Does anyone want to receive Spiritual Enlightenment?

[eye exaggerate]

Because most people find that which they don't understand to be unnerving. The term they often use to describe the feeling happens to be "spooky". Some would simply say "startling".

Can you think of an example of the supernatural which doesn't seem spooky or startling?

...be right back

...just one more sec

 

[eye exaggerate]

...k, phew.

...I think spooky is caused by a state of mind in most instances. Spooky has varying effects according to the day a person's had. But, for every positive is there a negative? Do we know the answer intuitively? Day follows night, etc... There are delights and there are horrors, no denying that. I think it follows that there are unknowns that will always be unknown. I think our minds are powerful enough to create spooky scenarios for us to learn from - not to run from.

...here is what some believers call supernatural. Turning water into wine. The water is 'sex' and the wine is 'no longer seeing sex as a purely instinctual activity'. Nowadays this IS a supernatural feat.

-------

*thaumaturgy is a whole other story.

 

[New Age United]

Dear New Age,

Well, there is a difference between a theory and an assertion of "truth". Philosophy plays a big part in the sciences. You really, in my opinion, can't have one without the other. It seems to me that some of the greatest scientists, politicians, theorists of any kind, could also be considered philosophers as well. You can't develop a theory without understanding logic; your logic has to be based on the best information that we have at the present time. You can develop theories about anything really, but unless it's based in some observable reality... it won't be given much credence and is almost certainly bound to be wrong.

I really think you'd enjoy and get a lot out of reading some works by Karl Popper. He was not without his criticisms, and I disagree with a few of his "larger" views, but I do think it would be a great introduction to the Philosophy of Science, Epistemology, and Philosphy of Religion for you since many of your views... at least from my point of view, do not seem to be at odds with much of what he believed. Even though he has his critics, he still is respected in the field of philosophy and could most certainly help you build a framework for your ideas.

Anyone else have any recommended reading? I'm interested myself.

Very respectful, not against anyone, you very well could be the most enlightened person on this thread including myself

I am sorry people I know that this may seem like white noise to some, some people just do not see, I don't know why they just don't, plain and simple they just don't

Pie in the sky ideas, he is literally the driving force of physics, if he had enough time he could complete the book, he has to go through all of the possibilities, that is the only way to find the Truth, it is all about recognizing the counter-intuitive, and finding the Intuitive, that is where the Truth lies, and he Knows that, he trusts his Intuition, that's because he is a Genius

Trust your Intuition

Logic without Intuition is a wormhole, it will lead you so far away from the Truth that you don't even know what Truth is anymore. You can spend the rest of your life chasing the thoughts inside your mind, rationalizing, reasoning, following this logic or that logic, or you can just open your eyes and see

The rational mind does not trust Intuition, the rational mind can not find the Truth, only a belief, only the Knower can Know the Truth

Logic without Intuition is very dangerous, it has you trapped inside a dream, your mind is full of garbage, clear it out, this dream it will destroy you humanity, Awaken, just open your eyes and see

"The greatest obstacle to the Truth is to believe that it does not exist" Me, I said that JK... seriously I'm kidding Ego

But it is True, the greatest obstacle to the Truth is to believe that there is no Truth


“The intuitive mind is a Sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.” Einstein

“I never made one of my discoveries through the process of rational thinking” Einstein

“Out of clutter, find simplicity.” Einstein

"Truth is ever to be found in simplicity, and not in the multiplicity and confusion of things" Newton

 

[mindphuk]

Sounds like special pleading combined with begging the question to me. "oh, you just can't understand that's why you think I'm spouting bullshit, but in reality, if you were enlightened, you would understand how to become enlightened."

Your capitalizing "Truth" implies unique and special knowledge, and not your mundane, objective, truth such as what Einstein and Newton were referring. If you think there is one unique "truth" you should be able to demonstrate it without your contradictory, psuedo-spiritual nonsense. You can't even use consistent definitions of words. In spite of requests, you have yet to demonstrate anything like you claim actually exists. No one's ideas need to be taken seriously on their word alone.

You also seem to have a bone to pick with Dr. Hawking. The interesting thing is you haven't been specific but talk in circles about his supposed philosophy. You haven't even demonstrated he holds the views you attribute to him with any valid quotes or reference to any of his published work. The things is, he is one man. Though some may agree with his views, many may not. What's the point of attacking him in threads that haven't even mentioned him? Start a thread on Hawking if you want, but your attacks seem disjointed and out-of-place in the discussions where I have seen you make them.

