Biological prevention everyone should use when growing.

Pepe le skunk

Well-Known Member
An Ounce of prevention is worth harvesting many pounds!

I know most people would jump to have as few pests as possible and almost guaranteed results if there was just one or two things they needed to do. The problem is most don't have a hortoricultural degree and don't know about these few extra steps you can take to have the best results possible. So here are a few preventative measures you can take to prevent soil bugs, powdery mildew and have the best conditions in your soil or coco. These few items are more important even then the soil you use.
So that is saying alot.
I believe you can also use some of these in hydro setups as well.

The other day I was talking with a friend who has grown for many years and he said he expects to get spider mites, Powdery Mildew and fungus nats every time he grows. These are the big three that most people battle while growing. Just read some of the threads on most of the boards out there. As I battle some of these very issues I started to think, how or what do most large commercial plant farms do to keep their crops in order and what do they know that we don't?

Many people do some type of soil somewhere in their grow. Even if it is Coco or any type of medium there are microbes you can add as a foliar spray, a soil drench or even when you mix up your own super soil that will help prevent most plant diseases, soil insects, and the benefit is vigorous plants, that have increased vitality and have much better root growth. Also it keeps 2 of the big three pests at bay in the process.

These beneficial bacteria/microbes include biennial bacterium streptomyces Lydicus (Actinovate SP Biological Fungicide ), Live Beneficial Nematodes (Scanmask) and Mycorrhiza Fungi. They are completely safe for people, pets, and the environment, and are compatible with other beneficial insects. They also pump up the plants immune system by making all the necessary trace minerals soluble and kill off bad bacteria as a bonus.

Actinovate SP Biological Fungicide
Actinovate SP is a high concentration of a patented biennial bacterium on a 100%
water soluble powder. This powerful new product effectively suppresses/controls
a wide range of soil borne diseases including Pythium, Phytophthora, Fusarium,
Rhizoctonia, Verticillium and other root decay fungi. Actinovate SP is also
labeled as a spray application for foliar diseases (when applied as a spray)
such as Powdery and Downey Mildew, Botrytis, Alternaria and others. In fact,
when used as a preventative, researchers have seen Actinovate SP work as well or
better than most chemicals. The benefits of Actinovate SP don't stop there:
Because of the special properties of the Actinovate microbe, plants treated with
Actinovate SP will be vigorous, have increased vitality and have much better
root growth. Actinovate SP contains the microorganism Streptomyces lydicus
strain WYEC 108. When introduced into the soil this microbe colonizes and grows
around the root system of plants. While settling in the root's rhizosphere, the
microbe forms a relationship, feeding off of the plant's waste materials while
secreting beneficial and protective by-products. This combination of the
colonization and the protective secretions forms a defensive barrier around the
root system of the plant which in turn suppresses and controls soil pathogens.
S. lydicus also has been shown to prey on certain pathogens, disrupting their
cell walls and disabling them in the process. Finally, the by-products of the
Actinovate microorganism also aid plants in complexing minerals and
micronutrients found in the soil, allowing easier uptake and, thus, creating a
stronger, more robust plant. This symbiotic relationship between the plant and
the microbe is the optimum balance for a natural, productive soil environment.
Actinovate SP makes it happen

Scanmask (nematodes)
These microscopic organisms destroy pests that live underground. They will seek
out and destroy more than 230 different kinds of soil dwelling and wood boring
insects, including Japanese beetles, cut worms, wire worms, weevils, white
grubs, fungus gnat larvae, flea larvae, subterranean termites, and many more.
They are so small that several thousand would fit on the head of a pin! But they
do a big job --moving through the ground, they enter the body cavities of their
target pests and release bacteria that kill that pest. They are completely safe
for people, pets, and the environment, and are compatible with other beneficial
insects. Each container includes seven million live beneficial nematodes.

Mycorrhiza Fungi
Sources of these fungi include Plant Sucess (OK), Myco Magic (OK) Sub-Culture (slightly better) and Super Plant Tonic (my favorite - none better). soil secrets "earth nectar" and "earth ambrosia" a wonderful humic and fulvic acid innoccullant full of the beneficial bacteria's growers love...cheap and effective.

If you use these in the beginning you will see results and the total cost is less than if you have to battle one or two of the big three.
Hope a mod makes this a sticky as it is probably one of the most important steps you can take in the beginning that can set you up for success.
Feel free to comment.
Hope that helps.
 

Yodazherb

Active Member
Stellar post.
Ive used beni's in my veggie garden for 30+ years.
Makes a HUGE difference.
Nematodes are tiny warriors !
Not to mention they destroy flea's and ticks in the back yard as well !
 

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
Pepe, enough of the junk science and feelings. You're falling into the typical noob trap of claims and ads.

