Obamacare Enrollment Estimates Less Than 50,000

[abandonconflict]

Why all these straw men?

I never said you were a liberal, I said you're part of the extreme left wing. You can't argue a thing on the merits my friend, then you get pissy when someone points it out.

I'm arguing with 3 people and winning, as evidenced by the fact that you continue responding to comments not directed at you and calling them strawmen. You're dumb.

 

[beenthere]

I'm arguing with 3 people and winning, as evidenced by the fact that you continue responding to comments not directed at you and calling them strawmen. You're dumb.

Yah right and guys with little dicks think they're tearing that pussy up!

 

[abandonconflict]

Now it's just one big attack on conservatives because we threaten to interrupt business in Washington as usual. The ruling class doesn't like that.

Conservative = 99% now lol. The Heritage Foundation, Koch brothers, tea Party, John Birch Society, GOP were not actually representing the ruling class, who the fuck knew.

 

[Doer]

Why all these straw men?

I never said you were a liberal, I said you're part of the extreme left wing. You can't argue a thing on the merits my friend, then you get pissy when someone points it out.

Why do you throw stones, cast aspersions, and generally act shitty and pissy all at once?

 

[ginwilly]

No. Not at all new. The reason why left wing ideas are so foreign to you is that in the last century it was illegal to be left wing in the US. That is why conservatives think that liberals are left wing, they are just to your left, not left of center.

Left wing ideas are not new to anyone who has attended public schools, ffs you are dense. I was reading Shaw, Spooner, Marx etc before you were born. I also know there was a very violent Marxist movement in the early 20th century that our history lessons don't always teach, but they always, always teach about McCarthyism that came after the fact. During the McCarthy period, Marxism was outlawed but not all leftist ideas. FDR was a leftist, the New Deal was a leftist idea... sometimes you just repeat sstupid shit others have said without really thinking it through. Remember your brilliance that the press in the US was the least free press in the world? Yeah, shit like that.

 

[Doer]

OMFG I am very far left and radical, no doubt about it. I'm not a liberal or democrat though, as those are center-right ideologies.

This cat is almost as LEFT as I am. Right on.

 

[abandonconflict]

McCarthyism that came after the fact. During the McCarthy period, Marxism was outlawed but not all leftist ideas. FDR was a leftist, the New Deal was a leftist idea.

I agree that FDR was left of center and that the New Deal was left of center. I also agree that McCarthyism came after THAT fact.

 

[abandonconflict]

This cat is almost as LEFT as I am. Right on.

You Malthusian, I'm way out to your left.

 

[beenthere]

Why do you throw stones, cast aspersions, and generally act shitty and pissy all at once?

Don't fret, it's only with pissy internet pseudo intellects.

 

[Doer]

Don't fret, it's only with pissy internet pseudo intellects.

So, you admit to being a judgemental, elitist snob.

No one in his right mind will lump buck and cn together as "that type" of anything.

 

[ginwilly]

I agree that FDR was left of center and that the New Deal was left of center. I also agree that McCarthyism came after THAT fact.

So then you agree that only some leftistness (namely marxism) was outlawed for only a very short period. Your statement insinuates something different and was misleading wouldn't you say?
and this " in the last century it was illegal to be left wing in the US" is simply not true and is yet another example of your brain to keyboard filter being broke.

 

[Doer]

You Malthusian, I'm way out to your left.

No. Now, I'm left of you, again. HA. Damn. You passed me again. It is ON, mo'fo!

 

[beenthere]

So, you admit to being a judgemental, elitist snob.

No one in his right mind will lump buck and cn together as "that type" of anything.

Really, says who?
Isn't your signature a bit contradictory to your actions?

 

[ChesusRice]

Hey bro, somewhere back in time you made some life decisions that you are living with today.
If it makes you feel better to blame everyone else for the moves you made back then, well, have at it.

It just doesn't work on me.

Yeah you did to.

But you seem to be miserable with yours

 

[Doer]

Yeah you did to.

But you seem to be miserable with yours

And he certainly spews his partisan blame and sometimes even the open end of the wet paper bag, defeats the thinking on both sides.