I'm sure some of this may be due to smoking a lot before posting, but I wonder if sometimes you forgot to take your other meds. That wasn't meant as a cheap shot either but an honest appraisal based on people I know very well.

 

[Beefbisquit]

Very respectful, not against anyone, you very well could be the most enlightened person on this thread including myself

I am sorry people I know that this may seem like white noise to some, some people just do not see, I don't know why they just don't, plain and simple they just don't

Pie in the sky ideas, he is literally the driving force of physics, if he had enough time he could complete the book, he has to go through all of the possibilities, that is the only way to find the Truth, it is all about recognizing the counter-intuitive, and finding the Intuitive, that is where the Truth lies, and he Knows that, he trusts his Intuition, that's because he is a Genius

Trust your Intuition

Logic without Intuition is a wormhole, it will lead you so far away from the Truth that you don't even know what Truth is anymore. You can spend the rest of your life chasing the thoughts inside your mind, rationalizing, reasoning, following this logic or that logic, or you can just open your eyes and see

The rational mind does not trust Intuition, the rational mind can not find the Truth, only a belief, only the Knower can Know the Truth

Logic without Intuition is very dangerous, it has you trapped inside a dream, your mind is full of garbage, clear it out, this dream it will destroy you humanity, Awaken, just open your eyes and see

"The greatest obstacle to the Truth is to believe that it does not exist" Me, I said that JK... seriously I'm kidding Ego

But it is True, the greatest obstacle to the Truth is to believe that there is no Truth


“The intuitive mind is a Sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.” Einstein

“I never made one of my discoveries through the process of rational thinking” Einstein

“Out of clutter, find simplicity.” Einstein

"Truth is ever to be found in simplicity, and not in the multiplicity and confusion of things" Newton

As MP stated, for someone who claims to have achieved enlightenment and wants to show other people the way, you know very little about it, why it works, how it works, and what is taking place, etc. You can't even explain why some people are and some people aren't enlightened, yet you expect people to drink your Kool-aid without so much as a hiccup? If that's what you expect you are not living in reality.

What do you intuit from these two scenarios?

A train, its brakes failed, is rushing toward five people. The only way to save the five people is to throw the switch sitting next to you, which will turn the train onto a side track, thereby preventing it from killing the five people. However, there is a stranger standing on the side track with his back turned, and if you proceed to thrown the switch, the five people will be saved, but the person on the side track will be killed.

A train, its brakes failed, is rushing toward five people. The only way to save the five people is to throw the switch sitting next to you, which will turn the train onto a side track, thereby preventing it from killing the five people. However, there is a 12-year-old boy standing on the side track with his back turned, and if you proceed to throw the switch, the five people will be saved, but the boy on the side track will be killed.

Would you flip the train to the side tracks, or allow the five people to die?


Now ponder this scenario;


A brilliant transplant surgeon has five patients, each in need of a different organ, each of whom will die without that organ. Unfortunately, there are no organs available to perform any of these five transplant operations. A healthy young traveler, just passing through the city the doctor works in, comes in for a routine checkup. In the course of doing the checkup, the doctor discovers that his organs are compatible with all five of his dying patients. Can the surgeon take the life of the healthy young traveler to save the five other people?

To claim something is intuitive is to claim there is a definitive right or wrong answer, which is simply not the case in many thought experiments. If ethics were intuitive then everyone would feel the same way about abortion, or gay marriage. We clearly don't, and ethics are clearly not intuitive.

 

[eye exaggerate]

...interesting tidbit on intuition. The heart sends more information to the brain than the brain sends to the heart.

 

[Zaehet Strife]

...interesting tidbit on intuition. The heart sends more information to the brain than the brain sends to the heart.

Contrary to popular belief... the heart is merely a hollow muscular organ that pumps blood through the circulatory system by rhythmic contraction and dilation. It is a pump... nothing more, nothing less.

Actually, a few months ago some new ager was trying to explain to me just how exactly the heart was responsable for many different emotions, until i showed and explained to him this... (in which case he had no idea this even existed)



As i continued on asking him just how an artificially made heart could make you feel emotion, and also if you did get one... if you would stop feeling emotion.

It all ended with him getting very upset with me, and blocking and deleting me. Lol!