What you recommend may have merit with some applications, I use myco drenches myself in my commercial ag biz, but none of what you're suggesting is gonna alleviate high pressure from fungus gnats, mites or PM.

I need to see scientific, empirical data from a non-partisan firm to be convinced.

UB
 

HeartlandHank

Well-Known Member
I have been using Actinovate to fight Take all root rot.
I'm curious to see if ACtinovate will work as a preventative for Powdery Mildew on Crepe Myrtles.
I picked up 18oz for $125... next year I will have a chance to really try out the PM/Crepe thing.
 

Pepe le skunk

Well-Known Member
Bookmarked for later use. Might be handy to use this info with sub's super soil.
I do use it in the month of cooking the soil before use. Especially the Mycorrhiza Fungi and the scan mask.

Stellar post.
Ive used beni's in my veggie garden for 30+ years.
Makes a HUGE difference.
Nematodes are tiny warriors !
Not to mention they destroy flea's and ticks in the back yard as well !
Thank's for sharing your experience.


Here is a schedule I use when foiler feeding and soil topping or light drenching the soil.
Week 1
When mixing soil make sure you add Mycorrhiza Fungi.

Week 3 of life or when clone is transplanted to soil.
Scanmask
(I usually just do water the first week for new clones in soil to lessen stress. Week 2 they get 1/4 fert after that it is game on.)
Treat soil while watering with a small dose of Scan mask. 1/2 top plain water first. go light. 1/4 scanmask topsoil water drench next.
(Prepare scanmask ahead of time at least 30 min to 45 min beforehand.) mix scanmask and let it set up with water and 1 tablespoon peanut butter in the small container it comes in.
30 to 45 min later I then mix with 2 1/2 gallons of water with the contents of the (scanmask) nematodes as a concentrated bucket.

Only need a 1/4 to 1/2 cup per plant container as a top dressing.
At this time I usually do the bottom drain holes with a quick soil dunk using a small plant water catcher (drain water saucer) filled 1/2 way and allow the container to wic from the bottom.
Let it sit at least 2 minutes in the saucer with the drain holes completely submerged. I then let it sit in a second saucer to drain any excess water. That was the last 1/4 for watering.
Otherwise adults will breed and lay eggs in the drain holes. Damn things.

Week 5
Foliar spray the leaves with Actinovate SP mixed with water. (To harden plant against powdery mildew)

week 7
Soil drench with Actinovate SP and foilar spray with Actinovate SP.
Again you only need a little as a soil top drenching. Use about a cup per container. Depending on size of container.

Week 8 or whenever you transplant.
Treat new soil with Scan mask soil drench. (To prevent any Fungus nats or new bugs in soil.)

Week 10-16 Or when you move to flower. (week 1 flower)
Treat with Actinovate SP for powdery mildew as a foilar. (PM hit me in week 2 of flower right after doing scrog and tying up plants. Stuff spreads like wildfire in just 2 days. No signs of it before tying plants that's why you hit it in week one and 3 and 5.) Also do a quick soil drench top dressing to harden soil off in flower. Get it into the roots and inside the plant.

Week 2 Flower
Treat with Scan mask as soil topping especially if you transplanted into larger container for flowering with new soil. You might want to up the amount to 1 cup to cover soil surface.
Preventative against fungus nats during flowering. Sucks if they get stuck in your trichomes. lol

Week 3 flower
Treat with Actinovate SP foilar spray for PM.

Week 5 flower optional.
Treat as a foilar only if you have a strain that is not resistant to PM or if you know you have it. Otherwise you should be good because the buds could start to rot from to high of moisture. Although Actinovate SP might help prevent it. And remember because it is a natural product they are safe up until 2 weeks before harvest.
 

Pepe le skunk

Well-Known Member
Pepe, enough of the junk science and feelings. You're falling into the typical noob trap of claims and ads.

What you recommend may have merit with some applications, I use myco drenches myself in my commercial ag biz, but none of what you're suggesting is gonna alleviate high pressure from fungus gnats, mites or PM.

I need to see scientific, empirical data from a non-partisan firm to be convinced.

UB
Remember these are preventative and not if you already have an active infection. You need to do alot more if you have an active infection of PM or Nats. None of these will stop mites however you might not have them if you take care of your garden in the first place. Thanks for your experience that you yourself use some of these preventative measures. I consider that as a complement from you especially after reading the wealth of info you bring with you to RIU.

I have been using Actinovate to fight Take all root rot.
I'm curious to see if ACtinovate will work as a preventative for Powdery Mildew on Crepe Myrtles.
I picked up 18oz for $125... next year I will have a chance to really try out the PM/Crepe thing.
Let us know how it works. Good luck. Crepe Myrtle is a nice plant/ bush for the yard.
 

