since insurance deals with risk...

[UncleBuck]

...then why do we have health insurance, since needing health care is inevitable?



i can understand why we have auto insurance, since getting into a vehicle accident which injures someone is not inevitable. still, it's nice to know that the driver who just cut me off and put me into the telephone pole has basic 30/60 coverage to cover the bill on my broken leg and whiplash.

i can understand why we have homeowner's insurance, since my grow room burning down my house is not inevitable. still, it's nice to know that everything in my house can be replaced if the shoddy, decades old wiring in my house decides to go on the fritz when i'm not here to extinguish it.



but health insurance is different. the fact is that every single one of us will need health care at some point in our lives, and many of us will need a lot of it.

so why handle the inevitable with actuarial tables, instead of just treating it like the inevitability that it truly is?

 

[Dr Kynes]

so, since it is inevitable, we should be taxed sufficiently to pay for the costs of any conceivable medical costs we may incur...

http://www.fiercehealthcare.com/story/how-seemingly-largest-hospital-bill-came-be/2011-07-29

9.2million x 314 million people = $2,888,800,000,000,000.00 in taxes for Obamacare Version 2, National Healthcare Boogaloo.

when you gonna pay your share bucky?

i know i dont have 9.2 mil in the bank to offset my potential medical costs due tio the INEVITABILITY of medical costs, and since actualrial tables cannot be used to estimate the likely costs, we should all have to fork over the necessary monies immediately, to ensure we dont become burdens on the totally imaginary, not at all planned out, completely unexpected slide into a nationalized medical system, which Harry Reid totally doesnt anticipate.

 

[UncleBuck]

...since actualrial tables cannot be used to estimate the likely costs...

unless my sarcasm meter is way off here, you seem to be implying that the utility of insurance is that it will do a good enough job to cover your likely (and inevitable) costs.

it seems that you would prefer this system over the tried and tested method in the rest of the world, which produces better outcomes for more people at lower cost.

so if you prefer the insurance model for covering the inevitable costs over a single payer type of model, then why so many objections to mandatory health insurance?

 

[Dr Kynes]

unless my sarcasm meter is way off here, you seem to be implying that the utility of insurance is that it will do a good enough job to cover your likely (and inevitable) costs.

it seems that you would prefer this system over the tried and tested method in the rest of the world, which produces better outcomes for more people at lower cost.

so if you prefer the insurance model for covering the inevitable costs over a single payer type of model, then why so many objections to mandatory health insurance?

as i stated so many times before, i would PREFER a National Healthcare System, and the elimination of the insurance companies from the medical issue entirely...


Provided Washington Actually Pays For It.


if we are taxed to fund the porogram, upfront, i would be happy to foot the bill for the tax. i havent seen a physician since 2004, but the next time i gotta see a croaker im fucked, since i dont qualify for medicaid (in Ca its called Medi-Cal) and dont wqualify for shit in subsidies from O-Care, i am in a hole.

i cant afford the premiums, and am too "rich" for indigent medical care coverage.




my problem with O-care (just like Hillarycare before it) is not the stated aim of helping ewverybpody see a doctor when they need it, but rather the method of drafting the laws (in secret) and the shenanigans in funding it. the funding is from taxes through the backdoor, concealed by lies, increasing the debt and putting us all on a collision course with the single payer system the left wants, instead of simply creating a plan and selling it without the fucking games and bullshit.

rolling together medicare, medicaid, the VA system, and the military medical programs, plus an extra tax (maybe 2-6% total in payroll taxes) to fund a national medical system with local clinicsin outlying regions, larger hospitals in densely populated regions, and central specialist hub hospitals to handle shit like cancer, etc... would reduce redundancy, cut costs, eliminate a shitload of bureaucracy and create a system by which everybody pays a set % of their income (from whatever source derived, including capital gains and investments), and any asshole who feels the need can walk into a hospital without signing over an arm a leg and a testicle to pay for a broken arm.