Ohhhh new agers, why you do dis?!

 

[Mister Sister]

We're all in this ship together. We are all wrong and we are all correct. Our thoughts and ideas are only a pinpoint snapshot of a much grander story. Does it matter who's wrong now, if that person is right later? If you are correct right now, does that mean you'll still be correct in the future?

Yet we all see another person's opinion and dismiss or ridicule it. I believe there is strength in our differences, and I challenge everyone reading this thread, myself included, to take an argument you disagree with and find truth in it. Fresh baked cookies for all.

 

[Zaehet Strife]

We are all wrong and we are all correct.

I do not agree with that. lol!

I think most of us humans like to think we are correct... and that some people are and some aren't. In the totality of our brief existence on this planet, hopefully on others, as the universe gets older and older and starts to cool...inevitably our race is destined to die out, nothing REALLY matters lol. So no i don't think it matters who is right or wrong about questions that no one can provide us with an answer to begin with. But it does matter once we get into ideas that will effect our well-being and health. Such as faith healing or crystal healing etc.

I don't think everyone here is dismissing and ridiculing ideas and opinions, i think a lot of people here have a lot to offer. Some really neat ideas and concepts, they give us more opportunities to learn from each other and widen our horizon of thought.

I do agree though, that there is strength in our differences. Our differences make us unique to one another, how boring would it be if we all thought the same way, right?

 

[New Age United]

I do not agree with that. lol!

I think most of us humans like to think we are correct... and that some people are and some aren't. In the totality of our brief existence on this planet, hopefully on others, as the universe gets older and older and starts to cool...inevitably our race is destined to die out, nothing REALLY matters lol. So no i don't think it matters who is right or wrong about questions that no one can provide us with an answer to begin with. But it does matter once we get into ideas that will effect our well-being and health. Such as faith healing or crystal healing etc.

I don't think everyone here is dismissing and ridiculing ideas and opinions, i think a lot of people here have a lot to offer. Some really neat ideas and concepts, they give us more opportunities to learn from each other and widen our horizon of thought.

I do agree though, that there is strength in our differences. Our differences make us unique to one another, how boring would it be if we all thought the same way, right?

Very well said, and I am not trying to change anybody, but some people are suffering and this stuff really does help them, some people don't feel comfortable enough to be themselves. Yes our differences are a very good thing.

 

[New Age United]

To claim something is intuitive is to claim there is a definitive right or wrong answer, which is simply not the case in many thought experiments. If ethics were intuitive then everyone would feel the same way about abortion, or gay marriage. We clearly don't, and ethics are clearly not intuitive.

Genius, true genius, it really is, I agree completely that ethics is not intuitive, it is not part of the intellect.

 

[Beefbisquit]

As MP stated, for someone who claims to have achieved enlightenment and wants to show other people the way, you know very little about it, why it works, how it works, and what is taking place, etc. You can't even explain why some people are and some people aren't enlightened, yet you expect people to drink your Kool-aid without so much as a hiccup? If that's what you expect you are not living in reality.

What do you intuit from these two scenarios?

A train, its brakes failed, is rushing toward five people. The only way to save the five people is to throw the switch sitting next to you, which will turn the train onto a side track, thereby preventing it from killing the five people. However, there is a stranger standing on the side track with his back turned, and if you proceed to thrown the switch, the five people will be saved, but the person on the side track will be killed.

A train, its brakes failed, is rushing toward five people. The only way to save the five people is to throw the switch sitting next to you, which will turn the train onto a side track, thereby preventing it from killing the five people. However, there is a 12-year-old boy standing on the side track with his back turned, and if you proceed to throw the switch, the five people will be saved, but the boy on the side track will be killed.

Would you flip the train to the side tracks, or allow the five people to die?


Now ponder this scenario;


A brilliant transplant surgeon has five patients, each in need of a different organ, each of whom will die without that organ. Unfortunately, there are no organs available to perform any of these five transplant operations. A healthy young traveler, just passing through the city the doctor works in, comes in for a routine checkup. In the course of doing the checkup, the doctor discovers that his organs are compatible with all five of his dying patients. Can the surgeon take the life of the healthy young traveler to save the five other people?

To claim something is intuitive is to claim there is a definitive right or wrong answer, which is simply not the case in many thought experiments. If ethics were intuitive then everyone would feel the same way about abortion, or gay marriage. We clearly don't, and ethics are clearly not intuitive.