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
I have been using Actinovate to fight Take all root rot.
I'm curious to see if ACtinovate will work as a preventative for Powdery Mildew on Crepe Myrtles.
I picked up 18oz for $125... next year I will have a chance to really try out the PM/Crepe thing.
Myclobutanil. I use the Rally product.

Been growing pot for years and never had a PM problem. Had bud rot, but that's different.
 

cannawizard

Well-Known Member
((Streptomyces lydicus strain WYEC 108 is a naturally occurring bacterium that is commonly found in
soil. When applied to soil mixes or turf grass, the bacterium protects the plant against a range of root
decay fungi. Streptomyces lydicus strain WYEC 108 can also be applied to plant foliage in greenhouses
to control powdery mildew. No harm to humans or the environment is expected from use of
Streptomyces lydicus strain WYEC 108 as a pesticide active ingredient.))

--If it is a naturally common spore strain found in soil, wouldn't it be better just to inoculate your amended super soil with bac/fung compost teas; to boost the already present microbes in the soil?

--Wouldn't a good batch of fungal tea have more strains available to combat PM instead of just using (Actinovate)?

--I've personally tested sub-culture and myco-magic against an aggressive PM (growing on c99 moms) and it didn't work, on the other hand, the gradual application of ACT did work..

also found this online:

http://www.futurecobioscience.com/media/publications/72e991f011fd043690e91d8cc4e2bc88.pdf
--short summary would be-- the product was tested in (vitro trials) not under field conditions-- which is different..

So have you rigorously tested this product since your telling everyone under the AMC board that its "the-go-to" product to use for all our biological problems??

:leaf::joint:
 

HeartlandHank

Well-Known Member
Thanks. Good to know. MJ plants aren't a problem.
Crepe Myrtles though... especially those not planted in full sun.

Bayer 3 n 1 does alright. Have used neem for those who demand organic... with so so success.
I'll look out for myclobutanil

Myclobutanil. I use the Rally product.

Been growing pot for years and never had a PM problem. Had bud rot, but that's different.
 

HeartlandHank

Well-Known Member
--Wouldn't a good batch of fungal tea have more strains available to combat PM instead of just using (Actinovate)?
Prbly. Actinovate is most well know for turf treatment of fungal disease... A good dethatch followed by 1/8in top dress of good compost in early spring seems to do well.. Fucking St Augustine... stupidest shit ever.
 

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
Prbly. Actinovate is most well know for turf treatment of fungal disease... A good dethatch followed by 1/8in top dress of good compost in early spring seems to do well.. Fucking St Augustine... stupidest shit ever.
Hydro-seeded 6,000 s.f. front yard with LaPrima blend bermuda seed. Nice! St. Aug. does suck.
 

Pepe le skunk

Well-Known Member
This response is not ment to insult, harm or otherwise make someone mad or pissed off. Just want to get that out incase it might be interperated that way.
Cheers,
Pepe.
--If it is a naturally common spore strain found in soil, wouldn't it be better just to inoculate your amended super soil with bac/fung compost teas; to boost the already present microbes in the soil? Yes it would. As long as you had 3-6 months ahead of time made the compost to brew said tea. 99% of people on this form probably didn't or don't know how to make it. However the stuff in the lab was made awhile ago and was reduced down to a concentrated formula you can just purchase and use. Again this is a preventative measure and most growers or new growers didn't do the research about inoculating soil. This is a much faster direct approach and is the information they should know and what to do to get them ahead of the game.

--Wouldn't a good batch of fungal tea have more strains available to combat PM instead of just using (Actinovate)? Again probably, but if someone is going to mix soil in the next 5 days, this is a much faster and better option and one that is specifically used to combat one of the three biggest problems most growers face. Remember, these bacteria have been specifically bred and raised to combat specific strains of mold and fungus and will put most growers well ahead of the game in a very short period of time combating 3 of the biggest problems growers face. Did I really just say that two different ways?

--I've personally tested sub-culture and myco-magic against an aggressive PM (growing on c99 moms) and it didn't work, on the other hand, the gradual application of ACT did work.. How long did it take you to learn that you had PM? When you found out something was wrong how long did it take you to do something about it? If you used the above items in the preventative maintenance as I suggested above, do you think you would have had the same problem? An ounce of prevention is equal to a pound of cure. I bet that if you would have read the suggestions 6-10 weeks before, you got the C-99 with the aggressive PM, you would have done one of two things. One: read and learned a good way to prevent these issues and then actually done them or something similar, or two, you would have disregarded sound advice and ended up doing just what you did. Treating after the fact.

If you would have done the treatments above by taking the advice, you also would have realized that a population of bateria takes time to build up and do it's job. And combined with the foilar feedings you would have built up a natural resistance you outlined above and that you are now using (the tea method.) Glad you are now doing something as a preventative.