 

[UncleBuck]

*i dont qualify for medicaid (in Ca its called Medi-Cal) and dont wqualify for shit in subsidies from O-Care, i am in a hole.

no one believes that you make 400% of poverty.

at the $10 an hour or so that you've let on, you'd have to work about 91 hours a week, 50 weeks a year to get past the subsidies in the PPACA designed to help you out.

i'd be far more inclined to believe that you are closer to 138% of poverty, the threshold for medi-cal ($11,490 X 1.38% = $15,856, $15,856/$10 per hour = 1,586 hours, 1,586 hours/50 work weeks = 31 hours a week, about all a bum knee can handle as a stockboy).

but your lies aside, let's take a look at this abrupt about face from your first post.

rolling together medicare, medicaid, the VA system, and the military medical programs, plus an extra tax (maybe 2-6% total in payroll taxes) to fund a national medical system with local clinicsin outlying regions, larger hospitals in densely populated regions, and central specialist hub hospitals to handle shit like cancer, etc... would reduce redundancy, cut costs, eliminate a shitload of bureaucracy and create a system by which everybody pays a set % of their income (from whatever source derived, including capital gains and investments), and any asshole who feels the need can walk into a hospital without signing over an arm a leg and a testicle to pay for a broken arm.

but then you'd complain about "criminally high" taxes and poo poo all over that idea, just like you do when i point out how the rest of the world basically does it that way.

i honestly don't think anything will satisfy you because it will take away from your narrative of poor, persecuted kynes.

you talk out of both sides of your mouth on this one constantly, and there is no way your financial situation is what you say it is.

 

[Dr Kynes]

no one believes that you make 400% of poverty.

at the $10 an hour or so that you've let on, you'd have to work about 91 hours a week, 50 weeks a year to get past the subsidies in the PPACA designed to help you out.

i'd be far more inclined to believe that you are closer to 138% of poverty, the threshold for medi-cal ($11,490 X 1.38% = $15,856, $15,856/$10 per hour = 1,586 hours, 1,586 hours/50 work weeks = 31 hours a week, about all a bum knee can handle as a stockboy).

but your lies aside, let's take a look at this abrupt about face from your first post.



but then you'd complain about "criminally high" taxes and poo poo all over that idea, just like you do when i point out how the rest of the world basically does it that way.

i honestly don't think anything will satisfy you because it will take away from your narrative of poor, persecuted kynes.

you talk out of both sides of your mouth on this one constantly, and there is no way your financial situation is what you say it is.

yes, criminally high taxes. BUT THEY CHOSE IT.

further, THEY ARE HAPPY WITH IT (mostly)

i oppose the O-man and his O-care because it was draftred in secret, the taxes are a pig in a poke, the "reforms" contiinue to line the pockets of his big money contributors, and it forces everybody to buy shit from a for-profit company or face the IRS who, despite your claims, WILL put butts in jail when the Penal-Tax is not paid.

 

[UncleBuck]

yes, criminally high taxes. BUT THEY CHOSE IT.

further, THEY ARE HAPPY WITH IT (mostly)

i oppose the O-man and his O-care because it was draftred in secret, the taxes are a pig in a poke, the "reforms" contiinue to line the pockets of his big money contributors, and it forces everybody to buy shit from a for-profit company or face the IRS who, despite your claims, WILL put butts in jail when the Penal-Tax is not paid.

you hyperbole, fear mongering, distortions, and about-face-flip-flops aside, how is it that you don't qualify for subsidies under the PPACA?

do you want us to believe that you are past 400% of poverty?

 

[beenthere]

[h=2]since insurance deals with risk...[/h]

...then why do we have health insurance, since needing health care is inevitable?
​

 

[UncleBuck]

since insurance deals with risk...

...then why do we have health insurance, since needing health care is inevitable?
​

https://www.rollitup.org/politics/567721-obamas-fake-lead-polls-exposed.html

 

[Dr Kynes]

you hyperbole, fear mongering, distortions, and about-face-flip-flops aside, how is it that you don't qualify for subsidies under the PPACA?

do you want us to believe that you are past 400% of poverty?

still cant accept the simple idea that NOT lying, NOT creating a shell game, and NOT designing a plan which is doomed to failure to force the country into a socialized system, whether they want it or not would be better then FRAUD.

O-Care is FRAUD it is designed to create the crisis which will result in a socialized system.

Harry Reid even admitted it was just the first step in the long term plan.

but we are supposed to just assume harry knows best, and Barry has our best interests at heart, and thats why they have to lie about their shit.

it's for our own good, we just arent clever enough to recognize their genius, even when we have it thrust upon us.

if you want socialized medicine, SELL SOCIALIZED MEDICINE, dont play shabby games and fuck the current system over to force what you want down our throats.

but then Ye Olde Tyme Marxism isnt selling, so we need slow, gradual fascism, thats why Il Duce invented it.