I'm actually hoping for an answer on these, btw...

What would you do, and why?

 

[New Age United]

...I have a question. He says in the beginning of the video 'spookiness'. Why is supernatural always associated with spooky? Something other than natural seems spooky?

"The world is full of weariness, a man can not utter it" The Torah

What are you afraid of, there is nothing to be afraid of, pain comes and goes and death is very Peaceful

 

[New Age United]

let me help you with all the semantics and mumbo jumbo.

Just learn to meditate and do it daily. Don't worry about torahs and hall of halls and tablets.

I do understand what you're saying and that does help many people so that is an avenue that you may want to explore, another thing you may want to try is accupuncture, but make sure that it is performed by a Chinese Traditionalist or someone who has studied it, it is not a science it takes a very keen sense to be Aware of what is going on in the Chi.

There is no hall of halls, this is not Valhalla, Odin's wrath will be unleashed if you do not listen to me people I swear it will lol!!!!!

It's ok people don't you ever worry about me, I am in Paradise, why aren't you in Paradise I don't get it, this place is beautiful, it is absolutely perfect, everywhere you look perfect, I am the richest man in the world, I have a Glorius Kingdom I really do, I'm not trying to change anybody, rather just ease your suffering by showing you what I see

But I do not use meditation I get 6-10 hours a night and that is plenty enough for me.

 

[eye exaggerate]

Contrary to popular belief... the heart is merely a hollow muscular organ that pumps blood through the circulatory system by rhythmic contraction and dilation. It is a pump... nothing more, nothing less.

Actually, a few months ago some new ager was trying to explain to me just how exactly the heart was responsable for many different emotions, until i showed and explained to him this... (in which case he had no idea this even existed)

View attachment 2630816

As i continued on asking him just how an artificially made heart could make you feel emotion, and also if you did get one... if you would stop feeling emotion.

It all ended with him getting very upset with me, and blocking and deleting me. Lol!

Ohhhh new agers, why you do dis?!

...bah, does it or does it not send more info than vice-versa?

 

[New Age United]

...bah, does it or does it not send more info than vice-versa?

The Heart in your sense is a strictly Spiritual thing, and let me give you my opinion, keep in mind that at least one half of Enlightenment is purely Spiritual and not Philisophical.

The Soul is the individual human form, and is of course "Mortal", you have a Heart(sub-conscious) and a mind(conscious), and the sub-conscious is the faculty of all emotion, and thus does have a tremendous effect on the conscious, in fact anything that is not intellect is effected by the Heart, ie Ethics, your morality is very much governed by your "emotional intuition", love/hate, right/wrong, kindness/meaness, good/evil, these things all exist in the Heart, but they most certainly can have a great effect on the mind, they can take complete control of your mind and thus control your "will", in fact the majority of human action is controlled by the Heart.

Basically anything that does not take place on an intellectual level is influenced by the Heart, it is an absolutely vital part of the human experience.

"A sword will pierce even your own Soul, to the very end, so that the Thoughts from many Hearts may be revealed" The New Testament

"I swear oh lord, their eyes you have closed, to this day you have not opened them, this people's Heart is waxed, and their ears are dull from hearing, lest at anytime they should hear the word, and see with their eyes, and "KNOW" with their Hearts, and I shall heal them"

The Spirit is YOU, Awareness, pure Awareness, untouched by time, you are Eternal, you are One with Space, NO FORM, Indestructible, the Light does not die, Immortal Spirit, Mortal Soul.

"I will clear a Space for you in the darkness and fill it with Light, where you will shine for all Eternity" Jesus, not his exact words, I do that sometimes and there is a reason.

"If anyone adds or takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away that person’s share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book"

The very end of The New Testament, the reason why it says this is because the Roman Empire is trying to gain control over the minds of the masses in the 4th century AD, it doesn't want anyone messing with it and revealing the Truth to which Jesus was trying to convey.

Cause and effect, trust your Intuition, it is a genius.

 

[New Age United]

I'm actually hoping for an answer on these, btw...

What would you do, and why?

In the case of the train, Silence, no action.

In the case of the surgeon no I would not take the travelers life, murder is not just in my "opinion"

Actually you know what, I can't honestly say that, in the case of a serious situation, such as Hitler, murder is justified.