 

[abandonconflict]

So then you agree that only some leftistness (namely marxism) was outlawed for only a very short period. Your statement insinuates something different and was misleading wouldn't you say?
and this " in the last century it was illegal to be left wing in the US" is simply not true and is yet another example of your brain to keyboard filter being broke.

It was in fact in the last century. Not the century prior, not this century. The time period in which McCarthyism occurred was in the last century. The problem is not my brain to keyboard filter, it is your weak command of English. I did not say, "for exactly 100 years...". Now, you can try to interpret this how ever you want, but using FDR as a counter example such that not all leftism was outlawed, shows how slow and dumb you are.

I'll try to break it down slowly. FDR and NEW Deal was prior to McCarthyism. That means before. That means McCarthyism witch hunt was AFTER FDR and New Deal. It had to happen after, because if it had happened before, capitalism would not have had a chance to be saved. So I'll go slow, Capitalism was near demise, FDR rescued it, McCarthy then went on a witch hunt against ALL left wing ideas and people.

To this day, if anyone on the left has an idea you conservatives don't like, we are called marxists, communists, socialists and such, in order to associate our ideas with the evil taboos against which a witch hunt occurred in the last century. That is probably why JFK was killed too. That is why both major parties have become right wing.

This weak attempt of yours, to make my statement seem unhistoric, is underscored by your failure to grasp the simple historical fact that the New Deal and FDR occurred before the McCarthy witch hunt. In your petty semantic attempt at arguing, you have revealed how dumb you are. Weeks from now, when I say some completely unrelated thing that you don't like, you'll bring it up again, in an attempt to derail discussion and troll. So you're not only a liar, you're dumb.

 

[londonfog]

I have never once argued from the standpoint that I don't want to pay, yet you continually appoint that perspective to me so you can argue against it. Can I say you are arguing for UHC and attack that straw man? Would be the same thing.

Your answer on how ER abuse will stop is still, "it just will, believe me".

As for 3, why 26? Why not let families group as they wish, why can't neighbors group as they wish? The logic behind the exchange is to pool resources. We are presently doing this on a state level to save money and the leftists want this done on the federal level, but nobody wants to allow it done on the individual level, why? It wouldn't make much sense to limit participates of the exchange based on age, but allowing a kid to stay on a personal account a year longer is seen as a major breakthrough. If a bunch of my friends all wanted to buy a tv, we would get a much better deal if we all went together, that's just how the market works.

London, it was a fun exercise but you most definitely proved the point I was trying to make. That people support the bill because of what they think it does, not for what it really does. There was nothing I could ever say to convince that the ER abuse problem wasn't addressed, in your world it was, you don't know how, you just know it.

I have showed how AHCA can work ...you choose to ignore again and again. I tell you what you say you are for healthcare reform...tell us all how you could make what we have better.

For the record sometimes you know not works until you try. So far you have projected nothing but negative with no answers or solutions. Americans sure seem to be full of American't
We needed health care reform and we got AHCA. What do you suggest would be better to help MOST Americans receive healthcare ??? You say your argument shows that people are only going by what they think it does Everything thing I pointed out shows what it could do if it works the way it should. How do you know unless you try. Crazy thinking from the some of you. I would have never been able to succeed in life had I your attitude.
Negative thoughts received negative results

Republicans fought Social Security and Medicaid and Medicare when they were first proposed, those programs are now highly effective and broadly popular parts of our social safety net.

Now I have already named 3 reasons why I support AHCA ( we have to agree to disagree on one about the ER)

Let me move to my fourth ( which is another personal one for me )

4. AHCA expands tax credits to help small businesses provide health insurance to their workers. Companies with fewer than 50 employees do not have to provide insurance, but ACHA will make it much cheaper for me

Recap once again
My pros
1.Will lower cost of ER and the pass down cost. <<<We have to agree to disagree here<<<

2.Makes it so you can't be turned down due to pre-existing conditions.

3. allows kids to stay on their parents insurance plans until age 26

4. expands tax credits to help small businesses provide health insurance to their workers

Your con

There is no collection agent that will force people to pay fines and relies on people doing the "right thing". If we could count on that, we wouldn't need insurance reform.

which I'm to understand means...I DON"T WANT TO BE FORCED TO PAY FOR ANYTHING......................