I am trying to help people learn from others mistakes, and now hopefully, other's on this forum, being able to use that knowledge, can form a strategy, to take that ounce of prevention, and utilize that information like it seems you are now doing. So props for doing just that. Please feel free to include your recipe for making said tea or if you are using a product that can be purchased, please add it to this post, so you can help somebody..


also found this online:

http://www.futurecobioscience.com/media/publications/72e991f011fd043690e91d8cc4e2bc88.pdf
--short summary would be-- the product was tested in (vitro trials) not under field conditions-- which is different..

So have you rigorously tested this product since your telling everyone under the AMC board that its "the-go-to" product to use for all our biological problems?? Yes, I have used it as a preventative, to stop powdery mildew dead in it's tracks, by doing repeated doses on a regular bases, a plant that was less resistant to PM, became more resistant to PM, and agressive cases no longer affected that plant, or any others in the same flower room, because now, they all had been treated over a 8 week period and were not attacked by the mildew even if some of it showed up, the bateria would consume it before it got out of control..

But to get to your point, these preventative measures will not stop an agressive case of PM, that was the growers fault, for not doing, the necessary preventative maintence, in the first place ..


:leaf::joint:

Response above in green.

One last thing. If we had some Ham, we could have some Ham and eggs, if we had some eggs.
 

cannawizard

Well-Known Member
This response is not ment to insult, harm or otherwise make someone mad or pissed off. Just want to get that out incase it might be interperated that way.
Cheers,
Pepe.
--I saw nothing in your response that was insulting or misleading, good response to my Qs btw :)

--And from how you responded, I will now look into Actinovate, it does sound like a handy product for preventative maintenance~

--The compost I used for ACTs is from 1yr old batches, good stuff, and the PM affecting the c99 moms came off another strain introduced to the garden.. Thats why I dont accept clones from unknown gardens anymore :P

**I'll definitely give Actinovate a go, but i'll stick to what I said about myco-magic & subculture (two products that did not live up to their marketing hype) ..O yea, scanmask is an awesome product too

#cheers :-o


 

Pepe le skunk

Well-Known Member
--good response to my Qs btw :)

I will now look into Actinovate, it does sound like a handy product for preventative maintenance~

the PM affecting the c99 moms came off another strain introduced to the garden.. Thats why I dont accept clones from unknown gardens anymore :P
O yea, scanmask is an awesome product too

#cheers :-o


I hear ya on the clone bringing in PM. I try and treat any new ones and it makes any corrective action not as harsh. The Actinovate and scanmask help and thats better than nothing. All it takes is one bad batch of soil, pests entering on your cloths or PM from a clone to make your life a lot more difficult and at least if you where doing maintenance you might catch it before they ruin your crop.

If anyone does something for mites or over all plant health that is a tea or something else feel free to give another beneficial treatment suggestion.

I try to change my shoes and cloths when I enter into a garden especially if I went outside. Anyone else do that?
 

HeartlandHank

Well-Known Member
If anyone does something for mites or over all plant health that is a tea or something else feel free to give another beneficial treatment suggestion.
I've heard compost tea sprays leave a "bio film" on the leaves.. making it harder for leaf sucking/chewing pests to take hold. True? I don't know.
You can buy fresh compost teas at some nurseries. Ask around. I bet someone in your area sells them. Around here, they only sell them on the weekends.

Spider mites indoors.... the best thing you can do is be careful about going outdoors to indoors. If you can, always change clothes/shoes. Definitely never work on an outdoor garden then walk inside and go to your indoor garden.

The best way to prevent spider mites is to not bring them indoors on your shoes, clothing or tools. Or cuttings your bring in...
 

fattiemcnuggins

Well-Known Member
not mj... i can snap some others though if you want.

they were just sprayed with Bayer 3in1 on Sunday. So it's looking pretty mild.
Couple tablespoons of Bragg's apple cider vinegar per gallon works awesome for PM. I had tried other brands, baking soda, neem oil, with limited success. No recurring problems in 6 months or more.
 

fattiemcnuggins

Well-Known Member
I've heard compost tea sprays leave a "bio film" on the leaves.. making it harder for leaf sucking/chewing pests to take hold. True? I don't know.
You can buy fresh compost teas at some nurseries. Ask around. I bet someone in your area sells them. Around here, they only sell them on the weekends.

Spider mites indoors.... the best thing you can do is be careful about going outdoors to indoors. If you can, always change clothes/shoes. Definitely never work on an outdoor garden then walk inside and go to your indoor garden.

The best way to prevent spider mites is to not bring them indoors on your shoes, clothing or tools. Or cuttings your bring in...

The "bio-film"-- you can make with homemade lacto bacillus. It will colonize your leaves and soil leaving no room for bad guys to take hold (pm, rust, etc.)

I wanna say dandelions and nettles are good sources of immune boosters but I'll double check.
 
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