 

[eye exaggerate]

The Heart in your sense is a strictly Spiritual thing, and let me give you my opinion, keep in mind that at least one half of Enlightenment is purely Spiritual and not Philisophical.

The Soul is the individual human form, and is of course "Mortal", you have a Heart(sub-conscious) and a mind(conscious), and the sub-conscious is the faculty of all emotion, and thus does have a tremendous effect on the conscious, in fact anything that is not intellect is effected by the Heart, ie Ethics, your morality is very much governed by your "emotional intuition", love/hate, right/wrong, kindness/meaness, good/evil, these things all exist in the Heart, but they most certainly can have a great effect on the mind, they can take complete control of your mind and thus control your "will", in fact the majority of human action is controlled by the Heart.

Basically anything that does not take place on an intellectual level is influenced by the Heart, it is an absolutely vital part of the human experience.

"A sword will pierce even your own Soul, to the very end, so that the Thoughts from many Hearts may be revealed" The New Testament

"I swear oh lord, their eyes you have closed, to this day you have not opened them, this people's Heart is waxed, and their ears are dull from hearing, lest at anytime they should hear the word, and see with their eyes, and "KNOW" with their Hearts, and I shall heal them"

The Spirit is YOU, Awareness, pure Awareness, untouched by time, you are Eternal, you are One with Space, NO FORM, Indestructible, the Light does not die, Immortal Spirit, Mortal Soul.

"I will clear a Space for you in the darkness and fill it with Light, where you will shine for all Eternity" Jesus, not his exact words, I do that sometimes and there is a reason.

"If anyone adds or takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away that person’s share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book"

The very end of The New Testament, the reason why it says this is because the Roman Empire is trying to gain control over the minds of the masses in the 4th century AD, it doesn't want anyone messing with it and revealing the Truth to which Jesus was trying to convey.

Cause and effect, trust your Intuition, it is a genius.

...for me the key thing is the fact that, in terms of 'hierarchy', the heart is in the middle of a person's structure. Below that is the motor-instinctual; above the two is the conscious bit. The middle is the mediator, it's that point between something and nothing. Think of how much info there is in the blood. Then think about how it communicates to the brain.

When someone calls your name do your point at your house or car and say "who, me?" Nope, you point at your chest when that happens. Must be mind control

 

[New Age United]

...for me the key thing is the fact that, in terms of 'hierarchy', the heart is in the middle of a person's structure. Below that is the motor-instinctual; above the two is the conscious bit. The middle is the mediator, it's that point between something and nothing. Think of how much info there is in the blood. Then think about how it communicates to the brain.

When someone calls your name do your point at your house or car and say "who, me?" Nope, you point at your chest when that happens. Must be mind control

You are a Spiritually Intuitive person, and trust me that is much more valuable than everything else combined it really is. Another thing you may notice is that when you are being honest you will hold your hand to your chest(Heart), but when you lie you will throw your hands away from you, as if you are pushing the lie away from you.

 

[New Age United]

Sounds like special pleading combined with begging the question to me. "oh, you just can't understand that's why you think I'm spouting bullshit, but in reality, if you were enlightened, you would understand how to become enlightened."

Your capitalizing "Truth" implies unique and special knowledge, and not your mundane, objective, truth such as what Einstein and Newton were referring. If you think there is one unique "truth" you should be able to demonstrate it without your contradictory, psuedo-spiritual nonsense. You can't even use consistent definitions of words. In spite of requests, you have yet to demonstrate anything like you claim actually exists. No one's ideas need to be taken seriously on their word alone.

You also seem to have a bone to pick with Dr. Hawking. The interesting thing is you haven't been specific but talk in circles about his supposed philosophy. You haven't even demonstrated he holds the views you attribute to him with any valid quotes or reference to any of his published work. The things is, he is one man. Though some may agree with his views, many may not. What's the point of attacking him in threads that haven't even mentioned him? Start a thread on Hawking if you want, but your attacks seem disjointed and out-of-place in the discussions where I have seen you make them.

I'm sure some of this may be due to smoking a lot before posting, but I wonder if sometimes you forgot to take your other meds. That wasn't meant as a cheap shot either but an honest appraisal based on people I know very well.

Ok mindphuk, I have found the one who wants to prove me wrong, congrats, I give you this challenge, PROVE ME WRONG. No Ego, whatsover, there are counter-intuitives placed in my logic, find them, but prove me wrong and I will call myself a fool and you a genius.