 

[ginwilly]

word vomit

you said " in the last century it was illegal to be left wing in the US".

Are you willing to go on record that this statement is true? Or would "there was a small period of time in the last century where there was a communist witch hunt" be true? Do these two statements mean the same thing? McCarthy went after leftist groups on the basis of communist spying, as ridiculous as that is, being left was never illegal, spying was. The fact that one very powerful man made it his mission to stomp out communism and did so in a delusional and paranoid manner, doesn't mean left wing was illegal in the last century.

 

[abandonconflict]

The fact that one very powerful man made it his mission to stomp out communism and did so in a delusional and paranoid manner, doesn't mean left wing was illegal in the last century.

Yes, yes it does.

 

[ginwilly]

I have showed how AHCA can work ...you choose to ignore again and again. I tell you what you say you are for healthcare reform...tell us all how you could make what we have better. and please stop using "ER ABUSE"..no abuse when someone is ill and the only means of healthcare is the ER.

For the record sometimes you know not works until you try. So far you have projected nothing but negative with no answers or solutions. Americans sure seem to be full of American't
We needed health care reform and we got AHCA. What do you suggest would be better to help MOST Americans receive healthcare ??? You say your argument shows that people are only going by what they think it does Everything thing I pointed out shows what it could do if it works the way it should. How do you know unless you try. Crazy thinking from the some of you. I would have never been able to succeed in life had I your attitude.
Negative thoughts received negative results

Republicans fought Social Security and Medicaid and Medicare when they were first proposed, those programs are now highly effective and broadly popular parts of our social safety net.

Now I have already named 3 reasons why I support AHCA ( we have to agree to disagree on one about the ER)

Let me move to my fourth ( which is another personal one for me )

4. AHCA expands tax credits to help small businesses provide health insurance to their workers. Companies with fewer than 50 employees do not have to provide insurance, but ACHA will make it much cheaper for me

Recapp once again
My pros
1.Will lower cost of ER and the pass down cost. <<<We have to agree to disagree here<<<

2.Makes it so you can't be turned down due to pre-existing conditions.

3. allows kids to stay on their parents insurance plans until age 26

4. expands tax credits to help small businesses provide health insurance to their workers

Your con
which I'm to understand means...I DON"T WANT TO BE FORCED TO PAY FOR ANYTHING

My answers and suggestion are anti-central planning and community based so you won't consider them real ideas and have been rehashed for the years I've been on here. I believe less government intervention and bureaucracy is part of the solution as well as educating people on healthy choices. Our FDA works against our interest. I can't buy a Canadian drug that does the same as ours for a fraction of the cost because we can't trust third world countries like Canada, we can only use good ole US meds (made in Malaysia).

I already pay for my health care voluntarily so please drop that strawman you are assigning to me.

While it's true that I and others don't want to be forced to pay for things against our will, that's not the argument, that's the point. You can't make them under the present law. You can require it by mandate, but if someone really doesn't want to pay, you won't make them under the ACA, get it? If you can grasp that simple concept, that a shit load of people are economically incentivized to NOT pay, and the only incentive TO pay is "it's the right thing to do for the greater good", yet still can't grasp that our ER abuse was not addressed I'm wasting my time.

More cons

Adds yet another layer of bureaucracy that requires increased manpower to fill out properly causing costs to rise.
Decreases the incentive to businesses expand over 50 full time employees
Decreases the incentive of the individual to take ownership of their health.
Decreases the amount of full time jobs and makes the 29hr job the new rage.
Adds financial burden to states who can't print their way out.
More doctors are refusing to take medicaid leaving an increased number of people without a doc, since medicaid is far and away the most popular choice of expansion.
Expensive medical equipment that is a staple of US manufacturing just became more expensive with shiny new taxes, the incentive now being to move those jobs overseas, or pass the costs onto the patients, another cost increase.
It does NOTHING to address ER abuse
The entire premise of the bill relies on young healthy people who don't feel the need to pay for health care insurance to suddenly pay because it's the right thing for everyone else.


Decrease does not mean eliminate before you construct that strawman too.