 

[NLXSK1]

Why dont we just have everyone pay for their own healthcare since death is inevitable...

Costs would come down drastically...

 

[UncleBuck]

still cant accept the simple idea that NOT lying, NOT creating a shell game, and NOT designing a plan which is doomed to failure to force the country into a socialized system, whether they want it or not would be better then FRAUD.

O-Care is FRAUD it is designed to create the crisis which will result in a socialized system.

Harry Reid even admitted it was just the first step in the long term plan.

but we are supposed to just assume harry knows best, and Barry has our best interests at heart, and thats why they have to lie about their shit.

it's for our own good, we just arent clever enough to recognize their genius, even when we have it thrust upon us.

if you want socialized medicine, SELL SOCIALIZED MEDICINE, dont play shabby games and fuck the current system over to force what you want down our throats.

but then Ye Olde Tyme Marxism isnt selling, so we need slow, gradual fascism, thats why Il Duce invented it.

so in other words, no matter what happens, you'll be crying about fraud, marxism, bolsheviks, and criminally high taxes.

in short, nothing will satisfy you. in fact, nothing CAN satisfy you, otherwise you wouldn't be able to claim persecution.

and still nobody believes you are making 400% of poverty or more.

 

[heckler73]

still cant accept the simple idea that NOT lying, NOT creating a shell game, and NOT designing a plan which is doomed to failure to force the country into a socialized system, whether they want it or not would be better then FRAUD.

O-Care [edit:he means Republicare] is FRAUD it is designed to create the crisis which will result in a socialized system.

Then why did the Republicans push so hard for this individual mandate?
Why didn't they just say "YES" to the single-payer ObamaJomamallamaCARE at the beginning if this is their plan anyway?

[video=youtube;dLHb4Pb0Xwg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLHb4Pb0Xwg[/video]

Shouldn't the blame be laid at the feet of those who stomped on it in the first place?

 

[UncleBuck]

Why dont we just have everyone pay for their own healthcare since death is inevitable...

Costs would come down drastically...

yeah, let's ask the guy with renal failure to cough up the $80,000 while he is bedridden.

you are literally retarded.

how many chickens do you suppose that guy is gonna need to trade to cover his health care costs?

get to fucking, birds.*

 

[Dr Kynes]

Then why did the Republicans push so hard for this individual mandate?
Why didn't they just say "YES" to the single-payer ObamaJomamallamaCARE at the beginning if this is their plan anyway?

[video=youtube;dLHb4Pb0Xwg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLHb4Pb0Xwg[/video]

Shouldn't the blame be laid at the feet of those who stomped on it in the first place?

nobody wants to hear what van jones has to say, and nobody believes your attempts to blame the republican party for O-care.

the heritage foundation (NOT ALL REPUBLICANS) proposed this idea as a "Fuck You" to the low income people who dont buy health insurance, because they cannot afford it, and do not qualify for Medicaid.

a proposal is NOT A LAW fuck it's not even a bill.
it was a shitty idea no matter who thought it up first, and the fact that the left latched onto it like a pit bull on a preschooler doesnt make it any better or any worse an idea.

why dont you repost your van Jones clip a few more times though, im sure you think it is so badass we should all enjoy the ravings of a marxist bigoted left wing agitator, but those of us you so desperately wish to convince couldnt give a shit what that turd flaps his gums about.

 

[abandonconflict]

O-Care is designed to create the crisis which will result in a socialized system.

You have developed an entire foil hat tale about how fascism is the first step toward socialism. The entire system has just been privatized and you're blaming the left. It wouldn't be your special kind of bullshit with out mention of Mussolini and that cool story about how he was a socialist.

There is absolutely nothing about Obamacare that is socialist. Yet in your mind, it is socialist because clearly, socialism will be the solution for the problem it creates.

That is fucking brilliant Kynes, by a stroke of pure idiocy, you're accidently right. Socialism is exactly what will fix the problems caused by capitalism.

 

[beenthere]

My God, grown men whining for government handouts

 

[see4]

My God, grown men whining for government handouts

Even whining about it, is just as bad. How about people start working together to solve problems instead of constantly blaming the other side?

 

[UncleBuck]

My God, grown men whining for government handouts

actually, this is a conversation about the inevitability of needing health care and methods of implementation in light of that fact.

why don't you just go ahead and retreat back to the kiddy table where your level of intellect is more at home?

 

[Flaming Pie]

Is obamacare dead yet?