2 full-blown floods-- we threw in the towel (*hee hee*) and went back to individual buckets without the circulatory system... worked well, but didn't have the same results.

Much happier in soil with organics.. Feed once a week, water as needed... only have to check the pH when I feed (our water is consistent 6.7-6.9) so I'm a happy camper

Yeah i started thinking about going soil the other day haha. The only thing that bothers me with soil is the potential for lower yields. How much loss did you see when you switched if any?

 

[dimebag87]

Do you have some Dutch master reverse? If not get ready to do some plucking!

Haha no man but I have heard of that stuff. I'll take a look but I'm strapped right now and can barely afford the ton of nutrients I'm going to have to get so I can support them for the next five weeks. If they start popping them out a lot I will keep it in mind!

 

[jin420]

Haha no man but I have heard of that stuff. I'll take a look but I'm strapped right now and can barely afford the ton of nutrients I'm going to have to get so I can support them for the next five weeks. If they start popping them out a lot I will keep it in mind!

I'd only go through the trouble of getting some if bannanas started popping all over the place. If it just pops a few you should be able to pluck them with some tweezers I wouldn't be too concerned though they don't look that bad. Good luck though I HATE herme plants and have done battle with those freaks before.

 

[dimebag87]

I'd only go through the trouble of getting some if bannanas started popping all over the place. If it just pops a few you should be able to pluck them with some tweezers I wouldn't be too concerned though they don't look that bad. Good luck though I HATE herme plants and have done battle with those freaks before.

I just read the spec for it and you can only use it up to two weeks of flowering so it won't be much use now unfortunately. Thanks for the help though mate

 

[jin420]

Yeah i started thinking about going soil the other day haha. The only thing that bothers me with soil is the potential for lower yields. How much loss did you see when you switched if any?

You should try a top drip system all you'd need is a submersible pump, some drippers, a plastic tote and you could convert you're exisiting reservoirs to work. I can tell you from expirence that a drip system yields more than soil and matures the plants a hell of a lot faster. If you decide to try it out and have any questions feel free to PM me I've been using drip systems for 7yrs and know just about everything about them.